Three years after the January 6 attack, propaganda about the insurrection is poisoning the American public
The U.S. will mark the anniversary of the January 6 insurrection on Saturday, a milestone that will confer upon the reality-dwelling citizenry a grim reminder of the potency of propaganda and how quickly it can warp perception when introduced into the public square.
Just three years ago, most of the country watched with dismay and horror as a violent MAGA mob beat back authorities and stormed the country’s citadel of democracy. The Donald Trump-incited crush of disillusioned rioters, fueled by a stream of fantastical lies, believed that the 2020 election had been stolen by sinister forces working to undermine the democratic election.
Of course, not only was their belief flatly incorrect, but evidence later emerged indicating that it was Trump who, in fact, had tried to subvert democracy.
Facts, however, have little bearing on the sentiment inside the Republican Party, which has been fed a steady diet of lies and half-truths by Fox News and the rest of the sprawling right-wing media machine. To wit, the false notion that Joe Biden nefariously stole the 2020 election is now widely shared inside the GOP. A CNN poll conducted over the summer found that nearly 70% of Republicans believe Biden’s win was not legitimate, a number that has continued to tick up.
IMO, this event was worse for America and the world than 9/11. What goodwill and credibility can America exercise on the world stage when Trump can incite a violent attack on the US Congress, and he is still the front runner?
If he had convinced the Capital Police to get rid of the metal detectors, as he tried to do, America would be under a Trump dictatorship right now.
As if his capitulation to Russia, Saudi Arabia, China, or North Korea shouldn't immediately disqualify him, or the millions of dollars he personally received from foreign governments during his presidency.
It's a matter of degrees .... American establishment wants fascism, they are just taking their time getting there.
The problem isn't Trump, Trump is an idiot and dime a dozen, once he dies, there will be another idiot just like him that the establishment will court and push into our faces every day.
The problem are the millionaires and billionaires of America that are funding all this crap and keep maintaining it all. If all this relied on Trump's charisma, it would have died out a long time ago ... it's just a huge marketing machine that keeps it afloat.
As long as we keep seeing these headlines, no matter if it's Trump or someone else ... it's just a sign that the wealthy want fascism to keep growing because they know it will mean a win fall for them at the cost of all of us.
Thanks America ... you're doing a bang up job.
As an American. You are 100% spot on. Had Republicans not enabled and helped trump at every step. He would have gotten nothing accomplished. They were there every hour of every day ready to lick his greasy taint in an effort to please their voters. It could be any idiot. It just happened to be Trump
With many other countries I could agree. But America is the global reserve currency and basically the world’s police. For the theocrats pushing a takeover it wouldn’t end well. F35s and other highly technical defense system would crumble. Our soft power would evaporate overnight. Many Billionaires would wake up only to find their billions are worth a fraction. Sounds Improbable.
This is a pretty solid take imho, but I’m not sure the ultra wealthy see it that way. Look at how deluded they show themselves to be when there isn’t a PR handler in the mix to filter their thoughts on platforms like Xitter. Their ego and hubris from living in the alternate reality their great wealth affords them presents tremendous risk in this situation.
I believe this.
I'm a bit older (40+) and when I was in college, it was pretty popular for students from more prestigious colleges to be paying students at my college and other less prestigious colleges to do original research for them. Plagiarism with extra steps and pay. The poor student gets paid, and the rich student gets to put their name on it and get the grade.
I think the elite have been buying their credentials for too long and fully believe their own lies. They love the smell of their own farts, as it were.
They are so many generations removed from real knowledge about international markets and so on that there is real possibility that they will make the whole house of cards collapse in hubris.
There are two types of wealthy people ... those who have all the power and those that want all the power
Those already in power probably don't want change .... but those that don't have it all certainly would like to see change and a reshuffling of wealth and the chance of gaining control of more, or even everything.
Every major change in history never really changed anything ... all it ever does is change the actors and players - old wealth gets removed by new wealth - old elites are replaced by new elites
American political and military power will probably always stay the same for the foreseeable future ... the question is who will get the chance to sit at the top and rule the world.
What confuses me is that they seem to miss that historically fascists or authoritarians more generally don't actually pander to the wealthy once they have power, and many wealthy suddenly end up dead or missing. Look at Xi and Putin for instance. Or history.
It's a rat cage and everyone is chasing after the hunk of cheese above our cage ..... the ones closest to the top believe that by climbing on those below them, they can reach higher .... and those close to the top are desperately trying to pull down the one just above them to gain that extra bit of chance of going up one more level.
The ultra wealthy at the top may or may not want fascism ... but those just below them might because they believe in changing the guard, reshuffling the wealth and giving a new group of a privileged people a chance ... like you say, every big political authoritarian change came at the cost of removing many wealthy people, but it also meant a new crop of people to fill the gaps.
They finally found their useful idiot who was capable of energizing a portion of the population who previously didn't believe voting was important.
The majority of the GOP in office will continue to bend the knee to anyone they view to have the same power. And I fear eventually we will see the same action taken on the left.
