Dragon's Dogma 2 launches to "Mostly Negative" review bombing after microtransactions reveal, and man, what a bummer
windowscentral.com
What you need to know
- As Dragon's Dogma 2 launched on PC Thursday evening, a previously hidden suite of microtransactions became available for purchase.
- Things you can buy for the single player ARPG include fast travel points, Rift Crystals for hiring Pawns and buying special items, appearance change and revival consumables, a special camping kit that weighs less than normal ones, and a few others.
- In response to the microtransactions, Dragon's Dogma 2 is being review bombed, with the game currently sitting at "Mostly Negative" on Steam.
No, it's not. Review bombing is a reaction caused by an extrinsic factor. DD2 is being reviewed negatively because of what's built into the game.
Yeah, too many “journalists” chuck around the term review bombed to mean when a AAA game gets a load of (deserved) hate.
Good journalists go back, edit their original review to call out the bait and switch of hiding the microtransactions from reviewers, and adjust their score accordingly with microtransactions taken into accout.
And release a follow up "article" just letting people know what happened and that they've updated the review, so it doesn't fly under people's radar.
Seriously, reviewers need to stop softballing when this shit happens. It's one thing for review copies to maybe be missing the final coat of polish. It's something completely different to completely leave out a feature known to be contreversial in an attempt to pump up scores, then turn it on after the initial wave of buyers can no longer return their purchase. Not like they spontaneously developed this shit since review copies went out.
Too many reviewers don't want to get kicked out of getting early releases and review codes so they can earn those yummy clicks.
It's still a form of review bombing. If the game is good (I have not played it nor seen any review so I don't actually know, but the article is making it sound like the only issues are the mtx) aside from the predatory mtx, does it deserve a mostly negative rating ?
I wouldn't necessarily disagree, but I can also see reasons to if one thinks that you are not getting a much worse experience by not paying for these micro transactions.
Also, it's fucking Capcom. They have good studios but they have always been greedy bastards. So I can't say I'm surprised by any of this.
Yes. Yes I think it does. Seems like many other people agree!
Well I agree too but it's not a fucking law of physics, the journalist is allowed to have a different opinion on that
The microtransactions are one issue among many. To be frank, putting microtransactions in a $70 USD title would still warrant negative reviews in and of itself, but the the game is also having catastrophic performance issues and crashing on PC for what seems to be the majority of players, to the point of many Youtube channels covering it that did not get press copies being all but unable to play at all.
It doesn't matter if a game has a lot of good elements, if it has bad ones and people cite those bad elements in negative reviews it's not review bombing, it's consumers giving an honest review of a product.
Imagine that you're having the best dinner of your life. Everything you like, jizz-in-your-pants delicious, served by beautiful people of your preferred sex. Then dessert comes, a massive cake, but while you're enjoying it, you notice a different flavor. And a smell. You look and in the middle of the cake, there is a half-consumed turd.
Would you still rate it "9/10 great except for the turd"? Or would you remember it as the restaurant that served you a turd?
(I stole this hyperbole from the Angry Joe Show's GOT review)
Lmao, ok, downvote me for providing context. I'm not even disagreeing. Personally I don't think this is review bombing. Y'all need to chill.
You're replying to a comment where you say
Be better at lying.
Sorry, it should have been "it can still be considered a form of review bombing. However I am on my smoke break and will not spend 15 minutes writing and proofreading a message when I know I will get piled on by internet strangers regardless of how obvious I make my own opinion while trying to explain what it sounds like the writer's point of view is" but I was pressed for time
The problem is that those two things look exactly the same without the added context that you can't fit into an easy title and people won't read the details anyways.
did it for ya
I've never heard of your definition before. It was "review bombing" when Payday 2 added MTX to the game, which I think was one of the early uses of the term even.
Review bombing is when people organize and get other people to review a game poorly for something they're opposed to, rather than the product actually being bad as a whole.
This isn't to say it isn't deserved for DD2. I have seen tons of reviews of bad performance and things like that. Also one where someone got stuck in the floor and had to delete their save to be able to play the game again. The MTX stuff mostly sounds overblown from my experience with DD:DA, but it does suck it's there are all. I can't tell you if it deserves mostly negative or not because I haven't played it.
Imagine putting microtransactions, paid character edit vouchers, Denuvo, and anti-cheat into a $70 single player only game. They know what's happening, they're just trying to shift blame onto the community.
This reads like satire wtf
Think of it as their very shitty solution to mods and cheats that so many dumbasses pay for. "Hey, why let those cheat makers profit off of our games? Let's make the cheats ourselves! But you know, for better profit, let's chop off parts of the game and call them cheats instead."
