How do I stop hating children?
Almost all my life I've absolutely despised children. Pretty much from the moment I stopped being a child I've hated being around children.
It doesn't even matter what the child is doing. Whether they're laughing and having fun or screaming and throwing a tantrum. The sound of a child being loud activates an almost primal rage that I can barely contain.
I've had to leave social gatherings/restaurants/grocery stores all because if I'd stayed I'd have made a complete ass of myself by screaming at a child just for existing.
It's even worse with infants which makes me feel horrible because I know they can't help it. I know the kids don't know any better and it's our job as adults to get them through childhood, but my blood boils when they get loud or demand attention.
Has anyone else dealt with something like this? Is there anything I can do to stop from getting so angry?
Therapy. It's clear this is causing you problems in your life. And that's exactly what therapy is for.
I'm just a dickhead on the Internet, but what you're describing doesn't sound normal or healthy to me. Have you tried therapy?
I've done therapy a few times now and we never really covered this.
It doesn't help that I live in a small town so the therapists here are extremely underqualified for actual mental illness and not just helping people through "tough" times
There's such a thing as remote therapy.
I've tried that more times than actual in person therapy and it's extremely hard for me to form the emotional attachment necessary for me to let my guard down and bare my thoughts and feelings.
It feels so fake and forced. I feel more like a subject being examined than a patient there for care
Your mileage may vary, but have you tried over the phone instead of video chat (if it's an option where you live)? I felt exactly the same about video, but something about over the phone felt chill, I could just "chat with a friend" in my pajamas. Helped me a lot and neither my therapist or I ever actually saw each other.
Or even just messages. I believe that betterhelp offers purely messages for therapy, which would maybe help start a more trusting relationship first. And they could either stick with messages, or if they’re comfortable, move to voice therapy
At the end of the day with therapy you get out what you put in. They can't help you work through issues if they don't know what they are.
I recently had a breakdown and attended therapy. I decided from the start I'd just be completely open and throw everything I have at them.
It was massively helpful and has transformed my life.
It's their job to listen and not judge and they've definitely heard much much worse stuff.
yeah tele medicine isn't always great. the bond is important, and it's harder to build that way.
keep checking out your town. even a small town is gonna have a decent number of therapists. don't worry too much about their expertise. if they're licensed, they have the training to help you. trust that and focus on the bond.
Betterhelp was selling medical information to facebook so make sure you find someplace legitimate to get help
That's not a terrible idea. They might even tell you that your emotions are not uncommon and give you some tips for dealing with it.
Or something else could be going on and you could get some more complete therapy.
Source: being some other jerk on the Internet.
Internet jerks unite!!!
Yeah, that's actually a thing for some people to various degrees.
It's called misophonia
https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/24460-misophonia
I had it for high pitched sounds as well, went on Beta Blockers for migraines and it fixed this as well.
The noises are triggering your adrenal response and your body is screaming at you that the noise has to stop and it doesn't matter what it takes. Beta blockers block adrenaline, so now noises that used to set me on edge are just normal noises to me.
I think one of the current hypothesis is that it might be close to a sound that would attract predators, but sometimes wires get crossed and you have the reaction to a random noise.
Most commonly it's people hating the sound of others chewing.
I was unfamiliar with misophonia so I went looking into it. I know it is a poorly studied issue, but I wasn't able to find any peer reviewed research where children's noises in general were used or reported as a trigger. I found lots of discussion forums, but that is anecdotal.
The reason I went digging is because the op describes all children's noises, happy, sad, whatever, whereas what I read in the literature was very specific noises were reported as triggers. E.g, lip smacking, chewing, pen clicking, etc. In one study, they even used videos of children and dogs playing to help participants calm down and establish a baseline. https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0227118
While I'm admittedly ignorant, it seems OP may have a more general aversion to children than I would expect of misophonia given what I've read from medical sources.
I only mention this as a counter suggestion to help op avoid self diagnosing and maybe going down the wrong track.
I think counseling is warranted to help sort it out.
Not specifically kids.
But kids make lots of really high pitched noises, and those can be a trigger.
Happy, sad, for no reason at all.
