Voters don't care about the economy as long as their cost of living situation is worse.
I suspect it's booming because the cost of living situation is worse
Biden has called out the greed of businesses, but we've seen no action from the government to rein them in.
How is Biden supposed to have done anything to rein in corporate greed when he's stuck with a Republican controlled house that refuses to even entertain the faintest notion of the slightest hint of the merest idea of reining it in?
Come on, it's not like Republicans are against their own bipartisan immigration deal because it would be good for Biden. I'm sure they'll work with him on the economy...
Oh.
The president needn't do a damn thing. The People need to protest outside of Citizens United office. Its what we need to do. Tear the structure from the Earth and the occupants along with it. Cast them to Tatarus where they belong.
Citizens United
1006 Pennsylvania Ave SE
Washington, DC 20003
Office: (202) 547-5420
Fax: (202) 547-5421 info@citizensunited.org
How is protesting in front of the office of a random right wing political group in DC going to accomplish anything? They won their court case a long time ago so they seem kind of irrelevant now.
Oh, you mean the people who got Money = free speech codified into law? You dont see how that would help? It shows we know. We know who you are and what you did. And we dont accept it.
No, I don't see how that helps anything. They already know we know. They have been protested before and it didn't change anything, how is it going to have any impact on anything to do it again? You could burn their office down and nothing will change, it's just a random office belonging to a random political group. They aren't even really relevant beyond the case they won back in the day so what's so special about their office now?
Threaten to nationalize any business that extorts with the defense production act. Cant have good conscriptees if they are malnourished and mentally ill.
Lets get creative.
Does that mean that bidenomics is actually the work of the republican controlled house? I don't see how biden can get credit for a supposedly amazing economy but at the same time be powerless to do anything because of congress.
He can do some things. He can't do others.
For example one of the big checks on corporate greed is the FTC, which is independent of the executive branch's direct control. All he can do is nominate people to the FTC, which has to go through the legislature. At the moment, the FTC has a majority Democrat leadership, which has resulted in things like the blocking of Amazon's acquisition of iRobot, the attempted blocking of the Albertsons-Krogers merger, the upcoming ban on noncompete clauses, and other reining in of corporate greed.
Biden can't tell the FTC "you have to impose fines on x corporation". All he can do is appoint the kinds of people he thinks would support fines on x corporation. And like I said, even that is subject to the legislature's approval.
Biden can modify student loan programs, but (according to the courts) he does not have the power to wholesale forgive student loans. He's doing what he can, but he's not a dictator. We have 3 branches of government for a reason.
Biden just doesn't seem to put up much of a fight, whereas Trump was pushing ahead with ridiculous actions like his Muslim ban, whether or not a court would uphold it. Biden's inaction in a number of areas are excused with "if he tried then it would be stopped." At least try. And again, if Biden is so powerless, how can he take credit for the economy?
Did you see the headline on your own link?? "BIDEN ON BORDER WALL: 'I HAD NO CHOICE'"
Biden’s inaction in a number of areas are excused with “if he tried then it would be stopped.”
Yes. Why the fuck do you want him to bang his head against a brick wall? That's stupid and if you want it, you're stupid. Things he can do, he should do. Things he can't do, he shouldn't waste time on.
if Biden is so powerless, how can he take credit for the economy?
Well, two things. First, like I said, he does have some measure of control over some things, and he has popular influence. But second, and more importantly, presidents always get praise or blame for the economy under them regardless of how incredibly stupid it is to believe that the president can personally make the economy good or bad. So, political reality is, if he has a good economy, he has to claim it, since if there's a bad economy, he'll be blamed for it.
There is nothing that forces Biden to waive federal laws. Biden had a choice, he just decided to make this one for whatever reason. Republicans can obstruct all they want, but apparently democrats are incapable of even inaction to stop or slow down dumb republican shit like the border wall. Tell me how this makes any sense.
Biden slapping his name onto the economy by calling it "bidenomics" is a risky bet when the market is so fickle and people can feel wildly different depending on their individual circumstances. Broad numbers can hide very real problems that aren't being addressed.
It's not "for whatever reason".
Pressed about Biden’s previous comments rejecting the construction of more border wall during his presidency, the White House official said the administration had no choice but to use the money Congress appropriated in 2019 during the Trump administration.
“In order to follow the law, we had to use this money,” the official said, adding that the timing of the environmental waiver was related to the end of the fiscal year.
Why delay the inevitable? Do it, gain some political points, move on. It's gonna happen anyway, and he needed he points he got from moderates more than he needed the points from people like you.
So you admit that he had a choice in the matter, but now you claim it was needed to score points with the supposed "moderates" that love republican policy. If "moderates" want a wall, they will simply vote republican. This dumb stunt does not change that at all. I am curious what you mean by "people like you".
I meant "far leftists who make irrational demands of Democrats"
He had no choice in stopping the wall from being built.
He could claim points for not delaying it.
Both of these are true.
And do you really believe moderate Democrats don't exist?
The issue with that logic is that Dems will say they can’t get anything done but fear the substantial change that Trump can bring. Like the party’s own stance is more of the same with Biden or certainty of drastic change by voting against Biden. That does not come off like the party elites think it does. I can see how that messaging can work with say the UAW or the already rich who can claim wins during the last four, but many of us really only expected him to not be Trump after the Biden win and somehow even that bar feels missed, the man has lower approval ratings than Trump ever had.
Well thats just not true. His approval rating is very low for sure, but Trump has got him beat in that metric, he had substantially worse ratings. Still Biden might end with worse approval average if he continues downward in approval ratings, and that's kinda impressive since Biden hasn't been doing egregiously corrupt and stupid shit basically daily like Trump did. Golfing at his own resort. Putting his kids into government positions. Firing staff on grounds of "loyalty" like some mob boss. Etc etc. Biden hasn't even been impeached, let alone twice.
I don't know why you're being downloaded, you're right here. They fear that Trump is going to be a dictator rightfully, yet Biden's not allowed to use any power to help the people. That, for some reason, is where the line in the sand is.
The rate of increase is slowing rapidly: In December, prices for food consumed at home were up by just over 1 percent, according to the Labor Department. But administration officials say Mr. Biden is keenly aware that prices remain too elevated for many families, even as key items, like gasoline and household furnishings, are now cheaper than they were at their postpandemic peak.
And yet there is a general belief across administration officials and their allies that there is little else Mr. Biden could do unilaterally to force grocery prices down quickly.
“It’s hard to figure out what the short-term policy response is in this situation,” said Bharat Ramamurti, a former economic aide to Mr. Biden and an author of a report on grocery-price inflation that the progressive Groundwork Collaborative in Washington published on Friday.
I think we can expect Biden to be loud about grocery prices and grocery store profit margins, because the price of almost everything else has stabilized or gone down. He can issue executive orders that do little to directly influence prices, but any more would require legislation, and, well, the party that controls the House wants higher prices.
And yet there is a general belief across administration officials and their allies that there is little else Mr. Biden could do unilaterally to force grocery prices down quickly.
I wish I could just slap the shit out of every Democrat in charge of any sort of media relations. They're so terrible.
IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER. WHAT. YOU. DO. Good deeds do not sway voters. Spin sways voters. Media sways voters. You can literally fuck up the economy and blame your opponents for it and people will believe you if you message it right.
Democrats should work to help people not because it will win them votes but because it's the right thing to do. Democrats need to understand that words and deeds are two entirely separate things. Deeds help people. Words sway voters. The two are not related.
“Economy” is such a bullshit term here. What they really mean is stock market. The real economy is shit. Pay is shit. Healthcare is shit. Real estate is a fat hog that needs to get slaughtered already. When will the people be treated as Too Big To Fail?
Ehh, I think the economy is doing okay. Inflation is being controlled/managed. In some cases it's correcting itself.
Don't lose sight of the forest for the trees. The media in this country has been really pessimistic about the economy and blaming the admin--to the point it seemed intentionally misrepresented.
This economy could have gone the other way pretty easily especially with the billions thrown into circulation during the pandemic.
If we want to credit Presidents when the economy is bad, you need to credit them when it's good too.
If anything this admin should get credit for being stable and a source of order in all of the chaos--not the cause of it.
Ehh, I think the economy is doing okay. Inflation is being controlled/managed. In some cases it's correcting itself.
I have to agree. Some people are still certainly struggling, of course. Homelessness is still a problem in places. Many people still live paycheck to paycheck. But the economy isn't going to fully right itself in four years, especially with a hostile House that controls the purse strings.
Additionally, nothing has been done about greedflation (yet?). If Congress or Biden can figure out a way to force companies to stop tacitly colluding to squeeze more money from people, I would suspect more people would start to feel more optimistic about their finances (and the economy in general).
Greed will sadly have to wait....when your ship is sinking you gotta patch the holes first, then you can rebuild the troublesome parts.
The US is putting fingers in the holes of the dam right now and doing an okay job of it.
I believe it's more like while this ship is sinking the majority are below decks with old buckets trying to desperately bail out the rising seawarer while the rich and those in power are above deck ripping off all the planks they can to build themselves a life raft, fully intent on leaving the rest of us to drown in the sinking ship.
I like the analogy!
The one below mine is better lol.
The media is owned by billionaires and/or public traded companies. Reporting is skewed to keep the populace complacent.
Some people are already too big to fail. It's just not you or me.
Look at Trump. He's too big to fail. He's not in jail, despite numerous counts of accusations, from rigging elections to treason to sexual assault.
When you're rich enough or connected enough, you're too big to fail.
If you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100 million, that's the bank's problem.
-- J. Paul Getty
It’s worse, when it’s us g peoples donated election money for personal expenses, including legal expenses. Do the people donating understand that they’re not even getting a campaign out of their cash? Why isn’t this misuse of funds yet another criminal charge?
Considering the only information they get is within their little bubble which is mostly what Trump tells them, I think they believe they're helping the most mistreated man in history get out of his very unfair oppression to stop him from saving humanity. And by humanity, they mean America. And by America, they mean white people. And by white people, they mean cishet people.
Maybe I should have quoted or capitalized “The People”. I mean the common layperson. trump, Muskrat, and their ilk aren’t “the people”. They are the storied “1%” that depend on social welfare from our government.
Whatever the fuck they're saying on the nigntmare box means dick. I'm still poor.
It’s about jobs more than the stock market. The report says over 350k net jobs added this quarter (more than double expected) and unemployment has been below 4% for two consecutive years (not seen since the ‘60s). Plus inflation is quickly dropping and the administration is lowering costs on things where they can, putting more money in our pockets. It’s legitimately incredible what’s happened with the US economy since the pandemic nearly guaranteed a recession, according to Fox News.
We spent THREE YEARS with media of all stripes gaslighting us about a supposed incoming recession any day now. Any day now, for three years, even when the economy was doing gangbusters. Bastards.
The numbers for the real economy have been good too. The median wage rose faster than inflation in 2023 and unemployment has been consistently low, people are finding work and finally starting to earn more. Obviously things aren't great for everyone but it's going way better than anyone expected and it's heading in a good direction rather than deteriorating further like when inflation was still out of control.
Don't forget the car market as well both the used and new market has lost its fucking mind.
*jobs exist that don't pay a living wage, sending workers ever deeper into poverty and despair*
media and politicians: "LoOk At AlL tHe JoBs! BoOmInG eCoNoMy!"
You get two jobs, and you get two jobs, everyone gets two jobs!
🎵you load 16 tons, waddaya get? another day older and deeper in debt. St. Peter don't you call me cuz I can't gooooooo, I owe my soul to the company store. 🎵
"I see you still have like eight hours each day you could sacrifice to your employers, what's your excuse there?"
"That's when I eat and sleep."
"Ah, so greed and laziness. I see."
Biden’s administration has done pretty well considering all the grenades the GOP had thrown into the road.
Imagine how well people could be doing if the GOP actually cared about anyone other than themselves, rich people, or the Russians.
Biden’s administration has done pretty well considering all the grenades the GOP had thrown into the road.
people who say things like this have never been affected by any former president or the current one in a bad way and most likely do not travel around the US in any capacity
how has the economy improved under Biden? make it make sense
was it that higher minimum wage he promised then told workers not to protest and ask for better?
was it the factory jobs in the south he touted where pay and work condition standards are lower?
was it his obama style communication relief that helped citizens with things like internet bills that is now ending that only helped with about $25?
was it that national health insurance he promised that he never mentions?
yes biden has done some things but not enough or long enough or at all in some cases
everything he has done has been quartered ass at best and never good enough and always blamed on someone else when he fails to deliver like every president the US has ever had
Did you miss the part about the GOP scuppering and hamstringing every attempt by the Dems to make things better for the people?!?!
Pull your head out of your ass and look at the ACTUAL enemy rather than blaming the Dems for not walking as far as they could if the hurricane of traitorous actions by the GOP was not pushing them back at every step.
You don't have a choice tho.
The economy is rich people's yacht money, remember?