Kernel level anti-cheat
Micro-transactions
Paid character edit vouchers
Ouch, I'd be pissed too if my $70 was still not enough to buy all the character models, let alone that I would have to pay to re-customize my character. They 100% deserve this negative criticism.
Wait, anti-cheat? Wtf?
It has Denuvo Anti-tamper and Denuvo anti-cheat. If they didn't include the latter, you could just bypass the microtransactions entirely.
There's a mod right now that adds the item you need to change appearances to a vendor for like 10 gold, so I'm not really sure what cheats it's preventing exactly.
part of the reason im always pro mod option, there will be a fan who offers an optional "fix" for a game.
The very fact it's called a "review bomb" is an attempt at controlling the narrative. Fuck game "journalism".
$70 price point for entry, microtransactions for stupid shit, and launches with severe technical issues.
I'm so sick of your shit Capcom.
When a game releases with multiple purchases along side it, it just means you chopped up my full price game and are charging me extra for what I should have already gotten
WWE 2k24 in infuriating like this. If you want the full game on release, it's actually like $150.
Exception to this is actual extras, like the game's soundtrack or access to concept art.
Supposedly a lot if not all of these micro transactions are simply faster unlocks to the content/feature, still though not a good look.
That just means they deliberately made the game tedious with the goal of annoying people into paying
This is what I've pieced together as well. Everything can be fairly easily found and used (or hoarded) in game. However, this in no way excuses the other issues.
That said, I don't blame the devs. Someone light the C-Suite bonfire.
If the devs know what they’re working on, they’re choosing to participate in it.
Peoole can't just quit their jobs because they don't like a few decisions by the suits. If that were feasible for everyone then the world would be a better place.
Following this thread of logic the thousands of devs laid off in recent weeks must be heroes. After all, if they don't have a job, according to you they can do no harm, and that's a good thing.
Unless you think someone who refuses to do the work they're assigned are likely to retain their position?
Thanks for letting us know. Removed from my wishlist.
What in the fuck.
Wowwwww that is noxious. Maybe I'll check it out in 5 years, but for now this is a hard pass.
I was so hyped for this game too. The original had something special if a little underdeveloped. I was excited to see if they could make it bloom.
Guess not anyway
"Pay us more money to spend less time in the game we made" Yeah I think I'll just pass on the whole game actually
LOL THEY MANAGED TO MAKE THE FAST TRAVEL WORSE THAN IN THE FIRST GAME?! HOW?!
Not defending the mx in Dragons Dogma 2 but at least in the first one I think the way fast travel works was kinda good. It's cumbersome and not very flexible but it fits the kind of game it is and you have to actually think about where you want to go instead of zipping around the map. Imo
Besides the unlimited use ferrystone, which doesn't work in bitterblack isle, that was added to the first game later, the fast traveling works pretty much the exact same.
If anything, there's more fast travel options in Dragon's Dogma 2 thanks to the ox carts which let you skip time until you arrive, or get ambushed, which lets you continue once you clear the ambush. And that's just from well under a few hours of my time in game.
Also in the significantly less than 24 hours I've had, rift crystals, the currency they're selling for "convenience", are quite easy to get, and you absolutely never need to spend them on pawns, just drop the max pawn level to your own level or under and they're free to use.
I've already gotten enough to do a full appearance change, another thing they're selling for "convenience", without specifically trying to get them, just having fun playing the game, exploring, and completing quests.
And the tents? They aren't consumable unless maybe they get broken from ambushes, which I have yet to have occur after over 5 uses of the cheapest tent, likely because I clear the area around me first. All that's affected is weight, which becomes less of a problem the more you play regardless.
Wakestones? If you're dying, you're not prepared or ready enough, come back later, it's really that simple. I've already gotten a wakestone shard randomly, which you combine a few to get a full wakestone, which seems way faster than the first game given the much larger scale of this one. Not to mention that the ones you can buy as DLC are limited in that you can only buy 5 total, ever, but likely you can get endless amounts later in the game.
The rift incense? The one offered is the actual worst one available, it's random, as opposed to the pre-set ones you can get in game.
Even the rift crystals you can only buy a limited amount for "convenience" when you can get unlimited just for playing the game.
I'm sorry if I went off topic and on an extended reply, just a bit frustrated that I've been seeing tons of people spreading outright wrong and incorrect information about basic parts of the game. I've played both games now and gladly will clear up a ton of stuff like that. It's one thing to criticize the microtransactions themselves accurately for what they are, and another thing entirely to lie out of ignorance just to have more to complain about.
