Donald Trump using bail bondsman rings alarm bells about his finances
newsweek.com
Donald Trump reportedly used a bail bondsman after being arrested at Fulton County Jail in Atlanta, Georgia, on Thursday, paying $20,000 of his bond set at $200,000 and taking out a loan for the rest of it. The fact that the former president resorted to such a measure has sparked questions on social media about the state of his finances.
Why pay $200k when you can pay $20k and then refuse to repay the other $180k?
Because if you pay the $200k you get it back when the case is over. The $20k is gone forever.
That's assuming the judge doesn't decide you've violated the bond conditions forfeit the bond. If that happens, the bondsman's going to go after you for the full $200k in addition to what you paid though, and you still wind up $20k poorer than if you put up the full amount in the first place.
What probably happened is that he plans to use his usual delaying tactics and run the case out for several years, so his accountants decided they could earn at least 11% on the remaining $180k by the time the case is up, making it cheaper to pay the $20k up front.
That or he's using his other favorite tactic and found a bondsman that's on the verge of going bankrupt and he's planning to stiff him and betting the guy won't have enough money to take him to court over it. That said, he could also be in financial trouble. It's been well known for a long time now that Trump pretends like his finances are MUCH better than they actually are, with him regularly bleeding money on failed ventures. There's a reason he's basically been running grifts for decades and just slapping his name on successful things run by other people instead of his own businesses. He was probably counting on using campaign funds and donations to cover his legal costs and got told he couldn't, and his usual sugar daddies aren't willing to pour money into him considering how unlikely he is to beat the current slate of charges.
It's also interesting that he recently "sold" Mar-A-Lago, although since he "sold" it to his son the move is more likely just to protect the property if he does end up in jail. Could also be to provide him some liquidity to cover his legal costs.
I would seriously be worried that he flees
He's got 24/7 secret service protection just like every former president. I don't think there's any way he can actually flee unless he can flat out refuse secret service protection, which I'm sure he already knows is a significant risk to his personal security so he probably won't.
Honestly I strongly suspect he's going to try to drag out every charge for as long as possible, use every legal and illegal tactic he can to avoid actually being sentenced to more than a fine, then if he ever sees actual jail time he'll commit suicide. I can't see him pulling a Skreli and doing a few months with his head low before getting out on good behavior
Why would protection service limit his movement? He can just jump to his private plane and fly to Russia. He definitely will extend this BS as long as possible and collect money from gullible people to "fund" his defence (meaning that he pockets the money)
I think there's logistical issues with paying your own bail in full. Like, the court has limited hours and may not accept wire transfers. It could be days before they can clear that kind of money and you're in jail until that time. The bondsmen already have all that ready to go with the courts so they can do it instantly.
Except he's a "billionaire" and knew he was going to have to show up there for days, if not weeks.
None of that explains why any bondsman would take Trump at his work lmao
The art of the deal
The bail bondsman who gave him that loan is the biggest sucker in the whole MAGA kingdom. That $180,000 will never be seen again.
Edit: Nevermind, I didn’t understand how bail works.
A bail bondsman has more legal options for going after someone than any other type of loan officer, including the use of bounty hunters.
Imagine working as a bounty hunter going after a US President.
*FORMER US President.
4 times indicted former US president**.
**This has only ever been known to happen once in the history of the country
Don't forget twice impeached, zero-time winner of the popular vote
Sounds like a movie, but I wouldn’t want to be the bounty hunter tasked with going up against the Secret Service! Though this does raise questions about the Secrets Service’s responsibility to protect against legally sanctioned law enforcement (of sorts).
As long as the SS keeps him alive, they are doing their job. Unfortunately, I suspect that the dudes that are surrounding Trump might take that to the extreme.
Wanna bet the bondsman is his supporter and won't even mind losing the money? It is a goddamn cult.
There's an episode of Dog I'd watch.
That is undoubtedly a great bounty hunter resume stuffer.
"- provided white-glove support for Donald Trump's capture"
I mean first off you're going to have to fight the secret service right?
One with secret service.
