I have blocked sooooo many german communities and several german instances.
I browse all to get as much new content as possible.
But I have to block a shitload of stuff I am not interested in seeing.
SPRICH DEUTSCH DU HURENSOHN
Nej, jag kan inte Tyska, men om du vill kan vi prata Svenska! (:
Ik versta daar dus allebij helemaal niks van. Wel leuk, zo'n internationale draad.
akkor a kurva anyรกd
Fel sprรฅk รคr jag rรคdd, fรถrsรถk igen! (:
Du luktar skitgott.
Tackar tackar, jag har inte ens duschat!
jach ki'imak in wรณol yo'osal Google Translate
I took German in highschool, but all thatโs left is: Darf ich aufs Klo gehen?
kek
Moerasduits. Is dat goed genoeg?
Tja, da verpasst du was...
Just learn German. Just do it
รh, du kan vรคl lika gรคrna lรคra dig Svenska, det blir enklare fรถr oss bรฅda! (:
I was thinking of doing that if I actually move to Finland.
Having been to Finland before I know that it's not very useful in everyday situations but it's still useful and way easier to learn than finnish. Especially as I speak German.
There are parts on Finland where Swedish is the primary laguage even over Finnish.
I have filtered out some terms: elon musk and donald trump
There was a fair amount of French language posts too, not sure how much quality and engagement they have.
I've heard it called "US Defaultism" where most Americans online seem to assume that everyone they interact with is from their country and all US news is considered significant even when it really isn't.
Counterpoint: I rarely see non-US news posted. I do from time to time here on Lemmy, but itโs very rare.
I might just be in the wrong communities though.
That's because most of the world countries keep internal news, internal, but you're right tho, not enough representation makes people think like that
I do lean moee towards us defaultism being the case as other country news does get posted but has zero to none interaction because the us posts threads are getting so much more activity.
Outside Lemmy I use Apple News and what I kind of hate about it is even while traveling abroad youโre stuck with US news. I have both English and Spanish languages set up on iOS so being in a Spanish-speaking country, it would be nice to see local news in either language.
Wish we had Apple News :(
I generally avoid news of late of any kind as its just so bloated and every once a week or so just visit one of my local sites for a quick scroll.
The community news@lemmy.world used to have it in their rules, that it must be US news, same as on the old site. I just looked, and it's no longer a rule on lemmy.world
I didnโt realize that โ kind of dumb it was US-only when the instance TLD is .world. ๐คฆโโ๏ธ
I do this sometimes, and I hate when I catch myself doing it.
Imagine if different fonts represented different accents.
Iโve been guilty of that- commenting before checking what community the post was in. Thankfully, Iโve found that most people outside of the US prefer gentle correction. Unfortunately, I doubt the average person from the US would show the same courtesy if the roles were reversed.
I find that it correlates more with education status than nationality... but therefore it surely is more rare among the set of average Americans who have access to the internet than globally.
... the average Westerner also has access to the internet? At most, maybe it excludes those who don't speak English
If I was using a website called "Facebloke" that was well known to have been made and ran in the UK, I'd assume everyone on it was British.
Or the Australian version "Matebook", full with Aussies.
And why would you make that assumption? The internet has no borders, so it doesnโt really matter where or by whom something is made. Especially if the language is English, which has somewhere between 1.5 and 2 billion speakers worldwide.
The internet has no borders
Except that it actually does. See: China, North Korea, other fucked up governments that lock down the Internet for their people etc.
โFaceblokeโ
More like Faceberk, amirite?
Yes, I saw that. But it is obviously meant to be an analogy for how Facebook is a website famously made in America by an American.
...Anything written in English, and you can usually filter that even more by just looking for people using too many U's.
people using too many Uโs
You mean people using British spellings right?
Why whateveur dou you mean?
Lol ngl that's probably how a French accent would look like spelt out XD
Agreed, reading this summoned the SpongeBob narrator in my mind.
I read this like officer crabtree from Allo Allo
One day if we are brave, we will get rid of the U in a lot of British words like color and armor, but by God we will keep the British U in the word glamour!
I think you'll find most of the time the British use precisely the number U's they intend to though typos may afflict even the best.
And when you do use those โจUโฉ (I do), people assume that you know what's going on in the UK (I don't.).
What if i use "color", " gouvernment", "dialogue", " humor", "armor", " and "honour"
I see you like to keep 'em guessing.
I'd think 'who's this foucker?'
Self leart second language, so it could be anything.
Im gonna assume youre from the coast of Virginia and are transcribing your accent.
Finally your edumacashun is compleute, go fourth and enjouy your freedumb! ๐
and an aversion to Zees - I mean Zeds!
I'm from Australia and don't mind engagement with the (mostly) US content.
Let's face it, the US election is the most interesting event on the planet anyway.
also one of the most concerning ones
My favorite answer when internet Nazis asked "How could the Nazis have won?" used to be "Be America."
It's not as funny anymore. They listened.
Stop giving them ideas.
I'm sorry, the rise of American fascism is all my fault :(
I just wish Americans would have a little self awareness when engaging in foreign content.
I was in a comment thread for a video on a report by the ABC about ADEs. Now I will give Americans the benefit of the doubt, we both have ABC networks, but ours clearly says "Australia", the news presenter has a Australian accent, and was talking about the Australian minimum wage, there were references to Centrelink and the Australian government repeatedly. If you watched the video and couldn't tell me what country the video was about, you need to go back to primary school, your media comprehension level is dysfunctional .
I mentioned a clarifying point in the the comments about ADE being different from DES and giving numbers for each (you don't need to know anything about these acronyms), and someone starts arguing with me that when they were in the disability program they got xyz and they didn't have to do any of this. I replied saying that these processes have been unchanged for 20 years, I don't know how they're getting what they're getting, they have a unique case. They come back telling me everyone gets that, that's how it is, I need to do my research before I make stuff up. I explain that I work in the sector, I'm looking at the cases software, if they are indeed getting those services through that program, they are the only one of 40,000 people in the program getting that, because that's not how the service works. They tell me 15 million people people use the program. I finally realise what's happening. "there are only 25 million people people in Australia....you're a lost American aren't you?" and sure enough ,they politely reply with "oh yeah, I'm not Australian so I don't know, maybe it's different over there".
And I just can't with that level of American stupidity.
You can came into an Australian forum and assumed I wasn't Australian, assumed I wasn't talking about Australia, then came to the conclusion that "maybe it's different over there" when I had explicitly just informed you that ,yes, the law is different here.
Now many times could I have used the acronym DES before the American thought to themselves "maybe this person isn't talking about SSDI".
And this is just the example from the last hour. I end up in a lot of international PD sessions for my work, and something like this is a daily occurrence, only with the Americans.
Canada, you are sadly not excused from this, nor sure why but it's always "okay, where are we all from? "Australia" "Belgium" "Brazil" "Indonesia" "Fort Freedom" "Edmonton"
Those are cities and provinces, clearly the rest of us are doing countries, some of us are big enough that we could name states if we wanted to, but we're being polite, you've got 50 (10+3 ๐จ๐ฆ ) of them and we didn't memorise a silly song in school to learn your states.
The fact that I know how many states the US has and how many provinces and tertories Canada has, but an American would be stabbing in the dark to guess how many states and territories Australia has, even though our biggest state is 3x bigger than Texas and Australia as a whole is a comparable landmass to the contiguous 48.
And I just can't with that level of American stupidity.
Not just Americans, most people don't read/watch the link
The fact that I know how many states the US has and how many provinces and tertories Canada has, but an American would be stabbing in the dark
Not surprising given our influence on your culture is far greater than the other way, landmass is worthless when it's full of the Outback (a beautiful place for sure)
And you'd be surprised how many of us know it's 6, I bet. Californians get to play with you guys online if we stay up past our bedtimes, after all.
The more fun part is going to be me trying to name them and see if I still can: Queensland, New South Whales, Western? Australia, Northern? Australia, Victoria (you already HAVE ONE NAMED AFTER THE QUEEN THOUGH), Tasmania? Is that one you guys?
This is a good point about cultural export, majority of modern content use American, and the majority of childhood content at least for me was Canadian.
I'm often surprised how little I know of the UK compared to the USA when I think of how much is imported to Australia from the UK ....including my family.
Thank you so much for giving me your guesses at state names, we did make it easy for you with just a bunch of cardinal directions.
You are bang on with 6 states, and almost bang on with their names.
The place you've dubbed "Northern Australia" is the "Northern Territory" and is not a state, the state you are missing is South Australia.
We have two major territories, Northern Territory as mentioned, but then similar to the USA, our national capital is not located within a state.
Our capital city is in "The Australian Capital Territory", or just "the ACT"
We are super creative with the names. Hence why we named 2 after the Queen (then stupidly named the capital city of Victoria "Melbourne" instead of "Batmania", which was totally an option on the table!) but also America can't talk, how many important places have you named after Washington and Columbus?
Tasmania is indeed ours, ours lonely Island state. Not so fun fact, Tasmanian Devils are endangered because they keeps biting each other's faces off and giving each other contagious facial cancer.
There's another internal territory no one really talks about, Jarvis Bay, it was formed mostly so the ACT could have access to a port without needing to use a state's port.
We have 7 external territories, the main ones being the island territories of Norfolk, Cocos, and Christmas Islands.
My stab in the dark is 8. That feels about right
oh god, no
I find a squirrel climbing a tree a more interesting event
Not to worry, I'm sure that there are websites around that cater to your squirrel tastes
To be fair, squirrels are pretty interesting.
Glad everyone else is enjoying the show at least. Half of us here are terrified we're about to lose the country to maniacal egotists with a penchant for a bit of racism and monarchy.
As a Canadian, we're feeling it too. I'm sure it's not as significant as what you're all feeling.
It's weird having a half deranged megalomaniacal neighbor, where they're fine most of the time then occasionally go completely off the rails.
I've often wondered how concerned ya'll might be. Sorry about the mess. For whatever it is worth, a lot of us are trying to clean it up.
We're hoping that happens, and you don't get stonewalled by idiots. We're cheering for your efforts.
To be fair, we have our own share of problems, including, but not limited to, hardline conservatives pulling similar crap, and even the odd Canadian Trump supporters, which always confused me.
We're coping okay. Hopefully it doesn't get any worse.
Trump supporters outside the us are the absolute weirdest anamoly to me. I barely get why some Americans like him. But seeing avid support for him elsewhere just blows my mind. Good luck though! Rooting for you guys too!
Could not disagree more.
It's a pathetic state of affairs that people here care and know more about US politics than our own country's, and I'm personally sick of it.
the default country
Lmao no. God no.
That implies every country started out as the US. Whereas the US is actually one of the youngest countries.
Haha. Like anyone lives outside the US
Ahh the United States of America. What a fascinating planet.
Tbf it seemed to make more sense for the likes of Reddit, Facebook, etc. Similarly if I go to a Chinese forum I would not assume that everyone there was from the USA.