I totally agree with you on the fact that people act like Capcom murdered their grandma or something. There is no need to make stuff up when the facts are bad enough on their own. I guess one reason people are so upset is the fact that microtransactions can be an actual and dangerous addiction to some people and are usually only found in multi-player games or straight up casino type stuff. Dragons Dogma is a beloved game and cult hit for a reason and this whole thing absolutely taints it's "reputation".
Anyway, I think it's great you seem to still enjoy the game and that's what matters at the end of the day. Cheers!
Adding to that; the first game had mtx for rift bucks too. That was removed when dark arisen came out.
I don't know exactly how true this is, but I read in another thread that you can't even delete your save and start over
I've read that you can start over. But not in any kind of sensible in game way.
You have to completely delete all of the game's files off your computer and steam cloud
You have to start from a fresh install every time
Maybe they'll sell a microtransaction that allows people to start over.
I was joking around but I just read that is literally true, what the hell?
No, it's not literally true. There's an MTX to re-customize your character (not start a new game), which seems to be an option in-game too but maybe later or maybe it's expensive.
I hate having to "defend" these MTX but everyone is misrepresenting what's going on...
That's another dlc coming once it's been out for a week.
FWIW the items to do this are also available in game. I haven't played yet so I don't know how reasonable it is to get these in game.
I get that, but they're really exploiting their customers with impulse control issues. This is all designed to fleece whales and I think it's a pretty disgusting practice that's becoming too normalized
I don't disagree, but some of the articles / reactions I've seen are like "you have to pay for fast travel points!" which isn't accurate.
I'm thinking back to deus ex: mankind divided, which had a strongly negative reaction due to the fact that you could buy praxis kits. But if you played through those games...there was absolutely no reason you needed to buy praxis kits. The game was definitely not one where you would find yourself grinding out praxis kits, and in fact buying them would've probably spoiled the experience.
Then there's about a million jrpgs like the Tales of series, or falcom's trails series, where you can buy high potency healing item kits as DLC. Again these are absolutely not needed to finish those games. But they'll make certain achievements a lot easier. And again this has been going on for a long time.
I don't know, while I think this stuff crosses a line (and the fact that they deliberately hide it from reviewers shows they're well aware), the line has been steadily moving for a long time. Personally I have never once in my life bought one of these dlcs (I actually hate when they make them free in complete editions! Don't break game balance as a "bonus"!) but obviously people do cause they keep selling them. I have no idea how gamers reset this. But at the same time, review bombs are just...kind of lame. People will be looking at steam reviews 5 years from now and not even remember what the controversy was.
No review bombs are really good actually, they are the only reason why Square patched the steam version of nier automata years later, people reviewed bomb the steam release after they released a much better port on the windows store.
Right because when I'm browsing game reviews long after whatever kerfuffle is forgotten, it's really helpful to have to guess whether it's a legitimate problem that was long since fixed, a controversy that had to do with a dev's actions completely external to the game, some Andrew Tate loving incels upset because WOKE, or if it's actually a bad game. Review bombs are childish and people have a hair trigger for them. And I don't think they're terribly effective. I'm also pretty sure Nier Automata only got patched due to microsoft's gamepass requirements.
Nope, it's another version entirely. The steam version received no patch for 4 years until the review bomb started.
lol. First it had denuvo and now microtransacrions? pathetic
There is a pidcast that i like and they both praised the game and got sponsored by Capcom. I think i have to sit out the next episode, because i kinda don't want to hear them vwing apologetic towards capcom.
Nobody knew about the micro transactions until right before launch, to be fair
Agree, but I also read that it was in the review guide they provided for reviewers that apparently everyone missed.
Something was off with the way fast travel worked but I didn't expect they'd try to fucking sell it.
From my understanding, it works exactly like the first game (though prior to Dark Arizen which gave an infinite teleport item). You can get teleport crystals you can place and spend a consumable to teleport to them, just in 2 you can pay real money to get more. 1 also didn't have the carts that 2 has to travel to different places. I'm not sure how those work, but I assume it's cheaper than teleporting, and you don't need a crystal there.
Kind of, yeah.
The difference is that the first game has a reusable ferrystone that you are given for free (patched in post launch) and you couldn't buy them with real money.
DD2 has a much bigger map but you are still only allowed to teleport to the 2 big cities by default, fast travel is a lot more important than in the first game.
It looks like it was done on purpose to sell MTX rather than to make the game better, they knew ferrystones were a problem in the first game since they fixed it and still went ahead with this.
That permanent stone was only added in dark arisen after they removed the micro transactions. This system is exactly the same as the first game in launch.
I didn't know the original had MTX at launch, looks like they didn't learn from it.