Power is the most addictive drug.
It's so stupid though. The German conservative aristocracy wanted fascism (mainly because they were incredibly unsettled by the post WWI shake ups and terrified of bolshevism) and thought they could control the Nazis to their own ends. That pretty much immediately backfired on them. These people have to see that...
99% of our voting population is going to vote team color no matter what. They don't care that Biden hasn't done anything meaningful to put a stop to this, and they'll argue with me tooth and nail that electing him is a moral imperative anyway.
Fascism is inevitable now.
Seriously though, what other choice do I have with my vote? The reality is we live in a two party system, I have zero power to change it by voting random 3rd party candidates that will never get the support, and the other guy is even worse.
This is the logic that's given us a 40-year slide into fascism and a near total loss of power.
I'm sorry, but if you're unwilling to change, you can't expect things to change. You can look at the last two decades and see the results of electing do-nothing Democrats.
In fact, read up on Idaho for the next step in crises that Democrats are simply going to ignore.
This is the logic that got us Bush.
Nader’s vote total was several times higher than Bush’s margin in both Florida and New Hampshire. Him off the ballot in either of those states would’ve made Gore v Bush unnecessary as Gore would’ve been a clear winner.
It also earned Clinton’s election with Perot being the Republican spoiler for Dole in 96, though I don’t remember which states.
Third parties will always be a spoiler until voting reform happens and plurality winner-takes-all ends.
>This is the logic that got us Bush.
gore won. Bush's daddy's friends made him peesident
Gore should’ve won. It’s plainly obvious that there were multiple plan-Bs to assure Bush’s win, between his brothers obviously flawed ballots and the Supreme Court and who knows what else never made national news.
It’s like gerrymandering, voter suppression (by means of strategically making polling places in predominantly Democratic areas more crowded making and blocking mail ballots/early voting difficult if not impossible), and voter purges aren’t enough of a leg up for them…we then find out that they actually have multiple layers of plans to help get a victory one way or the other.
We saw it in 2000, and we saw it in 2020. And we saw how deep the rabbit hole goes when we realized that by crippling the USPS to prevent mail voting, they managed to delay getting their own fake ballots into DC in time.
At what point do we stop calling what the GOP does “politics” and start actually calling it “organized crime”?
Got it, my problem is I'm not applying enough hopes and dreams that the entire system changes because I voted for a write-in.
My plan is to keep voting in local candidates for local offices that are working to make the changes I'd love to see, but until then there's absolutely nothing I can do at a national level but try to keep the openly evil guy from winning by voting for the most likely other option. If you have a better plan that has a chance of changing anything THIS election cycle, I'd love to hear it and be educated. Honestly, I would!
This is the only power you have now, and you should absolutely vote progressive locally if a candidate actually has a progressive record. (And many Dems don't there either.)
At the national level, it's too late. It doesn't matter how you vote now. The simple fact is that Biden needs many people to vote for him that are finding it too expensive to live under his governance, and as we saw with Obama trying to hand of the reins to Hillary, that kind of record isn't something the public is going to buy. When Obama ignored the middle class, they didn't care that Trump was a racist piece of shit. They only cared that he was the candidate of change.
They're not going to care that Trump or DeSantis are fascist. They're going to care that they're not Biden, and therefore (in the minds of these voters) more likely to make a change that makes their individual lives easier.
Right, so I suck it up and vote Biden so my vote can at least try to counter someone voting the actual proclaimed dictator in the meantime, correct? We're back to square 1 until any of my preferred local candidates can get to the national level and hopefully push some real change. In the meantime I do the best I can and talk to people about what we could be doing better. Democracy yo. 🤷♂️
If you think that's best, sure. Your vote is your business.
If democracy is your issue, though, I wouldn't vote Democrat, though. They cast themselves as stewards of democracy but they fight harder to keep Greens off the ballot than they do to beat Republicans in elections.
They are overtly anti-democratic, and that tendency has moved fascism along, not helped to stifle it. Democracy doesn't mean 'freedom to vote Democrat'. It means freedom to vote the party you want, and as a Green party supporter, they actively work to suppress my voice.
can we be friends?
Believe it or not, Greens are a bigger threat to Democrats losing than republicans are.
Democrats are a larger threat to Democrats losing than Greens or Republicans. 'We are not Trump' is not a platform
It absolutely is. Trump isn’t a person. As long as most of the GOP is emulating him, Trump, himself, is an ideology.
“We are not Trump” is shorthand.
Not that that is literally a part of anybody’s campaign. Biden has had a pretty accomplished first term given the split Congress and the stacked court. That “we are not trump” is some phrase coined against dems by some right wing blogger years ago.
You wouldn’t know that from watching the news, since every channel picks and chooses what they show and they are building their brands not just through the news that they are airing, but also by the news they are not.
Yeah but one half went to college and formed their opinions in open debate and discussion, graded work, with accomplished authors and scholars, the professors, and their peers. Republicans did their own research or went to the school of "hard knocks."