TIL grudgingly is a word. I've only ever heard begrudgingly before.
Apparently grudgingly is done with lack of interest
Begrudgingly is done with envy
TIL
Hey let me know if you guys find any extra money floating around. This economy is so good I can barely afford gas and groceries.
Brace for a lot of the magats claiming that faux is "too woke"/"too liberal" and claim they'll have to watch ONAN even harder.
It was extra hilarious when they were complaining about the environmental impact of Taylor Swift's plane. Like you admit the climate needs help, Fox?
Plus, like only her plane. How many millionaires fly in their private jet and they complain about her? Obviously they are teiggered. The bootstrap party sure likes to whine about dumb shit. Imagine if they put even half as much effort into anything productive.
It’s no different from them suddenly caring about the environment when it comes to EVs. “Mining lithium is so bad for the environment!” They post to Facebook from their lithium-battery powered cellphone.
Dangerously close to “yet you exist in society.. I am very smart.”
It would be better to just go along with them when they are incidentally correct like that instance, but push towards the logical endpoint of that thought train.
Agree with them, like, “yeah, mining lithium is fucking horrible, and it is literally impossible currently without coerced labor somewhere in the supply chain. Let’s empower the regulatory bodies in countries where lithium is mined to prevent negative externalities that currently exist only because it is more profitable.”
Or “yeah it’s fucking ridiculous how much swift uses that jet. Musk too, and Bezos too. These fucks could never ride in a jet the rest of their lives and we could take flights to vacation multiple times a year for the rest of our lives and we still wouldn’t even be responsible for 1% of their emissions output. Let’s ban private jets and make these fucks ride commuter with the rest of us.”
Except I don’t think they’re incidentally correct at all. They weren’t worried about lithium at all until it was put into car batteries. Because it was never about the lithium.
The economy is only booming for the rich, anyone trying to tell us otherwise doesn't care about our well-being. If it were doing well they wouldn't have to keep telling us, we could see it in our everyday lives.
Gas prices are down. General cost of living is stabilized. Unemployment is extremely low and the percentage of eligible workers on the sidelines is dropping. Wages are up for the lowest income levels and continue to climb despite slowing inflation. Black households, in particular, have seen a significant narrowing of the income gap, more so than they've seen in many many years. The percentage of women in the workforce is up and salaries are climbing for them as well. In fact, the post-COVID recovery has been wildly successful when you compare it to post-2008 with respect to the improvements for the poorest among us, which is precisely the opposite of what you're claiming.
Yours is purely an appeal to anecdote. The data is clear. Unfortunately, as study after study has shown, data can't compete with vibes, and we just spent the last two years with the MSM (not to mention social media...) telling everyone a recession was around the corner.
I'll tell that to the out of control housing, rising food costs and the worsening healthcare coverage and quality. Man! So glad these few things you mentioned are superficially better. There's no problems now!
/s because you know someone is gonna take it literally.
Housing costs are sky-high. Rent is ridiculous. Good luck ever trying to own a house. And yeah, cost of living went way way up and now it's "stabilized" there.
And to say wages are up is just laughable. I mean, yeah people are now being paid $15 an hour instead of $10, but what does that matter when food and housing costs increased more than that?
The data is skewed by the people that benefited from raising the price of everything during COVID-19 and then never brought the prices down.
The rich are richer and they are the measuring stick for the economy because they own all the news sources. It is dramatically worse for the poor now than it was 5 years ago.
Don't let bullshit propaganda fool you.
I feel like this CONSTANTLY happens and people just eat it. Prices skyrocket. Then they stop rising or maybe even dip a little but still remain way higher than they originally were and... Problem solved! It's stabilized! In fact prices are DROPPING! huzzah!
Makes me wonder if people are really this easily fooled or are they all just being ignored? Lol
I feel like this CONSTANTLY happens and people just eat it. Prices skyrocket. Then they stop rising or maybe even dip a little but still remain way higher than they originally were and… Problem solved!
Literally yes. Prices go up, wages go up, that's a healthy economy. Take an economics class.
If prices ever start broadly going down, prepare for a massive economic ass fucking the likes of which you've never seen and clearly can't imagine.
Yeah the economy is healthy, just not for 90% of the country.
Line go up is just a cult, nothing else.
Ideally the economy is just something you need to plan, to stay stable and anticipate environmental and population concerns. It shouldn't need to go up or down to maintain production.
This "homelessness goes up but so does GDP so it's okay" shit is unworkable, cruel and unsustainable and only benefits bezos et al
Christ alive you have no idea what you're talking about. Have you ever studied economics? At all? Or are you just posting your fee fees?
Would you go into a hospital and start lecturing doctors on how their practice is bullshit? Sure, there are probably a lot of things that could be improved, but you don't have the knowledge to speak about them. Take some courses, then come back and speak from an informed perspective.
"Planned economy" is a 12 year old's idea of how things should be.
You’re on serious damage control and spouting derivative drivel. “Take an economics class” meanwhile people who did found that set of nomics to be non sensical, because “economics” at its core isn’t about what most people think it is. Cost and worth are two separate things, and the whims of our livelihoods is decided emotionally. Not logically.
Answer my question. Have you ever studied economics in any fashion?
Yes I absolutely have. Would you care to say anything other than “study economics”? Would you care to support your bullshit or explain for those who haven’t?
For the benefit of those who haven’t studied carpentry, it’s not out of line for a carpenter to explain the trade a little.
Great. So do you understand why a moderate level of inflation is a good thing for quality of life? "line go up" in a broad economic sense.
And do you understand how profit motives spur investment which generates improvements which leads to better quality of life? "Line go up" for individual companies.
And this is a little more advanced, but also a little easier to see in the real world: do you understand why every planned economy has failed to raise quality of life as well as capitalist economies?
I would LOVE to unpack this with you right here and counter your sentiments.
Great. So do you understand why a moderate level of inflation is a good thing for quality of life? “line go up” in a broad economic sense.
The main issue I have with this is that its a self fulfilling prophecy, and that's something all economists acknowledge. The prevailing theory is that rising prices alters consumer behavior, ie making a new purchase out of fear of further price increases. Workers ask for raises to cope with rising prices. My argument is that this bad due to the circular nature of this logic. As a working everyperson, you ask for a raise to mitigate inflation, so that you can again afford goods/services, which then increases the demand, which in turns results in higher prices again. Employers decide to pass this cost on too which further inflates prices.
The issue is the lack of monitored expectations due to investor demands both in speculative and results driven investments. Take a company's debt basis or attractiveness to investors, they want the "line go up" to get a return on investments but that has to come from somewhere. In what we're seeing today we have record earnings and by all indicators record revenue growth but investors want their return, and the executive leadership in our current organizational models means they answer neither to customers nor employees but only "line go up", and that's short term at best. Cue lack of monitored expectations. On the sense of policymakers looking at inflation being too bad, their control mechanism for reducing inflation puts the hardship primarily on the working class. Ie reduce demand by firing people and putting them into poverty. The need for healthcare exists, and the facade of "but EMTALA makes healthcare accessible" does nothing to address the financial ruin a person sees by getting laid off, losing their job and coverage, all because policymakers saw that inflation was too high and it gets taken out on workers instead of having mechanisms to deal with corporate profits, which is widely acknowledged to be responsible for 40% of inflation overall, yet the control mechanism is widespread impact on those least able to absorb it.
My opposing viewpoint to the economist perspective of inflation being necessary is this concept of forcibly creating winners and losers the way that we do. People who attempt to save money lose because their savings is devalued, so we're dependent on a set of tax rules that allow us to rathole money up in 401k's/IRA's on the hope that investments outperform inflation, but anything in savings just devalues over time. Let's say you save money for major auto repairs, but in one year the repair costs jump up 20%, how fair is that? That means we have to continually adjust the financial model for vehicle ownership, and if you plug those numbers in you find that people can't afford cars where 5 years ago on median incomes they could. Meanwhile credit worthy individuals who borrow heavily benefit from debt that gets "inflated away" provided they are lucky enough to negotiate the income.
I don't know if you've noticed, but 2024 is not off to a great start, due to the interest rate adjustments, getting a job right now is hell, so the worker leverage is virtually gone. Employers are increasingly taking the "GTFO if you don't like it" approach and are even doing soft layoffs with RTO policies.
Count more than fucking beans, and also economists emotionally justify what they want to see, and the data can be interpreted many ways. I think it's a bullshit profession that causes way more harm by justifying policy that benefits the wealthy while fucking the rest of the country.
And do you understand how profit motives spur investment which generates improvements which leads to better quality of life? “Line go up” for individual companies.
Explain that to the hundreds of thousand of people finding their job redundant thanks to AI investments. I don't see how getting fired benefits people when the market isn't creating replacement opportunities for them. What's happened is that the leverage people use to enjoy in their profession just got removed, and I would posit that this mindset has created the second gilded age that we're in with a declining quality of life. Look at housing, healthcare, and education costs before telling anyone with a straight face that the above mindset lifts up quality of life for the average person. I would say that for wealthy investors and the billionaire class, it sure benefits them.
And this is a little more advanced, but also a little easier to see in the real world: do you understand why every planned economy has failed to raise quality of life as well as capitalist economies?
Look at Scandinavia and tell me the US healthcare approach is better. Look at Canada and tell me the US higher education system is better. We're already seeing competing economies that use socialism alongside capitalism to vastly improve quality of life metrics far moreso than the US. Capitalism is fine, when its regulated and heavily so. It's amazing to me that people forgot the Sherman Anti Trust Act, and why such laws got passed in the concept of "what's good for the public trust". Economics works against the public trust by being amoral in nature. Things like stock buybacks need to be illegal again, and socialism shouldn't be an ugly word. Heavily regulating conflicts of interest (see Oxley Sarbanes), anti-trust (see Sherman Antitrust), and working against the concept of "winner take all" is how we avoid despots and tyrants who got lucky enough to be born rich and sociopathic.
If you go back to the planned economy the US had during wartime, I would argue that a planned economy sows the seeds for the massive gains experienced by the bull markets thereafter (transitioning from WW2 to the 50's). Unplanned free market economies are what has been associated with the guilded age and "winner take all" concepts that dominate our worst years of depressions in history.
If his is purely anctedote, then yours is decontextualized.
Gas prices are down.
Sure. Since a high in June of 2022. The last time gas prices were at this level was June 2021. And the time before that was October 2014. Which is to say, for about 6 years, gas prices were lower than today. And just looking at the graph, they were significantly below today's level. Just to note, they have yet to return to the levels before the precipitous rise stating in December 2020.
There maybe, as you noted, vibes, but they ain't wrong.
Unemployment should be looked at with, of course participation rate which has held even for the last year, and how long people have been unemployed which has been growing slightly for those unemployed for 27 weeks or more. This also doesn't address underemployment which disporporstely effects the young and poor. Underemployment colors one's outlook for stability in the present and future.
Thankfully, Biden and others in the administration have managed this far better than 2008 for the average citizen. Not having a recession is a good thing. I've lived through several. But that doesn't mean there isn't looming concerns. Inflation is still higher than the target and instigating further disinflation is uncharted territory.
Data, in of itself, is not enough. It needs to be contextualized to develop political and social narratives. Addressing people with condescension and dismissing their anxieties as mere vibes fails politically.
I think people are expecting all the prices to return to "normal" when that's probably never going to happen, as a good chunk of the price increases are due to post-covid inflation
the largest driver of inflation during and after the pandemic is companies raising prices, and turning record profits.
Living is more unaffordable than ever. What even is your comment
I stopped reading at gas prices are down. They are up .40 the last week.
The data is clear
The gaslighting is all thats clear. All the data conflicts with your claim. Homelessness up to the highest level ever recorded, housing is unaffordable, food is unaffordable, wages are stagnant, income inequality is the widest ever recorded.
Looking pretty low to me. Speaking in terms of this week makes no sense to me.
It's almost like they cherry pick data that fits their preconceived notions...
I stopped reading at gas prices are down. They are up .40 the last week.
This is just as stupid as saying because it snowed, global warning isn't real.
No if you're going to get the first fact blatantly wrong odds are the rest is going to be bunch of bullshit too
Gas prices are down in my area, so you're blatantly wrong.
Checkmate, dumbass.
Good thing your area is the entire world. Oh wait. Turns out, on balance gas prices are not down. But you go ahead and live in that bubble of yours and pretend your name calling is doing something.
Good thing your area is the entire world.
OH MY GOD HE FINALLY GETS IT LADIES AND GENTLEMEN!
Apparently you don't though. Jesus, the willful ignorance is strong.
A lot of the Fox Business stuff is not crazy politically biased in the way the Opinion primetime stuff is. There's a lot of old rich white guy conservatism, like Mitt Romney conservative. They'll spin storylines as explanations, but not basic facts.
Just seems like people are talking past each other sometimes with Fox stuff. Same as the polling "even FOX is saying X Democrat is winning!" well yeah Fox's polling infrastructure is pretty good, it's probably because that candidate is leading.