Sure, but this is a pretty unprecedented situation... I doubt there are many bounty hunters who know how to deal with a secret service detail, for instance
That’s not how bail bonds works. It’s not a loan. You pay the bondsman 10%. Then the bondsman guarantees that the defendant will show up to his court dates. If the defendant fails to show up the bondsman has to pay the court the entire amount. Bondsman often use bounty hunters to pick up defendants who haven’t shown up.
I am not American, so it might be the phrasing that confuses me.
But is the 10% returned to the defendant? Or that's a flat fee that the bondsman take?
If that is the latter, then I understand why people are questioning why Trump is using a bondsman since he supposedly have the cash to cover the full bond that he will get back once he shows up.
So either he plans to fuck off so he saved 90% of his bond, or he's having cashflow issues.
If it's the former, then it make total sense to use a bondsman regardless of your fortune.
The 10% is payment to the bondsman. They keep it.
Then people definitely have to question why a supposed billionaire is using a bondsman.
Exactly, if he actually had the money and doesn't plan on skipping town, then he should have no problem putting that money up. I see a lot of people saying he's not above running away, but I really don't think his ego would let him. I think he truly believes he can beat the charges or win the election first, despite all the losses he's already had.
You can consider the 10% as "interest" since the bondsman would have to cover the rest of the bail in case the indictee doesn't show up
And they get their pay normally by keeping the 10% from the defendant. If the defendant skips town, they lose the other 90% unless they can locate the defendant and get them back to court.
It pretty much is
I'm curious, does the bondsman actually give the court cash, or just guarantee that they will if the defendant doesn't show? And if that is the case, do they bond out more people than they actually have cash to cover, knowing that it is unlikely that they'll ever have to cover all those positions?
Someone correct me, but I think it's dependent on the court. But either way, that's why they generally employ bounty hunters to track down the defendants to make sure they don't have to pay the court the rest.
Trump wouldn't be the one paying it back. Unless you're implying he's going to not show up for trial.
You really think he's "above" skipping town to avoid jail time?
50:50. If he doesn't skip and gets elected he Pardons himself
Above it? no. Capable of doing so? also no.
Is he poor? Maybe. The question is why is he poor? He just sold Mar-a-lago to a company owned by Don Jr., alledgedly for something over $400 million.
He might be poor because he's hiding all his assets on offshore banks. If so, then the question becomes: why is he doing that?
Man, I really hope he runs. Just to see Republican faces when he abandons them and maybe a few finally realize they were conned.
Jfc. Where have you've been? THEY WILL NEVER TURN ON HIM.
The top dogs all know. They have tried multiple times to push him aside. Propping up desantis, having rules for the debates that are targeted at trump etc. It doesn't work and they are happy to use him when it suits them. The question is will it blow up in their faces to personally damage them or just the party and they will take their I'll gotten gains and slink away.
A few, maybe. But I worry that anyone who's still on the Trump train at this point may be on it for life. They'll rationalize that he was forced out of the country by a crooked liberal conspiracy.
FREE TRUmP! Political EXILE!
I'm guessing he's worried about his assets being seized once his involvement with criminal money laundering for Russian mobsters comes to light. And emoluments. And using his position as an elected official to enrich himself by having the secret service stay at his properties paying exorbitant amounts above market value. And so on.
That one crime is that one that might get him executed, so at least he prioritizes risks to himself
Preparing to run.
No. All rich people do. Why? Taxes.
"He's a political refugee because of Hillary's emails and the tan suit!"
He’s obviously not poor enough to not be able to come up with 20 grand. But if your backup plan is to flee the country, why put up any of your own money? He’s going to try to be in Moscow or some other country that won’t extradite him if it starts looking bad. He might not actually pull it off but he’s dumb enough to think he can.
My head canon for that timeline involves him being hunted down for betraying the united states, and his corpse dumped in the ocean like bin laden so that his grave site doesn’t become a place of worship for republicans.
Saving this in case I ever have trouble getting an erection later
That could actually be a book. I'd read it.
I believe the terms of bonds in Georgia are that 10% must be posted by the defendant. This is the absolute least of his own money he could put up and not have to sit in jail until trial.