I've heard this more times, and it's kind of baffling. The US isn't even the biggest individual country on Facebook. What do people who assume everyone is from the US think a non-US "forum" looks like? Where do Americans think everybody else hangs out online?
As a US citizen I think we forget how much of our shit gets out.
Iโm always surprised when I go abroad and people are up to date with somewhat niche US info. I was in Hong Kong and some local dude made a reference to the fatass NJ gov who was chilling on the closed beach during lockdowns.
I do feel like I see far more people complaining about US people making assumptions than I do US people assuming. When Iโm replying to someone I donโt put any thought into where theyโre from unless they drop a context clue.
Note: this is just for your understanding, I'm not criticising you.
It's the little things, like using NJ as a short form assuming everyone to know. Hong Kong is arguably more well known globally, but you spelled it out.
The ones in the know often don't see the assumption.
This is true. I wonder how often people assume and don't think anything of it because it doesn't even register that they may not be correct.
That said, I once did have a long conversation here with someone who just straight-up refused to believe I'm not American and would not take my word for it. I never quite got why he believed I'd be lying about that, but that person would not be persuaded, and it was one of the most baffling interactions I've had in my life.
Eh that seems like a major stretch. NJ used above was prefaced with โsomewhat niche US infoโ
I even replaced what the guy said which was Chris Christie with NJ gov because I hardly expected anyone abroad to know him
I feel like if weโre going to start thinking that someoneโs putting the ass in assumption just because they used something others might not understand then weโre in trouble
Youโd have to kill off any slang or expressions for fear that people might not understand them
NOW, but when Reddit started, and therefore the now infamous subreddit names were first doled out?
I am fairly sure that the rest of the world already existed. And those formats keep being in use in newer places, too. This is not just a Reddit thing. Even you mentioned Facebook, which was instantly popular globally.
I am fairly sure that the rest of the world already existed.
No way - at least not back then! Source: am American, and therefore entirely confident that no other nations existed prior to my hearing about them (Christopher Columbus told me so! ๐). And maybe even then... which reminds me, are you so sure that you are real? Maybe you too are in America and just forgot? ๐ซ
Also, just so we are clear, "American" = "USAian", definitely no other nations exist on the American continent, nope, no way! (Except Canada and Mexico, and they get a pass as wannabe USA states) ๐
instantly popular globally
There are 8 billion people on this planet, nothing happens instantly.
Facebook took a long time to spread around the globe. Same for reddit, this is a quote from the Wikipedia article:
As of August 2024, Reddit is the 9th most-visited website in the world. According to data provided by Similarweb, 51.75% of the website traffic comes from the United States, followed by the United Kingdom at 7.15% and Canada at 7.09%.[6]
More than two thirds of reddit traffic still comes from Anglophone countries to this day, and that percentage was surely much higher back in the early days.
I think you're severely overestimating how many people from other countries actually use Western social media. Between the language barrier and the technology barrier, most people on this planet simply don't have any opportunity or desire to use a site like Reddit or Lemmy. Facebook has slowly but steadily made global inroads, but by the time it got popular in non-western countries, Americans had largely moved on.
... I am a non-anglophone who, at the time of Facebook's raise to social media dominance lived in multiple non-anglophone countries. I was there.
In one of the places I lived there was briefly a popular local Facebook alternative. It lasted maybe a couple of years before entirely capitulating and getting absorbed. That place does still have a local Reddit-like alternative, and Reddit is certainly more US-centric. You are right that Facebook stayed popular much longer outside the US. It has started falling off in some of those places, but I did keep a Facebook account for work purposes for a lot longer than you'd expect because work relations in those territories would share Facebook credentials as a way to establish professional contact. Twitter may as well have been a lost ancient civilization, though.
There's also a lot to unpack in the assumption that on a thread about "why do Americans default to assuming everyone is from the US" you're reflexively lumping the entire anglosphere as part of the US, but honestly, I'll let the recently annexed English-speaking countries deal with that one on their own.
That's interesting, thanks for sharing. I don't mean to diminish your experience, but the world is simply too massive for anecdotal knowledge to apply when attempting to make sense of it. In other words, it's impossible to gather a balanced understanding of global phenomena via primary experiences. I'm not as well traveled as you, but I'm analyzing the statistics rather than relying on personal experiences, which is much more informative when trying to recognize the big picture.
I'm not reflexively lumping anything in, I'm simply recognizing the reality that the cultural life of anglosphere countries is heavily mixed, and that US culture dominates that mixture due to its size and economic position. It's not a controversial statement to say that Canada and the US are peas in a pod.
I left the original assumption unchallenged, but I don't agree with it tbh. There are a ton of Europeans on Lemmy and also reddit, and it's quite obvious to notice as an American. Furthermore, the entire premise is faulty. Rather than ask why people default to the US, the question is why people are assuming anything at all about anonymous accounts. And the answer is because of human nature, which isn't something unique to Americans.
Well, yeah, but it's not anecdotal. There is data to tell you how big Facebook is and was outside the US, in what territories and by how much relative to their US popularity at what point. My personal experience just happens to match those numbers (India, by the way, is Facebook's current biggest market).
I would also point out that by your own data, which is accurate as far as I can tell, 49% of Reddit is not American, so even with its more US-focused audience the assumption that users are American unless proven otherwise is wildly ethnocentric.
Now, I agree with you that assuming things about anonymous accounts, and especially anonymous accounts writing in English, is foolish. Lots of people are fluent in English who are not native speakers and definitely who are not from the US. Most, in fact, depending on how you define your parameters.
I disagree that this is "human nature", though. I don't assume the same thing from people who speak my native language online. I also don't assume the same thing about English speakers. The reason the OP is asking is that US ethnocentrism stands out. That's not to say it's not natural. We non-native dwellers in anglocentric social media will often comment on US cultural and political minutia, because US cultural and political minutia is present and relevant to us in a way ours isn't to Americans (thanks for that, cultural imperialism). We pass for Americans in more situations than some American lurking in a German-language forum would, and we're likely many times more numerous than... well, Americans lurking in German-language or Chinese-language socials.
But it being natural doesn't mean it isn't notable or an issue or a symptom of a dysfunction. Which it is, and it does annoy me for that reason.
49% of Reddit is not American, so even with its more US-focused audience the assumption that users are American unless proven otherwise is wildly ethnocentric.
The assumption that the 51% of reddit constitutes a monolith of non-Americans is wildly reductive and offensive /s. The majority is irrelevant, Americans still constitute the plurality of users, and thus inevitably become the default.
I absolutely agree that it's a symptom of dysfunction, but I just think it's unfair to blame on the average American. We didn't ask for this either.
Wait, what?
We're talking about assuming that a site's default user is from the US. I'm saying if 49% are not, then that assumption seems ethnocentric. That doesn't require every other user to be part of a monolith of non-Americans, they all share the trait of being... you know, not American.
That's a big chunk of your users that don't conform to your default use case. If this was about anything else you would not a default at all in that scenario, but that's not what happens. Also, it's not blamed on the "average American", it's being blamed on Americans as a whole, culturally, on the aggregate, which is fundamentally different.
As I've already explained, you're talking about the general case of assuming where someone is from. Because otherwise, you're suggesting that we should assume someone is from a different country than the US? Which country? I honestly don't understand what your point is.
they all share the trait of beingโฆ you know, not American.
Yes, this is the most important trait among humans, it is known.
Alright, let me take a step back to the OP.
The claim here is that unless something is flagged as being "world" something, it's assumed to be specific to the US. The obvious example is politics forums with no qualifier in social media (including here and on Reddit) being about US politics where everywhere else is qualified with either "world" or a specific country/region.
That's the claim.
The counterclaim is that makes sense for US-based social media where most users are American. I dispute that because... well, most users are not American in many of those sites, or a large enough proportion aren't that the assumption is not justified.
The logical way to organize that would be for the US politics channel, forum, magazine or whatever to be flagged "US politics" while everything else keeps its own qualifier. There is no default nation for politics. If anything, "politics" without a qualifier should be fair game for all world politics. That makes logical sense, but it's often not what happens in social media unless the specific social media site is heavily restricted to a specific non-English language or territory.
Given how many people choose to speak their native language in the US (myself included), I guess they assume they post to forums that are in their language.
So like Facebook and Reddit? Social media isn't in English specifically. People who speak other languages often post in their native language for some things and in the lingua franca for more international conversations. The Internet is the Internet regardless.
To be fair, the US has the largest number of English-speakers of any country in the world. As a first language, it has five times as many native English speakers as second place (the UK). It also has one of the highest Internet penetration rates in the world, meaning most of those English-speakers are also Internet users.
The US is a single country that is three-quarters the population of the entire European Union, and nearly all of its inhabitants speak English and use the Internet. So yes, if you pick a random user on an English social media page, odds are very good that person is an American. If you were to guess any random English-speaking Internet user's nationality, "American" is the best possible guess. But go on a Spanish language forum or a French language forum and nobody will assume you're American.
Consequently, Americans generate the majority or large plurality of English-language Internet content.
Edit: Please stop replying with "English is a lingua franca for non-native English speakers". I never made the claim that someone who uses English on the Internet is likely a native English speaker. I am claiming the converseโthat people who natively speak English are likely to use English on the Internet.
Iโm sorry but this is nonsense. Iโm in a lot of online communities where everyone uses English, despite it being nearly nobodyโs first language. It just happens to be the only language that everyone there knows. Language is no indication of nationality, especially online.
And to be honest, in those places the assumption is usually that everyone is European, which I can imagine is just as annoying for the stray American.
I think you misunderstand.
What I am saying is that of all Internet users that use English, Americans are by far the largest group due to it being a very large country, (third most populous in the world) with a high Internet penetration (97%), and whose residents speak English as their main language (78.3%).
But I would argue that the rest of the world also uses primarily English online. And just by virtue of being the rest of the world, outnumbers the Americans.
In other words, of all Internet users that use English, the vast majority is likely not American.
Of course I donโt have data to back this up, except anecdotally.
What I am saying is that of all Internet users that use English, Americans are by far the largest group
No, they didn't misunderstand. It is you who are massively misunderstanding. You are suffering from the erronous assumption that people who speak English on the internet are native English speakers when that it is not so at all. People speak English on the internet because it is the largest commonly understood language. So people from non-English speaking countries are using it as well. And there are a heck of a lot more non-native English speakers in the world than native English speakers.
So you are most likely at any time on the internet to be speaking to a non-native English speaker, and thus definitely not an American.
I did not claim the people who use English on the Internet are likely native English speakers.
I made the converse claimโthat people whose native language is English are likely to use English on the Internet.
This list puts US at ~297m English speakers which is the largest group from one single country, that is true. But 297m / 1,537m = The US has 19.35% of English speakers globally.
You are likely also greatly underestimating current internet connectivity, older smartphones have changed things for poorer countries a lot over the past decade. For example, India has only 62.6% of people as internet users - but that's still 880m people and probably most of their 125m English speakers. Nigeria has 63.8% internet users, but that's 136m internet users. And they also have 125m English speakers, who again, are more likely to be the people who can afford an English education, and also a smartphone. And then there's Pakistan with another 100m English speakers and 70.8% internet users, etc.