Kids make a lot of noise, and it's almost all high pitch
I'll have to look into this. People chewing normally don't bother me, but if someone is sitting close and chews with their mouth open... yeah, instant rage.
I’ll have to look into this again thanks, but Just a cautionary note that it can be hard to get off of beta blockers iirc
While true, it's not that they're addictive or dangerous or anything.
It's just a long half life so they stay in your system for days when taken as prescribed.
So if you take your doses regularly, your body gets used to never having adrenaline.
Take a week off, and your body is suddenly dealing with adrenaline again while having like zero tolerance for it.
So if you're on it for cardiac reasons, stopping abruptly can very likely lead to a heart attack.
So (like most meds) if you're going off them you need to titrate slowly so your body adjusts. But it's not like Benzos where it causes withdrawals or anything.
If someone takes them "as needed" then they can just stop taking them whenever without cause for concern. Because their body is still used to occasional adrenaline.
Obviously consult your doctor though, I just took a few classes on this stuff over a decade ago
This is actually a neurological thing. It has a name and everything (though I can't recall what the name is). A lot of people on the spectrum have it. You may want to talk to a therapist about it, if this isn't merely hyperbole.
Misophonia is the thing you’re describing.
That's the fear of soy paste.
That's misophobia, misophonia is when you don't like how soy paste sounds.
That's the disease that may qualify you for financial compensation
You're thinking of mesophobioma.
That's mesothelioma. You're thinking of what happens when the doctor tells you you've got a different disease to the one you actually have.
As dumb as this comment is, you’ve just guaranteed that I’ll never forget the name of this problem, so thanks for that
That´s Misophobia 👨🔬
I have this too. The sound of chewing is like nails on a chalkboard all through my bones. It's awful.
Oh just what I need more evidence.
Never hurts to check.
Unless you're American and don't have health insurance. Then it might hurt.
I have it. The sounds of people eating, especially slurping or crunching, are literally repulsive. I have to have something else to train my focus on or else I'll get up and bolt.
Other repetitive sounds trigger it too: people popping gum, chewing ice, clipping fingernails, etc. But not too bad with keyboards and typing.
I'm not sure if I have it or I'm just an irritable asshole, but I certainly gave pause when I first read about it because plenty of sounds people make absolutely do feel like a nail being driven into my brain, inducing a feeling of unrepentant anger that is tough to let go of. Though, they're usually sounds most people also find irritating. Like lip smacking and nostril wheezing. At what point is it not simply a common irritation and it becomes a disorder? 🤔
When it affects your relationships and your life. My wife has a complex now about crunching in front of me and chooses food accordingly, which makes me feel terrible.
Or when I can't focus on what my boss is saying because she's eating almonds while she talks.
I just try to find coping behaviors and sometimes literally bite my lip to get thru some situations.
eating while talking is just rude
Yep, autism was my first thought too.
I have no advice, but I have to say I really admire and appreciate you for acknowledging that it's unfair for the children and trying to change that. Most people aren't strong enough to introspect
I would even argue that you've already done the hard part
I've noticed a correlation between the trait you describe and high-functioning autism. I've dated two women with the trait you describe, and one of them was diagnosed HFA, and the other showed signs of HFA but was undiagnosed last I heard.
We have a tendency to expect others to show the same level of maturity as we've learned to exhibit ourselves. Being accepting of those who haven't learned that level of maturity is a skill that must be learned. Learning teaching skills/methods helps with this.
fwiw some people REALLY hate the term "high functioning", i'm myself what would be called really high functioningly autistic and have been quite condescendingly informed that the term is somehow terrible.
To follow up, you'll have better luck saying "high succeeding"
Could be worth looking into Misophonia. Basically it's an irrational anger response to specific noises that vary person to person. I don't know enough about it to say how it can be dealt with, but it may be something you could find a specialist for.
It's very weird to me that you're only listing loud things children do... Like, have you ever been around a sleeping child? Do they bother you? What about in a classroom, watching a movie, or running in the distance (out of earshot)?
Average volume of a child is higher than adults, but only by a factor of 2 or so. And their noises are interpretable, you can definitely figure out what they mean, unlike the adult noises.