I'd agree, but Fox Business has gotten much worse over the past few years. It has always been pro-business (duh), but it was rather reliable otherwise and had to be. The viewers cared about their investments and companies; a bias would make them unreliable.
They started changing and adding more and more right wing nutjob opinions to their reporting, though.
Gas prices are below $3 here, only spent $91 on weekly groceries yesterday, and my high interest savings accounts are sitting around 4.75%
My property taxes went up 20% but that's a local thing...
And I'll toss this in here even though you'll cry that it's not a valid metric, but my retirement accounts are at a record high
Like, what more do you want??
They probably want theirs and everyone else’s cost of living to not be a crisis.
It’s great that yours has slightly improved, it hasn’t for the majority however and continues to get worse.
But it's now getting worse at a slightly slower rate. Yay, progress!
House prices to contract down to a realistic level. Rent controls such that the price of rent is not higher than the price of a mortgage (which gives you ownership of a valuable asset, a tenancy does not).
But rent has to cover all the costs of ownership and then some, meanwhile the mortgage payment is but a fraction of that.
It doesn't, though. The owner should cover the cost of ownership, as they're the one who gets the valuable asset at the end. The tenant should pay proportionally less than this, merely the cost of them living there for a temporary period.
If you live with someone and pay towards their mortgage, you can rightfully claim a share in the equity of their house. However, if you're a tenant and pay the entire mortgage, and then some, you don't get anything. That's patently not right.
You don’t get to claim part of the equity just for living with someone and paying part of their mortgage. You would have to set up a joint venture or other business structure, otherwise you would just pay rent to the owner/ roommate like they were your landlord.
And even if the partnership was legally set up where you got a percentage for paying rent on a room in a house, unless you retroactively paid part of their downpayment, it would be an insignificant percent the home’s value..probably to the tune of 1/360th of the home’s value, minus the downpayment, minus the growth in value for however many years they have been paying on the loan, and your share would essentially be less than half of your rent going to the value of the investment due to taxes and insurance.
Most of what you are paying for on a home is taxes and insurance. My mortgage is about 65% taxes and insurance. If I were to rent my home, should I pay all of the taxes and insurance that occur in real time so the tenant has a less expensive place to live or pass that on to the renter as a cost of living in the residence?
I’m not a landlord because I ran the numbers and this just barely profitable in a best case scenario where you had nothing but great tenants, no downtime between renters, and no major house repairs, but there is a huge amount of risk with letting stranger occupy your most valuable asset. The expectation that a home owner should offer a discount on the actual cost of the home because they get to sell the house and recoup the asset value is not realistic. When you consider the amount of damage, additional maintenance, turnover costs, downtime between renters, and a whole mess of other things that cost additional money that come with renting to tenants, it is understandable why it’s hard to find cheap rent.
It sucks that this is how the system is, but housing prices have to come down and wages have to come up before this problem gets fixed, and the landlord isn’t the demon you think he is. Corporate firms buying up hundreds of houses to manipulate prices up on the other hand…
I agree that there is a lot more wrong with the system than just mortgage rates being higher than rents. The tax, fees and interests are certainly a good target for how things are wrong. With regards to damages, obviously tenants should be more easily held liable for damages they cause - and equally landlords should be more easily held liable for failing to provide a well maintained property (eg no mould).
The system is generally screwed up through and through. The people on the bottom get shat on, but even as you work your way up there's always still someone above shitting down hill. But that's no excuse for resigning and not sorting the shit out.
For starters, we need to sack all MPs and implement something closer to a direct democracy, or at least representation truly as a public service.
Also forgetting that the "then some" part is only warranted if we want an incentive for people to buy houses to rent out. If it was a socially beneficial thing to do. Society would not lose out if buying a house on a mortgage and renting it out was not a profitable thing to do.
Exactly. If it wasn't so exploitatively profitable, fewer people would do it, and more houses would be available on the market - lowering prices and giving more people an opportunity to buy and own their own home.
We’ll have to agree to disagree.
I'd appreciate if you could justify your position. I think, when you carefully consider it, you'll understand that it's skewed the wrong way and not justifiable.
If I buy a house with a mortgage, it costs a lot of money, but I can live in it right away and afterwards I have a house, which I can sell. If I rent, I only get to live in it for so long as I pay rent - I own nothing at the end. You get more for your mortgage but pay less, surely the rent should be lower and proportionate to what you're getting?
Sure, if rent was cheaper than a mortgage, people would be far less inclined to be landlords - but why should that be a given path to profit? Why should the housing supply by usurped by those who already have an excess of wealth?
Sure. The terms of the owner’s financing are none of the renter’s business. The only facts that are relevant are that the owner is willing to rent out their property at a certain price, and the renter is willing to pay that price, and both parties are entering into the transaction of their own free will. If the owner and renter are unable to agree on a price, they are free to go their separate ways. No harm, no foul.
The renter has no real choice, though. The renter can either accept the price the landlord offers, or go to another landlord who offers the same price, or be homeless. This makes the renter open to exploitation by landlords. Sure, every landlord does it - but that doesn't make it any less exploitation.
This is exactly the type of thing where government should come in and regulate. I'm saying that such regulation should position rents as lower than mortgage rates.
choosing to be wrong: it's a bold move, cotton. let's see how it plays out.
Flapjacks.
I can do Jack Black doing jumping jacks, final offer.
And hookers
$91 for a week of groceries? You either live alone or your poor family is subsisting on Top Ramen.
I just spent $86 at a Whole Foods for what will amount to this week’s groceries (which is making breakfast, lunch, and dinner for two each day). I already had many of the staple ingredients, and no Top Ramen is involved.
My spouse and I typically spend around $60-$80 a week. $90 seems kind of high honestly.
I have a family of 3 and can hit that target for a week of groceries pretty easily. What are you buying that's so expensive? I've found the price of produce, milk, and eggs have all gone down over the last few months
Where do you live and what do you eat?
That retirement account is going to mean fuckall when you retire as inflation eats up most of it.
I'll be sure to raise a fist to Biden when that day comes, and curse the wretched two party system which hath delivered me and you, apparently, such misery
Edit:but until then, I'll vote for Biden. Because honestly
I don't know why this guy's getting downvoted. Rent prices are at record high. APRs are through the roof. Groceries are getting more expensive every year. I'm even paying $20 more every month for car insurance. Sure Trump was worse but let's not act like everything is all sunshine and rainbows just because it's an election year.
Google seems t suck these days and I wasn’t able to find good data, but
I see historical graph of car interest rates peaking over 8% in November, but current advertised rates 4-7%
I see mortgage rates peaked in Sept and headed down. Most predictions I see are down or at least consistent - I didn’t see any predicting up
gas prices are much cheaper lately
my savings account t just went up again, I think it’s now paying 4.5%
Gotta admit it’s tough to sympathize with a $20 insurance increase when I just got hit with the double whammy of teenaged driver and new car. My car insurance is quintuple what it was a couple months ago😒
A shocking amount of people I know, including myself were all laid off. Ive been unemployed for 6 months. There are zero jobs in my Ruby red shithole state aside from retail.
This growth is not distributed equally.
my Ruby red shithole state
It’s really difficult not to turn this political, but yes, it seems like political leanings are a huge part of it.
Admittedly, my company is hiring mostly overseas in cheaper markets, but we are hiring, and a I’ve seen a lot of friends switch jobs to jump start stagnated pay
Thats the problem though, yes we know who's to blame, but its still up to dems to fix it.
Its not acceptable to just have them rightfully blame then throw their hands up.
Tech?
A failed college actually. Friend was in construction.
That sucks, I'm sorry. Any plans to move to somewhere with more jobs?
My family safety net is here, so it would honestly take some saving at a different job before Im comfortable starting a life somewhere else.
But eventually I may have to. In the meantime all I can do is keep applying.
imo that "safety net" is a bit of a trap. I may be biased by how well this worked for me, but when I left my shithole Southern state I had like $40 and whatever could fit in my crappy car. Couchsurfed and slept in my car for the first few paychecks of the job I got pretty much immediately when I got to California.
This has got to be an Onion headline. I mean, of course it is, but they would never in a million years admit it.
Ask not for whom the economy booms -
For only the bell tolls for thee.
I don't think Republicans get to complain about trickle down though
Great for who? Not me. Not anyone I know. Two of my close friends lost their jobs in the last few months. And tech layoffs out of control due to interest rates. Fuck off with this propaganda
Chinese propaganda gonna propaganda. Shill.
It's gotta be "USA #1" or nothing with you?
Not at all.
But I see the .ml and know that you’re almost certainly a Xi puppet.
you see that in my username? interesting.
Anyway, I see aussie.zone in your name so I guess you're a friend of ScoMo.
Scomo can burn in hell.
Well well well
Where's this .ml you're seeing?
The one at the end of your name too.
Oooh I see.
So is lemmy.ml associated with Chinese propagandists now? There was me thinking it was just the one that happened to be created by the creators of lemmy....
Clearly explains why a tiny criticism of mine of the Chinese government in Hong Kong was quickly erased and I was given a ban in worldnews.ml
Fuck Lemmy.ml and all the tankie shits.
I got banned from world news in lemmy.world so what does that say?
Dunno.
You tell me.
you're the one jumping to conclusions about entire instances
Data and firsthand personal experience.
Probably because Fox only makes good revenues when their buffoons aren't in charge to undermine their narratives with utter incompetence and pure greed.
Fox needs its viewers to want to start winning, not to be winning. That's why Tucker publicly put a stop to the Biden "crime family" claims right before the 2020 election, and resumed right after it.
Their viewership does best when their claims are not falsifiable.
There are genuine grievances in the economy; most notably perhaps the affordable housing crisis. My home's value is so fucking inflated it's not even funny. It's not worth what it is appraised for; none of these houses are. Chronic homelessness is at an all-time high.
That being said — since we are going into election year — we need to frame this not as what we see but what Republicans would normally boast of if Donnie2Scoops was in office.
They'd be boasting about unemployment
They'd be boasting about low inflation
They'd be boasting about lowering gas prices
They'd be boasting about stock-market being at an all-time high
They'd be boasting about the GDP growth-rate.
So context matters. By the standards of what Republicans usually tout, the economy is thriving. Which means they've got nothing going into an election year... Which means they're fucked.
Consider that Democrats won a midterm election during worse economic conditions in what is historically a rough midterm for an incumbent President's party. Now consider the same with the risk of Democracy on the line, abortion rights, and a strong economy.
Republicans are fucked. (But still, get 5 people you know to register and vote). Hence why they're so desperately clinging to this BoRDEr cRiSis as their only issue that's sticking — and Biden just called their bluff on it.
There's quite a few places where right and left agree on some point, but not what to do about it. It's not Horseshoe Theory, because they only meet in a single place and then run in different directions. They don't come up with the same solutions at all.
Republicans say the economy is failing, Democrats do not, but the left also thinks the economy is failing. But the left think it's failing because it does not provide a base of support for everyone and would like to fix it. Republicans don't give a shit about that and would prefer to keep pulling the ladder up behind them.
This is the thing. We have objective measures of the economy and by those measures (the same ones we'd use to say a Republican is doing a great job) the economy is doing well.
The broader left becomes something of a useful tool for Republicans to use in election years during these discussions, because while Republicans agree with leftist feelings about the economy until elected. Afterwards, those same metrics they insist are incomplete or don't count are exactly the things they'll tout again to say they're doing a great job.
Leftists need to get an objective set of metrics together and then consistently grade all policymakers on them. I also think that it's not solely (or even mostly) up to the president to determine economic policy. Presidents have an effect, for sure, but it's largely stuff passed through the Congress that impacts the economy.
Well said. In essence, perfections becomes the enemy of good. Because leftists frankly tend to be more informed on the nuances of the economy — and especially what impacts the poor and middle-class — they have more specific demands. Which is fine, but we must always remember that Republicans will never care about those things; whereas we're seeing legitimate progress and a reshaping of the Democratic platform in just the last 10 years.
People of a certain level and type of education think data and policies mean more than sentiment and messaging. But for many,t he data is secondary. You can see my comment on gas prices and unemployment being rooted in data and vibes. But the vibes for most people are what matters. And the vibes on election day are what matter most to undecided voters. I don't think either party really gets the sense of dread that most people have and may never get it.
Which midterm are you talking about? I'm assuming you're talking about the 2018 mid-term when Democrats picked up 41 seats since they lost the House in 2022. But another way of looking at the last five midterms, you see the midterms going to the party that is not the president's. So I don't think that the 2018 midterms provide a great reference point for the presidential election. Additionally, those gains in the 2018 election have slowly eroded giving control in the house to the Republicans.
In 2020, all six went Biden by less than 5%. In the 2022 midterm, Republicans gained seats in the house from Arizona, Wisconsin, and Georgia. If those three switch to Trump, Trump wins with 272. Having a record showing in California or New York does little to help with these strategic areas.