Just 3 countries, (2 of which were 1 country 80 years ago) and you're close to that 300 million count already.
The internet is less American than ever. It's just that most non-American people probably have non-English language spaces they can choose to gather in addition to the English-dominated spaces. Americans, on the other hand, are more likely to be monolingual English speakers and so they concentrate in the English-dominated spaces.
And non-Americans are all so used to people assuming American defaultism in English-dominated internet spaces because it was historically hugely expensive to get online and was overwhelmingly American English-speaking, that it's not even worth correcting when it happens the millionth time.
I've also put non-metric and US currency conversions in posts online many times. Not because I'm American or use them in daily life. It was just less annoying to convert them when writing rather than hear the inevitable multiple complaints about not understanding things in meters and dessicated jokes like "that's probably $2 in real money".
You're either overestimating the accuracy of your assumptions about your online interactions and/or seeing selection bias from your immersion in otherwise culturally isolated spaces.
Americans generate the majority of English-language Internet content.
Doubt.
There are 1.3 billion people who use English on the internet as a first or second language.
Not all Internet users generate the same amount of content. In addition to Americans being proud blabbermouths in general, people from wealthy countries generate more content than those from poorer countries. The US is among the wealthiest countries in the world.
Although it is not the most representative, nearly half of all Reddit users are American. American media outlets have immense global reach. You can probably name four or five American media outlets just off the top of your head, even if you're not American. The USA's geopolitical power means people are always talking about American politics or what America's leaders are doing, which draws engagement from Americans like a lamp draws moths. 7 out of the top 10 English-language YouTube channels are American (fully or partially).
It's pretty much impossible to prove, but I think the claim that Americans generate most of the content on the Internet is likely true or very close to true.
It's even more convincing if you exclude English Internet users from India, as a quick visit to any forum dominated by Indian users will cause you to quickly realise that the language used there is not really English but a mix of English and Hindi which is not comprehensible to non-Indians.
Again, the numbers you linked shows that you are more likely to speak to a non-American on reddit than an American. Your entire premise is flawed from the beginning.
Consequently, Americans generate the majority of English-language Internet content.
False. Yes, it is larger than any other individual English speaking group but accounts for less than a fifth of the total English speakers.
I wouldnโt have guessed Nigeria is the third largest English speaking group.
This point was plainly addressed. Read carefully before going in guns-blazing.
Do you think Nigerians use the Internet as much as Americans?
โGoing in guns-blazingโ, lol, some Americansโฆ
The more egalitarian principle would be to not assume. I won't deny that. People from more minority locales have every right to be upset at being marginalized.
But at the same time, whenever I read passive aggressive comments on socials from residents of crown countries or from EAASL people around the world bitching about US defaultism as if people are doing it just to be ignorant dicks, I can only think to myself, "Uhh, hello? What do you think the demographics of this space were? What did you expect?"
Americans are hardly the majority of the world's English speakers, but for all the reasons you listed, they tend to remain a massive plurality, if not an outright overwhelming majority, of any mainstream online English language platform. No, that's not a license to perpetuate US defaultism. But like... read the room, people. Your good fight is far more uphill than you seem to think it is.
Again, you are completely missing the point of the internet and English usage on it. People are using English as a lingua franca. There are a lot more non-native English speakers on the internet than native English speakers.
So no, odds are not that it is an American you are speaking to, just because that person speaks English. You are literally regurgitating the fallacy that OP is about.
We should really be counting English literate people, since nobody here is talking, and literacy is more reading/writing.
Literacy is pretty broad too. It doesn't imply that it's your native language, nor if you can speak the language (whether you can do that very well or not).
Literacy is going to be a bonefide requirement for most of the internet, with some exceptions, like text to speech and speech recognition stuff, people with disabilities who may not be able to see properly or at all.... Stuff like that.
lingua franca
I love that the real lingua franca, a term from both Latin and Greek roots, literally meaning the language of the Franks (French) is English. Plus, also, fuck you Esperanto!
FYI
According to Wikipedia the percentage of English speakers located in the US is lower that 20%. Does this mean that only 1 in 5 users is from the US?
English Speakers in the US: 297.400.000. English Speakers in Europe: 260.000.000. So you have about 37,4M more English speakers in the US than in Europe.
The average American uses only English language forums.
The average European who speaks English will probably spend some portion of their time using whatever their native language is.
The average English speaker in Africa is not as likely to have an Internet connection.
The average English speaker in China is likely to not be able to access English social media sites (great firewall).
Many English-speakers in India post online in a mix of English and Hindi that non-Indians find difficult to comprehend.
You're correct that the claim that the US is ยพ the population of Europe is erroneous. But it is ยพ the population of the EU. I've corrected this.
I admire your determination to bend your perception of facts to fit your narrative.
Russia, Kanada, Australia, South America? Apparently they ceased to exist.
Africa? They still live in mud and abject poverty. There is no electricity nor Internet.
China? They're 100% locked in. (No bots no nothing.)
Indians can't write proper English (a bit rich coming from an USAmerican)
Surely you have a bit more thinking power than that. If you gave each of your bullet points a mere five seconds each of critical thought, you wouldn't have made this ridiculous comment.
Those countries you mentioned? Of course there are people living in them. But there aren't as many English-speakers as in America. I didn't say all, I say most (this will be a recurring theme).
With the exception of southern Africa (76%), the rest of Africa has Internet penetration rates below 50%. As low as 27% in east Africa. Remember, I didn't say all, I said most.
China's great firewall prevents most people from accessing the outside Internet, and many Chinese people don't care to. I know this, because I'm fucking Chinese. Is it possible to circumvent? Sure, if you're willing to play VPN whack-a-mole with the CCP or are lucky enough to be the 1% of China that lives in Hong Kong or Macau. But again, I said most, I didn't say all.
You also clearly have never been on any forums populated by Indian users if you think that I'm only saying Indians use unintelligible English on the Internet because I'm racist. They code-switch between English and Hindi. If you don't know Hindi, you won't understand it. Are all posts like this? Of course not. But a great deal are. I never said all, I said most.
Here are random top comments from the top posts of Reddit's r/Indiasocial that show what I'm talking about:
Kal bolne ja rha Hu usko . Want to get it over it once and for all been bugging me since some time .
No boldiya toh sahi hai Padhai kar lunga .
Kassh bta pata mummy ko apni sab problems. Bta bii nhi pata kyuki woh chinta karengii
OP ke AAnde jalwa diye
Folks, look what I found during cleaning today๐ญ๐ฅบ๐ฅน
I am so happy that my mom has still kept all of stuff in the store room. Woh bhi kya din the๐ฅน๐ฅน
Bhai hamare side ke Ghar mein kirayedar rehte Hain. To un baccho kii ball hamari chat ya backyard mein aa jati thi aur mere ek Purina badi wali thaili bharke balls bahut variety Hain par mummy nikalne NAHI deti.
Time to leave this sub. Har dusara post my gf/bf made this, i went for date, gift given by my bf/gf. Had hai
And also, I don't use American English. I live in America but I am a Hongkonger and use British English.
They code-switch between English and Hindi. If you donโt know Hindi, you wonโt understand it. Are all posts like this? Of course not.
You're so close. Let me give you another hint: What do you think every other regional sub looks like? (I speak multiple languages, so I've been to multiple regionals - including in Languages I don't really speak)
Also, yes it is a bit racist to assume that Indians are only able to converse in an Hindi/English mix and unable to converse in proper English. On top of that it is a bit stupid to assume all of India speaks Hindi - e.g. most of Bengalurians speak Kannada.
But there arenโt as many English-speakers as in America. I didnโt say all, I say most (this will be a recurring theme).
You're correct. It's a recurring theme. You have been made aware by multiple people now that you over-inflate the percentage of USAmericans among the users of English-speaking forums and that you have been incredibly ignorant about it.
I think none will dispute that US located users are in the majority - the majority is however not as big as you make it out to be. (and your reasoning is - for lack of a better term - atrocious)
The only thing I am claiming is that a majority or large plurality of English language Internet users are American, meaning if you are to assume a country of origin (note: if), assuming the user is an American is the one most likely to be accurate. I think I've said enough on the matter.
If you disagree, that's fine but I'm tired of this conversation.
Assumed by Americans which is an important detail.
To be honest I also find myself assuming this frequently. And I'm rarely incorrect
Yup, if it's English-language, it's probably American unless otherwise noted
Weird to go into a website based in the States, with a large audience of Americans, all speaking in the American dialect of English primarily about events in US news and politics, and then get mad because it's America-centric.
I don't care where y'all are from as long as you're not a dumbass dickhead.
Oh. I'm shit out of luck then.
Well, I also sit in front of a mirror.
Terrible news, guy who just started posting on the Internet
I wonder if a news community with a "no mentioning the US" rule would work. Not out of any hate, just as something arbitrary like "don't use the letter E".
There was one on Reddit that had a rule that no more than 50% of a story could be about the US and if the US was one of two parties they preferred the other point of view.
Jimmy Eat USA
Bleed Earthlings
I hear you and am guilty of it myself. I feel like it's due to the anonymous nature of the internet. I think everyone immediately falls into the category of "peer" before putting a touch more thought into who the actual person (bot/ai) is that wrote the reply. Add that to the fact that most Americans see themselves (as a country) as the king of the world.
Maybe you can try typing with an accent, but I think that'd probably just be seen as a racist American.
I'm not even American, I find my thoughts defaulting to this.
i live in DC and we get tagged for everything world politics.
forgive me for not caring if fvey countries get lumped into uspol.
as a person that came from 3rd world country, i relate T_T
Howdy y'all bros. My name is Todd Bonzalez and I am from one of the great American places foreigners know from your TV shows.
The SMX "World Championship" just finished. It only takes place in the US.
its just the loudest voices that seem to drive the world.
Well Al Gore invented the internet so the internet is more a.USA thing ๐คฃ๐คฃ
Heavily inspired by the french Minitel but yes
Heavily inspired by the Sumerian cuneiform but yes
Minitel launched in 1982, well after work had begun on interconnections between different computer networks, using the predecessor protocols to TCP/IP and what would become the addressing/domain name system. Minitel launched on protocols that were ultimately incompatible with the rest of the Internet, and didn't have an easy way to actually get joined in.
Minitel was more of an alternative internet than it was the inspiration for the migration of the internet to becoming a HTTP/www-centered network.
As an American who just wants things organized clearly, I find it annoying too
I mean, we did invent this cursed network. It's our job to ruin it.
One day, we will shitpost our way to freedom
This is lemmy.world, you would have to join lemmy.{country} for lands beyond the fruited plains and purple mountains majesty.
As someone outside the U.S., what is your default persona for anonymous/pseudonymous users until you know more about them? Just curious. Like, if you don't have any information about them, do you read the words in the voice of a person just like you?
I default to everyone sounding like Macho Man Randy Savage.
Oh yeah!
I don't read words in any voice other than the naturally subvocalisation that occurs when I'm reading, which is always in my voice.