EDIT: I'm at least partially wrong here. With a bond you're giving a percentage of your bail to a 3rd party who will in turn post the full bail amount for you. When you show up to trial, they get the bail back and pocket the percentage you paid. The only reasons you'd take bond over bail is if you can't afford the full amount, or you think you can make more money than the percentage by investing that money in something.
Still seems like this is the cheapest way for him to stay out of jail in the short term. Lord knows a bondsman's bounty hunter would have his work cut out bringing in a former president...
I imagine if TFG was dumb enough to try to jump bail (yeah, he very well might be that dumb), the judge would simply phone the Secret Service. They're law enforcement so even if they won't arrest him themselves, when the sheriff or federal marshals call, they'll simply arrange a protection detail around Trump and the deputies and keep Trump very safe as he's arrested and hauled into custody.
What a stupid fucking bondsman to take that risk. Let's see you bounty him.
Wait..
I want to see Dogg the bounty hunter cap doofus McGee.
Dogg would just suck his dick and let him go.
Trump is just using the first rule of being rich...use other people's money.
Particularly if you think you might decide to skip out at some point.
...or he'll just skip out on the bondsman like most of his other creditors.
Looking forward to the documentary of bounty hunters trying to catch him 😊
That would be by far this best reality TV appearance yet.
The
apprenticefugitive - starring former president and felon Donald J Trump and Dog the Bounty Hunter....though Dog would almost certainly be helping teach Trump the tricks of the trade.
Do we even know for sure any money changed hands? Maybe the bail bonds person is a cult 45 member and sees it as service to the dear leader? Admittedly, my bail bonds knowledge is limited to late night cheesy commercials and an episode and a half of dog the bounty hunter, but I got the impression they're something of a shady character; someone who'd be at home in the cult. No?
I'm pretty sure it's a cult member, you might be right.
He's rich. First rule of being rich is never pay when you can borrow.
But this isn't the same kind of thing. When the court sets bail, you give them that amount as like a deposit. When you show up to court, you get it back. Lots of people don't have the cash though, so they go to a ball bondsman, give them 10% of the total amount, and the bondsman pays the court the whole amount. When you show up to court, the bondsman gets that amount back, and they keep your 10%.
So yes, it's a loan, but it's a really shitty loan. I can't see how he wouldn't be better off just paying the full amount himself unless he thinks he can successfully skip town.
Completely agree with you, however if trump thought he would get more than 20k in returns on the 180k in principle he saved, this also is a good financial play.
That said, 200k is petty cash for a billionaire. Or should be, if one was.
I suppose a big factor is how long until trial. If it's less than a year, it seems unlikely he'd get that, but if he manages to stretch it out to multiple years, he'd get that easily.
It's .02%, or .0002 of a billion. That's a whoops it slipped out of my pocket while I was changing my diaper kind of petty cash.
Depending on how long it is until hed get the deposit back, they money may be better off invested.
I don't know the schedule, but I think it's supposed to be expedited because of the upcoming election. But if Trump is successful in stalling it, who knows how long that money would be tied up.
IMO he's probably planning on playing games and no showing, but it may make sense financially too depending on their plan
Funny, I just said basically the same thing to someone else. Yeah, if he pushes it out a couple years, he'd really make more investing it.
Yep. I'd say that no matter what, it's a bad idea to do business w Trump, but it may be worth 20 or 200k to the bail bondsman for the notoriety
Not exactly. Rich people pay cash when doing so avoids fees. It would only make financial sense if bail bonds in Georgia go for below market rates.
If he could have paid bail through a PAC or one of his companies, that would most probably be cheaper.
He likely doesn't have $200K to his personal name (to avoid tax) and is probably not allowed to pay bail from his PAC or company.
Rich people take loans when the loan is cheaper than an investment. If he can borrow at 10% and has money making. 12% there's no reason not to take the loan. Rich people almost never use cash and they have very few cash in hand
No, absolutely not.
No rich person is paying retail interest rates of 10%.
If Trump could access his PAC money, he would be paying the bond in cash and have a loan against his PAC with favourable terms.
Rich people almost always pay cash with funds secured by low interest loans from their company or private bank.
Not all loans are created equal. High interest retail debt is for poor people to get stuck in debt traps. Low interest financing is for rich people to avoid taxes and leverage their money for more.