I'm not too certain what matters to the voters in these six states, but in Arizona, the BoRDEr cRiSis, as you condescendingly noted, probably matters to them. In all six of those states, you'll need a get out a vote drive to convince people to vibe with Biden. Usually those people are young and have a little more free time. But not when they see a genocide unfolding in Palestine and the Biden administration being complicit. Are the Arab Americans of Deerborn, MI going to come out and vote for Biden and Tlaib again? Will Tlaib stump for Biden? Are young Blacks in Atlanta or Philly going to come out in droves for Biden? I don't know.
I don't know what ground work the DNC has been doing, but I hope they've built a trusted network to get people to the polls. Either way, I don't think the "Republicans are fucked". It think we are looking at a close election again.
I'd wager we can simply call vibes the right-wing grip on shallow political talking-points at the national level, for which they're pretty effective at admittedly. Such is the nature that lies and bullshit are easier to spread than the complexity of truth & reality. So in that respect, sure, there are many people who don't have the vibe or feel the sentiment that things are going well — not because the data is wrong, but simply because they live in an alternate reality; an echo-chamber. A place where that data just doesn't exist.
There is, frankly, little I can think of that we can do to reach these people. On the other hand, I think Donald has already cast a wide net and those who were trump supporters remain trump supporters (minus the dead ones from old boomers dying, covid, etc.). Yeah he's making sligh tinroads with the likes of certain Hispanic populations — mostly in Florida and Texas, but Nevada is up in the air. The question is whether these inroads outpace the influx of Gen Z and Millennials who overall lean Dem.
Actually I am referring to 2022 midterms, because as you said -- the midterms tend to go to the party not the President's; and if we compare either 2010 or 2014 to 2022, then Democrats vastly overperformed in 2022, turning what was coined the "red wave," to at best a red tinkle, or even a blue tinkle depending on what you prioritize. Because of the reversal of Roe, youth showed up and offset what could've otherwise been a disastrous midterm during a rough economy. We won key Secretary of State positions, Governorships, and expanded a lead in the Senate. Yes, lost the House, true. Though not by much.
If Democratic turnout meets 2020 or 2022 levels, which it should, then I think Biden is in a stronger position now than he was in 2020 due to:
Having (and thus no longer going against) incumbent advantage.
A more united Democratic party (than the brutal 2020 Dem primaries)
Reversal of Roe being a massive boost in turnout
Being honest here: There's good reason Republicans fear a Taylor Swift endorsement and voter registration drive.
Both covid recovery and the economy are objectively better now than 2022 and overall improved across the course of Biden's Presidency
In the absence of major economic issues, I predict the priorities of preserving Democracy, Justice, and Women's Rights will rise to forefront -- especially after campaign spending really kicks off.
It's really not that big of an issue. It's no different than the "mIGRanT CaRaVaN" that Donnie tried to fearmonger with as he pulled National Guard from their Thanksgiving dinners to try to drum up hysteria... Which turned out to be nothing. Hell even of the recent MAGA convoy themselves arrived and are confused..
So, what exactly is going in favor for Republicans compared to past election cycles...? The age issue remains a constant with both Presidents. I "condescendingly" wrote it that way because it's patently a manufactured crisis. There are myriad issues that far exceed in this in impact to Americans overall. Yet I admit that the "vibe" right-wing media projects has this "BoRDeR CriSis" sticking even with some Independents and Democrats. Hence why Biden in a stroke of genius called the bluff of Republicans by giving them everything they wanted, and now they stumble to save face and figure out a way to not pass the legislation because Donald Trump told them not to because it's literally his only attack going into 2024. Thus, Biden just neutered it.
But not when they see a genocide unfolding in Palestine and the Biden administration being complicit. Are the Arab Americans of Deerborn, MI going to come out and vote for Biden and Tlaib again? Will Tlaib stump for Biden? Are young Blacks in Atlanta or Philly going to come out in droves for Biden? I don’t know.
These are pretty small groups; the BoTh SiDeS false equivalence fallacy is losing its muster as more and more people are made aware of classic wedge-driving techniques during these election cycles. At the end of the day, Biden has already significantly shifted his tone with Israel, and will these people be foolish enough to think Trump won't be an order-of-magnitude worse in his revocation of rights and complicity in genocides? (Recall, Trump said he'd block all Palestinian refugees... That really sat well with Muslims last time he tried that, didn't it?). What about Ukraine? We know Trump sucks up to Putin... Will people opt to not vote or vote for Trump, knowing he'll leave Ukraine hanging? I don't think so.
I'm not going to say this is a slam-dunk, but I absolutely am more confident now than I was in 2020, or 2022.
Swing states matter. And small, undecided groups in swing states matter most.
All the data and risk assessment mean very little. Politics are emotional. They are in the pain of today and worries of tomorrow.
I think your confidence is on shaky ground. And worry that Biden and the Democrats aren't doing enough of the right things to be seen as better than anything else.
Well I think we've both said our piece and it's just a matter of time now before speculation turns history. Perhaps more productively we need to ask how we can increase the odds Biden wins by even more, which I'm not opposed.
Well yeah all those stats look great but the problem is that inflated housing just undoes them.
China is coincidentally also facing their economic issues from their massively inflated housing market with Evergrande (again?) collapsing
For sure, completely agree it needs addressed. But like most things, the origin of this housing crisis largely falls on Republicans. Here's what I'd do if I were Democratic strategists going into this year. Pivots. Lots of pivots.
If Republicans push back on Gun Control talk, you go, "okay, if you don't want to solve that and deflect, then let's solve root problems like societal stress, education, single-payer healthcare, and guaranteed access to a therapist at any age
If republicans push back on the boRDeR cRiSis, (a) point out the net-positive economic impact these hard workers fleeing crime & poverty have while (b) pivoting to the domestic terrorist threat from right-wing extremists home-grown here in the US that are the #1 threat per the DOJ.
Combined with the border crisis and affordable housing, Democrats need to go, "Why focus on the small fish at the border and not the foreign investors from China, Japan, Russia, Saudi Arabia who've bought up large swaths of land, stifling the American dream? Hell even the King of Jordan owns 2 Beach-front Malibu properties. Look at all the real estate investors and AirBNB jacking up the prices.
Most of the housing crisis needs to be solved at the local level. Zone for density, support social housing (where the city builds the houses rather than developers), design walkable neighborhoods, and support public transportation.
The federal government can play with interest rates, regulate banks, and provide funding for cities to do the above. It certainly affects things, but it's highly abstracted from the actual work of getting more people into affordable housing.
I agree zoning is a big one.
There are some top-down factors that need to be addressed in my view; chief among them is cracking down on rental properties, and foreign investors/ownership.
Another facet to this is the deterioration of small and rural communities across the country. We have a massive amount of land and yet the population density in certain hot-spots is off the charts. In this respect, I think we need an investment in bridging the rural-city divide. That means promoting work-from home jobs with federal tax incentives, high-speed rail infrastructure akin to the Interstate system that helps link the rural communities to the cities, and high-speed internet for all akin to the investments FDR made for rural communities in bringing electricity to the masses (The REA).
The ultimate effect of this will be de-congest cities where stress is high, bring people closer to nature, and tap into unused land and foster smaller more tightly-knit communities that aren't so disconnected from the world.
Democrats aren't going to fix shit lol they're just going to bail out the banks again after the economy collapses like Obama did in 2008.
And then pepper spray the protestors on Wall Street
... That was a University police officer on UC Davis campus in California and literally had zero to do with Democrats' direction, lmao. Wtf you smoking this early?
And don't care — One side is objectively orders-of-magnitude worse. Progress or damage-control, it makes little difference to me.
Them protesting against the direction of Obama bailing out the big banks?
Seems kinda relevant.
One side is objectively worse but you don't have to spread the fairy tale that Democrats are going to ever fix anything. They are just slightly less worse.
There's also NYPD cops pepperspraying the protestors if you like that one more but the picture doesn't look as funny:
Protester Kelly Schomburg filed suit after NYPD officer Anthony Bologna pepper-sprayed a group of protesters in 2011, when Schomburg was 18 years old
I'm certain the lives of these people would've totally improved if the banks and economy completely collapsed, right? As with most things, the direction and anger of these Occupy protests — which I was a part of — had a long list of grievances including "banks got bailed out, we got sold out." But universally all these problems are squarely of Republican origin; and their solutions are almost all squarely obstructed by Republicans.
After all these years, do people forget that Democrats and Obama only had a filibuster-proof control of Congress for literally only months early in his first term? These protests came after the disastrous 2010 midterm election when many of these Occupy Wall Street protesters stayed home and let the Tea Party (pre-MAGA if you're unfamiliar) take control of Congress with the Freedom Caucus and other bullshit. So that sure did wonders for all the bankers, didn't it?
There's still a full on America+China+EU sized market crash boiling under that "booming" surface. I don't know quite how they staved it off with just Credit Suisse and two other banks imploding so far. But it's not done, it's not finished, it hasn't even started.
No idea what backroom deals were done in the financial sector to stop it all for now, but it's still coming. Otherwise corporations wouldn't still be bleeding the plebs dry with cost of living and trying to offset their shitty investments on the CBMS as well as fighting tooth and nail to keep students indebted forever, so the party can keep on rolling.
It's an utter clusterfuck. We'll see what happens in the next few years.
I gotta admit dude, this just smells like made up conspiracies. That Credit Suisse and 2 regional US bank shock happened almost a year ago. If those were emblematic of systemic issues, the failures would have continued, but they were instead just the result of bad governance and decision-making at each individual institution. The world economy absorbed those failures and moved on a long time ago.
And do you really think businesses need this excuse to raise prices? What about good old fashioned greed? Regarding prices either way, they've gone down in almost every sector of the economy besides groceries. High grocery prices definitely hurt the most, though, and I hope Biden can help influence grocers to charge less
I don't think they need excuses, no. But there is a limit to how much you can realistically get out of a stone.
The world economy has absorbed fuck all, because a lot of, if not all, bad debt is still floating around the markets, hidden in swaps overnight repo, and similar mechanics. I don't care if you believe me, it's crazy talk for sure. It doesn't even matter a single bit if I am right, because there's fuck all to do about it for most day to day people. I'm also not being alarmist in: OH BUY GOLD NOW, PREP YOUR BUNKERS!!!!
I would much rather be wrong here. Would be fan-fucking-tastic, and if I am, good. That'd be literally the best for everyone.
All I'm saying is, the underlying issues that keep leading to these market upsets aren't resolved and CS, et al are just minor break outs of a major issue that keeps bubbling and boiling. Fucked if I knew when it'll blow, but the next time it does, will be bigger than anything we've seen. Just these three banks failing in 2022 was already much larger in value than the entirety of 2008-2009 collapses.
Again, it doesn't matter what I think or say. I don't know if I'm right either, how could I? No one does. I just believe that it's much more likely that the same fucks that caused 2008, who never saw any consequences whatsoever and are still running the show, never changed their greedy underhanded and horrible ways and 2008 was never resolved either, than all of them having a change of heart and never doing anything shifty or illegal ever again, cross their hearts and hope to die.
Credit Suisse and two other banks imploding so far
Don't forget Evergrande
Here's a Plain Bagel video on why the Evergrande liquidation isn't as big a deal as lots of other people are hyping, at least to the world economy
No offense, but I'm so burnt out of this finance crap, everyone is lying, the whole thing is a pointless big casino. Reading anything about finance anywhere is as reliable as reading TASS (or Ukrainian) reports from the war in Ukraine.
Nothing ever is a big deal, then everything comes down and a bunch of flapjacks who caused it are laughing and drinking champagne above the sea of desperate people protesting the whole charade.
Economics is the one issue where I will actively not trust the experts. When so many of them were saying we were going to have a recession, I was starting to get suspicious. And it turned out, we didn't have one, even though so many were so sure of it.
Generally speaking, the experts seem to fall into groupthink and miss the actual trends. I've seen forecasters at some of the biggest oil and gas companies make the stupidest calls ever. They apparently forgot that in a cyclical business, we were due for a bust after a boom. It caught them by total surprise.
Nothing ever is a big deal, then everything comes down and a bunch of flapjacks who caused it are laughing and drinking champagne above the sea of desperate people protesting the whole charade.
Are you talking about 2008?
Yeah, those occupy pictures hit hard.
No mention of swaps, no mention of debt lending and loaning. Evergrand's impact doesn't just come from the shit it does in China with the real estate. As a publicly traded company, there are many financial instruments tied to that single stock that have nothing at all to do with the real estate side of things.
Evergrande stock has been all but worthless for over 2 years now, what shoe do you think is left to drop?
the economy isnt booming, what a crock of shit, the people are poor and therefore it is not booming
By many metrics, it IS doing much better than expected. Go look it up
instead of moaning.