Even when I read a quote myself Morgan Freeman, I'm hearing my voice, doing a Morgan freeman impression.
But in terms of who I picture? Nothing, people online are not even corporal beings to me until details are revealed. They are still human and have whole lives offline so that's not an excuse to be needlessly rude, but I know nothing of them so why would I randomly invent details unless I'm doing so as a "put myself in their shoes" thought experiment.
But then I have a degree of aphantasia so I'm not "picturing" anything, all I have is words anyway, so it's easy not to add in extra words that change my assumptions about a person.
You mean anything without world in its name?
What? Like the World Series of Baseball?
The name fits, it's just that the only people in the world who give a shit about baseball are from the USA.
Japan would like a word, but otherwise, fair enough
Puerto Rico and Cuba also love baseball.
Hell, in Cuba standing around arguing about baseball is a recognized profession.
HE WAS SAFE!!!
Well that's just not true, you should check out the World baseball Classic, it'll open your eyes.
Sorry, anything with or without / everything not ich_iel
I completely understand the sentiment.
I also understand the sentiment that the internet is effectively a US invention dating back at least to ARPAnet.
I guess what I'm suggesting is: can't we all just get along? At least we can now all communicate with each other.
We are trying to get along. We are already speaking English, which is a massive step in your direction. US commenters and posters don't even bother to convert to kilometres or something. Or the worst: write about something that happened in AK as if everyone knows postal shortages of the US.
The crazy irony is that those from outside the US probably know way more than those in the US, in terms of stories about Alaska.
No hate here. There will be ups and downs.
At the end of the day, I'm happy to communicate with you.
Don't ever talk about kilometres in here. Are you trying to spark an international incident?
FWIW ich habe Deustch gelernt. Aber ich habe die meistens vergessen ๐
Dein Deutsch klingt richtig gut ๐
Danke schon ๐
If it makes it any better youre more likely to get an American who can convert Miles into Leagues before they even think about kilometers. We dont really use metric for anything, unless youre military or something.
I also understand the sentiment that the internet is effectively a US invention dating back at least to ARPAnet.
Yeah, but this is a website. Sir Tim Berners-Lee represent!
Plus also, English is an English invention.
But otherwise, you're good.
The World Wide Web is not an American invention. Who invented what is completely irrelevant in this context anyway though.
Don't be so self-involved.
Try visit China for once and you will get sick of the word "China", it's literally in everything there :), like communist party's intelligence service :)
The thing is we are not talking about visiting countries. We are talking about the virtual World Wide Web.
The "World" wide web not USA wide web
It does make it fun to stir the pot
I mean the us dwarfs other english speaking countries
Tons of people speak English as a second language, on the internet
Your comment is very typical of that (fallacious) US centrism. People write in English on the internet because that is the universal language. There are far more secondary English speakers on the internet than primary English speakers.
because that is the universal language
*grince des dents*
because it is the international language of this days and time.
Le franรงais รฉtait ร un moment donnรฉ, hein
Yeah XD Now english is the lingua franca
Yeah like India
135 million english speakers is less than 300 million
Mr Blott really really really likes to denigrate Americans. Don't rain on his parade
What on Earth are you on about? "denigrate Americans". They are pointing out facts. That you apparently are so fragile that you consider that denigration is entirely on yourself.
I think you owe me an apology. It took me a while to copy paste all that senseless vitriol and you won't even acknowledge your mistake. Disappointing.
Surprised at a yank using the word "denigrate" without clutching their pearls at the etymology of it lol
Look at their comment history. They can't go two days without getting in a dig at Americans. Even when it's completely irrelevant and off topic. I'm just pointing out that this person has a bone to pick and not to take it personally.
The funny part is that they're often completely wrong when they try to talk shit. Like here, thinking that India having a larger population than the US is some kind of gotcha moment, despite less than 10% of that population speaking English.
I'll just transcribe a few lovely comments from our good friend Mr Blott.
Glock pistols popular in US because of the proliferation of fucking cowards
Scared of their own fucking shadows, those pussies
Whatโs the difference between a cow and 9/11
Youโd stop milking a cow after 23 years
Seems a bit unnecessary when you could just dress the ivy up like schoolkids and the yanks would wipe it out in a week
German
Iโm guessing a yank whose great great great great great great grandfather once wiped his cock on a strudel
Theyโre using American weapons, they should just aim for schools
Holy fuck, yanks are weird
God Iโd hate to have such poor reading comprehension. Youโd last about a minute in UK based communities lol
Youโre not out of the dark ages, you quivering shitebag lol
You mean prison slavery? Thatโs the US, get on it lol
Did it come out of the States?
If so, guaranteed utter fucking horseshit
You can punch your hand through your plasterboard mate lol
You can always spot an American because theyโre so fuckin scared of everything. Look, this oneโs scared of his own shite ๐
Of course!
Just lose the -
Guns
Tiny-penis trucks
the "right" to hate-speech
the religious weirdo thing
And you'll be getting close to the 20th century!
Know how yous get upset when people say โAmericans are stupidโ
Literally a third of you have demonstrated that youโd eat gravel if someone said itโd cure immigrants
A third. So lets just say only half of the other two thirds are stupid
Thatโs quite a few. Almost a quarter pounder
Yous cunts are greedy to the point of being fuckin EVIL
Thatโs justโฆ evil, taking money from poor folk and their kids
How are yous letting evil cunts do this to your fellow citizens? How are you not fucking getting the flaming torches out?
Selfish fucking cunts, the lot of you. Stand up for not just yourselves, for all of yous
The bot is only โspreading misinformationโ to people who are too stupid to realise that โleftโ and โrightโ mean politically different things in different countries
Mostly the yanks
I feel really sorry for this guy
What kind of unhinged parents call their kid Tyreek?
This is just from the past few weeks lmao. This dude has issues.
network invented in America
look inside
Americans
How could this have happened?
This is why:
The US has more allocated IPv4 addresses and more users per allocated IPv4 address than any other country, by wide margins - and IPv6 adoption is not that widespread yet. It is entirely rational to assume that an English-speaking person on the Internet is from the US, given no other information.
Of course English is spoken in other countries, and other countries have high numbers of internet users, but it does not follow that English is a commonly used language for internet users in other countries. Most Chinese are probably speaking Chinese, most Indians are probably speaking Hindi.
The IPv6 graph you linked shows that adoption is still less than 50%, and I'm not clear on their methodology... does "users that access Google" mean users with Google accounts? or individual users that use google.com? or does it include all of their cloud services? do web servers linking content from Google Ads count? does this data represent mostly end users, or also infrastructure connections?
When non-native English speakers are navigating in a non-national internet setting we use English. I have gathered from the many American comments in this thread, that that fact is apparently incredibly difficult for Americans to gauge. Nevertheless, it is a fact.
2016 is a little far, isn't it?
I hate to say it, but, these things don't change a lot, or quickly.
IP blocks, or "large groups of IP addresses" are assigned to regional internet registries, or RIRs which then hand them out from there. There's a couple RIRs. I think five in total? ARIN covers North America, and has, by far, the most IP addresses given out.
There's also RIPE, in Europe, APNIC, for Asia and the Pacific areas, including China and Australia, AfriNIC, which is basically all of Africa... If that wasn't obvious. And lacnic, which is South America.
Large IP blocks can, but rarely ever do, get transferred between RIRs.
But wait, it gets more complicated. IP addresses allocated in one region could be used anywhere in the world. The vast majority are not, and it's important to note that because of global routing, you can't have a block smaller than 256 addresses allocated in the default free zone (DFZ). The DFZ is the part of the internet that doesn't have a "default gateway". All routes are advertised, and by those advertisements are learned by others. The routers in the DFZ only have so much memory, and there was a crisis a while ago when the memory of most of the routers in the DFZ were dangerously close to being full.... That was around when ipv6 was first switched on. The routing memory is extremely fast, because it needs to be. Looking up a route in a table with a million+ entries takes time, but that time needs to be so short that latency is effectively mitigated. So that memory is some of the fastest used in tech at times, notwithstanding newer technologies.
I'm off topic. Anyways, my point is, ARIN is big. They have a lot of IPs. However allocation doesn't and shouldn't imply usage. A large number of addresses are allocated for US military use that are basically unseen in the internet. There's a few infamous /8 blocks of around 16.7 million addresses that don't get advertised and can't be used by anyone besides the US military. I forget which branch of military owns it. They've owned it since the internet started giving out allocations (more or less) and today one of those /8 blocks is worth billions, with a cost of about $50 per IP.
So yeah, the US has a lot of IP allocation, they also have a large amount of unused IP addresses.
I would love to see a more recent source if you have one.
Regardless, possession of IP addresses doesn't change all that much. In the early days a company could buy an entire Class A (1.X.X.X) address space comprising 16million+ addresses for their private use. There are still many companies holding large blocks of addresses, and most of those companies are in the US, and they don't just give up those addresses.
The point being, there's significant resistance to redistributing addresses once they've been allocated. They don't change hands terribly often (and keep in mind we're talking about actual internet addresses, not local network addresses that are being dynamically assigned and NATed across router domains).
No, they highlight some problems with IP4: Bad distribution of IP4 ranges and bad usage of those ranges. So the graphs show the US has way too much IP actresses, some under used/unused and some overused. The blog post they are from is pretty clear about this.
These graphs do not give an indication of how many users per country there are. There are in fact statistics on that which expectedly show China and India on top. These however do not take into account that social media use way more popular in the U.S. for now.
The closest stat may be Reddit users by country which seems to indicate that about every 2nd user is from the US. (Not sure if Russian/Chinese bot accounts also count towards these though).
These graphs do not give an indication of how many users per country there are. There are in fact statistics on that which expectedly show China and India on top.
Well sure, but people from those countries are far less likely to be speaking English, which is why I said:
It is entirely rational to assume that an English-speaking person on the Internet is from the US, given no other information.
The prevalence of internet use in countries with primary languages other than English has no bearing on this statement.
The point of using the IP address statistics is to show that the vast majority of websites on the Internet were created in the US for the US market, and that is still true today.
On a side note, the distribution of addresses is unbalanced but it isn't "bad". It is a consequence of a system growing over time. Communications infrastructure cannot pop into existence everywhere all at once, and realistically not many people outside the US had any interest in the internet in 1983.
Sorry, are you trying to prove beyond a doubt that you are dishonest and statistics-illiterate?
which is why I said:
It is entirely rational to assume that an English-speaking person on the Internet is from the US, given no other information.
No, you wrote:
**The US has more allocated IPv4 addresses and more users per allocated IPv4 address than any other country, by wide margins **- and IPv6 adoption is not that widespread yet. It is entirely rational to assume that an English-speaking person on the Internet is from the US, given no other information.
So your assumption is based on a gross misinterpretation of the statistics you presented. Your incorrect interpretation of the graphs would put US participation at about 99,99%, which is obviously ridiculous.
Also according to Wikipedia the percentage of English speakers located in the US is lower that 20%. Does this mean that only 1 in 5 users is from the US?