Except when you give 10% to the bail bondsman, you don't get that money back.
That's the point -- 10% as opposed to 100%
You would get back 100% of bail once you show up for court. That’s how a bail bondsman makes money.
Right, ignore me.
Though I suspect that if you can leverage that debt, you can still come out ahead.
It's not debt it's a payment.
So he doesn't owe the remaining 90% to anyone?
it was probably money suckered from some of his followers
Seriously this. Or if the borrowing rate is less than what you can make in the mean time by keeping it, why would you?
This isn't borrowing. This is paying.
ITT: So, so many people not understanding bail, or bail bondsmen.
Mind expand a bit on that, please, then?
Bail is essentially the court saying “give us this money, and when you show up for court you will get that money back.”
A bail bondsmen takes 10% as payment, giving the court the bail money. They will go so far as to hire bounty hunters to hunt you down, making sure you show up to court. When the court gives back the bail, they get to keep both the bail money (obviously) but also the 10% payment.
There’s no loan involved, the bail is more of a hold, and the bond is more of a payment. Trump isn’t paying less, he is literally paying a 10% bond to not have the full bail held. (Though it could be argued that the $180k could be used to make back the $20k but that’s a different discussion.) The bondsman has already received payment, there’s no concern of non payment by Trump.
Cool. So why would a billionaire use a bail bondsman service?
Honest but unpopular answer? He might believe he can make more money holding on to the $180k. It's the same reason why I would take a 2% car loan even if I had enough to buy the car outright. I can make more than 2% just keeping that money in a mutual fund.
It's not so much that this would be a valid (if boring) financial strategy.
It's the fact that Trump is actually a terrible fucking businessman. To the extent that he makes any money at all, he makes it by borrowing money and resources and then never giving back anything in return. And he STILL lets casinos go bankrupt. He's completely incompetent, which makes it hard to believe he would take the valid (if boring) strategy of reinvesting the 180k.
$200,000 for him (if he is real billionaire) should be like $20 for us, he would have to have really some killer investment strategy to make more than $20k during that time (which would be worth about $2) and all of that to ruin his image of a billionaire who can't afford $200,000?
That's possibly what he's thinking, but making back 20k on 180k (11%) before his trial ends seems like a bit of a tall order. Especially for someone who's business accumen is a bit suspect. Not necessarily impossible, depending on how long the trial takes.
Of course he may just feel that keeping the capital fluid is a more prudent decision right now. Or he's broke. No way to be sure ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Because he will use other people's money rather than his own at every chance he can get.
That is the real question.
That's how it's supposed to work, but in many counties the bondsman doesn't actually front any cash to the court, and they don't get charged if the suspect runs. They operate as a sort of slush fund for the owners, the officials, and the cops.
So these companies are often just another way to siphon money from people accused of a crime.
Super shady stuff.
I upvote you..
Wow can’t believe Newsweek didn’t even do their due diligence. A bail bond is not a loan. You pay a bondsman 10% and then the bail bondsman guarantees the court that you will show up on the court date. If you fail to show up the bondsman has to pay the court the full amount.
I think the point is that he paid the 10% rather than front the $200k out of his own pocket. The 10% he doesn’t get back since he used a bail bondsman, but he would have gotten the full $200k back when he showed up in court had he used his own money.
So either he's gonna need that 200k in Russia and won't be getting it back because he won't be showing up in court, he doesn't care about a 20k deposit and doesn't mind losing it, or he doesn't have enough money to pay the 200k and needed a better deal. I'm betting on option 3 but option 1 is a possibility.
he doesn't intend to pay any of it back.
Or he intends to flee if things are looking bad.
He openly said at a rally last week or so that he, "hates living in America," and would rather live in France.
I maintain he said France because he couldn't say Russia, and he couldn't remember another allied countries name at the time
As if France would have him...
If Trump did flee to France, they would send him right back due to pesky extradition treaty.