BTW I see you’re on a UK instance. The Tories are an entirely separate dumpster fire, but still related in populist bullshit, to Trump.
Got to love the constant partisan distraction machine.
Congrats on the booming economy while we're helping with genocide overseas and we have record homelessness here.
Voters don't care about the economy as long as their cost of living situation is worse.
I suspect it's booming because the cost of living situation is worse
Biden has called out the greed of businesses, but we've seen no action from the government to rein them in.
How is Biden supposed to have done anything to rein in corporate greed when he's stuck with a Republican controlled house that refuses to even entertain the faintest notion of the slightest hint of the merest idea of reining it in?
Come on, it's not like Republicans are against their own bipartisan immigration deal because it would be good for Biden. I'm sure they'll work with him on the economy...
Oh.
The president needn't do a damn thing. The People need to protest outside of Citizens United office. Its what we need to do. Tear the structure from the Earth and the occupants along with it. Cast them to Tatarus where they belong.
Citizens United
1006 Pennsylvania Ave SE
Washington, DC 20003
Office: (202) 547-5420
Fax: (202) 547-5421
info@citizensunited.org
How is protesting in front of the office of a random right wing political group in DC going to accomplish anything? They won their court case a long time ago so they seem kind of irrelevant now.
Oh, you mean the people who got Money = free speech codified into law? You dont see how that would help? It shows we know. We know who you are and what you did. And we dont accept it.
No, I don't see how that helps anything. They already know we know. They have been protested before and it didn't change anything, how is it going to have any impact on anything to do it again? You could burn their office down and nothing will change, it's just a random office belonging to a random political group. They aren't even really relevant beyond the case they won back in the day so what's so special about their office now?
Threaten to nationalize any business that extorts with the defense production act. Cant have good conscriptees if they are malnourished and mentally ill.
Lets get creative.
Does that mean that bidenomics is actually the work of the republican controlled house? I don't see how biden can get credit for a supposedly amazing economy but at the same time be powerless to do anything because of congress.
He can do some things. He can't do others.
For example one of the big checks on corporate greed is the FTC, which is independent of the executive branch's direct control. All he can do is nominate people to the FTC, which has to go through the legislature. At the moment, the FTC has a majority Democrat leadership, which has resulted in things like the blocking of Amazon's acquisition of iRobot, the attempted blocking of the Albertsons-Krogers merger, the upcoming ban on noncompete clauses, and other reining in of corporate greed.
Biden can't tell the FTC "you have to impose fines on x corporation". All he can do is appoint the kinds of people he thinks would support fines on x corporation. And like I said, even that is subject to the legislature's approval.
Biden can modify student loan programs, but (according to the courts) he does not have the power to wholesale forgive student loans. He's doing what he can, but he's not a dictator. We have 3 branches of government for a reason.
But there are things in his control where he doesn't put up a fight at all. A great example of this is where he not only didn't fight against border wall funding, he actually went out of his way to waive federal laws to accelerate the border wall construction: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/biden-administration-waives-federal-laws-allow-border-wall-constructio-rcna118959
Biden just doesn't seem to put up much of a fight, whereas Trump was pushing ahead with ridiculous actions like his Muslim ban, whether or not a court would uphold it. Biden's inaction in a number of areas are excused with "if he tried then it would be stopped." At least try. And again, if Biden is so powerless, how can he take credit for the economy?
Did you see the headline on your own link?? "BIDEN ON BORDER WALL: 'I HAD NO CHOICE'"
Yes. Why the fuck do you want him to bang his head against a brick wall? That's stupid and if you want it, you're stupid. Things he can do, he should do. Things he can't do, he shouldn't waste time on.
Well, two things. First, like I said, he does have some measure of control over some things, and he has popular influence. But second, and more importantly, presidents always get praise or blame for the economy under them regardless of how incredibly stupid it is to believe that the president can personally make the economy good or bad. So, political reality is, if he has a good economy, he has to claim it, since if there's a bad economy, he'll be blamed for it.
There is nothing that forces Biden to waive federal laws. Biden had a choice, he just decided to make this one for whatever reason. Republicans can obstruct all they want, but apparently democrats are incapable of even inaction to stop or slow down dumb republican shit like the border wall. Tell me how this makes any sense.
Biden slapping his name onto the economy by calling it "bidenomics" is a risky bet when the market is so fickle and people can feel wildly different depending on their individual circumstances. Broad numbers can hide very real problems that aren't being addressed.
It's not "for whatever reason".
Why delay the inevitable? Do it, gain some political points, move on. It's gonna happen anyway, and he needed he points he got from moderates more than he needed the points from people like you.
So you admit that he had a choice in the matter, but now you claim it was needed to score points with the supposed "moderates" that love republican policy. If "moderates" want a wall, they will simply vote republican. This dumb stunt does not change that at all. I am curious what you mean by "people like you".
I meant "far leftists who make irrational demands of Democrats"
He had no choice in stopping the wall from being built.
He could claim points for not delaying it.
Both of these are true.
And do you really believe moderate Democrats don't exist?
The issue with that logic is that Dems will say they can’t get anything done but fear the substantial change that Trump can bring. Like the party’s own stance is more of the same with Biden or certainty of drastic change by voting against Biden. That does not come off like the party elites think it does. I can see how that messaging can work with say the UAW or the already rich who can claim wins during the last four, but many of us really only expected him to not be Trump after the Biden win and somehow even that bar feels missed, the man has lower approval ratings than Trump ever had.
Well thats just not true. His approval rating is very low for sure, but Trump has got him beat in that metric, he had substantially worse ratings. Still Biden might end with worse approval average if he continues downward in approval ratings, and that's kinda impressive since Biden hasn't been doing egregiously corrupt and stupid shit basically daily like Trump did. Golfing at his own resort. Putting his kids into government positions. Firing staff on grounds of "loyalty" like some mob boss. Etc etc. Biden hasn't even been impeached, let alone twice.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_approval_rating
I don't know why you're being downloaded, you're right here. They fear that Trump is going to be a dictator rightfully, yet Biden's not allowed to use any power to help the people. That, for some reason, is where the line in the sand is.
I think we can expect Biden to be loud about grocery prices and grocery store profit margins, because the price of almost everything else has stabilized or gone down. He can issue executive orders that do little to directly influence prices, but any more would require legislation, and, well, the party that controls the House wants higher prices.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/01/us/politics/biden-food-prices.html
I wish I could just slap the shit out of every Democrat in charge of any sort of media relations. They're so terrible.
IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER. WHAT. YOU. DO. Good deeds do not sway voters. Spin sways voters. Media sways voters. You can literally fuck up the economy and blame your opponents for it and people will believe you if you message it right.
Democrats should work to help people not because it will win them votes but because it's the right thing to do. Democrats need to understand that words and deeds are two entirely separate things. Deeds help people. Words sway voters. The two are not related.
“Economy” is such a bullshit term here. What they really mean is stock market. The real economy is shit. Pay is shit. Healthcare is shit. Real estate is a fat hog that needs to get slaughtered already. When will the people be treated as Too Big To Fail?
Ehh, I think the economy is doing okay. Inflation is being controlled/managed. In some cases it's correcting itself.
Don't lose sight of the forest for the trees. The media in this country has been really pessimistic about the economy and blaming the admin--to the point it seemed intentionally misrepresented.
This economy could have gone the other way pretty easily especially with the billions thrown into circulation during the pandemic.
If we want to credit Presidents when the economy is bad, you need to credit them when it's good too.
If anything this admin should get credit for being stable and a source of order in all of the chaos--not the cause of it.
I have to agree. Some people are still certainly struggling, of course. Homelessness is still a problem in places. Many people still live paycheck to paycheck. But the economy isn't going to fully right itself in four years, especially with a hostile House that controls the purse strings.
Additionally, nothing has been done about greedflation (yet?). If Congress or Biden can figure out a way to force companies to stop tacitly colluding to squeeze more money from people, I would suspect more people would start to feel more optimistic about their finances (and the economy in general).
Greed will sadly have to wait....when your ship is sinking you gotta patch the holes first, then you can rebuild the troublesome parts.
The US is putting fingers in the holes of the dam right now and doing an okay job of it.
I believe it's more like while this ship is sinking the majority are below decks with old buckets trying to desperately bail out the rising seawarer while the rich and those in power are above deck ripping off all the planks they can to build themselves a life raft, fully intent on leaving the rest of us to drown in the sinking ship.
I like the analogy!
The one below mine is better lol.
The media is owned by billionaires and/or public traded companies. Reporting is skewed to keep the populace complacent.
Some people are already too big to fail. It's just not you or me.
Look at Trump. He's too big to fail. He's not in jail, despite numerous counts of accusations, from rigging elections to treason to sexual assault.
When you're rich enough or connected enough, you're too big to fail.
-- J. Paul Getty
It’s worse, when it’s us g peoples donated election money for personal expenses, including legal expenses. Do the people donating understand that they’re not even getting a campaign out of their cash? Why isn’t this misuse of funds yet another criminal charge?
Considering the only information they get is within their little bubble which is mostly what Trump tells them, I think they believe they're helping the most mistreated man in history get out of his very unfair oppression to stop him from saving humanity. And by humanity, they mean America. And by America, they mean white people. And by white people, they mean cishet people.
Maybe I should have quoted or capitalized “The People”. I mean the common layperson. trump, Muskrat, and their ilk aren’t “the people”. They are the storied “1%” that depend on social welfare from our government.
Whatever the fuck they're saying on the nigntmare box means dick. I'm still poor.
It’s about jobs more than the stock market. The report says over 350k net jobs added this quarter (more than double expected) and unemployment has been below 4% for two consecutive years (not seen since the ‘60s). Plus inflation is quickly dropping and the administration is lowering costs on things where they can, putting more money in our pockets. It’s legitimately incredible what’s happened with the US economy since the pandemic nearly guaranteed a recession, according to Fox News.
We spent THREE YEARS with media of all stripes gaslighting us about a supposed incoming recession any day now. Any day now, for three years, even when the economy was doing gangbusters. Bastards.
The numbers for the real economy have been good too. The median wage rose faster than inflation in 2023 and unemployment has been consistently low, people are finding work and finally starting to earn more. Obviously things aren't great for everyone but it's going way better than anyone expected and it's heading in a good direction rather than deteriorating further like when inflation was still out of control.
Don't forget the car market as well both the used and new market has lost its fucking mind.
*jobs exist that don't pay a living wage, sending workers ever deeper into poverty and despair*
media and politicians: "LoOk At AlL tHe JoBs! BoOmInG eCoNoMy!"
You get two jobs, and you get two jobs, everyone gets two jobs!
🎵you load 16 tons, waddaya get? another day older and deeper in debt. St. Peter don't you call me cuz I can't gooooooo, I owe my soul to the company store. 🎵
"I see you still have like eight hours each day you could sacrifice to your employers, what's your excuse there?"
"That's when I eat and sleep."
"Ah, so greed and laziness. I see."
Biden’s administration has done pretty well considering all the grenades the GOP had thrown into the road.
Imagine how well people could be doing if the GOP actually cared about anyone other than themselves, rich people, or the Russians.
people who say things like this have never been affected by any former president or the current one in a bad way and most likely do not travel around the US in any capacity
how has the economy improved under Biden? make it make sense
was it that higher minimum wage he promised then told workers not to protest and ask for better?
was it the factory jobs in the south he touted where pay and work condition standards are lower?
was it his obama style communication relief that helped citizens with things like internet bills that is now ending that only helped with about $25?
was it that national health insurance he promised that he never mentions?
yes biden has done some things but not enough or long enough or at all in some cases
everything he has done has been quartered ass at best and never good enough and always blamed on someone else when he fails to deliver like every president the US has ever had
Did you miss the part about the GOP scuppering and hamstringing every attempt by the Dems to make things better for the people?!?!
Pull your head out of your ass and look at the ACTUAL enemy rather than blaming the Dems for not walking as far as they could if the hurricane of traitorous actions by the GOP was not pushing them back at every step.
You don't have a choice tho.
The economy is rich people's yacht money, remember?
Not who dies of drugs and/or starvation
TIL grudgingly is a word. I've only ever heard begrudgingly before.
Apparently grudgingly is done with lack of interest
Begrudgingly is done with envy
TIL
Hey let me know if you guys find any extra money floating around. This economy is so good I can barely afford gas and groceries.
Brace for a lot of the magats claiming that faux is "too woke"/"too liberal" and claim they'll have to watch ONAN even harder.
It was extra hilarious when they were complaining about the environmental impact of Taylor Swift's plane. Like you admit the climate needs help, Fox?
Plus, like only her plane. How many millionaires fly in their private jet and they complain about her? Obviously they are teiggered. The bootstrap party sure likes to whine about dumb shit. Imagine if they put even half as much effort into anything productive.
It’s no different from them suddenly caring about the environment when it comes to EVs. “Mining lithium is so bad for the environment!” They post to Facebook from their lithium-battery powered cellphone.