This is the big one for me. I don't know how affordable they are in 2, but the fact DD:DA made them free in 1 shows there was some kind of issue. Was that just a design issue that's been fixed in 2 or something more fundamental though? I can't say without experience. Fast travel is absolutely in the game for free though, despite what some people are saying. It's a lot more limited than most games, but this isn't most games. It's about as limited as the original at launch, a little less actually.
"we won't have fast travel.."
FOR FREE.
They do have fast travel for free. It's the same as the first game. You can get the fast travel crystals in game and the consumable to teleport to them in game. The MTX is just a different option for them. There's also carts that let you travel in some form, I assume between cities.
I haven't played the game yet, but I wish people would stop lying about the MTX. They're bad enough that we don't need to make things up like the only way to fast travel being the MTX.
Edit: Yeah, sure. Downvote my comment without actually saying how it's wrong (because I only stated factually correct things). I don't understand you people. You'd rather be lied to so you can hate a thing more than have the truth and dislike it for the real reasons.
The article states that in a complete playthrough, he found exactly 2 fast travel crystals; in the second, he got one. those are definitely artificially limited to make sure someone drops some cash. if you read the article, you wouldn't get downvoted man.
It was the same in the first game where there were no micro transactions. 1-3 sounds correct from my memory. So in this case, it still feels like an additive.
The first game was full of micro transactions until it was removed in dark arisen. It's hilarious how everyone has forgotten this.
https://dragonsdogma.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_Downloadable_Content#Misc
It looks like one of those bundles also includes Ferrystones.
Completely forgot these existed which is irronic considering the current backlash
You can duplicate any item in the game for regular ol gold with a special NPC.
I'm certain there are more than two. I've played the first game and they're rare, and you actually have to find them, but I think there's about five or so. You may not find all of them, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. The fact that the first game functions like this without the ability to purchase them screams intent, and that intent was not for it to be sold. That was something forced on them by the business side.
If you want to argue the limitation is only about selling them, you must explain the existence of the same mechanic in the first game.
Edit: It looks like both games have a hard limit of 10 at any time. Once you hit that cap there's no need for more. With this consideration, it really doesn't seem like a great way to try to force MTX to happen. If they really wanted to do that it would be a different item without a limit. The fact there's a limit means once you reach 10 any extra are wasted, and it appears that they may be purchasable in game in 2, and I'm confident you can find many as well.
Since when do we trust game journalists to get things right all of a sudden? Then saying they found 2 shouldn't be an indication of anything, other than them finding 2 and certainly missing more.
That doesn't change the fact that you might just have a game where you get shafted and have to pay to get meaningful fast travel going. i'm pretty sure that wasn't the case in dd1, and that they hid the MTX in the review copys they sent out and activated their garbage when they started selling it shows that they know that it's not acceptable and that their reviews would have suffered quite a bit.
also, delivering a single player game as always online, Denuvo Antitamper AND Anti-Cheat (so you can't circumvent the MTX-crap) simply doesn't fly in a post-Baldurs Gate 3 Era.
Putting conveniences into a VIDEO GAME as MTX means that the inconveniences are part of the design. This is BAD design.
this
No, it was so much worse in 1. There was no cart system to travel to cities. I think there was a static port crystal in the main city and that's it. The consumable to use it was also too bad to make good use of the system. It's so bad that enhanced edition (Dragons Dogma: Dark Arizen) , which I think is the only version available today, added an additional static port crystal and gave the players an unlimited use teleport consumable. Players were absolutely "shafted", but it was a design decision, not a business one. The fact it still works the same to me says it's still a design decision, but the business side wanted to sell players a way to subvert the designed intent.
Yep, this is super fucked up. This is one of the huge things that should be being critiqued. People critiquing made up issues ensure people just think it's all made up when they discover the reality of the situation.
I believe I've read you can play offline. The people talking about saves being backed up are confusing it with Steam Cloud, not something the game is doing. Steam Cloud can be enabled or disabled regardless of it you're online in game. I'm not sure about this, because I haven't played the game and probably won't for a while, but I'm relaying what I've read.
Edit:
It "didn't fly" long before BG3. It still happens anyway, because the suits don't get it. They see it as ensuring sales, not harming sales.
You are being downvoted for defending this shit. Fact is you can buy fast travel options with real money. I dont care if you can unlock it for free too. The fact that a single player rpg has mtx is terrible and completely destroys all immersion when you csn open a shop to pay with real money.
Am I defending it? I'm correcting a factually incorrect statement. It sucks it's for sale, but the fact of the matter is it is available in the game. The first game it wasn't for sale and worked the same way.
I don't think it breaks immersion though. I don't get that. Do you think about how much you paid for the game while playing it? It can feel bad, but immersion breaking? It shouldn't be for sale though regardless.