It's supposed to be that in the land of the blind, the one eyed man his king. In the land of Republicans they would poke out the man's eye and claim sight is deep state propaganda. "Don't look up!"
I would argue that those who graduated from the school of hard knocks are why we have labor laws and unions. It wasn't college educated people who were the drive behind unions.
Strike: Strikes in the United States
I highly doubt railroad workers, miners, steel workers, and auto workers all had post-secondary education. If it wasn't for them striking and pushing for better wages. We would be far worse off. Without better wages, post-secondary education would be a pipe dream for money.
National Association for the Protection of Labour
John Doherty (trade unionist)
I doubt someone who had been working since ten years old in 1800s would have any education other than an extremely basic one. Yet, John Doherty pushed to create a national union to fight for a better future.
What Made the Battle of Blair Mountain the Largest Labor Uprising in American History
Seems like uneducated coal miners were far more progressive.
I will agree that post-secondary education has been a overall boon for progressive politics and for a better society. It can be argued that the chance to get post-secondary education would never be possible if it wasn't those who graduated from the school of hard knocks. It wasn't until the uneducated working class fought for better a living, post-secondary education was allowed for those with money.
Yeah, you're right, some. It was trial lawyers and Ivy Leaguers who won labor rights in America, they argued the cases in courts and in public, and in Congress. Upton Sinclair went to Columbia. FDR went to Harvard and Columbia Law. Who organized the strikes?
Union Activists such as:
César Chávez - Folk hero and symbol of hope who organized a union of farm workers.
Eugene V. Debs - Apostle of industrial unionism.
William Green - Former AFL president who moved the federation toward "social reform unionism."
Mother Jones - "The most dangerous woman in America."
Lucy Randolph Mason - Social reformer dedicated to workers' rights and racial justice.
A. Philip Randolph - Organized the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters and fought discrimination in national defense.
None of these people had any post-secondary education yet were major players of the labor movement.
Post-secondary education doesn't always equal progressive politics. There is the Chicago School of Economics, which according to Paul Douglas:
There is also conservative post-secondary educational institutes such as: Brigham Young University, Liberty University, Bob Jones University, etc.
While post-secondary education has been a tremendous boon. I really don't care if they have post-secondary education or dropped out of elementary school. What metric we should be using is are people able to see the injustices in the world.
And then they sat through 2-4 decades of Democrats actively voting against the interests of their constituents, ignored it, and vote for them anyway despite the evidence right in front of their eyes.
Democrats aren't our friends. They stab us in the back while Republicans stab us in the front.
We vote for Democrats because the alternative is getting Republicans. The voting system doesn't let third parties win. I wish it did. The lesser of two evils is still less evil inflicted on me at the end of the day.
If Democrats lost because people on the left refused to vote for them, they would be forced to change. Problem is everyone claims each election is an existential crisis (doubtful) so you're never allowed to withhold a vote or vote third party.
Nothing personal against Mike Pence, but there's a part of me that thinks it would have been better if he'd gotten in that car and been disappeared.
An assassinated vice president would have forced Biden to crack down on fascism harder.
But without effective leadership, the problem's gotten worse.
If that has happened, I doubt we would have a president Biden or an upcoming election.
I don't think that's accurate.
Every other aspect of the attack was unsuccessful, and not only that, but pathetically so. But if they'd manage to assassinate a VP, Biden and his administration would not have been able to simply ignore it. They would have had to act, even if it pisses off the billionaires.
Pence stopped Trump’s group delivering the fake electors to steal the election. If Pence disappeared Trump would have never left office.
Pence made the the last minute stand to save our country. Terrible viewpoints and politics, but at the end he did his job
Because Dan “Potatoe” Quayle told him to not go along with the coup.
Mike fucking Pence and Dan fucking Potatoe Quayle saved our Democracy and the US Democratic Republic.
What a timeline.
Still,.. there are many many timelines where it worked, Trump is the Orange King, and I’m dead now from being put up against a wall; so I’ve got that going for me, which is nice.
If they would have assassinated Pence on J6, before the certification, someone else would have stepped in, most likely Grassley. He would have accepted the alternate slate of electors and Biden would not be president.
I guess the law says the senate is supposed to choose someone if the vice president is unavailable to access president of the senate.
Man, I had forgotten about that car thing. I don't know. They wouldn't have harmed him. They would have delayed him enough that he couldn't certify the vote. Then Trump had plans to use the military to seize voting machines (after which he would have obviously lied about whatever his goons found).
The Joint Chiefs memo was very comforting regarding the transition but it came on January 12th and cited the Congressional certification in saying "we will evict him with force on January 21." If the certification didn't happen, the transition and the election would have remained uncertain.
I think there is very little appetite in Washington for such uncertainty, but one side of the aisle is treasonous and would gladly acquiesce.
remember Adolf Hitler tried to start an insurrection, got caught, thrown in jail, wrote a book, and then got elected and started World War 2.
And remember how much Trump loves dictators.
Ya but....9/11 was brown people, 1/6 was white people.