Dangerously close to “yet you exist in society.. I am very smart.”
It would be better to just go along with them when they are incidentally correct like that instance, but push towards the logical endpoint of that thought train.
Agree with them, like, “yeah, mining lithium is fucking horrible, and it is literally impossible currently without coerced labor somewhere in the supply chain. Let’s empower the regulatory bodies in countries where lithium is mined to prevent negative externalities that currently exist only because it is more profitable.”
Or “yeah it’s fucking ridiculous how much swift uses that jet. Musk too, and Bezos too. These fucks could never ride in a jet the rest of their lives and we could take flights to vacation multiple times a year for the rest of our lives and we still wouldn’t even be responsible for 1% of their emissions output. Let’s ban private jets and make these fucks ride commuter with the rest of us.”
Except I don’t think they’re incidentally correct at all. They weren’t worried about lithium at all until it was put into car batteries. Because it was never about the lithium.
The economy is only booming for the rich, anyone trying to tell us otherwise doesn't care about our well-being. If it were doing well they wouldn't have to keep telling us, we could see it in our everyday lives.
Gas prices are down. General cost of living is stabilized. Unemployment is extremely low and the percentage of eligible workers on the sidelines is dropping. Wages are up for the lowest income levels and continue to climb despite slowing inflation. Black households, in particular, have seen a significant narrowing of the income gap, more so than they've seen in many many years. The percentage of women in the workforce is up and salaries are climbing for them as well. In fact, the post-COVID recovery has been wildly successful when you compare it to post-2008 with respect to the improvements for the poorest among us, which is precisely the opposite of what you're claiming.
Yours is purely an appeal to anecdote. The data is clear. Unfortunately, as study after study has shown, data can't compete with vibes, and we just spent the last two years with the MSM (not to mention social media...) telling everyone a recession was around the corner.
I'll tell that to the out of control housing, rising food costs and the worsening healthcare coverage and quality. Man! So glad these few things you mentioned are superficially better. There's no problems now!
/s because you know someone is gonna take it literally.
Housing costs are sky-high. Rent is ridiculous. Good luck ever trying to own a house. And yeah, cost of living went way way up and now it's "stabilized" there.
And to say wages are up is just laughable. I mean, yeah people are now being paid $15 an hour instead of $10, but what does that matter when food and housing costs increased more than that?
The data is skewed by the people that benefited from raising the price of everything during COVID-19 and then never brought the prices down.
The rich are richer and they are the measuring stick for the economy because they own all the news sources. It is dramatically worse for the poor now than it was 5 years ago.
Don't let bullshit propaganda fool you.
I feel like this CONSTANTLY happens and people just eat it. Prices skyrocket. Then they stop rising or maybe even dip a little but still remain way higher than they originally were and... Problem solved! It's stabilized! In fact prices are DROPPING! huzzah!
Makes me wonder if people are really this easily fooled or are they all just being ignored? Lol
Literally yes. Prices go up, wages go up, that's a healthy economy. Take an economics class.
If prices ever start broadly going down, prepare for a massive economic ass fucking the likes of which you've never seen and clearly can't imagine.
Yeah the economy is healthy, just not for 90% of the country.
Line go up is just a cult, nothing else.
Ideally the economy is just something you need to plan, to stay stable and anticipate environmental and population concerns. It shouldn't need to go up or down to maintain production.
This "homelessness goes up but so does GDP so it's okay" shit is unworkable, cruel and unsustainable and only benefits bezos et al
Christ alive you have no idea what you're talking about. Have you ever studied economics? At all? Or are you just posting your fee fees?
Would you go into a hospital and start lecturing doctors on how their practice is bullshit? Sure, there are probably a lot of things that could be improved, but you don't have the knowledge to speak about them. Take some courses, then come back and speak from an informed perspective.
"Planned economy" is a 12 year old's idea of how things should be.
You’re on serious damage control and spouting derivative drivel. “Take an economics class” meanwhile people who did found that set of nomics to be non sensical, because “economics” at its core isn’t about what most people think it is. Cost and worth are two separate things, and the whims of our livelihoods is decided emotionally. Not logically.
Answer my question. Have you ever studied economics in any fashion?
Yes I absolutely have. Would you care to say anything other than “study economics”? Would you care to support your bullshit or explain for those who haven’t?
For the benefit of those who haven’t studied carpentry, it’s not out of line for a carpenter to explain the trade a little.
Great. So do you understand why a moderate level of inflation is a good thing for quality of life? "line go up" in a broad economic sense.
And do you understand how profit motives spur investment which generates improvements which leads to better quality of life? "Line go up" for individual companies.
And this is a little more advanced, but also a little easier to see in the real world: do you understand why every planned economy has failed to raise quality of life as well as capitalist economies?
I would LOVE to unpack this with you right here and counter your sentiments.
The main issue I have with this is that its a self fulfilling prophecy, and that's something all economists acknowledge. The prevailing theory is that rising prices alters consumer behavior, ie making a new purchase out of fear of further price increases. Workers ask for raises to cope with rising prices. My argument is that this bad due to the circular nature of this logic. As a working everyperson, you ask for a raise to mitigate inflation, so that you can again afford goods/services, which then increases the demand, which in turns results in higher prices again. Employers decide to pass this cost on too which further inflates prices.
The issue is the lack of monitored expectations due to investor demands both in speculative and results driven investments. Take a company's debt basis or attractiveness to investors, they want the "line go up" to get a return on investments but that has to come from somewhere. In what we're seeing today we have record earnings and by all indicators record revenue growth but investors want their return, and the executive leadership in our current organizational models means they answer neither to customers nor employees but only "line go up", and that's short term at best. Cue lack of monitored expectations. On the sense of policymakers looking at inflation being too bad, their control mechanism for reducing inflation puts the hardship primarily on the working class. Ie reduce demand by firing people and putting them into poverty. The need for healthcare exists, and the facade of "but EMTALA makes healthcare accessible" does nothing to address the financial ruin a person sees by getting laid off, losing their job and coverage, all because policymakers saw that inflation was too high and it gets taken out on workers instead of having mechanisms to deal with corporate profits, which is widely acknowledged to be responsible for 40% of inflation overall, yet the control mechanism is widespread impact on those least able to absorb it.
My opposing viewpoint to the economist perspective of inflation being necessary is this concept of forcibly creating winners and losers the way that we do. People who attempt to save money lose because their savings is devalued, so we're dependent on a set of tax rules that allow us to rathole money up in 401k's/IRA's on the hope that investments outperform inflation, but anything in savings just devalues over time. Let's say you save money for major auto repairs, but in one year the repair costs jump up 20%, how fair is that? That means we have to continually adjust the financial model for vehicle ownership, and if you plug those numbers in you find that people can't afford cars where 5 years ago on median incomes they could. Meanwhile credit worthy individuals who borrow heavily benefit from debt that gets "inflated away" provided they are lucky enough to negotiate the income.
I don't know if you've noticed, but 2024 is not off to a great start, due to the interest rate adjustments, getting a job right now is hell, so the worker leverage is virtually gone. Employers are increasingly taking the "GTFO if you don't like it" approach and are even doing soft layoffs with RTO policies.
Count more than fucking beans, and also economists emotionally justify what they want to see, and the data can be interpreted many ways. I think it's a bullshit profession that causes way more harm by justifying policy that benefits the wealthy while fucking the rest of the country.
Explain that to the hundreds of thousand of people finding their job redundant thanks to AI investments. I don't see how getting fired benefits people when the market isn't creating replacement opportunities for them. What's happened is that the leverage people use to enjoy in their profession just got removed, and I would posit that this mindset has created the second gilded age that we're in with a declining quality of life. Look at housing, healthcare, and education costs before telling anyone with a straight face that the above mindset lifts up quality of life for the average person. I would say that for wealthy investors and the billionaire class, it sure benefits them.
Look at Scandinavia and tell me the US healthcare approach is better. Look at Canada and tell me the US higher education system is better. We're already seeing competing economies that use socialism alongside capitalism to vastly improve quality of life metrics far moreso than the US. Capitalism is fine, when its regulated and heavily so. It's amazing to me that people forgot the Sherman Anti Trust Act, and why such laws got passed in the concept of "what's good for the public trust". Economics works against the public trust by being amoral in nature. Things like stock buybacks need to be illegal again, and socialism shouldn't be an ugly word. Heavily regulating conflicts of interest (see Oxley Sarbanes), anti-trust (see Sherman Antitrust), and working against the concept of "winner take all" is how we avoid despots and tyrants who got lucky enough to be born rich and sociopathic.
If you go back to the planned economy the US had during wartime, I would argue that a planned economy sows the seeds for the massive gains experienced by the bull markets thereafter (transitioning from WW2 to the 50's). Unplanned free market economies are what has been associated with the guilded age and "winner take all" concepts that dominate our worst years of depressions in history.
DOES IT FUCKING MATTER IF THEY CANT AFFORD FOOD AND RENT?!
Yes. Because if they decide to make things worse out of ignorance, then other people can't afford food and rent.
You might want to tell that to Walmart:
https://youtu.be/xuBrGaVhjcI
I don't watch youtube videos linked by people arguing in favor of something dumb. It's a good way to waste my time and ruin my algorithm.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out sweetie
If his is purely anctedote, then yours is decontextualized.
Sure. Since a high in June of 2022. The last time gas prices were at this level was June 2021. And the time before that was October 2014. Which is to say, for about 6 years, gas prices were lower than today. And just looking at the graph, they were significantly below today's level. Just to note, they have yet to return to the levels before the precipitous rise stating in December 2020.
There maybe, as you noted, vibes, but they ain't wrong.
Unemployment should be looked at with, of course participation rate which has held even for the last year, and how long people have been unemployed which has been growing slightly for those unemployed for 27 weeks or more. This also doesn't address underemployment which disporporstely effects the young and poor. Underemployment colors one's outlook for stability in the present and future.
Thankfully, Biden and others in the administration have managed this far better than 2008 for the average citizen. Not having a recession is a good thing. I've lived through several. But that doesn't mean there isn't looming concerns. Inflation is still higher than the target and instigating further disinflation is uncharted territory.
Data, in of itself, is not enough. It needs to be contextualized to develop political and social narratives. Addressing people with condescension and dismissing their anxieties as mere vibes fails politically.
I think people are expecting all the prices to return to "normal" when that's probably never going to happen, as a good chunk of the price increases are due to post-covid inflation
the largest driver of inflation during and after the pandemic is companies raising prices, and turning record profits.
Living is more unaffordable than ever. What even is your comment
I stopped reading at gas prices are down. They are up .40 the last week.
The gaslighting is all thats clear. All the data conflicts with your claim. Homelessness up to the highest level ever recorded, housing is unaffordable, food is unaffordable, wages are stagnant, income inequality is the widest ever recorded.
Looking pretty low to me. Speaking in terms of this week makes no sense to me.
https://www.gasbuddy.com/charts
It's almost like they cherry pick data that fits their preconceived notions...
This is just as stupid as saying because it snowed, global warning isn't real.
No if you're going to get the first fact blatantly wrong odds are the rest is going to be bunch of bullshit too
Gas prices are down in my area, so you're blatantly wrong.
Checkmate, dumbass.
Good thing your area is the entire world. Oh wait. Turns out, on balance gas prices are not down. But you go ahead and live in that bubble of yours and pretend your name calling is doing something.
OH MY GOD HE FINALLY GETS IT LADIES AND GENTLEMEN!
Apparently you don't though. Jesus, the willful ignorance is strong.
A lot of the Fox Business stuff is not crazy politically biased in the way the Opinion primetime stuff is. There's a lot of old rich white guy conservatism, like Mitt Romney conservative. They'll spin storylines as explanations, but not basic facts.
Just seems like people are talking past each other sometimes with Fox stuff. Same as the polling "even FOX is saying X Democrat is winning!" well yeah Fox's polling infrastructure is pretty good, it's probably because that candidate is leading.
I'd agree, but Fox Business has gotten much worse over the past few years. It has always been pro-business (duh), but it was rather reliable otherwise and had to be. The viewers cared about their investments and companies; a bias would make them unreliable.
They started changing and adding more and more right wing nutjob opinions to their reporting, though.
For example, three of their top stories right now are political pieces; one about how fast food prices will go up because of a higher minimum wage in one state and a second where Elon Musk blames immigrants for the housing crisis plus whatever other garbage comes from his mouth. Another article here claiming the "border crisis" was caused by DEI policies at some companies.
Booming for who exactly?
Me?
Gas prices are below $3 here, only spent $91 on weekly groceries yesterday, and my high interest savings accounts are sitting around 4.75%
My property taxes went up 20% but that's a local thing...
And I'll toss this in here even though you'll cry that it's not a valid metric, but my retirement accounts are at a record high
Like, what more do you want??
They probably want theirs and everyone else’s cost of living to not be a crisis.
It’s great that yours has slightly improved, it hasn’t for the majority however and continues to get worse.