I don't understand how letting players pay money to avoid grinding for items isn't a douchy move. It either means they think you will have less fun if you pay less (otherwise people wouldn't be motivated to buy shortcuts) or that they are making you pay extra for an easy mode.
I didn't say it wasn't douchy. I said it's available in the game. The first game it wasn't an option to purchase them and it still worked the same way. It clearly isn't a business decision first. It still sucks they're selling it.
They almost got me with preorder last night, but I was like nah I'll just wait and see in the morning. I love how i've been reading for weeks that "it's good they made fast travel hard", like preparing us for a fast travel MTX. Or it's the greatest character creator of all time, but to edit after you have to spend more money - the game is basically $100 canadian. Absurd.
Don't forget the performance. One review was saying it's so bad that a dragon was speaking before his animation started playing.
Fuck, really? I mean, I'm not like a die-hard fan of the game(s) or anything, but the first one is still pretty enjoyable. And it's $5 on steam.
And it's a totally complete game, with an in-game barber/character customizer. You can't change your character's body type though, only the hair and skin colors/styles.
You can buy the MTX items InGame at the vendors. Still shitty to have the MTX but yea...
If you can do it with in-game earnable currency that's a bit different.
Tbh I haven't heard that that's the case, but I also haven't gone looking.
They already said you could, but at least in the first one it was an end game/post game item to edit your character. You can check the news tab for the game on steam.
Nah m8, they had circumstances that forced them to release it before they wanted to. There is a bunch of cut content and other not fully realized features. People just don't notice them much because the game is phenomenal as is.
I mean literally every video game has some cut content somewhere. Whether it still feels complete afterward is a different story.
Never pre-order. Learned that long ago. Even games I have waited on for a long time, i'll still wait. Starfield was most recent example of that.
I think I will break the rule though for the factorio DLC, if they do a preorder.
Just curious on what you think the benefit of pre-ordering a factorio dlc would be instead of buying after release?
No real benefit. Guess I was trying to say that i trust factorio devs.
Damn game has devoured years of my life...
I learnt my lesson from Starfield; the most expensive video game I ever purchased.... I pre-ordered that tripe and suffered the consequences. Never again.
I am so glad I learnt my lesson and decided to wait for the reviews for Dragon's Dogma 2. Pretty sad that this is the outcome, but I am glad that I decided to wait and see.
Starfield got me and I should know better by now than to pre-order. I just figured it'd be the usual 'Bethesda puts out crap that modders quickly sort' but the it ended up being 'fast travel, the game' which seems hard to fix.
Thank god for BG3, though - rock solid game.
Fast travel worked almost identically in 1 with no MTX. This isnt why it's like that, but it was an opportunity they say that they could sell.
Lack of simple fast travel is what made the first game horrible
This is why we don’t pre-order :/
Stop buying this shit, and they'll stop doing it.
They won't stop doing it. Think of how many live service games have failed. Are the investors going to stop drooling over that Fortnight $$? AAA game are made to please investors, not players.
Boiling everything down to econ101 serves to absolve the bad behavior or games companies as "rational actors" while placing the blame for shitty games practices on "stupid" gamers.
If enough people are buying it, they'll keep doing it whether you like it or not. So why waste your energy getting mad about it?
You already lost the fight when you start talking about "bad behavior" and "blame." Just accept the fact that you're not the target audience for shitty modern AAA games, and move on.
It's OK. I'm not the target audience either. I'm not the target audience for Taylor Swift concerts, either. Does that make it "bad behavior" if I don't like her ticket prices?
Stop getting mad about companies making money. That's literally their purpose. There are plenty of other products out there to buy.
Regulation. Bad behavior that can't be policed by econ 101, gets regulation. Stuff like recognizing the predatory nature of these micro transactions and limiting their exposure to kids and warning labels like we slap on actual gambling. Even higher taxes on profits derived from these sorts games. Maybe they aren't so profitable when we actually protect the vulnerable and they have to truly rely on just the 'stupid whales' and not kids.
Is it predatory, though? Or are people just upset because they fell for pre-order hype, despite it being 2024 and they should know better.
Let's not muddy the waters by comparing it to gambling. Pay-to-win (or pay-for-convenience, which, in my opinion, is the same as pay-to-win) is not gambling. It's just shit. You're not paying for a randomized chance at a reward. You know exactly what you're getting.
I don't have first-hand knowledge of the game, but from what I have seen, there are no predatory IU elements to lure vulnerable kids into stealing their mom's credit card.
Don't get me wrong. I think the MTX is shit. I was mildly interested in the game, but now I won't consider it even on 75% Steam sale. Capcom won't be getting my money, that's my choice.