Most adults are also unbearable so that's not convincing anyone
But I think blaming children for the fact that all people are unbearable is... idk, you've mistaken a symptom for a problem? Working on the general misanthropy is probably a better start?
At this point it might as well be a natural response to childeren to link them to the loud noises ( which irritate op ). Tbh, i was thinking the same and it might help you realise what you hate ( childeren, or just loud noises )
As an adult I'm louder sleeping (snoring at 80 dB) than being active in the day
Lol, OSHA gonna visit your bedroom!
No one is working when I'm sleeping
How would you know? You're sleeping.
Partners
Someone probably needs a CPAP or APAP
I just want to commend you on asking for help, and based on your post and replies, it sounds like you can at least offload the belief that you hate children, because it doesn’t seem that way, only that you’re very triggered by the noise, which I can totally relate to. It happens for me with kids and barking dogs, and I have to manage the sound with music and earbuds. Sound sensitivity and being stressed by it is very real for a number of conditions or conditioned mentalities, so I wouldn’t be so hard on yourself about it when it’s clear you’re empathetic and don’t want to feel that way, but seeking therapy with someone familiar with such reactions is probably a good idea. Though ultimately personal noise management may still be a big part of the solution.
That's the neat part, you don't
There was probably a moment when you decided to dislike the "child part" of yourself.
Normal people start being a grown-up, but do not totally turn away from that "child part". It is still there. It is always there. It is a normal part of a normal life.
Try to make amends with that part of yourself, and allow it to resurrect in you.
The more of these comments I read the more I'm starting to realize it's because I wasn't allowed to be that loud kid.
The moment I started getting loud whether happy or sad I just got punished.
Resentment through jealousy I suppose. Looks like I have some things to think about
I was also expected to be very quiet and perfectly behaved, and have also struggled with resentment toward rowdy children as a result. Even now, at 39 years old, I sometimes want to retaliate with an Aztec death whistle.
Therapy can be really helpful in learning to deal with that resentment. If possible and reasonable, so can talking about it with your parent(s).
Several years ago I said to my mother, "I'm feeling angry right now because I'm thinking about that loud kid we saw in the store today and remembering how I had to repress myself as a child." Then we had a really productive conversation about the pressure to defy stereotypes about poor parents, being a parent with unrecognized and unsupported neurodivergence, and sensory issues.
I hope you're able to dissolve a significant amount of your resentment, too. In the meantime, there's a kind of reusable earplug that reduces noise just a little bit so you can still have a conversation (can't remember the brand name though).
My husband had that kind of childhood too, and loud kids really trigger him, just like you've described in your post.
That's a great insight for you to have! It's easier to address a struggle if you can identify the root of it ❤️ Also many of us can empathize with being treated that way as children.
Are you a cat?
One thing you could do to at least mitigate the issue is carry a set of ear plugs on you at all times. That's what I do and it's really helped me out in certain situations. It obviously won't solve the problem, but if it reduces the noise level, it should make it less irritating.
So, this form of victim-shaming is okay?
I carry a pair on me at all times, too. And it's a bigger help than one might realize.
If someone is sensitive to loud noises or particular sounds, earplugs can help prevent them from being overstimulated by those sounds. If I enter a loud bar, I put them in. If I have to be around loud or crying kids, I put them in. Loud college party or hockey game? Ear plugs. Crowded fair? Ear plugs.
They allow me to stay in social situations that I would otherwise have to leave. It makes much more sense for me to put my plugs in than to expect kids to be quiet all the time. Or for everyone at a party to be respectful just for me.
OP, don’t feel alone or hopeless. There are more of us out here who know exactly what you’re describing because we experience it ourselves.
It doesn’t mean you’re a bad person or that it’s your fault for experiencing this - there’s not much you can do to “fix” it, if anything. I’ve been to a therapist and medical professionals, and basically noise cancelling AirPods or ear plugs in public are the only solution. And maybe some medications.
We used to have neighbors with several small children who would - at the same time every day - go play in their backyard. Normal kid thing. But if I was outside, I’d have to go back in. The frequency or pitch or whatever you want to call it of the loud shrieks was literally painful. I would cry.