The point of using the IP address statistics is to show that the vast majority of websites on the Internet were created in the US for the US market, and that is still true today.
That's not at all what these graphs show though.
Also, while I agree that most websites might be US targeted towards the US calling that 'vast' is bit of a stretch.
... and realistically not many people outside the US had any interest in the internet in 1983.
I gather you've not been around then. Almost none had any interest in "the internet" until the mid 90s - this includes the US. Partly because what you refer to as "the internet" was called WWW back then and started only 1989. People had been very anal about this until about 2005 - I guess you haven't been around then either.
That would be 3 addresses per US citizen. You have some whales like MS in there, just because your companies can grow dangerously big.
Aren't the majority of English speakers from the US?
EDIT: The USA has 3x the population of the UK and Australia combined and the USA appears to be the home of approx 60% of native English speakers. However there are billions of speakers if you include it as a 2nd language. Which Americans don't speak 2nd languages so we obviously don't count that.
I'd just like to mention that plenty of ESL users speak English more than their native, and that the country with the most people who use English for interacting with the Internet, it's probably India. Indians communicate to a lot of their compatriots in English, since they are also an ex-British colony, and have a large variety of native languages.
What's your definition of first/second language if you grow up bilingual?
The majority of English speakers aren't from the US, though the US does have the most English speakers. Important distinction to make!
Not on Lemmy. Om Lemmy you're 50% German, 50% American unless proven otherwise.
๐ฏ๐๐๐๐ ๐ถ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐๐ ๐ฑ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐ป๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐ฐ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐๐๐ ๐ญ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐ ๐ฏ๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐๐!
I have blocked sooooo many german communities and several german instances.
I browse all to get as much new content as possible.
But I have to block a shitload of stuff I am not interested in seeing.
SPRICH DEUTSCH DU HURENSOHN
Nej, jag kan inte Tyska, men om du vill kan vi prata Svenska! (:
Ik versta daar dus allebij helemaal niks van. Wel leuk, zo'n internationale draad.
akkor a kurva anyรกd
Fel sprรฅk รคr jag rรคdd, fรถrsรถk igen! (:
Du luktar skitgott.
Tackar tackar, jag har inte ens duschat!
jach ki'imak in wรณol yo'osal Google Translate
I took German in highschool, but all thatโs left is: Darf ich aufs Klo gehen?
kek
Moerasduits. Is dat goed genoeg?
Tja, da verpasst du was...
Just learn German. Just do it
รh, du kan vรคl lika gรคrna lรคra dig Svenska, det blir enklare fรถr oss bรฅda! (:
I was thinking of doing that if I actually move to Finland.
Having been to Finland before I know that it's not very useful in everyday situations but it's still useful and way easier to learn than finnish. Especially as I speak German.
There are parts on Finland where Swedish is the primary laguage even over Finnish.
I have filtered out some terms: elon musk and donald trump
There was a fair amount of French language posts too, not sure how much quality and engagement they have.
Well, then have some proof:
G E K O L O N I S E E R D
zeg makker
Als een warm bad
SPRICH
ESPAรOL
ะขะซ
FIGLIO DI TROIA
Du irrst dich, Brudi - niemand spricht Deutsch hier.
Yo no hablar alemร n
Se hablรกs castellano entonces complica, ya que no hablo. Excepto cuando borracho*. Aรบn asi, no es castellano, es mรกs como portitaรฑol...
*de veras, che. Una vodca hoy serรญa genial.
Da hast du wohl recht, ich habe noch kein einziges "du hast mich" bis jetzt (Verwenden Sie fรผr den zitierten Teil nicht Google Translate)
Auch weil alles Liebe in Lemmy ist, ja? /witz
das oder neunundneunzig Luftballons ๐
Just like Reddit was back in the day.
Alter.. das kann nicht sein
Ja ech waar, ik maak geen gein
Just like Geilenkirchen.
Ja genau.
I'm Scottish and don't know what the fuck % I am.
I'm guessing 67% German, 22% American at this point.
I assume 70% European 30% whatever else, although that depends on the instance. Of the instance gives any indication I just assume that.
I've heard it called "US Defaultism" where most Americans online seem to assume that everyone they interact with is from their country and all US news is considered significant even when it really isn't.
Counterpoint: I rarely see non-US news posted. I do from time to time here on Lemmy, but itโs very rare.
I might just be in the wrong communities though.
That's because most of the world countries keep internal news, internal, but you're right tho, not enough representation makes people think like that
I do lean moee towards us defaultism being the case as other country news does get posted but has zero to none interaction because the us posts threads are getting so much more activity.
Outside Lemmy I use Apple News and what I kind of hate about it is even while traveling abroad youโre stuck with US news. I have both English and Spanish languages set up on iOS so being in a Spanish-speaking country, it would be nice to see local news in either language.
Wish we had Apple News :(
I generally avoid news of late of any kind as its just so bloated and every once a week or so just visit one of my local sites for a quick scroll.
The community news@lemmy.world used to have it in their rules, that it must be US news, same as on the old site. I just looked, and it's no longer a rule on lemmy.world
I didnโt realize that โ kind of dumb it was US-only when the instance TLD is
.world. ๐คฆโโ๏ธI do this sometimes, and I hate when I catch myself doing it.
Imagine if different fonts represented different accents.
Iโve been guilty of that- commenting before checking what community the post was in. Thankfully, Iโve found that most people outside of the US prefer gentle correction. Unfortunately, I doubt the average person from the US would show the same courtesy if the roles were reversed.
I find that it correlates more with education status than nationality... but therefore it surely is more rare among the set of average Americans who have access to the internet than globally.
... the average Westerner also has access to the internet? At most, maybe it excludes those who don't speak English
If I was using a website called "Facebloke" that was well known to have been made and ran in the UK, I'd assume everyone on it was British.
Or the Australian version "Matebook", full with Aussies.
Mate.
We call it Cuntface down here.
To be fair, we call everyone Cuntface down here.
I'm ready to discuss maple syrup on HoserLoonieSorryEh
Ah, yes! The 3 billion Americans on Facebook!
And why would you make that assumption? The internet has no borders, so it doesnโt really matter where or by whom something is made. Especially if the language is English, which has somewhere between 1.5 and 2 billion speakers worldwide.
Except that it actually does. See: China, North Korea, other fucked up governments that lock down the Internet for their people etc.
More like Faceberk, amirite?
Yes, I saw that. But it is obviously meant to be an analogy for how Facebook is a website famously made in America by an American.
...Anything written in English, and you can usually filter that even more by just looking for people using too many U's.
You mean people using British spellings right?
Why whateveur dou you mean?
Lol ngl that's probably how a French accent would look like spelt out XD
Agreed, reading this summoned the SpongeBob narrator in my mind.
I read this like officer crabtree from Allo Allo
I think you'll find most of the time the British use precisely the number U's they intend to though typos may afflict even the best.
And when you do use those โจUโฉ (I do), people assume that you know what's going on in the UK (I don't.).
What if i use "color", " gouvernment", "dialogue", " humor", "armor", " and "honour"
I see you like to keep 'em guessing.
I'd think 'who's this foucker?'
Self leart second language, so it could be anything.
Im gonna assume youre from the coast of Virginia and are transcribing your accent.
Finally your edumacashun is compleute, go fourth and enjouy your freedumb! ๐
and an aversion to Zees - I mean Zeds!
I'm from Australia and don't mind engagement with the (mostly) US content.
Let's face it, the US election is the most interesting event on the planet anyway.
also one of the most concerning ones
My favorite answer when internet Nazis asked "How could the Nazis have won?" used to be "Be America."
It's not as funny anymore. They listened.
Stop giving them ideas.
I'm sorry, the rise of American fascism is all my fault :(
I just wish Americans would have a little self awareness when engaging in foreign content.
I was in a comment thread for a video on a report by the ABC about ADEs. Now I will give Americans the benefit of the doubt, we both have ABC networks, but ours clearly says "Australia", the news presenter has a Australian accent, and was talking about the Australian minimum wage, there were references to Centrelink and the Australian government repeatedly. If you watched the video and couldn't tell me what country the video was about, you need to go back to primary school, your media comprehension level is dysfunctional .
I mentioned a clarifying point in the the comments about ADE being different from DES and giving numbers for each (you don't need to know anything about these acronyms), and someone starts arguing with me that when they were in the disability program they got xyz and they didn't have to do any of this. I replied saying that these processes have been unchanged for 20 years, I don't know how they're getting what they're getting, they have a unique case. They come back telling me everyone gets that, that's how it is, I need to do my research before I make stuff up. I explain that I work in the sector, I'm looking at the cases software, if they are indeed getting those services through that program, they are the only one of 40,000 people in the program getting that, because that's not how the service works. They tell me 15 million people people use the program. I finally realise what's happening. "there are only 25 million people people in Australia....you're a lost American aren't you?" and sure enough ,they politely reply with "oh yeah, I'm not Australian so I don't know, maybe it's different over there".
And I just can't with that level of American stupidity.
You can came into an Australian forum and assumed I wasn't Australian, assumed I wasn't talking about Australia, then came to the conclusion that "maybe it's different over there" when I had explicitly just informed you that ,yes, the law is different here.
Now many times could I have used the acronym DES before the American thought to themselves "maybe this person isn't talking about SSDI".
And this is just the example from the last hour. I end up in a lot of international PD sessions for my work, and something like this is a daily occurrence, only with the Americans.
Canada, you are sadly not excused from this, nor sure why but it's always "okay, where are we all from? "Australia" "Belgium" "Brazil" "Indonesia" "Fort Freedom" "Edmonton"
Those are cities and provinces, clearly the rest of us are doing countries, some of us are big enough that we could name states if we wanted to, but we're being polite, you've got 50 (10+3 ๐จ๐ฆ ) of them and we didn't memorise a silly song in school to learn your states.
The fact that I know how many states the US has and how many provinces and tertories Canada has, but an American would be stabbing in the dark to guess how many states and territories Australia has, even though our biggest state is 3x bigger than Texas and Australia as a whole is a comparable landmass to the contiguous 48.
Not just Americans, most people don't read/watch the link
Not surprising given our influence on your culture is far greater than the other way, landmass is worthless when it's full of the Outback (a beautiful place for sure)
And you'd be surprised how many of us know it's 6, I bet. Californians get to play with you guys online if we stay up past our bedtimes, after all.
The more fun part is going to be me trying to name them and see if I still can: Queensland, New South Whales, Western? Australia, Northern? Australia, Victoria (you already HAVE ONE NAMED AFTER THE QUEEN THOUGH), Tasmania? Is that one you guys?
This is a good point about cultural export, majority of modern content use American, and the majority of childhood content at least for me was Canadian.
I'm often surprised how little I know of the UK compared to the USA when I think of how much is imported to Australia from the UK ....including my family.
Thank you so much for giving me your guesses at state names, we did make it easy for you with just a bunch of cardinal directions.
You are bang on with 6 states, and almost bang on with their names.