We don't need the government involved in regulating shitty entertainment. It's not water or electricity or healthcare. You can just not buy the thing. If you start calling for regulation of everything you don't like, that's how you get geriatric politicians who never played a game in their life and still call it "the Nintendo" deciding what you can and can't have in your game.
I was responding in general to the concept, not specifically this implementation, which as you say is not the worst implementation for sure.
We'll have agree to disagree on pay2win not being predatory. Again, this specific implementation may not be as bad, but the market as a whole absolutely has examples just as dangerous as slot machines. They're built on the same psychology.
As for regulation, it doesn't strictly have to come from the government. Both movies and games have rating boards specifically to avoid government intervention and I think they are failing consumers here. The threat of government intervention might see the ESRB and the various gaming marketplaces adopt more strict rules and warnings. Things like preventing the sale of games with specific, predatory mtx dark patterns and mechanics from sale to minors, stronger warning labels on games containing these sorts of practices and penalizing companies from adding MTX in a deceitful manner (such as after launch). A game would be heavily penalized for adding adult content this way and perhaps MTX should be treated in a similar manner.
The ones who buy items in-game are the ones who buy the games. Those are the customers they want to appease the most.
You not buying the game is 1 vote, someone that pays for micro transactions get multiple votes everytime they buy, you lost, they paid for your copy.
Damn... I was really close to pre-ordering this one and I held off basically just because I wanted to wait for information about the Steam Deck compatibility. So glad I didn't pre-order. I figured all of the glowing reviews that came out earlier this week would have mentioned secret microtransactions, but it seems like this was a very nefarious bait and switch. I like to give the benefit of the doubt and apply Hanlon's Razor, but it really feels like this was a deliberate and sinister act.
There's rarely any reason to preorder a digital thing. They don't run out of stock.
The preorder "bonuses" are rarely worth it.
You made the right choice.
Never, ever pre-order.
The only "advantage" is that you can play the game a few hours, maybe a day earlier, which makes no difference whatsoever in terms of the fun you get from the game, and to get that "benefit" you run a huge risk of not only wasting your money but also of getting to experience the actual feeling of having been scammed.
I can understand that most people lack the impulse control to wait 6 months or more (by then getting it cheaper and with most bugs fixed) and just "have to have it right now", but in the digital download era pre-ordering might at best get the game in your hands a few hours earlier than just buying it when it comes out.
How's dragons dogma 2? ... To shreds you say... And how about the community... To shreds you say ...
Cant wait to play the next Monster Hunter and buy hunting permits at $2.99 for each hunt.
You mean the series that has been selling a character edit voucher since World?
I've been a fan of Monster Hunter since the PSP and somehow completely forgot that it was made by Capcom. I was already a bit peeved that they moved G-rank behind a paywall and a year of waiting but now I'm nervous that you may not be super far off. People already think that the game has a desire senser and with AI being what it is today it wouldn't be very hard to sell a 'premium carving knife' with charges on it to get that Gem or Plate you need to finish your set.
Theyll turn the elder melder into the elder lootbox store
Oh no. We gotta stop giving them ideas.
You can earn minimum wage in premium hunt credits by working the grill with the felyne chefs (up to 20 hours of work youre not getting free insurance by working full time you freeloader)
Gonna have to pay to skip cutscenes too. And SOS flares aren’t free but aren’t expensive either. Oof, we should be execs somewhere.
G-rank was always dlc, but physical on another version called 3U, 4U or XX, or frontier united.
I didn’t have to pay for G-rank until Iceborne and Sunbreak. I’d like to go back to those days.
Because you arrived late so you just bought that version
I’m not sure what you’re getting at. I bought every version of every game since the first one and pirated the Japanese versions before they were localized. G rank wasn’t something you had to pay for until the games I mentioned. It was either in the game or it wasn’t. I’m not interested in having an argument though so I’ll just see myself out of this weird pseudo-argument.
Digital safari is a pricey venture.
They did so well with World and Rise... I'm cautiously hoping they learn from the backlash here.
I'm going to be angry about microtransaction once the game actually runs. A 5800X3D and 7900XT should not be getting 20 - 40 FPS with medium settings at 1440p.
I got it refunded. I'll play it in a couple years after all of the patches and when I have a new gpu
Seems like it's just being accurately reviewed. How else are companies supposed to learn this is not okay?
For the character thing, as long as you don't care about restarting you can delete your save and force steam to overwrite your cloud save.
https://steamcommunity.com/app/2054970/discussions/0/4289188517340869363/
The rest is absolute bullshit and I hope Capcom gets shredded for this travesty... I'm the type to give a game a chance, and I will play this, but holy shit the greed is disgustingggg
Or you can also play the game and buy the item ingame for 500RC, it's not that big of a deal.