I see other replies saying it may be a factor of you not being able to express yourself in the same way as a child. I wasn’t either because my mom is terrified of the outside world & it would make her think I was in danger. Whether this played a role or not I have no idea. I don’t want to attribute it to purely psychological reasons when it sounds like there is potentially also an actual physical medical explanation. Maybe it’s a combination, maybe not. Who knows.
It’s a fact of life that IMO you cannot control and will have to have a plan for if and when it occurs. Earplugs, leaving the triggering situation, medication, I hope you find something that works. It is fucking painful. And I can’t control that. And it’s no one’s fault…we just try to avoid situations where young children will be present (which is really fucking hard at times for a woman, btw…baby showers! Parties where the women are expected to be the caretakers because….uterus, I suppose?).
Anyway, best of luck to you, it’s not your fault, and feel free to reach out any time.
Is it just the loud sounds of children that irk you, or do other things they do bother you as well regardless of the noise they make? And if it's just the noise, do other loud noises not associated with children bother you as well?
Sensitivity to loud noises could be something like sensory processing disorder, hyperacusis, or even a form of autism. I have had to move multiple times because of loud neighbours doing things that would certainly annoy other people too, but they could put up with it whereas I became absolutely consumed by the noise and even resorted to self harm to deal with it before giving up and leaving.
I don't have a solution for the above. It's just what I know from personal experience, but maybe it can help you figure out a cause and panacea for your issues with noisy kids.
Sensory processing disorder associated with autism is exactly what came to my mind because it's exactly what I deal with. I usually shut down instead of melting down, but kids playing at anything past a barely-audible level is extremely difficult for me. Other attention-grabbing noises are also difficult, like dogs barking, car doors closing, people yelling, etc., and other stimuli cause me to shut down too, like dogs jumping/breathing on me (basically everything about dogs, unfortunately) or someone touching the back of my head/neck.
It took a lot of research into how my sensory processing reacts to different things, and I still struggle frequently, but I'm a father now and most days I'm very happy about it. I have noise canceling headphones for when I get overwhelmed, and I keep a clicky mechanical keyboard switch and barrette in my pocket to fiddle with, which helps a lot.
OP, I can obviously only speak from my own experiences, but I think dissecting what exactly causes these sudden emotional bursts and finding sensory distraction or blocking techniques to dampen them might work for you too. Headphones are a godsend.
Edit: Definitely seek a professional opinion (if possible for you) and look into misophonia, especially if specific sounds are your only issue. I just wanted to provide my perspective because for me the exact same issue the original post describes was part of a broader thing that needed addressing.
I'm curious, how do you feel about being around drunk people while you are sober? Is the problem the children themselves, or is being around someone who is loud, obnoxious, and self centered (which I think describes both children and drunk people).
I'm general, my main advice would be to look into yourself to see what specifically is bothering you and why. That's basically what I assume a therapist would do. Maybe it's something like your own need for attention causes feelings of resentment when someone else is demanding attention. Maybe it's just the loud noises kids make. If it's the kids themselves and not their noise and self-centered attitude, maybe the root is something related to kids resurfacing your own childhood memories/trauma. Once you identify the root of the problem, maybe you can start working toward letting whatever it is go, or at least recognizing in the moment that your not angry at the kid, your angry at whatever issue in yourself you've identified. Understanding what is going on in your own head might at least keep you from screaming at the kid.
I don't know anything though, just a stranger spouting off, so please take this with a giant grain of salt. A professional therapist would obviously be better, but I understand from your other responses that might not be practical for you.
I know of one person in my wider circle who reacts also pretty bad when children are being children around him. In his childhood, every time he was loud, wanted attention, or just did what a child does, his parents (they did not even want children; he was an "accident") got really angry at him. So children being children is a trigger for him.
Talking to a trained professional helped him immensely to handle this.
Sounds like misophonia.
Goosfraba. seriously though I don't think there can be anything you do but remove yourself from the area unless they are your children. Its sorta funny but I was a way quite kid but I generally get kids. Its like dogs wanting to play. They just want to play. cyring and its like a dog wimpering. somethings wrong. Granted I have no kids and I don't go out of my way to wrangle other folks but it never really bothers me.