Edit: Added if
The entire job of Bail bondsmen is to know how to get people to pay back, including breaking legs
Haha I made this comment expecting this kind of response and I am really ok with anything t Bondsmen need to do to get their money back in this instance
Or they're a MAGA cult member who thinks their righteous leader who 10000% definitely, for sure donated his presidential salary just like he said, so why wouldn't he pay back the 200k
Even if it blew up in their face, I could see a non-sycophant reason for supplying Trump a bond, potentially with sweetheart terms: it would be the ultimate marketing coup within the industry. "We bailed out the highest profile defendant in American history, sure we can help you with your sixth DUI of the week!"
Lock Him Up
He’s never going to stop committing crimes
Hilary must be laughing her ass off.
Any bondsman stupid enough to lend this clown money deserves to lose it when Trump inevitablely refuses to pay it back.
That’s how he got so rich, spending the bare minimum amount of money he can on anything in any situation.
It was actually from having hundreds of million dollars handed to him by his father, but sure, ripping people off and being stingy hasn’t hurt. Being good at business would have been a good move though.
he bankrupted a casino, ffs, and his followers thik he's a smart businessman.
The only way he is smart is when it comes to grifting. He can grift the shit out of people.
Okay, so he isn't capable of being good at business. Would you settle for a book claiming he is good at business?
Using a bail bondsman is the exact opposite of spending the bare minimum. It's basically the equivalent of taking out a payday loan at a check cashing store.
Bail bondsmen are notoriously corrupt, so this tracks
I read he's paying about 2 million a month for legal fees. He only just stopped campaigning recently, too. I wouldn't say he's broke so soon.
Edit: Right his PAC is paying for them sorry
Why not. My understanding is none of his businesses are profitable. His grifting is meant to be to pay back debts. None of his actions have ever spelled out liquid rich person. Lawyers and others now want to be paid in advance as he is known to not pay debts.
Liquid rich person - "Drink the rich!"
Isn't that the tape the Kremlin is supposed to have?
This is golden!! :D
The pee tape, if it exists, will be the mildest Trump scandal compared to all the other stuff.
Yup, Trump got caught advocating and boasting about sexual assault and people still supported him. Trump's supporters wouldn't even care and hand wave it away with "He peed on Obama's bed. Fuck that guy."
You're giving him too much credit in assuming he pays his debts.
Didn't he just sell mar a Lago as well?
https://www.wptv.com/news/region-c-palm-beach-county/palm-beach/zillow-amends-incorrect-listing-amid-mar-a-lago-sale-rumors
According to this, no. That was a rumor fueled by a mistake/misclick
Most of his estate is in real estate in Manhattan and Las Vegas. So yeah, not at all liquid rich.
Except he isn't the one paying those legal fees. They're being covered by political donors through one of his PACs
He definitely hasn't stopped campaigning.
If he skips town and leaves the country, it's not his money that's gone. He's already the sort who will live with paranoid levels of security so some bail bondsman bounty hunter trying to bring him in is hardly a concern.
This week on Dog the Bounty Hunter:
Try to overthrow democracy in the US? Just $200k bail.
I always remember a line Quark said in ds9. A fine just means legal for a price. (I realise a fine a bail aren't the same thing.)
While I would very much like to see him stripped of every cent, bail isn't really supposed to be a punishment, it's just insurance that they're going to show up to court.
At least in theory it should be a matter of how much of a flight risk the person is.
The court holds onto some of their money and as long as they show up they get it back.
Someone facing decades to life in prison or the death penalty is more likely to not show up for court and try to run than someone who's just looking at a few months or some fines, so the bail is higher. Someone with a history of trying to skip bail or has otherwise given the court reason to think that they might would get higher bail than someone who has never given a reason for anyone to think that they won't show up, etc.
And in some cases, other factors like income and mental health can also be taken into account to various extents depending on local laws, the judge's discretion, etc.
Now of course that's the theory, in practice just about every aspect of our justice system is incredibly fucked up.
Just to spitball a few thoughts about Trump's situation as I would look at it
Being accused of various crimes related to trying to overthrow the government means the possibility should considered that this may be someone who has little to no regard for the rule of law, and may even be colluding with foreign powers and so may try to flee to another unfriendly country, making him a very significant flight risk.