The place you've dubbed "Northern Australia" is the "Northern Territory" and is not a state, the state you are missing is South Australia.
We have two major territories, Northern Territory as mentioned, but then similar to the USA, our national capital is not located within a state.
Our capital city is in "The Australian Capital Territory", or just "the ACT"
We are super creative with the names. Hence why we named 2 after the Queen (then stupidly named the capital city of Victoria "Melbourne" instead of "Batmania", which was totally an option on the table!) but also America can't talk, how many important places have you named after Washington and Columbus?
Tasmania is indeed ours, ours lonely Island state. Not so fun fact, Tasmanian Devils are endangered because they keeps biting each other's faces off and giving each other contagious facial cancer.
There's another internal territory no one really talks about, Jarvis Bay, it was formed mostly so the ACT could have access to a port without needing to use a state's port.
We have 7 external territories, the main ones being the island territories of Norfolk, Cocos, and Christmas Islands.
My stab in the dark is 8. That feels about right
oh god, no
I find a squirrel climbing a tree a more interesting event
Not to worry, I'm sure that there are websites around that cater to your squirrel tastes
To be fair, squirrels are pretty interesting.
Glad everyone else is enjoying the show at least. Half of us here are terrified we're about to lose the country to maniacal egotists with a penchant for a bit of racism and monarchy.
As a Canadian, we're feeling it too. I'm sure it's not as significant as what you're all feeling.
It's weird having a half deranged megalomaniacal neighbor, where they're fine most of the time then occasionally go completely off the rails.
I've often wondered how concerned ya'll might be. Sorry about the mess. For whatever it is worth, a lot of us are trying to clean it up.
We're hoping that happens, and you don't get stonewalled by idiots. We're cheering for your efforts.
To be fair, we have our own share of problems, including, but not limited to, hardline conservatives pulling similar crap, and even the odd Canadian Trump supporters, which always confused me.
We're coping okay. Hopefully it doesn't get any worse.
Trump supporters outside the us are the absolute weirdest anamoly to me. I barely get why some Americans like him. But seeing avid support for him elsewhere just blows my mind. Good luck though! Rooting for you guys too!
Could not disagree more.
It's a pathetic state of affairs that people here care and know more about US politics than our own country's, and I'm personally sick of it.
the default country
Lmao no. God no.
That implies every country started out as the US. Whereas the US is actually one of the youngest countries.
Haha. Like anyone lives outside the US
Ahh the United States of America. What a fascinating planet.
Tbf it seemed to make more sense for the likes of Reddit, Facebook, etc. Similarly if I go to a Chinese forum I would not assume that everyone there was from the USA.
I've heard this more times, and it's kind of baffling. The US isn't even the biggest individual country on Facebook. What do people who assume everyone is from the US think a non-US "forum" looks like? Where do Americans think everybody else hangs out online?
As a US citizen I think we forget how much of our shit gets out.
Iโm always surprised when I go abroad and people are up to date with somewhat niche US info. I was in Hong Kong and some local dude made a reference to the fatass NJ gov who was chilling on the closed beach during lockdowns.
I do feel like I see far more people complaining about US people making assumptions than I do US people assuming. When Iโm replying to someone I donโt put any thought into where theyโre from unless they drop a context clue.
Note: this is just for your understanding, I'm not criticising you.
It's the little things, like using NJ as a short form assuming everyone to know. Hong Kong is arguably more well known globally, but you spelled it out.
The ones in the know often don't see the assumption.
This is true. I wonder how often people assume and don't think anything of it because it doesn't even register that they may not be correct.
That said, I once did have a long conversation here with someone who just straight-up refused to believe I'm not American and would not take my word for it. I never quite got why he believed I'd be lying about that, but that person would not be persuaded, and it was one of the most baffling interactions I've had in my life.
Eh that seems like a major stretch. NJ used above was prefaced with โsomewhat niche US infoโ
I even replaced what the guy said which was Chris Christie with NJ gov because I hardly expected anyone abroad to know him
I feel like if weโre going to start thinking that someoneโs putting the ass in assumption just because they used something others might not understand then weโre in trouble
Youโd have to kill off any slang or expressions for fear that people might not understand them
NOW, but when Reddit started, and therefore the now infamous subreddit names were first doled out?
I am fairly sure that the rest of the world already existed. And those formats keep being in use in newer places, too. This is not just a Reddit thing. Even you mentioned Facebook, which was instantly popular globally.
No way - at least not back then! Source: am American, and therefore entirely confident that no other nations existed prior to my hearing about them (Christopher Columbus told me so! ๐). And maybe even then... which reminds me, are you so sure that you are real? Maybe you too are in America and just forgot? ๐ซ
Also, just so we are clear, "American" = "USAian", definitely no other nations exist on the American continent, nope, no way! (Except Canada and Mexico, and they get a pass as wannabe USA states) ๐
There are 8 billion people on this planet, nothing happens instantly.
Facebook took a long time to spread around the globe. Same for reddit, this is a quote from the Wikipedia article:
More than two thirds of reddit traffic still comes from Anglophone countries to this day, and that percentage was surely much higher back in the early days.
I think you're severely overestimating how many people from other countries actually use Western social media. Between the language barrier and the technology barrier, most people on this planet simply don't have any opportunity or desire to use a site like Reddit or Lemmy. Facebook has slowly but steadily made global inroads, but by the time it got popular in non-western countries, Americans had largely moved on.
... I am a non-anglophone who, at the time of Facebook's raise to social media dominance lived in multiple non-anglophone countries. I was there.
In one of the places I lived there was briefly a popular local Facebook alternative. It lasted maybe a couple of years before entirely capitulating and getting absorbed. That place does still have a local Reddit-like alternative, and Reddit is certainly more US-centric. You are right that Facebook stayed popular much longer outside the US. It has started falling off in some of those places, but I did keep a Facebook account for work purposes for a lot longer than you'd expect because work relations in those territories would share Facebook credentials as a way to establish professional contact. Twitter may as well have been a lost ancient civilization, though.
There's also a lot to unpack in the assumption that on a thread about "why do Americans default to assuming everyone is from the US" you're reflexively lumping the entire anglosphere as part of the US, but honestly, I'll let the recently annexed English-speaking countries deal with that one on their own.
That's interesting, thanks for sharing. I don't mean to diminish your experience, but the world is simply too massive for anecdotal knowledge to apply when attempting to make sense of it. In other words, it's impossible to gather a balanced understanding of global phenomena via primary experiences. I'm not as well traveled as you, but I'm analyzing the statistics rather than relying on personal experiences, which is much more informative when trying to recognize the big picture.
I'm not reflexively lumping anything in, I'm simply recognizing the reality that the cultural life of anglosphere countries is heavily mixed, and that US culture dominates that mixture due to its size and economic position. It's not a controversial statement to say that Canada and the US are peas in a pod.
I left the original assumption unchallenged, but I don't agree with it tbh. There are a ton of Europeans on Lemmy and also reddit, and it's quite obvious to notice as an American. Furthermore, the entire premise is faulty. Rather than ask why people default to the US, the question is why people are assuming anything at all about anonymous accounts. And the answer is because of human nature, which isn't something unique to Americans.
Well, yeah, but it's not anecdotal. There is data to tell you how big Facebook is and was outside the US, in what territories and by how much relative to their US popularity at what point. My personal experience just happens to match those numbers (India, by the way, is Facebook's current biggest market).
I would also point out that by your own data, which is accurate as far as I can tell, 49% of Reddit is not American, so even with its more US-focused audience the assumption that users are American unless proven otherwise is wildly ethnocentric.
Now, I agree with you that assuming things about anonymous accounts, and especially anonymous accounts writing in English, is foolish. Lots of people are fluent in English who are not native speakers and definitely who are not from the US. Most, in fact, depending on how you define your parameters.
I disagree that this is "human nature", though. I don't assume the same thing from people who speak my native language online. I also don't assume the same thing about English speakers. The reason the OP is asking is that US ethnocentrism stands out. That's not to say it's not natural. We non-native dwellers in anglocentric social media will often comment on US cultural and political minutia, because US cultural and political minutia is present and relevant to us in a way ours isn't to Americans (thanks for that, cultural imperialism). We pass for Americans in more situations than some American lurking in a German-language forum would, and we're likely many times more numerous than... well, Americans lurking in German-language or Chinese-language socials.
But it being natural doesn't mean it isn't notable or an issue or a symptom of a dysfunction. Which it is, and it does annoy me for that reason.
The assumption that the 51% of reddit constitutes a monolith of non-Americans is wildly reductive and offensive /s. The majority is irrelevant, Americans still constitute the plurality of users, and thus inevitably become the default.
I absolutely agree that it's a symptom of dysfunction, but I just think it's unfair to blame on the average American. We didn't ask for this either.
Wait, what?
We're talking about assuming that a site's default user is from the US. I'm saying if 49% are not, then that assumption seems ethnocentric. That doesn't require every other user to be part of a monolith of non-Americans, they all share the trait of being... you know, not American.
That's a big chunk of your users that don't conform to your default use case. If this was about anything else you would not a default at all in that scenario, but that's not what happens. Also, it's not blamed on the "average American", it's being blamed on Americans as a whole, culturally, on the aggregate, which is fundamentally different.
As I've already explained, you're talking about the general case of assuming where someone is from. Because otherwise, you're suggesting that we should assume someone is from a different country than the US? Which country? I honestly don't understand what your point is.
Yes, this is the most important trait among humans, it is known.
Alright, let me take a step back to the OP.
The claim here is that unless something is flagged as being "world" something, it's assumed to be specific to the US. The obvious example is politics forums with no qualifier in social media (including here and on Reddit) being about US politics where everywhere else is qualified with either "world" or a specific country/region.
That's the claim.
The counterclaim is that makes sense for US-based social media where most users are American. I dispute that because... well, most users are not American in many of those sites, or a large enough proportion aren't that the assumption is not justified.
The logical way to organize that would be for the US politics channel, forum, magazine or whatever to be flagged "US politics" while everything else keeps its own qualifier. There is no default nation for politics. If anything, "politics" without a qualifier should be fair game for all world politics. That makes logical sense, but it's often not what happens in social media unless the specific social media site is heavily restricted to a specific non-English language or territory.
That's the observation here.
Given how many people choose to speak their native language in the US (myself included), I guess they assume they post to forums that are in their language.
So like Facebook and Reddit? Social media isn't in English specifically. People who speak other languages often post in their native language for some things and in the lingua franca for more international conversations. The Internet is the Internet regardless.
Maybe you should try posting more often then ;)
To be fair, the US has the largest number of English-speakers of any country in the world. As a first language, it has five times as many native English speakers as second place (the UK). It also has one of the highest Internet penetration rates in the world, meaning most of those English-speakers are also Internet users.
The US is a single country that is three-quarters the population of the entire European Union, and nearly all of its inhabitants speak English and use the Internet. So yes, if you pick a random user on an English social media page, odds are very good that person is an American. If you were to guess any random English-speaking Internet user's nationality, "American" is the best possible guess. But go on a Spanish language forum or a French language forum and nobody will assume you're American.