What's that first word mean?
That's an important question.
But, can we get these ones checked too?
its from the movie anger management and sorta a joke but it only makes sense if you saw the movie.
https://digitalcultures.net/slang/goosfraba/
Have you tried plugging your ears or using noise cancelling headphones?
Yea, can’t help but wonder if OP is neuro divergent and the sounds kids make is a trigger for misophonia.
Or unplugging their ears and plugging them back in?
My sister has it too, her misophonia makes her dramatically more sensitive to any higher pitched sounds. And her borderline personality disorder combines to translate that annoyance directly into anger. She can still hang out with kids if they are being calm and quiet. But it's risky. The kids know that when she gets mad it wasn't their fault. They seem to handle it well, but we'll only really know in time. They currently still enjoy hanging out with her, so that's a positive sign.
If you have the same thing, as far as I know there is no way to stop it. But cbt(cognitive behavioral therapy) and things like that can help you be more present and mindful while experiencing those effects. Generally enough to prevent unwanted explosions and extricate yourself to a more comfortable environment to calm down over time.
I am exactly the same as you. I've stopped caring, neither me nor my friends have kids thankfully. But yeah the sound of kids crying or screaming or throwing a tantrum instantly hits a nerve in my head
Agreed. But, it is supposed to. We are wired for it.
[Facetious content warning: cheesy "as a parent" talk] Having a kid completely changed how the wires hit your empathy-center. The fact something you love inexplicably more than anything makes that sound, is looking at you for relief, and then you provide it (sometimes), it changes you. And other people's babies don't really bother you anymore. It fires up a different nerve center.
When I hear parents apologize to strangers about their baby and they get the response "it's ok, I'm a parent, too.", I take it as shorthand that they mean "our brains have been rewired too. We get it. So if your baby cries, we'll just frown with our bottom lip way down. We don't know why. There is no control anymore. The wires, they're all fucked up. Oh god why? Will I ever be normal again?". Then they catch themselves, and hide that instant of self-awareness by cooing at the baby. Tale as old as time.
Edit: Getting a few downvotes. Nbd. But I want to stress that this is not a top-level comment, and therefore should in no way be interpreted as an answer to OP's question. In no way do I advocate having kids to fix any kind of problem, especially one of the type OP is asking about. I will sing the praises of vasectomies from personal experience.
Have you ever spent any one-on-one time having fun with a kid?
Sounds like a dangerous time for the kid
I laughed really hard at your comment. Seriously thank you.
Yeah and now I have to go door to door to let my neighbors know about how great a time it was
Are you diagnosed neurodiverse? This is a common trait.
No judgement, just curious: I know it's more rare, but do you get the same visceral reaction to grown people throwing immature temper tantrums as well? Or is it limited to just the very young?
I just want to understand if this is more of a distaste for immaturity or if it's only the immaturity of the immature that's giving you that feeling.
I'm no fan of kids, but I don't get this kind of rage myself. I can dismiss myself from the situation long before I struggle with these kinds of feelings.
I don't hate children but children under age 6-8 creep me out. I get a flight response when I am put into a situation where I have to be around a toddler or baby. I have always thought it was an uncanny valley thing though. As soon as they can make complete coherent sentences though, it's awesome. It's incredible to watch them learn, absorb, and have them experience new things.
My brother's wife bought me a set of earplugs that deaden sound but still let you hear. These have greatly increased the amount of time I can be around children before it starts stressing me out. To the point that I don't mind going over there at all anymore and they have 3 kids in a small house. The brand is Loop but their may be other brands that are the same thing. Its like an earbud with a metal ring attached to it. They also help with other noise induced stress that I have.
I hated children until I had friends who are great parents and have great kids. I found out that I hate shitty parents, not kids. You can't turn this comment into actionable life advice, I'm afraid.
I used to think "good" kids had "good" parents and vice versa but I learned this isn't always the case. I should have realized, I was only such a "good" (quiet) kid because my parents scared me. I didn't feel safe. But some good parents raise genuinely respectful yet also self-respecting kids.