There is absolutely a difference in how Americans view the people involved. That's only been reinforced with this incident.
imo the genocide in Gaza is far worse
America is geopolitically isolated on its support for Israel, to the point where it's rapidly accelerating the collapse of its hegemony. We might lose Turkey in NATO, we might lose Egypt's cooperation on migration, dedollarization is accelerating, normalization between Israel and the surrounding neighbors is dead, international law is a joke, and this is happening at the same time that French imperialism in Africa is also collapsing with coups and revolts.
It's Joever
EDIT Downvoting me won't bring back American prestige you fuckin libs. What is Biden going to do when South Africa's suit against Israel finds them guilty of the crime of genocide? When America is compelled by international law to take available actions to stop genocide?
I'll tell you what he'll do! Nothing. When he does, the rest of the world is going to continue leaving America behind. Good riddance. 😜
They're not down voting you because they're liberals. They're down vote you because you're likely an accelerationis hypocrite. With shitty unconstructive hot takes and zero actual solutions.
An accelerationist would advocate voting for Trump to hasten to collapse of America. I'm not doing that. I'm just not voting for Biden.
Hell, I'm voting down ticket Democrat in case Trump wins and they need to obstruct his agenda! Hardly accelerationism.
I have a proposal, stop sending weapons to the fucking genocide, stop trying to use the military to protect a genocide. It's not a poster online doing this, it's our fucking government accelerating things you twat.
Love when a quisling shows up to say I'm the threat
Here's a proposal for you. As a non linenist Marxist and socialist I agree. As do many Democrats and liberals even. The thing is, our goals have to be realistic and achievable. And realistically what's achievable is likely either a Biden or Trump presidency. And believe me things will be worse under Trump. For democrats to be able to make any sort of positive change they have to be in control. Even if that means a flawed candidate like Biden.
Had I seen the name of the person I replied to. I either probably would have just downloaded and not replied. And definitely would not have used the term likely hypocrite. It's a 100% thing with them. And likely with a twat like yourself. U ml are like perpetual 10-year-olds. Your own worst enemies and saboteurs. And a threat to everyone else.
Abolition wasn't realistic or achievable until we fought a civil war over it.
Not advocating anything! Just something to think about.
Wait until you learn that the republican agenda will keep doing the same regarding gaza.
That's why I'm not voting for them. 🙄
Let me guess third PaRtY
No, I'm voting for Hillary Clinton. It's still Her turn!
Sure, and that hillary clinton is with you in the same room?
If you mean Bill's wife, she is not running.
You can write in anyone you want dawg
And yet the majority is conservative.
America's not going down without taking everyone with them.
They're crazy!
America is taking everyone with them anyway! See the latest climate summit for an example.
I’m more concerned about the American so-called communist who live in their mommy’s basements and troll online.
You're concerned about something you made up more than runaway climate change. Cool!
Very American.
You’re assuming my nationality.
Not everyone who uses Lemmy is American.
They only make up 4% of the world population in fact.
where did they say anything about your nationality?
Troubles reading or comprehending?
you should go back and read.
Explain it to me, big mouth.
they didn't do what you are accusing them of doing.
No, I'm telling you that you post like an American and your politics are like that of an American.
Also, you assumed a lot of shit about me? My parents are passed, I'm a factory worker and live in a trailer, fuck off.
When did I assume things about you?
🙄
America is the only country in the world with a nuclear first strike policy, and to have used nuclear weapons on civilians. The best thing that can happen for the rest of the world is for it to fall to internal power struggles.
Not quite true, have you heard of the Semipalatinsk Test Site?
I have, and I would say that the circumstances/implications are very different. One was the unforseen negative health impacts of a nuclear test site the other was the use of nuclear weapons on two population centers.
Also that's whataboutism I think lol. We're talkin about US crimes
No you are, I'm talking about whatever the fuck I want to thank you very much.
Which is pivoting to USSR bad propaganda in a thread about how the real issue in everyones minds should be the ongoing genocide in occupied Palestine?
Yeah I'm calling that whataboutism lmao
You can call it whatever you want to.
You said something wrong I called you out.
No need to get all pissy about it, it wasn't anything personal.
No, I said that America is the only country to use nuclear weapons on a civilian population. You gave me some bullshit about a side effects from a test site 'counting' as if that carries the same weight as literally evaporating hundreds of thousands of people in an instant.
I gave you an example of another country using nuclear weapons against civilians and you are taking it much too hard.
Learn from it and take the L. Its not like you lost credibility at your super cool club because you were wrong once.
I think bernie sanders needs to learn the word 'ceasefire'
The US has the only nuclear first strike policy and has demonstrated its willingness to evaporate living humans with nuclear weapons in order to dominate as much as the world as it can for capitalist extraction. It would be best for the rest of the world if it fell apart and silently faded into the background.
LoL. Best wishes champ.
As an outsider, I find American obsession over Jan 6th to be absolutely bizarre. At worst it was a riot. How exactly is a riot at the capital going to cause a coup? I'm guessing you too probably have overblown Jan 6th concerns but peoples response to your comment only confirms my thoughts. People are so entrenched in maintaining the "most dangerous thing since the civil war" that they are willing to consume their own over the smallest disagreements.