But it's now getting worse at a slightly slower rate. Yay, progress!
House prices to contract down to a realistic level. Rent controls such that the price of rent is not higher than the price of a mortgage (which gives you ownership of a valuable asset, a tenancy does not).
But rent has to cover all the costs of ownership and then some, meanwhile the mortgage payment is but a fraction of that.
It doesn't, though. The owner should cover the cost of ownership, as they're the one who gets the valuable asset at the end. The tenant should pay proportionally less than this, merely the cost of them living there for a temporary period.
If you live with someone and pay towards their mortgage, you can rightfully claim a share in the equity of their house. However, if you're a tenant and pay the entire mortgage, and then some, you don't get anything. That's patently not right.
You don’t get to claim part of the equity just for living with someone and paying part of their mortgage. You would have to set up a joint venture or other business structure, otherwise you would just pay rent to the owner/ roommate like they were your landlord.
And even if the partnership was legally set up where you got a percentage for paying rent on a room in a house, unless you retroactively paid part of their downpayment, it would be an insignificant percent the home’s value..probably to the tune of 1/360th of the home’s value, minus the downpayment, minus the growth in value for however many years they have been paying on the loan, and your share would essentially be less than half of your rent going to the value of the investment due to taxes and insurance.
Most of what you are paying for on a home is taxes and insurance. My mortgage is about 65% taxes and insurance. If I were to rent my home, should I pay all of the taxes and insurance that occur in real time so the tenant has a less expensive place to live or pass that on to the renter as a cost of living in the residence?
I’m not a landlord because I ran the numbers and this just barely profitable in a best case scenario where you had nothing but great tenants, no downtime between renters, and no major house repairs, but there is a huge amount of risk with letting stranger occupy your most valuable asset. The expectation that a home owner should offer a discount on the actual cost of the home because they get to sell the house and recoup the asset value is not realistic. When you consider the amount of damage, additional maintenance, turnover costs, downtime between renters, and a whole mess of other things that cost additional money that come with renting to tenants, it is understandable why it’s hard to find cheap rent.
It sucks that this is how the system is, but housing prices have to come down and wages have to come up before this problem gets fixed, and the landlord isn’t the demon you think he is. Corporate firms buying up hundreds of houses to manipulate prices up on the other hand…
I agree that there is a lot more wrong with the system than just mortgage rates being higher than rents. The tax, fees and interests are certainly a good target for how things are wrong. With regards to damages, obviously tenants should be more easily held liable for damages they cause - and equally landlords should be more easily held liable for failing to provide a well maintained property (eg no mould).
The system is generally screwed up through and through. The people on the bottom get shat on, but even as you work your way up there's always still someone above shitting down hill. But that's no excuse for resigning and not sorting the shit out.
For starters, we need to sack all MPs and implement something closer to a direct democracy, or at least representation truly as a public service.
Also forgetting that the "then some" part is only warranted if we want an incentive for people to buy houses to rent out. If it was a socially beneficial thing to do. Society would not lose out if buying a house on a mortgage and renting it out was not a profitable thing to do.
Exactly. If it wasn't so exploitatively profitable, fewer people would do it, and more houses would be available on the market - lowering prices and giving more people an opportunity to buy and own their own home.
We’ll have to agree to disagree.
I'd appreciate if you could justify your position. I think, when you carefully consider it, you'll understand that it's skewed the wrong way and not justifiable.
If I buy a house with a mortgage, it costs a lot of money, but I can live in it right away and afterwards I have a house, which I can sell. If I rent, I only get to live in it for so long as I pay rent - I own nothing at the end. You get more for your mortgage but pay less, surely the rent should be lower and proportionate to what you're getting?
Sure, if rent was cheaper than a mortgage, people would be far less inclined to be landlords - but why should that be a given path to profit? Why should the housing supply by usurped by those who already have an excess of wealth?
Sure. The terms of the owner’s financing are none of the renter’s business. The only facts that are relevant are that the owner is willing to rent out their property at a certain price, and the renter is willing to pay that price, and both parties are entering into the transaction of their own free will. If the owner and renter are unable to agree on a price, they are free to go their separate ways. No harm, no foul.
The renter has no real choice, though. The renter can either accept the price the landlord offers, or go to another landlord who offers the same price, or be homeless. This makes the renter open to exploitation by landlords. Sure, every landlord does it - but that doesn't make it any less exploitation.
This is exactly the type of thing where government should come in and regulate. I'm saying that such regulation should position rents as lower than mortgage rates.
choosing to be wrong: it's a bold move, cotton. let's see how it plays out.
Flapjacks.
I can do Jack Black doing jumping jacks, final offer.
And hookers
$91 for a week of groceries? You either live alone or your poor family is subsisting on Top Ramen.
I just spent $86 at a Whole Foods for what will amount to this week’s groceries (which is making breakfast, lunch, and dinner for two each day). I already had many of the staple ingredients, and no Top Ramen is involved.
My spouse and I typically spend around $60-$80 a week. $90 seems kind of high honestly.
I have a family of 3 and can hit that target for a week of groceries pretty easily. What are you buying that's so expensive? I've found the price of produce, milk, and eggs have all gone down over the last few months
Where do you live and what do you eat?
That retirement account is going to mean fuckall when you retire as inflation eats up most of it.
I'll be sure to raise a fist to Biden when that day comes, and curse the wretched two party system which hath delivered me and you, apparently, such misery
Edit:but until then, I'll vote for Biden. Because honestly
I don't know why this guy's getting downvoted. Rent prices are at record high. APRs are through the roof. Groceries are getting more expensive every year. I'm even paying $20 more every month for car insurance. Sure Trump was worse but let's not act like everything is all sunshine and rainbows just because it's an election year.
Google seems t suck these days and I wasn’t able to find good data, but
Gotta admit it’s tough to sympathize with a $20 insurance increase when I just got hit with the double whammy of teenaged driver and new car. My car insurance is quintuple what it was a couple months ago😒
A shocking amount of people I know, including myself were all laid off. Ive been unemployed for 6 months. There are zero jobs in my Ruby red shithole state aside from retail.
This growth is not distributed equally.
It’s really difficult not to turn this political, but yes, it seems like political leanings are a huge part of it.
Admittedly, my company is hiring mostly overseas in cheaper markets, but we are hiring, and a I’ve seen a lot of friends switch jobs to jump start stagnated pay
Thats the problem though, yes we know who's to blame, but its still up to dems to fix it.
Its not acceptable to just have them rightfully blame then throw their hands up.
Tech?
A failed college actually. Friend was in construction.
That sucks, I'm sorry. Any plans to move to somewhere with more jobs?
My family safety net is here, so it would honestly take some saving at a different job before Im comfortable starting a life somewhere else.
But eventually I may have to. In the meantime all I can do is keep applying.
imo that "safety net" is a bit of a trap. I may be biased by how well this worked for me, but when I left my shithole Southern state I had like $40 and whatever could fit in my crappy car. Couchsurfed and slept in my car for the first few paychecks of the job I got pretty much immediately when I got to California.
This has got to be an Onion headline. I mean, of course it is, but they would never in a million years admit it.
Ask not for whom the economy booms -
For only the bell tolls for thee.
I don't think Republicans get to complain about trickle down though
Great for who? Not me. Not anyone I know. Two of my close friends lost their jobs in the last few months. And tech layoffs out of control due to interest rates. Fuck off with this propaganda
Chinese propaganda gonna propaganda. Shill.
It's gotta be "USA #1" or nothing with you?
Not at all.
But I see the .ml and know that you’re almost certainly a Xi puppet.
you see that in my username? interesting.
Anyway, I see aussie.zone in your name so I guess you're a friend of ScoMo.
Scomo can burn in hell.
Well well well
Where's this .ml you're seeing?
The one at the end of your name too.
Oooh I see.
So is lemmy.ml associated with Chinese propagandists now? There was me thinking it was just the one that happened to be created by the creators of lemmy....
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36544805
Clearly explains why a tiny criticism of mine of the Chinese government in Hong Kong was quickly erased and I was given a ban in worldnews.ml
Fuck Lemmy.ml and all the tankie shits.
I got banned from world news in lemmy.world so what does that say?
Dunno. You tell me.
you're the one jumping to conclusions about entire instances
Data and firsthand personal experience.
Probably because Fox only makes good revenues when their buffoons aren't in charge to undermine their narratives with utter incompetence and pure greed.
Fox needs its viewers to want to start winning, not to be winning. That's why Tucker publicly put a stop to the Biden "crime family" claims right before the 2020 election, and resumed right after it.
Their viewership does best when their claims are not falsifiable.
Commentary on commentary
Lemmy: China is spreading propaganda about their failing economy booming in their news!
Lemmy: The American economy is booming! I read it in our news!
It's almost like those are two different groups of people.
Well both those types of articles are getting upvoted to the front page so I'm assuming there is overlap?
Have you tried submitting anything? There's very little content, I'd wager you too could get to the front page.
(Not dogging on lemmy,,I love this site)
There are genuine grievances in the economy; most notably perhaps the affordable housing crisis. My home's value is so fucking inflated it's not even funny. It's not worth what it is appraised for; none of these houses are. Chronic homelessness is at an all-time high.
That being said — since we are going into election year — we need to frame this not as what we see but what Republicans would normally boast of if Donnie2Scoops was in office.
So context matters. By the standards of what Republicans usually tout, the economy is thriving. Which means they've got nothing going into an election year... Which means they're fucked.
Consider that Democrats won a midterm election during worse economic conditions in what is historically a rough midterm for an incumbent President's party. Now consider the same with the risk of Democracy on the line, abortion rights, and a strong economy.
Republicans are fucked. (But still, get 5 people you know to register and vote). Hence why they're so desperately clinging to this BoRDEr cRiSis as their only issue that's sticking — and Biden just called their bluff on it.
There's quite a few places where right and left agree on some point, but not what to do about it. It's not Horseshoe Theory, because they only meet in a single place and then run in different directions. They don't come up with the same solutions at all.
Republicans say the economy is failing, Democrats do not, but the left also thinks the economy is failing. But the left think it's failing because it does not provide a base of support for everyone and would like to fix it. Republicans don't give a shit about that and would prefer to keep pulling the ladder up behind them.
This is the thing. We have objective measures of the economy and by those measures (the same ones we'd use to say a Republican is doing a great job) the economy is doing well.
The broader left becomes something of a useful tool for Republicans to use in election years during these discussions, because while Republicans agree with leftist feelings about the economy until elected. Afterwards, those same metrics they insist are incomplete or don't count are exactly the things they'll tout again to say they're doing a great job.
Leftists need to get an objective set of metrics together and then consistently grade all policymakers on them. I also think that it's not solely (or even mostly) up to the president to determine economic policy. Presidents have an effect, for sure, but it's largely stuff passed through the Congress that impacts the economy.
Well said. In essence, perfections becomes the enemy of good. Because leftists frankly tend to be more informed on the nuances of the economy — and especially what impacts the poor and middle-class — they have more specific demands. Which is fine, but we must always remember that Republicans will never care about those things; whereas we're seeing legitimate progress and a reshaping of the Democratic platform in just the last 10 years.
People of a certain level and type of education think data and policies mean more than sentiment and messaging. But for many,t he data is secondary. You can see my comment on gas prices and unemployment being rooted in data and vibes. But the vibes for most people are what matters. And the vibes on election day are what matter most to undecided voters. I don't think either party really gets the sense of dread that most people have and may never get it.
Which midterm are you talking about? I'm assuming you're talking about the 2018 mid-term when Democrats picked up 41 seats since they lost the House in 2022. But another way of looking at the last five midterms, you see the midterms going to the party that is not the president's. So I don't think that the 2018 midterms provide a great reference point for the presidential election. Additionally, those gains in the 2018 election have slowly eroded giving control in the house to the Republicans.
But I wanted to address your strategy first and foremost since you address messaging. The projected map has Biden at 226, Trump at 235, and 77 to close to call. Those 77 electoral votes are spread across six states:
Nevada (6 electoral votes)
Arizona (11)
Wisconsin (10)
Michigan (15)
Pennsylvania (19)
Georgia (16)
In 2020, all six went Biden by less than 5%. In the 2022 midterm, Republicans gained seats in the house from Arizona, Wisconsin, and Georgia. If those three switch to Trump, Trump wins with 272. Having a record showing in California or New York does little to help with these strategic areas.
I'm not too certain what matters to the voters in these six states, but in Arizona, the BoRDEr cRiSis, as you condescendingly noted, probably matters to them. In all six of those states, you'll need a get out a vote drive to convince people to vibe with Biden. Usually those people are young and have a little more free time. But not when they see a genocide unfolding in Palestine and the Biden administration being complicit. Are the Arab Americans of Deerborn, MI going to come out and vote for Biden and Tlaib again? Will Tlaib stump for Biden? Are young Blacks in Atlanta or Philly going to come out in droves for Biden? I don't know.