On the other hand, this is a former president, and major figure in the media. Anyone who cares to can pretty much follow his every move. Hell, it's Trump, there's a very real chance that he wouldn't be able to resist tweeting out his escape plan the night before. It would be nearly impossible for him to flee without someone knowing about it, maybe even one of his closest co-conspirators hoping to earn a bit of leniency for ratting him out. He's also probably one of the most recognizable humans on earth right now, anywhere he goes someone would recognize him, he'd never really be able to show his face in public again.
He also at least claims to be fabulously wealthy, he could potentially afford to put up many thousands, maybe even millions in bail and barely notice it was gone. If his actually wealth is even half as much as he likes to claim, he could shrug off a couple of million and still be set for life, especially at his age.
So setting an appropriate bail amount for someone like him is a bit complicated.
Personally with a situation as seriously and given that Trump should certainly be able to afford it, I'd tend to agree that the ammount should be far higher, but I also don't know what the laws and guidelines look like in GA and ultimately they have to keep to whatever those rules are.
This is nothing new for Trump, why pay the bill when someone else will pony up for him? He has a long history of not paying bills and using legal loopholes to get out of settling private debts. You can't do that with the state, but you can do that with a commercial business. While he's clearly not worth the amount he claims he is, there is no doubt in my mind that the amount he's still siphoning off of his base will cover all his legal expenses.
As much as conservative voters and talking heads say they hate Socialism, they sure do love being the social safety net of the rich.
Simply based off of his track history of not paying his debts I wouldn't take on a single contract or loan with this person. We have a local business owner who doesn't pay his contractors. It's well known locally so he always has to hire out of county to get work done because everyone knows he will screw you over. Trump is no different.
You're absolutely right but Trump or someone working on his behalf clearly is getting people to offer their services, in spite of his reputation of not paying out significant bills for services he clearly received. How he's getting these services is beyond me, perhaps some under the table or side deals offered as a sweetener upfront, or maybe in private he's actually a smooth an elegant talker? I doubt it but I've never been in the same room as him or his business associates, so at this point anything is possible.
I bet this is money laundering/bribery kind of scheme. Some actual billionaire likely told the bondsman they would cover the bond regardless, they tell trump it's covered, trump does whatever the fuck he wants, and the billionaire buys the favor.
I'm telling you, look into the bondsman - that POS probably just got his boat or mortgage unexpectedly paid off.
His private jet (a Boeing 757) that flew him from Palm Beach to Atlanta for his booking....costs $15k to $18k per hour to operate, and it's a 2-hour flight each way (not counting warmup, taxi, and idle time waiting to takeoff). He basically dropped $60k+ for that flight. It doesn't make sense that he'd need the services of a bail bondsman when he's dropping $60k for plane rides, or maybe his campaign funds are paying to operate that jet - I wouldn't be surprised.
Someone else is paying it...?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Donald Trump reportedly used a bail bondsman after being arrested at Fulton County Jail in Atlanta, Georgia, on Thursday, paying $20,000 of his bond set at $200,000 and taking out a loan for the rest of it.
Trump voluntarily turned himself in at the Georgia jail where he was booked on 13 felony counts linked to his alleged efforts to overturn his loss in the 2020 election in the state.
Trump and 18 co-defendants, including his personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani and former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows, are accused of conspiring together in the same election plot, according to the indictment released earlier this month.
"It's also unusual for a billionaire to post a bond in cash as he did in the E. Jean Carroll's case instead of getting a commercial insurance company to do it for him, and he couldn't do it there," Rubin said.
Earlier this month, the Associated Press reported that Trump's campaign finances were strained as the former president was dedicating tens of millions of dollars towards his legal defense.
On his campaign website, Trump asks his supporters for a "contribution to evict Crooked Joe Biden from the White House and SAVE AMERICA."
The original article contains 661 words, the summary contains 199 words. Saved 70%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
He sold Mar-a-Lago. apparently he's scraping together his money to leave the country.
He didn't sell it. He transferred it to his son as a "sale", probably to protect his assets from seizure
Saw that going around. It has been debunked though.
He didn't sell it to Don Jr?
deleted by creator
The Zillow listing was done in error apparently. Zillow came out and said it was not real.
Trump never took a loan he intended to pay back. Why start now?
You need to have a loan if you're not going to pay it back.