Consequently, Americans generate the majority or large plurality of English-language Internet content.
Edit: Please stop replying with "English is a lingua franca for non-native English speakers". I never made the claim that someone who uses English on the Internet is likely a native English speaker. I am claiming the converseโthat people who natively speak English are likely to use English on the Internet.
Iโm sorry but this is nonsense. Iโm in a lot of online communities where everyone uses English, despite it being nearly nobodyโs first language. It just happens to be the only language that everyone there knows. Language is no indication of nationality, especially online.
And to be honest, in those places the assumption is usually that everyone is European, which I can imagine is just as annoying for the stray American.
I think you misunderstand.
What I am saying is that of all Internet users that use English, Americans are by far the largest group due to it being a very large country, (third most populous in the world) with a high Internet penetration (97%), and whose residents speak English as their main language (78.3%).
But I would argue that the rest of the world also uses primarily English online. And just by virtue of being the rest of the world, outnumbers the Americans.
In other words, of all Internet users that use English, the vast majority is likely not American.
Of course I donโt have data to back this up, except anecdotally.
No, they didn't misunderstand. It is you who are massively misunderstanding. You are suffering from the erronous assumption that people who speak English on the internet are native English speakers when that it is not so at all. People speak English on the internet because it is the largest commonly understood language. So people from non-English speaking countries are using it as well. And there are a heck of a lot more non-native English speakers in the world than native English speakers.
So you are most likely at any time on the internet to be speaking to a non-native English speaker, and thus definitely not an American.
I did not claim the people who use English on the Internet are likely native English speakers.
I made the converse claimโthat people whose native language is English are likely to use English on the Internet.
This list puts US at ~297m English speakers which is the largest group from one single country, that is true. But 297m / 1,537m = The US has 19.35% of English speakers globally.
You are likely also greatly underestimating current internet connectivity, older smartphones have changed things for poorer countries a lot over the past decade. For example, India has only 62.6% of people as internet users - but that's still 880m people and probably most of their 125m English speakers. Nigeria has 63.8% internet users, but that's 136m internet users. And they also have 125m English speakers, who again, are more likely to be the people who can afford an English education, and also a smartphone. And then there's Pakistan with another 100m English speakers and 70.8% internet users, etc.
Just 3 countries, (2 of which were 1 country 80 years ago) and you're close to that 300 million count already.
The list also gives US as 92.4% internet users, for what it's worth. A little less than 97% and not even in the top 20 countries by percentage, which is surprising.
The internet is less American than ever. It's just that most non-American people probably have non-English language spaces they can choose to gather in addition to the English-dominated spaces. Americans, on the other hand, are more likely to be monolingual English speakers and so they concentrate in the English-dominated spaces.
And non-Americans are all so used to people assuming American defaultism in English-dominated internet spaces because it was historically hugely expensive to get online and was overwhelmingly American English-speaking, that it's not even worth correcting when it happens the millionth time.
I've also put non-metric and US currency conversions in posts online many times. Not because I'm American or use them in daily life. It was just less annoying to convert them when writing rather than hear the inevitable multiple complaints about not understanding things in meters and dessicated jokes like "that's probably $2 in real money".
You're either overestimating the accuracy of your assumptions about your online interactions and/or seeing selection bias from your immersion in otherwise culturally isolated spaces.
Doubt.
There are 1.3 billion people who use English on the internet as a first or second language.
Not all Internet users generate the same amount of content. In addition to Americans being proud blabbermouths in general, people from wealthy countries generate more content than those from poorer countries. The US is among the wealthiest countries in the world.
Although it is not the most representative, nearly half of all Reddit users are American. American media outlets have immense global reach. You can probably name four or five American media outlets just off the top of your head, even if you're not American. The USA's geopolitical power means people are always talking about American politics or what America's leaders are doing, which draws engagement from Americans like a lamp draws moths. 7 out of the top 10 English-language YouTube channels are American (fully or partially).
It's pretty much impossible to prove, but I think the claim that Americans generate most of the content on the Internet is likely true or very close to true.
It's even more convincing if you exclude English Internet users from India, as a quick visit to any forum dominated by Indian users will cause you to quickly realise that the language used there is not really English but a mix of English and Hindi which is not comprehensible to non-Indians.
Again, the numbers you linked shows that you are more likely to speak to a non-American on reddit than an American. Your entire premise is flawed from the beginning.
False. Yes, it is larger than any other individual English speaking group but accounts for less than a fifth of the total English speakers.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_English-speaking_population
I wouldnโt have guessed Nigeria is the third largest English speaking group.
This point was plainly addressed. Read carefully before going in guns-blazing.
Do you think Nigerians use the Internet as much as Americans?
โGoing in guns-blazingโ, lol, some Americansโฆ
The more egalitarian principle would be to not assume. I won't deny that. People from more minority locales have every right to be upset at being marginalized.
But at the same time, whenever I read passive aggressive comments on socials from residents of crown countries or from EAASL people around the world bitching about US defaultism as if people are doing it just to be ignorant dicks, I can only think to myself, "Uhh, hello? What do you think the demographics of this space were? What did you expect?"
Americans are hardly the majority of the world's English speakers, but for all the reasons you listed, they tend to remain a massive plurality, if not an outright overwhelming majority, of any mainstream online English language platform. No, that's not a license to perpetuate US defaultism. But like... read the room, people. Your good fight is far more uphill than you seem to think it is.
Again, you are completely missing the point of the internet and English usage on it. People are using English as a lingua franca. There are a lot more non-native English speakers on the internet than native English speakers.
So no, odds are not that it is an American you are speaking to, just because that person speaks English. You are literally regurgitating the fallacy that OP is about.
We should really be counting English literate people, since nobody here is talking, and literacy is more reading/writing.
Literacy is pretty broad too. It doesn't imply that it's your native language, nor if you can speak the language (whether you can do that very well or not).
Literacy is going to be a bonefide requirement for most of the internet, with some exceptions, like text to speech and speech recognition stuff, people with disabilities who may not be able to see properly or at all.... Stuff like that.
I love that the real lingua franca, a term from both Latin and Greek roots, literally meaning the language of the Franks (French) is English. Plus, also, fuck you Esperanto!
FYI
According to Wikipedia the percentage of English speakers located in the US is lower that 20%. Does this mean that only 1 in 5 users is from the US?
Population of the US: 334.914.895, Population of Europe: 745.173.774. 334.914.895/745.173.774 = 0,449%
English Speakers in the US: 297.400.000. English Speakers in Europe: 260.000.000. So you have about 37,4M more English speakers in the US than in Europe.
The average American uses only English language forums.
The average European who speaks English will probably spend some portion of their time using whatever their native language is.
The average English speaker in Africa is not as likely to have an Internet connection.
The average English speaker in China is likely to not be able to access English social media sites (great firewall).
Many English-speakers in India post online in a mix of English and Hindi that non-Indians find difficult to comprehend.
You're correct that the claim that the US is ยพ the population of Europe is erroneous. But it is ยพ the population of the EU. I've corrected this.
I admire your determination to bend your perception of facts to fit your narrative.
Surely you have a bit more thinking power than that. If you gave each of your bullet points a mere five seconds each of critical thought, you wouldn't have made this ridiculous comment.
Those countries you mentioned? Of course there are people living in them. But there aren't as many English-speakers as in America. I didn't say all, I say most (this will be a recurring theme).
With the exception of southern Africa (76%), the rest of Africa has Internet penetration rates below 50%. As low as 27% in east Africa. Remember, I didn't say all, I said most.
China's great firewall prevents most people from accessing the outside Internet, and many Chinese people don't care to. I know this, because I'm fucking Chinese. Is it possible to circumvent? Sure, if you're willing to play VPN whack-a-mole with the CCP or are lucky enough to be the 1% of China that lives in Hong Kong or Macau. But again, I said most, I didn't say all.
You also clearly have never been on any forums populated by Indian users if you think that I'm only saying Indians use unintelligible English on the Internet because I'm racist. They code-switch between English and Hindi. If you don't know Hindi, you won't understand it. Are all posts like this? Of course not. But a great deal are. I never said all, I said most.
Here are random top comments from the top posts of Reddit's r/Indiasocial that show what I'm talking about:
And also, I don't use American English. I live in America but I am a Hongkonger and use British English.
You're so close. Let me give you another hint: What do you think every other regional sub looks like? (I speak multiple languages, so I've been to multiple regionals - including in Languages I don't really speak)
Also, yes it is a bit racist to assume that Indians are only able to converse in an Hindi/English mix and unable to converse in proper English. On top of that it is a bit stupid to assume all of India speaks Hindi - e.g. most of Bengalurians speak Kannada.
You're correct. It's a recurring theme. You have been made aware by multiple people now that you over-inflate the percentage of USAmericans among the users of English-speaking forums and that you have been incredibly ignorant about it.
I think none will dispute that US located users are in the majority - the majority is however not as big as you make it out to be. (and your reasoning is - for lack of a better term - atrocious)
The only thing I am claiming is that a majority or large plurality of English language Internet users are American, meaning if you are to assume a country of origin (note: if), assuming the user is an American is the one most likely to be accurate. I think I've said enough on the matter.
If you disagree, that's fine but I'm tired of this conversation.
Assumed by Americans which is an important detail.
To be honest I also find myself assuming this frequently. And I'm rarely incorrect
Yup, if it's English-language, it's probably American unless otherwise noted
Weird to go into a website based in the States, with a large audience of Americans, all speaking in the American dialect of English primarily about events in US news and politics, and then get mad because it's America-centric.
I don't care where y'all are from as long as you're not a dumbass dickhead.
Oh. I'm shit out of luck then.
Well, I also sit in front of a mirror.
Terrible news, guy who just started posting on the Internet
I wonder if a news community with a "no mentioning the US" rule would work. Not out of any hate, just as something arbitrary like "don't use the letter E".
There was one on Reddit that had a rule that no more than 50% of a story could be about the US and if the US was one of two parties they preferred the other point of view.
Jimmy Eat USA
Bleed Earthlings
I hear you and am guilty of it myself. I feel like it's due to the anonymous nature of the internet. I think everyone immediately falls into the category of "peer" before putting a touch more thought into who the actual person (bot/ai) is that wrote the reply. Add that to the fact that most Americans see themselves (as a country) as the king of the world.
Maybe you can try typing with an accent, but I think that'd probably just be seen as a racist American.
I'm not even American, I find my thoughts defaulting to this.
i live in DC and we get tagged for everything world politics.
forgive me for not caring if fvey countries get lumped into uspol.
as a person that came from 3rd world country, i relate T_T
Howdy y'all bros. My name is Todd Bonzalez and I am from one of the great American places foreigners know from your TV shows.
The SMX "World Championship" just finished. It only takes place in the US.
its just the loudest voices that seem to drive the world.