Also, these people claiming Trump would be worse in Gaza, but it's not clear the US would be worse in Gaza if Trump won, the US has put up zero road blocks currently and with Trump in the Whitehouse the democrats would actually push back against the genocide because Trump is now president. Plus more negative press from the corporate media, again, because Trump is in charge. Not saying it's the most likely case, but it can be argued.
Yeah the riot had no realistic chance of success. A much more realistic coup will be one done by the 6-3 Supreme Court!
I still think it's fair to call them insurrectionists and treat them as such, but it was hardly "worse for America and the world than 9/11"
Their continued refusal to acknowledge that it was a crime, and the normalization of criminal conspiracy and use of political violence to chill efforts to hold people accountable... all amounts to organized crime masquerading as legitimate politics
I'm still shocked to this day that police weren't mowing people down as they tried to force their way in. By not doing so, they basically said, "this is fine" IMO.
Some of them on camera got caught removing the barriers and ushering them in.
"Some of those that work forces, are the same that burn crosses"
It's clear some people haven't seen the videos that have come out: quite a few people were let in by police. There is also some number of "arrested" people who turned out to be police and there is some evidence of them agitating the crowd.
I've got to admit, having seen similar tactics at the G20 protests in Toronto that resulted in total authoritarian overreaction, I'm now reading this telling of Jan 6 as an insurrection with skepticism.
LoL. This is the stupidity that you get from watching Fox News and their ilk. Totally debased from reality.
I don't watch Fox News, nor am I American.
It doesn't take a genius to see Jan 6 is more complicated than "chuds attacked the capitol". "Lefty" mainstream media in America is just a different flavour of neoliberal shit slung by an opposing oligarch. American politics and media are just IRL WWE but with actual stakes and these psychopaths on all sides don't care who they hurt.
Examples of the IRL WWE in action on the "left": Kyle Rittenhouse, Nick Sandmann, Johnny Depp. On the "right": election interference, welfare queens, Planned Parenthood rumors.
As hard as this will be for you to accept, you're being sold lies just the same as the people you mock for being uninformed.
I'd rather take a principled stance here and protect people's rights even if I find those people and their actions distasteful, than create a precedent and make those rights harder to protect and uphold later. Some of what happened here is entrapment and its bullshit.
That's a lot of words to say nothing
God you people are morons
Ok let me simplify it for you: the story you've been told is just as fake as the Fox News story. Hope that helps.
And you have some truth you want to lay on us, or is this just a broadly conspiratorial statement?
This may be an ESL thing, but your comment communicated no information. Seems to be randomly chosen words with small chunks of your opinion peppered in. But the comment itself makes absolutely zero sense.
So this was a left wing plot and for the first several hours, as Republicans begged Trump to do literally anything and he refused, he was actually doing what in your mind? Fighting a hidden battle against the deep state? All evidence suggests that Trump was more than OK with what was happening as it furthered his goals and supported his many other schemes of fraud, deception, and intimidation in order to remain in power.
no one is saying it was a left wing plot
Sure lol. Plenty of Republicans have blamed Antifa. But call it what you want, left wing plot, deep state plot, whatever. Whatever it is, it must be a master class in false flag operations considering it played right into everything that Trump had been broadcasting, desiring, and preparing for. They got him to play right along, vocally support the rioters, and withhold any assistance for the targets? Truly the greatest conspiracy of all time.
no one in this thread is saying it was a left wing plot. you're tilting at windmills.
Like I said, call it whatever you want. It's still stupid.
I have a flat earth to sell you!
So you’re saying the Police are complicit with Trump and his violent right wing extremists?
I watched it live. the more aggressive chuds are bad guys, but so are Congress and the capitol police and federal prosecutors and the fuckin media. letting the chuds go is good precedent for my freedom. siding with the police state is bad for my freedom. I don't need to agree with the chuds to keep shouting "fuck the police"
This is exactly where I'm at. Taking a principled stance here means we protect our own rights down the road, which I think are far more valuable than jailing some gullible idiots.
If it had been a liberal mob, we'd be marking the anniversary of the January 6 massacre, and it'd be a holiday for Republicans.
This. When I first heard I imagined they'd set up a few MG nests and show they weren't fucking around. I was quite surprised by how little a reaction, especially from the most gun happy country
They were the right colour.
They also had the right political views.
I feel like there's a major attribute of most of the crowd that affected this...
The seditionists were likely well armed, so firing at them might have felt like suicide.
Even the Republicans who admit Trump was at fault for the events of 1/6 still say they'll vote for him.
It isn't about right and wrong to them, its about getting a fascist in the White House to reorder society into their prescribed hierarchy. Different factions have their grudges: trans people & other sexual minorities, POCs, foreigners, religious minorities, and leftists.
The hatred is what unites them, but they're too goddamn stupid to see that fascism always eats itself in the end because it constantly needs a new target upon which they can focus their blinding rage.