My mom said she used to judge parents with bad kids, the ones having tantrums in the store, etc. "My kids would never do that", she assumed she was doing something right and they were bad parents . "Then God gave me Janet ". My little sister, who was a tantrum throwing hellion of a little kid and the teenager who got brought home by the cops.
She's a lovely person as an adult though.
THIS. Good parents are rare. I have one friend that has somehow raised 3 amazing kids. Don’t get me wrong, they occasionally act up, but on the whole I spend more time admiring how smart and thoughtful they are for 9, 13 and 15 year olds.
I used to hate kids. I gradually got over it in the course of 40 odd years. I still hate parents and can’t control their kids, but I don’t blame the children.
Very good observation
You seems to react to high pitched voice/sound of children. Hate the noise not the origin
I would echo the recommendation for counseling. However, is this a larger issue or unique to children? Do you find yourself getting disproportionately angry at other sources of annoyances? Answering that question might help you know whether there is a larger need to address.
I struggle with a lot of sounds, having a sensory processing disorder, the list of which is far too long to write out here. So I totally understand the frustration and how rage inducing it is, you are definitely not alone. Especially when people don't understand it's not a patience issue, it's a 'my brain isn't wired the same way as yours and it genuinely cannot be fixed' issue.
Other people have mentioned therapy, which is definitely a good idea. They can help you find ways to channel the energy into something else, or help you find the root cause (if it's a children-specific thing, and not just a general sensory issue), or teach you good cognitive behavioral therapy practices.
In the interim, since finding a good therapist for you can take a lot of time, I would definitely recommend some form of earplugs. Mine have saved me and my sanity so so so many times. If I can recommend a particular pair, I would suggest the Loop Switch, since they let you adjust the sound reduction levels on the fly - but any brand / even the foam tip ones (as long as they fit you properly!) can help immeasurably. For me, just knowing I have earplugs with me helps dealing with these sounds, even if I don't wind up using them, just knowing the option is there. Some form of stress ball or those grip / forearm strengtheners might also be of use for you? It can be a good distraction, as well as allowing yourself to let off some of the steam in a relatively healthy and inconspicuous manner.
And kudos for knowing this is a problem for you, and looking for help on how to improve it. I hope you're able to make progress you want, one way or another. Good luck, OP - we're rooting for you
By undergoing behavioral therapy.
How loud is loud? Is it only loud children or children of any volume? How do you feel about loud adults?
embrace it
Welcome to Lemmy. Welcome to autism.
I was a little like that until I had a kid myself. Much less than you perhaps, but I didn't have fun with kids, I never knew what to do, what to tell them, and I would be very unforgiving with kids who are cheating or lying for fun.
I always thought that when you have one, yours is different.
When i meet my soulmate, I knew she would be an awesome mother and it helped me retain some faith. We ended up having a boy who is now 4 and a half.
I must admit, I didn't know I had this much patience in me. Still not knowing what the hell I'm doing but I lowered the bar as much as I could : he's happy, and he's fed.
Now it's not always easy, and he tests my limits daily by pushing all the proper buttons. Sometimes I ask my girlfriend for an.... Emergency relief.
But now I kinda understand how to enter children's world. Doesn't work with all of them, and sometimes I must adapt. I still have a hard time tolerating crying over nothing serious, but I found ways to go around that and give hugs.
I try to remind myself of old memories when I did some very similar things with I was a kid, sometimes I'm not very proud...
All in all, I'm not telling to have kids, but just to say it can change. I just happened to have taken the "hard way", and I didn't regret any of it.
Once they have all been eliminated, then and only then, will your feelings go away.
Guess I needed this "/s"
It sounds like you still expect them to know better, to be better than the sociopathic children they are.
You can be angry at something because they are simply being annoying not just because expectations are not being met.
A baby crying is triggering to humans for example, this evolved on purpose to increase infant survivability. You don’t have to have expectations of quietness when a baby is crying loudly to feel irritated.
I could see the same applying to loud/rude children
lucky you, hated those fuckers even when I was one.
That's the fun part, you don't!
hating kids is bad ass
Hating kids is badass if you are a kid.