The availability of the item in-game doesn't matter. If anything it's availability in-game being "not that big of a deal" just showcases further the scumminess of it all being that purchasable item exists only to scam people by tricking them into thinking any modicum of money is worth a one use item.
And even then, if nobody complains about it, then they'll still continue on as they will. They'll do so regardless, of course, but at least you can say that there was pushback of some kind.
Having a pushback is fair, saying that the game is trash and review bombing the game for it far exceeds what I would consider fair pushback.
The game captures really well the first's feel, it's just an improvement in almost all aspects, which is great! It's a really good game, those unnecessary MTXs giving the game a negative review score is kinda crazy.
Cool, so if I'm your landlord you have no problem with me charging you $1 every time you use a light switch?
These are not the same thing, at all
I think a more apt comparison is if you're renting out a place where every light switch is three-way with one switch near the light it controls and another in a closet with all the other light switches. You can control the ones in the closet for free, but the ones in a reasonable location are pay-per-use. The problem isn't that the features aren't available for free. It's that they poured resources into deliberately making things worse, then they charge you to undo that. Literally creating negative value.
Except I'm playing the game right now and these "deliberately made worse" elements have not once inconvenienced me in 20 hours.
You are all crying about nothing.
I have no interest in this game, so I wouldn't know how it actually affects gameplay. But do you not agree that this is shitty business practice? You have a game. Sell the game. If you want microtransactions, then produce extra art or something and sell that. You can even make the case that separating out parts of the game into various DLCs on launch is acceptable. You're at least charging for something of value that you created.
Implementing anti-cheat costs resources and makes the end result strictly worse. Now you want people to pay you to undo that? That's creating negative value. We want the economy to run on people creating positive value.
You're right, but I just wonder where it will end up. Everything has a beginning.
This is the exact same monetization that Devil May Cry 5 had in that it is practically non-existent. You can earn everything in game, you do not have to spend money.
I'm glad you're not bothered by microtransactions. I personally don't like them, and I never buy games with anything more then cosmetic microtramsactions. But we all have that line in the sand we won't cross, this is one of mine.
How.
I'm playing the game right now moron, you don't have to spend a single dime for any of the things you spend money on. It is pay to play faster, cry more about it. Your experience isn't tarnished because someone else spent more money on the game than you.
The fact that the MTX exists in the first place is just predatory. It doesn’t matter if it’s optional.
Don’t forget that things got this bad to begin with because everyone kept defending early MTX with the same excuse. These companies are always trying to push shit. Give them an excuse and they’ll run with it.
The problem that everyone seems to be missing with this "slippery slope" bullshit is that you all acknowledge that there are MTX systems worse than this one. That worse one likely being P2W MTX, because that is undeniably the worst form.
The RE4 remake literally had P2W. You could buy the weapon upgrade items for real money. DD2s MTX are in no way P2W.
So to organize the factors I've presented as they pertain to the discussion, plainly:
Everyone wants to avoid P2W because it's a bad sign for games. P2W is the reason why gatcha is the way that it is.
The Resident Evil 4 remake (oh you know, Capcoms biggest franchise) had a P2W system (that thing we just established as being the worst form of MTX).
DD2 has an MTX system so functionally worthless that I'm about to beat the game and the only reason I've even considered spending money is because I'm lazy. You actually get more out of spending your money on gatcha games (on literal fucking P2W scams).
We reach this conversation, where you're suggesting that "It'S a SlIpPeRy SlOpE".
I cannot fully express through words how genuinely stupid it is to be picking this game to cry about how bad microtransactions are. Genuinely, this is some of the dumbest shit I've seen from gamers. In your analogy, we already reached the bottom of the slope and the people fucking cheered for it.
Yeah there are worse MTX systems out there. I think that makes a pretty good case for calling out bullshit when you see it no matter how you see it. If a company sees people accepting it, they'll push it further. Therefore I'd say there's a pretty good point in complaining about DD2.
RE4 having shitty monetization doesn't make DD2's monetization not bad. Both can be bad, this isn't a mutually exclusive thing.
DD2's MTX issue is still bad regardless of worse things being out there.
Again, call it out early. So that, if they made another DD game then they don't try to push it further. Like you said it's already bad for RE4. So if there's no push back for DD2 then don't be surprised if the next DD game has something worse. Call it out before it gets all fucked up, you know? Don't just go "Oh but other game bad so this one is actually ok!".
DD2's MTX system is basically preying on people with poor impulse control. You might see it as useless but you can bet there's people out there that'll buy that shit even if they don't need it.