It's extremely blatant at this point and they aren't trying to hide it. Support for Republicans is support for American fascism and Christian nationalism at this point. We really need to start acting like it. You wouldn't hire a Nazi. You wouldn't go on a date with one, or allow one in your bar or invite them to thanksgiving. America could defeat Nazis again without lifting a finger, but everyone is too fucking afraid that uncle Marty might get upset to take direct action in their own lives. So we'll end up back to fighting them in the streets one day.
“When and if fascism comes to America it will not be labelled ‘made in Germany’; it will not be marked with a swastika; it will not even be called fascism; it will be called, of course, ‘Americanism’.”
My MAGA dad keeps telling me it was an inside job by the Democrats. He's saying everything was filmed way in advance by actors and everything was peaceful because of this mystical "new evidence" coming out; all the cops were a-part of the FBI, CIA, ect.
QanonCasualties. I’m sorry for your loss.
my parents are like this. i have never taken them seriously regarding anything
No it's just poisoning the people that have no logical thinking and believe anything Trump says.
You’d be surprised. I know personally people who traditionally support the GOP but despise Trump who believe a bunch of the bullshit around January 6 because they hear it from their circles. Like how Antifa was involved.
Have you asked them why antifa would want to delay kicking Trump out of the white house?
They would just claim it was to 'make the them look bad' or something similar. That's the beauty of bullshit; it's like a perpetual avalanche. It's overwhelming and incredibly difficult to counter.
I'm not a conservative republican, but I do agree not all right wingers are bad, we have a representative democracy because what works for me in my medium sized city dosent work for Matt in New York, or Jerry in BFE Montana. It's the division that the partisan politics thats truly hurting us all.
Consider that you inevitably consume some propaganda yourself, but one never can see it, until maybe many years after.
Those people don't want to be fools too, but they don't see it happening.
The narrative around this event has been downplayed so much that it feels like a non factor for Trump. If it was anyone else in trouble for this there wouldn't be so much debate.
I think people are too literal when trying to understand each other. If someone says they believe in god, it means they identify as someone who believes in god. If someone says they think the election was stolen, it means they identify as someone who thinks the election was stolen. You don't defeat this with direct education / facts, you give these people an out. They need identities that are constructive and based in reality. Friends, family, culture... it all needs to be rewritten. Then they'll "believe" in reality.
So why don't they adopt an identity based in reality like the rest of us?
Is it because they want to hate demographics and the one media that supports that pushes irrational thought because their core components are irrational and it's easier to control them like that? I'm actually asking, because that's my best guess.
Unfortunately, yes. Main Street never came back with Wall Street and Hillary never set foot in the rust belt. They're hurt and afraid. I'm compassion fatigued to give a pass on Nazism but this is their explanation.
Nazis don't get a pass. People who advocate for violence against people they don't like don't get a pass. IDGAF. I've tried being open and receptive and all that (this "offramp" idea,) but at least here in the Bible belt all the bigotry and hate is tied directly into the religious suspension of disbelief and they're not interested in entertaining any ideas that aren't from their Fox News (or wherever) prophets.
Because reality is a neverending nightmare.
Nobody has the time for that.
That's an excellent point and probably why things only continue to get worse
You have to drink the poison willingly.
Not necessarily.
Or maybe it was just another glaring reminder that the public are that fucking braindead. Enough to truly buy into said propaganda. I guess it's just boredom anymore.
Point being, they'll doing it again if given the chance.
It isn't. Jist the dumb cunts that think trumps so pure. It was aired live on national TV if facts and literal live evidence doesn't sway them nothing will. Not even Trump fucking Ivanka on live TV would.
Like half of America is basically braindead.
https://youtu.be/WDUIX2-akuQ
It does seem like it hovers around 50 percent but there are other factors. Some of that 50 percent knows how to manipulate the brain challenged for their own personal or political benefit. Others might have the capacity to use logic and reason but were raised not to. Or are so stubborn and righteous that they seek only validation to confirmation bias.
Do you belong to that half?
What is the expectancy of you answering "yes" and the trustworthiness of your answer?
Need to start dealing with these people like nazis
Give them good jobs at NASA and other government agencies?
They aren't that smart sadly. At least the SS officers were insanely smart. Though they should have been gassed or shot.
I think we'd have enough bullets to just shoot them all, we wouldn't need to use gas chambers for them, that would be much less convenient.
Why isn’t the news covering the prosecutions of those involved in thr coup the way it covered the coup itself? If you want to convince Americans this was bad, show them the people being sent to jail over and over again.
That may backfire and make them martyrs.
Because the coup caught them all unawares and they had to cover it because they didn't know what was going to happen.
Then months later they've had time to listen to their overlords and get the new PR spin narrative ready to feed to the masses.
Three years later, the ring leader and main benefactor is still free and openly lying.
This country is a joke. Literally incapable of defending itself from the inside. The US is beyond pathetic and will go down in history as such. We are so capable yet choose corruption.