Well Al Gore invented the internet so the internet is more a.USA thing ๐คฃ๐คฃ
Heavily inspired by the french Minitel but yes
Heavily inspired by the Sumerian cuneiform but yes
Minitel launched in 1982, well after work had begun on interconnections between different computer networks, using the predecessor protocols to TCP/IP and what would become the addressing/domain name system. Minitel launched on protocols that were ultimately incompatible with the rest of the Internet, and didn't have an easy way to actually get joined in.
Minitel was more of an alternative internet than it was the inspiration for the migration of the internet to becoming a HTTP/www-centered network.
As an American who just wants things organized clearly, I find it annoying too
I mean, we did invent this cursed network. It's our job to ruin it.
One day, we will shitpost our way to freedom
This is lemmy.world, you would have to join lemmy.{country} for lands beyond the fruited plains and purple mountains majesty.
As someone outside the U.S., what is your default persona for anonymous/pseudonymous users until you know more about them? Just curious. Like, if you don't have any information about them, do you read the words in the voice of a person just like you?
I default to everyone sounding like Macho Man Randy Savage.
Oh yeah!
I don't read words in any voice other than the naturally subvocalisation that occurs when I'm reading, which is always in my voice.
Even when I read a quote myself Morgan Freeman, I'm hearing my voice, doing a Morgan freeman impression.
But in terms of who I picture? Nothing, people online are not even corporal beings to me until details are revealed. They are still human and have whole lives offline so that's not an excuse to be needlessly rude, but I know nothing of them so why would I randomly invent details unless I'm doing so as a "put myself in their shoes" thought experiment.
But then I have a degree of aphantasia so I'm not "picturing" anything, all I have is words anyway, so it's easy not to add in extra words that change my assumptions about a person.
You mean anything with
outworld in its name?What? Like the World Series of Baseball?
The name fits, it's just that the only people in the world who give a shit about baseball are from the USA.
Japan would like a word, but otherwise, fair enough
Puerto Rico and Cuba also love baseball.
Hell, in Cuba standing around arguing about baseball is a recognized profession.
HE WAS SAFE!!!
Well that's just not true, you should check out the World baseball Classic, it'll open your eyes.
Sorry, anything with or without / everything not ich_iel
I completely understand the sentiment.
I also understand the sentiment that the internet is effectively a US invention dating back at least to ARPAnet.
I guess what I'm suggesting is: can't we all just get along? At least we can now all communicate with each other.
We are trying to get along. We are already speaking English, which is a massive step in your direction. US commenters and posters don't even bother to convert to kilometres or something. Or the worst: write about something that happened in AK as if everyone knows postal shortages of the US.
The crazy irony is that those from outside the US probably know way more than those in the US, in terms of stories about Alaska.
No hate here. There will be ups and downs.
At the end of the day, I'm happy to communicate with you.
Don't ever talk about kilometres in here. Are you trying to spark an international incident?
FWIW ich habe Deustch gelernt. Aber ich habe die meistens vergessen ๐
Dein Deutsch klingt richtig gut ๐
Danke schon ๐
If it makes it any better youre more likely to get an American who can convert Miles into Leagues before they even think about kilometers. We dont really use metric for anything, unless youre military or something.
Yeah, but this is a website. Sir Tim Berners-Lee represent!
Plus also, English is an English invention.
But otherwise, you're good.
The World Wide Web is not an American invention. Who invented what is completely irrelevant in this context anyway though.
Don't be so self-involved. Try visit China for once and you will get sick of the word "China", it's literally in everything there :), like communist party's intelligence service :)
The thing is we are not talking about visiting countries. We are talking about the virtual World Wide Web.
The "World" wide web not USA wide web
It does make it fun to stir the pot
I mean the us dwarfs other english speaking countries
Tons of people speak English as a second language, on the internet
Your comment is very typical of that (fallacious) US centrism. People write in English on the internet because that is the universal language. There are far more secondary English speakers on the internet than primary English speakers.
*grince des dents*
because it is the international language of this days and time.
Le franรงais รฉtait ร un moment donnรฉ, hein
Yeah XD Now english is the lingua franca
Yeah like India
135 million english speakers is less than 300 million
Mr Blott really really really likes to denigrate Americans. Don't rain on his parade
What on Earth are you on about? "denigrate Americans". They are pointing out facts. That you apparently are so fragile that you consider that denigration is entirely on yourself.
I think you owe me an apology. It took me a while to copy paste all that senseless vitriol and you won't even acknowledge your mistake. Disappointing.
Surprised at a yank using the word "denigrate" without clutching their pearls at the etymology of it lol
Look at their comment history. They can't go two days without getting in a dig at Americans. Even when it's completely irrelevant and off topic. I'm just pointing out that this person has a bone to pick and not to take it personally.
The funny part is that they're often completely wrong when they try to talk shit. Like here, thinking that India having a larger population than the US is some kind of gotcha moment, despite less than 10% of that population speaking English.
I'll just transcribe a few lovely comments from our good friend Mr Blott.
This is just from the past few weeks lmao. This dude has issues.
How could this have happened?
This is why:
The US has more allocated IPv4 addresses and more users per allocated IPv4 address than any other country, by wide margins - and IPv6 adoption is not that widespread yet. It is entirely rational to assume that an English-speaking person on the Internet is from the US, given no other information.
reference
Nope https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_Internet_users
Strangely enough English is spoken in countries other than the US and even more use it as a lingua franca.
It is interesting you think IPv6 is not widespreaad https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html
Of course English is spoken in other countries, and other countries have high numbers of internet users, but it does not follow that English is a commonly used language for internet users in other countries. Most Chinese are probably speaking Chinese, most Indians are probably speaking Hindi.
The IPv6 graph you linked shows that adoption is still less than 50%, and I'm not clear on their methodology... does "users that access Google" mean users with Google accounts? or individual users that use google.com? or does it include all of their cloud services? do web servers linking content from Google Ads count? does this data represent mostly end users, or also infrastructure connections?
When non-native English speakers are navigating in a non-national internet setting we use English. I have gathered from the many American comments in this thread, that that fact is apparently incredibly difficult for Americans to gauge. Nevertheless, it is a fact.
2016 is a little far, isn't it?
I hate to say it, but, these things don't change a lot, or quickly.
IP blocks, or "large groups of IP addresses" are assigned to regional internet registries, or RIRs which then hand them out from there. There's a couple RIRs. I think five in total? ARIN covers North America, and has, by far, the most IP addresses given out.
There's also RIPE, in Europe, APNIC, for Asia and the Pacific areas, including China and Australia, AfriNIC, which is basically all of Africa... If that wasn't obvious. And lacnic, which is South America.
Large IP blocks can, but rarely ever do, get transferred between RIRs.
But wait, it gets more complicated. IP addresses allocated in one region could be used anywhere in the world. The vast majority are not, and it's important to note that because of global routing, you can't have a block smaller than 256 addresses allocated in the default free zone (DFZ). The DFZ is the part of the internet that doesn't have a "default gateway". All routes are advertised, and by those advertisements are learned by others. The routers in the DFZ only have so much memory, and there was a crisis a while ago when the memory of most of the routers in the DFZ were dangerously close to being full.... That was around when ipv6 was first switched on. The routing memory is extremely fast, because it needs to be. Looking up a route in a table with a million+ entries takes time, but that time needs to be so short that latency is effectively mitigated. So that memory is some of the fastest used in tech at times, notwithstanding newer technologies.
I'm off topic. Anyways, my point is, ARIN is big. They have a lot of IPs. However allocation doesn't and shouldn't imply usage. A large number of addresses are allocated for US military use that are basically unseen in the internet. There's a few infamous /8 blocks of around 16.7 million addresses that don't get advertised and can't be used by anyone besides the US military. I forget which branch of military owns it. They've owned it since the internet started giving out allocations (more or less) and today one of those /8 blocks is worth billions, with a cost of about $50 per IP.
So yeah, the US has a lot of IP allocation, they also have a large amount of unused IP addresses.
I would love to see a more recent source if you have one.
Regardless, possession of IP addresses doesn't change all that much. In the early days a company could buy an entire Class A (1.X.X.X) address space comprising 16million+ addresses for their private use. There are still many companies holding large blocks of addresses, and most of those companies are in the US, and they don't just give up those addresses.
The point being, there's significant resistance to redistributing addresses once they've been allocated. They don't change hands terribly often (and keep in mind we're talking about actual internet addresses, not local network addresses that are being dynamically assigned and NATed across router domains).
No, they highlight some problems with IP4: Bad distribution of IP4 ranges and bad usage of those ranges. So the graphs show the US has way too much IP actresses, some under used/unused and some overused. The blog post they are from is pretty clear about this.
These graphs do not give an indication of how many users per country there are. There are in fact statistics on that which expectedly show China and India on top. These however do not take into account that social media use way more popular in the U.S. for now.
The closest stat may be Reddit users by country which seems to indicate that about every 2nd user is from the US. (Not sure if Russian/Chinese bot accounts also count towards these though).
Well sure, but people from those countries are far less likely to be speaking English, which is why I said:
The prevalence of internet use in countries with primary languages other than English has no bearing on this statement.
The point of using the IP address statistics is to show that the vast majority of websites on the Internet were created in the US for the US market, and that is still true today.
On a side note, the distribution of addresses is unbalanced but it isn't "bad". It is a consequence of a system growing over time. Communications infrastructure cannot pop into existence everywhere all at once, and realistically not many people outside the US had any interest in the internet in 1983.
Sorry, are you trying to prove beyond a doubt that you are dishonest and statistics-illiterate?
No, you wrote:
So your assumption is based on a gross misinterpretation of the statistics you presented. Your incorrect interpretation of the graphs would put US participation at about 99,99%, which is obviously ridiculous.
Also according to Wikipedia the percentage of English speakers located in the US is lower that 20%. Does this mean that only 1 in 5 users is from the US?
That's not at all what these graphs show though.
Also, while I agree that most websites might be US targeted towards the US calling that 'vast' is bit of a stretch.
I gather you've not been around then. Almost none had any interest in "the internet" until the mid 90s - this includes the US. Partly because what you refer to as "the internet" was called WWW back then and started only 1989. People had been very anal about this until about 2005 - I guess you haven't been around then either.
That would be 3 addresses per US citizen. You have some whales like MS in there, just because your companies can grow dangerously big.
Aren't the majority of English speakers from the US?
EDIT: The USA has 3x the population of the UK and Australia combined and the USA appears to be the home of approx 60% of native English speakers. However there are billions of speakers if you include it as a 2nd language. Which Americans don't speak 2nd languages so we obviously don't count that.
I'd just like to mention that plenty of ESL users speak English more than their native, and that the country with the most people who use English for interacting with the Internet, it's probably India. Indians communicate to a lot of their compatriots in English, since they are also an ex-British colony, and have a large variety of native languages.
What's your definition of first/second language if you grow up bilingual?
The majority of English speakers aren't from the US, though the US does have the most English speakers. Important distinction to make!
No, it's roughly 20% (297M/1537M). Source.
Nah its 50/50, either you're a USA English speaker or you're not
I speak American, boy.
(Kratos voice)
This meme is essentially Al-Qaeda's motive for doing 9/11.