I don't know what ground work the DNC has been doing, but I hope they've built a trusted network to get people to the polls. Either way, I don't think the "Republicans are fucked". It think we are looking at a close election again.
I'd wager we can simply call vibes the right-wing grip on shallow political talking-points at the national level, for which they're pretty effective at admittedly. Such is the nature that lies and bullshit are easier to spread than the complexity of truth & reality. So in that respect, sure, there are many people who don't have the vibe or feel the sentiment that things are going well — not because the data is wrong, but simply because they live in an alternate reality; an echo-chamber. A place where that data just doesn't exist.
There is, frankly, little I can think of that we can do to reach these people. On the other hand, I think Donald has already cast a wide net and those who were trump supporters remain trump supporters (minus the dead ones from old boomers dying, covid, etc.). Yeah he's making sligh tinroads with the likes of certain Hispanic populations — mostly in Florida and Texas, but Nevada is up in the air. The question is whether these inroads outpace the influx of Gen Z and Millennials who overall lean Dem.
Actually I am referring to 2022 midterms, because as you said -- the midterms tend to go to the party not the President's; and if we compare either 2010 or 2014 to 2022, then Democrats vastly overperformed in 2022, turning what was coined the "red wave," to at best a red tinkle, or even a blue tinkle depending on what you prioritize. Because of the reversal of Roe, youth showed up and offset what could've otherwise been a disastrous midterm during a rough economy. We won key Secretary of State positions, Governorships, and expanded a lead in the Senate. Yes, lost the House, true. Though not by much.
If Democratic turnout meets 2020 or 2022 levels, which it should, then I think Biden is in a stronger position now than he was in 2020 due to:
Having (and thus no longer going against) incumbent advantage.
A more united Democratic party (than the brutal 2020 Dem primaries)
Reversal of Roe being a massive boost in turnout
Being honest here: There's good reason Republicans fear a Taylor Swift endorsement and voter registration drive.
Both covid recovery and the economy are objectively better now than 2022 and overall improved across the course of Biden's Presidency
91 criminal charges across 4 Grand Jury indictments will do nothing for Trumpers, but it will be a consideration for independents/moderates/swing-voters, and the polling generally agrees: More than half of Independents polled believe Trump is guilty, and 27% don't know. Hell, even 14% of Republicans think he's guilty..
In the absence of major economic issues, I predict the priorities of preserving Democracy, Justice, and Women's Rights will rise to forefront -- especially after campaign spending really kicks off.
It's really not that big of an issue. It's no different than the "mIGRanT CaRaVaN" that Donnie tried to fearmonger with as he pulled National Guard from their Thanksgiving dinners to try to drum up hysteria... Which turned out to be nothing. Hell even of the recent MAGA convoy themselves arrived and are confused..
So, what exactly is going in favor for Republicans compared to past election cycles...? The age issue remains a constant with both Presidents. I "condescendingly" wrote it that way because it's patently a manufactured crisis. There are myriad issues that far exceed in this in impact to Americans overall. Yet I admit that the "vibe" right-wing media projects has this "BoRDeR CriSis" sticking even with some Independents and Democrats. Hence why Biden in a stroke of genius called the bluff of Republicans by giving them everything they wanted, and now they stumble to save face and figure out a way to not pass the legislation because Donald Trump told them not to because it's literally his only attack going into 2024. Thus, Biden just neutered it.
These are pretty small groups; the BoTh SiDeS false equivalence fallacy is losing its muster as more and more people are made aware of classic wedge-driving techniques during these election cycles. At the end of the day, Biden has already significantly shifted his tone with Israel, and will these people be foolish enough to think Trump won't be an order-of-magnitude worse in his revocation of rights and complicity in genocides? (Recall, Trump said he'd block all Palestinian refugees... That really sat well with Muslims last time he tried that, didn't it?). What about Ukraine? We know Trump sucks up to Putin... Will people opt to not vote or vote for Trump, knowing he'll leave Ukraine hanging? I don't think so.
I'm not going to say this is a slam-dunk, but I absolutely am more confident now than I was in 2020, or 2022.
So two things and I'll let it be.
First, the migration issue has gained traction among voters in swing states [2]. Our system doesn't reward the most popular candidste, but the one who can garner the most votes by state.
Swing states matter. And small, undecided groups in swing states matter most.
All the data and risk assessment mean very little. Politics are emotional. They are in the pain of today and worries of tomorrow.
I think your confidence is on shaky ground. And worry that Biden and the Democrats aren't doing enough of the right things to be seen as better than anything else.
Well I think we've both said our piece and it's just a matter of time now before speculation turns history. Perhaps more productively we need to ask how we can increase the odds Biden wins by even more, which I'm not opposed.
Well yeah all those stats look great but the problem is that inflated housing just undoes them.
China is coincidentally also facing their economic issues from their massively inflated housing market with Evergrande (again?) collapsing
For sure, completely agree it needs addressed. But like most things, the origin of this housing crisis largely falls on Republicans. Here's what I'd do if I were Democratic strategists going into this year. Pivots. Lots of pivots.
If Republicans push back on Gun Control talk, you go, "okay, if you don't want to solve that and deflect, then let's solve root problems like societal stress, education, single-payer healthcare, and guaranteed access to a therapist at any age
If republicans push back on the boRDeR cRiSis, (a) point out the net-positive economic impact these hard workers fleeing crime & poverty have while (b) pivoting to the domestic terrorist threat from right-wing extremists home-grown here in the US that are the #1 threat per the DOJ.
Combined with the border crisis and affordable housing, Democrats need to go, "Why focus on the small fish at the border and not the foreign investors from China, Japan, Russia, Saudi Arabia who've bought up large swaths of land, stifling the American dream? Hell even the King of Jordan owns 2 Beach-front Malibu properties. Look at all the real estate investors and AirBNB jacking up the prices.
Most of the housing crisis needs to be solved at the local level. Zone for density, support social housing (where the city builds the houses rather than developers), design walkable neighborhoods, and support public transportation.
The federal government can play with interest rates, regulate banks, and provide funding for cities to do the above. It certainly affects things, but it's highly abstracted from the actual work of getting more people into affordable housing.
I agree zoning is a big one.
There are some top-down factors that need to be addressed in my view; chief among them is cracking down on rental properties, and foreign investors/ownership.
Another facet to this is the deterioration of small and rural communities across the country. We have a massive amount of land and yet the population density in certain hot-spots is off the charts. In this respect, I think we need an investment in bridging the rural-city divide. That means promoting work-from home jobs with federal tax incentives, high-speed rail infrastructure akin to the Interstate system that helps link the rural communities to the cities, and high-speed internet for all akin to the investments FDR made for rural communities in bringing electricity to the masses (The REA).
The ultimate effect of this will be de-congest cities where stress is high, bring people closer to nature, and tap into unused land and foster smaller more tightly-knit communities that aren't so disconnected from the world.
Democrats aren't going to fix shit lol they're just going to bail out the banks again after the economy collapses like Obama did in 2008.
And then pepper spray the protestors on Wall Street
... That was a University police officer on UC Davis campus in California and literally had zero to do with Democrats' direction, lmao. Wtf you smoking this early?
And don't care — One side is objectively orders-of-magnitude worse. Progress or damage-control, it makes little difference to me.
Them protesting against the direction of Obama bailing out the big banks?
Seems kinda relevant.
One side is objectively worse but you don't have to spread the fairy tale that Democrats are going to ever fix anything. They are just slightly less worse.
There's also NYPD cops pepperspraying the protestors if you like that one more but the picture doesn't look as funny:
New York City settles Occupy Wall Street pepper spray lawsuit for $50,001
I'm certain the lives of these people would've totally improved if the banks and economy completely collapsed, right? As with most things, the direction and anger of these Occupy protests — which I was a part of — had a long list of grievances including "banks got bailed out, we got sold out." But universally all these problems are squarely of Republican origin; and their solutions are almost all squarely obstructed by Republicans.
After all these years, do people forget that Democrats and Obama only had a filibuster-proof control of Congress for literally only months early in his first term? These protests came after the disastrous 2010 midterm election when many of these Occupy Wall Street protesters stayed home and let the Tea Party (pre-MAGA if you're unfamiliar) take control of Congress with the Freedom Caucus and other bullshit. So that sure did wonders for all the bankers, didn't it?
I'll say they're considerably-less worse. Obama sympathized with Occupy Wall street. I wonder what Trump would've done... Send in FBI vans like he did in Portland?
Bank bailouts got signed in by Bush though...wtf?
Both of them bailed out the banks. This is a both sides thing.
President-elect Barack Obama has teamed up with President George W. Bush for what could be the last major action of this presidency.
Also Obama was the guy dictatoring against Occupy Wall Street.
There's still a full on America+China+EU sized market crash boiling under that "booming" surface. I don't know quite how they staved it off with just Credit Suisse and two other banks imploding so far. But it's not done, it's not finished, it hasn't even started.
No idea what backroom deals were done in the financial sector to stop it all for now, but it's still coming. Otherwise corporations wouldn't still be bleeding the plebs dry with cost of living and trying to offset their shitty investments on the CBMS as well as fighting tooth and nail to keep students indebted forever, so the party can keep on rolling.
It's an utter clusterfuck. We'll see what happens in the next few years.
I gotta admit dude, this just smells like made up conspiracies. That Credit Suisse and 2 regional US bank shock happened almost a year ago. If those were emblematic of systemic issues, the failures would have continued, but they were instead just the result of bad governance and decision-making at each individual institution. The world economy absorbed those failures and moved on a long time ago.
And do you really think businesses need this excuse to raise prices? What about good old fashioned greed? Regarding prices either way, they've gone down in almost every sector of the economy besides groceries. High grocery prices definitely hurt the most, though, and I hope Biden can help influence grocers to charge less
I don't think they need excuses, no. But there is a limit to how much you can realistically get out of a stone.
The world economy has absorbed fuck all, because a lot of, if not all, bad debt is still floating around the markets, hidden in swaps overnight repo, and similar mechanics. I don't care if you believe me, it's crazy talk for sure. It doesn't even matter a single bit if I am right, because there's fuck all to do about it for most day to day people. I'm also not being alarmist in: OH BUY GOLD NOW, PREP YOUR BUNKERS!!!!
I would much rather be wrong here. Would be fan-fucking-tastic, and if I am, good. That'd be literally the best for everyone.
All I'm saying is, the underlying issues that keep leading to these market upsets aren't resolved and CS, et al are just minor break outs of a major issue that keeps bubbling and boiling. Fucked if I knew when it'll blow, but the next time it does, will be bigger than anything we've seen. Just these three banks failing in 2022 was already much larger in value than the entirety of 2008-2009 collapses.
Again, it doesn't matter what I think or say. I don't know if I'm right either, how could I? No one does. I just believe that it's much more likely that the same fucks that caused 2008, who never saw any consequences whatsoever and are still running the show, never changed their greedy underhanded and horrible ways and 2008 was never resolved either, than all of them having a change of heart and never doing anything shifty or illegal ever again, cross their hearts and hope to die.
Don't forget Evergrande
Here's a Plain Bagel video on why the Evergrande liquidation isn't as big a deal as lots of other people are hyping, at least to the world economy
No offense, but I'm so burnt out of this finance crap, everyone is lying, the whole thing is a pointless big casino. Reading anything about finance anywhere is as reliable as reading TASS (or Ukrainian) reports from the war in Ukraine.
Nothing ever is a big deal, then everything comes down and a bunch of flapjacks who caused it are laughing and drinking champagne above the sea of desperate people protesting the whole charade.
Economics is the one issue where I will actively not trust the experts. When so many of them were saying we were going to have a recession, I was starting to get suspicious. And it turned out, we didn't have one, even though so many were so sure of it.
Generally speaking, the experts seem to fall into groupthink and miss the actual trends. I've seen forecasters at some of the biggest oil and gas companies make the stupidest calls ever. They apparently forgot that in a cyclical business, we were due for a bust after a boom. It caught them by total surprise.
Are you talking about 2008?
Yeah, those occupy pictures hit hard.
No mention of swaps, no mention of debt lending and loaning. Evergrand's impact doesn't just come from the shit it does in China with the real estate. As a publicly traded company, there are many financial instruments tied to that single stock that have nothing at all to do with the real estate side of things.
Evergrande stock has been all but worthless for over 2 years now, what shoe do you think is left to drop?
the economy isnt booming, what a crock of shit, the people are poor and therefore it is not booming
By many metrics, it IS doing much better than expected. Go look it up instead of moaning.
BTW I see you’re on a UK instance. The Tories are an entirely separate dumpster fire, but still related in populist bullshit, to Trump.
Got to love the constant partisan distraction machine.
Congrats on the booming economy while we're helping with genocide overseas and we have record homelessness here.
https://www.ktvq.com/homelessness-reached-a-record-in-2023-and-it-could-get-worse