People acted stupid and violently. But I think the "insurrection" language isn't helpful when people on the right are fed stats about it that make that seem like propaganda, especially considering the violent riots in Seattle and other places not that long before. Like only three civilians were found with guns. And there is video of people being peaceably let into buildings.
I'm not saying people shouldn't be prosecuted. They fucked around and found out. Good. But a real right wing insurrection would have more than three guns. I'm expecting this will be removed though, have to control the dialog and making it an insurrection is crucial to the reelection plan! Fuck Republicans but fuck Biden too.
Trump supporters stormed the building in an attempt to obstruct Congress voting and forcibly have them change what they are doing (certify Trump instead of Biden).
It isn't an insurrection because it was violent enough or because they were unruly enough (a bloodless coup is still a coup). It's an insurrection because its aim was to seize power, unlawfully, in this case for the guy who lost the election. Whatever riots happened with no political goal or agenda to overthrow the government are irrelevant. However violent or unpleasant they were, they are not described as an insurrection because they aren't and insurrection
Just wait; if a Republican wins the next election, the democrats will be crying about voter fraud and a stolen election. It is the great circle jerk of American Politics.
It's quite a speculation. Democrats haven't lost (or won) any 2024 election yet.
That said, let's try to think how elections are "stolen". First of all, i define stolen as irregularities in counting votes. People voting twice or on behalf of someone else is unheard in the...human history (why? Because it's hard, a villain needs to find, one by one, millions of votes for making any meaningful impact on elections)
For counting irregularities it takes two things (1) that the primary system for counting is corrupted and (2) control mechanisms are corrupted and/or ineffective.
Only incumbent can influence (1) because only incumbent has power at the time of election while (2) is even more complex and, by design, neither incumbent (nor opposition parties) have full control of control mechanisms. So, realistically, only incumbent may have a chance to corrupt the system. In 2020, indeed, incumbent (Trump) tried to influence the counting system and failed because of the control mechanisms (e.g. state officials, even republican state officials, refused to comply because they knew their internal control mechanisms would not have allowed them).
Now in 2024 the incumbent is democrats so, if anything, only republicans may speculate irregularities.
But anyone can say anything. I may say that i am billionaire but not for this reason the bank must give me 1B$ cash. I have to demonstrate to be billionaire.
So, to recap, in 2024 onoy republican can reasonably accuse of irregularities and, in that case, they must demonstrate that there were these irregularities.
Three months after Genocide Joe committing mass murder, all the Democrats are doing is focusing on Trump.
Genocide Joe needs to go to prison for life and rot there. Filthy Zionazi scum.
You're the reason this article exists..
Why
For one, thinking that the current president is a mass murderer. His choice in supporting Israël is... Not good. But I value human lives so any choice to join a war or genocide or something is bad in my eyes.
Second ... I mean, zionazi? Really? You don't even know what both words apart mean, clearly.
Third. Even if it was all true, you are still just screaming nonsense. Nobody takes you seriously in that state. What are you trying to prove?
Zionists and Nazis are the same thing.
Genocidal maniacs that believe they are the Ubermensch and want to expand their Lebensraum by committing genocide and any person outside their group.
Or are you denying that israel is committing genocide?
Nazis were cribbing off of Manifest Destiny and the reservation system. Israel is just the 51st state.
From page 64 of the current South African genocide charge against israel.
Israeli Army reservist “motivational speech”: On 11 October 2023, 95-year old Israeli army reservist Ezra Yachin — a veteran of the Deir Yassin massacre during the 1948 Nakba — reportedly called up for reserve duty to “boost morale” amongst Israeli troops ahead of the ground invasion, was broadcast on social media inciting other soldiers to genocide as follows, while being driven around in an Israeli army vehicle, dressed in Israeli army fatigues:
“Be triumphant and finish them off and don’t leave anyone behind. Erase the memory of them. Erase them, their families, mothers and children. These animals can no longer live. . . Every Jew with a weapon should go out and kill them. If you have an Arab neighbour, don't wait, go to his home and shoot him . . . We want to invade, not like before, we want to enter and destroy what’s in front of us, and destroy houses, then destroy the one after it. With all of our forces, complete destruction, enter and destroy. As you can see, we will witness things we’ve never dreamed of. Let them drop bombs on them and erase them.”
From page 64 of the South African genocide charge against israel.
Sure seems some Nazi shit to me.
I recommend reading American Holocaust, Lies My Teacher Told me, A People's History of the United States, or any other account of the bloodthirsty freaks that genocided the Natives. The things America did inspired the Nazis, who then inspired the Zionists. It's all the same.
You stupid bitch, you remember how many us citizens died under trumps watch when covid first hit because he was negligent? I sure as hell do. Fuck you an every son of a bitch like you. What's sad is I don't like Joe. But he's no where near as incompetent as Trump. And all you can do is spout bullshit you know isn't true because your bitch daddy didn't get reelected and cried like a fuckin toddler cause he didn't get a candy bar at Walmart. I'm sick of little bitches like you.
Imagine being so America brained that Genocide Joe committing mass genocide on little children isn't relevant. Because they are brown of course.
Cultist shit.
Just 3 years after the January 6 attack, the "harm reduction" candidate is aiding (rushing weapons to, no less) an active genocide, using multiple aircraft carrier groups to fend off the second-poorest country in the middle east, because they are attempting ( and succeeding at) a blockade on the genociders, demanding a ceasefire.
Yeah I'd say there's a lot of propaganda about January 6 if that's where your attention is.
Today on, actual leftist, or right wing Poe's law troll: will voting for Trump end Israeli occupation of Gaza? Call 1800-OBV-IOUS to share your thoughts
I'm not voting for Trump, I'm writing in Hamas. Honestly incredible that democrats feel like they're entitled to my vote.
You are writing in an organization which openly calls for the extermination of Jewish people?
The end to the Jewish settler-ethnostate. They can participate in representative democracy with the rest of the Palestinians. Or are you trying to imply that anti-zionism is antisemitism?
You're literally trying to guilt trip me into voting for the person supporting an actual genocide
Secular representative democracy, right?
Would be an improvement over the settler ethnostates apartheid government.
Ah perfect, because that was the status quo of the Palestine Mandate - to govern Palestine via a bicameral legislature comprised of separate Muslim and Jewish houses. And I assume you know which side accepted this proposal and which side violently rejected it?
Yeah, because they were rejecting the settler-colony. How about zero settler states and 1 state for everyone that isn't an ethnostate?
This was pre-Israel. Partition was only considered because Arab Palestinians refused secular democracy. But as a student of history, you knew.that already.
Not sure what you're trying to accomplish here, is your position that ethnostates are good, or that US taxpayers are not complicit in genocide?
My point is that you claim to want secular democracy, and then you hold a double standard when it comes to Palestinian Arabs explicitly rejecting your solution. If you can convince Hamas to agree to secular unification then they will give you the Nobel Peace prize every day for the next 100 years. But this is not some big brain moment. Democratic unification has been tried. Democratic partition has been tried.
Just imagine that the republican agenda will keep the things as they are regardless of whoever is in power.
So yeah the president is wrong in this one, but the gop is wrong in this one and in almost everything they do.
I don't view the democrats as credible actors for improving things. Joe Biden still owes me $600 ffs.
Everything shitty that got started under Trump, finished under Biden. They're literally cutting a deal with republicans over the border to get weapons to a genocide faster.
Lol, just remember who had the majority of the house. Basically you are complaining for something that the republican party has thr majority of power to stop and yet they don't do it. Funny if you ask me.
I don't fucking care about which fucking rightwing party had which percentage of the house, it's not like any of them are actually trying to get anything done besides writing fat checks to weapons manufacturers. If we can have an election and then the opposite of the election happens in policy it sounds like we have a pretty worthless fucking democracy and nothing worth defending.
Biden could simply not arm the apartheid ethnostate which is ethnically cleansing Palestine.
Instead he's sending aircraft carrier groups to prevent Yemen from attempting to apply pressure for a ceasefire by blockading.
Sure bud, but the bOtH sIdEs argument is not good at all.
But tell me, under the other parry, would things be different?
Only the rhetoric would be different, the policy outcomes would be the same. I have a lot of negative emotions associated with having a bunch of soulless monsters pretending like they're somehow advancing the cause of LGBT rights by dumping weapons on a genocidal apartheid government.
Again the bOtH sIdEs argument is really bad in this case, because you know, I don't see one side removing rights of a sector of the population.
The hypocrisy here is the fact that many conservatives try to pass the blame 100% to the party in power even if the other party boycots them.
This sentence makes no sense, please do better.
The democrats are literally helping in the removal of rights of an entire fucking population what the fuck are you talking about.
Nah, they don't. The republican party is the one who does that, just look at the abortion rights. You just don't have to lie like that.
They're literally deploying multiple aircraft carrier groups to keep Yemen from blockading Israel, demanding a ceasefire- and end to the genocide. Biden is the one keeping this genocide going, and like it or not, the people Israel is killing are losing their human rights- all of them.
Democrats are cutting a deal with the republicans to give them what they want on the border so they can get more weapons to Israel faster. I don't see how these aren't just two right wing parties.
Sure bud, the democrats are the only ones.
Nah, biden only wants the status quo, is an idiot for doing that, but this is a matter that also the republicans are helping, just ask yourself why they didn't stop the sell of weapons to israel? they didn't.
Lol, you are just insane, anyway the republicans are the ones that give everything to keep israel armed, so don't lie.
Oh the poor Houthi rebels doing Iran’s bidding and attacking international commerce, they’re such victims. Poor guys are going to be red mist soon. Total bummer, said literally no one except shills.
Heroic Yemeni military acting on the Responsibility to Protect, doing whatever is in its power to stop the ongoing genocide. Every country should be doing what Yemen is doing and demand a ceasefire in Gaza.
US global legitimacy is going down the fucking toilet and you have nobody but yourselves to thank for it.