Yeah that's because it is a slippery slope. We didn't get to this point just like that did we? It started out small, with companies slowly pushing things to see how far they could go. Turns out, gamers are largely a masochistic lot that just let it roll in. Ball started rolling and here we are.
In this case we're seeing Capcom start out small by pushing an MTX to a specific series that seems small in comparison to other systems. Just because they could do P2W to RE doesn't necessarily mean they can get away with it in DD2, difference audiences and other factors. Making it small in comparison also has the benefit of getting some people to react like you're doing, rolling over and giving up because "Oh we're already at the bottom."
Yes, we already have P2W in some games. But I don't think that necessarily means that were are absolute rock bottom. Companies still give treat franchises with some level of individuality. While they might do something with one series, like MTX with RE4, they might think twice about trying it with another series if it gets push-back. Especially if that series is a big deal for them. That's why capcom doesn't have P2W in all of their games.
There's still a chance to keep bullshit out of stuff that hasn't yet been coated in it. So yeah I think it's pretty worth to make a point about it. It's certainly better than giving up and going "Guys things are already bad therefore it's stupid to try and change things for the better". If you want to roll over then go for it. Just don't try to bring other people down with that defeatist bullshit. Like what's the point of your reply? To say that things are bad so we shouldn't try to push people to do better?
You do not understand what you're talking about. You very clearly do not understand what I said.
I'm done with this conversation.
Nice cop out. I think I’ll give it a 9/10.
I've elaborated. I've explicitly detailed how you're wrong, and you turned around and literally said exactly what I said you would. "BuT iT iS a SlIpPeRy SlOpE".
It isn't. You just haven't been paying attention.
You really are comparing a basic necessity with a game? Talk about a false equivalency geez.
Also, since when is electricity free? This is such a weird comparison.
Man, that's some scummy behaviour right there.
It was getting really good reviews as well. All they had to do was fling the doors open and count the money.
Activision did it the other year for Crash Team Racing Remastered as well, only they at least had the good sense to wait a few weeks after release. At least here you can cancel your order and request a refund.
Capcom really saw the positive hype they got with this previously niche tittle and decided to go all RE4 weeks after release on it day 1. There's not even a new game option, I feel bad for Itsuno but it's deserved imo.
You can get all items in-game but cheats shouldn't ever be a paid feature, I criticized Saints Row 4 back then, I'll criticize Dragon's Dogma 2 today.
Publishers at the slightest inconvenience: We are getting review bombed.
Capcom can join Blizzard, EA, Ubisoft & Frontier Developments on my "Never Buy" list.
I've been living under a rock.. What has frontier developments done?
Way back when Elite: Dangerous was being Kickstarted it was shilled as bascially a 3D Neverwinter Nights in space with players having access to a toolset & being able to create their own private servers. This was the only reason I was interested in yet another space sim game.
A while after the Kickstarter was over, they completely changed the premises of what they wanted to make into what you see on Steam now. And were absolute assholes about it.
The change was so egregious, that I was able to charge-back my Visa several months after the original donation.
I'm sure the game is nice, but it wasn't what I was sold on.
(And don't bother giving me any crap about Kickstarter, I've had a good experience using it, even with the few campaigns that I donated to that still haven't delivered yet, looking at you Witchmarsh)
I love Elite Dangerous, but that sounds way cooler. Im still kind of pissed about the lack of ship interiors. Something that was promised way back when.
Well, I would say that boy needs therapy. It's psychosomatic
Oh wait. I'm thinking of the song Frontier Psychiatrist by The Avalanches
Why didn't they join that list when they had the exact same system with mtx in place in the first game? Or are you just saying it now because you want to be part of the angry internet mob about the current thing?
Fuck off, fan boy.
Lmfao what? I fucking hate the game and their shit devs and at least I'm consistent about it. Not like you and your small brain mob mentality. Do you always start swearing when you experience cognitive dissonance? Petty little loser.
Is this an always online game? If not, im sure wemod will have cheats for it soon enough to give you these items.
it is not online only but has drnuvo so you have to connectto the ibternrt reghlarly
Ermahgerd that’s herrbl.
Are you okay?
They were casting spells
!aneurysmposting@sopuli.xyz
no
They got what they deserved for hating on Denuvo - pirate scum! /s
When you turn off autocorrect or try something like Simple Keyboard (don't use it anymore fyi).
It was anysoftkeyboard. I have been using it for years at this point but its layout is so fucked up it still gets me typing funny
Start Wandows Ngrmadly?
Your character is stored online because of the online functionality, so I think so
Only if you want to get online pawns. You can play offline.
I believe your character is stored locally. Some people assume it's online because they're dumb and are confused by Steam Cloud (which can be disabled) bringing their save back after they delete it, but your game files are only backed up by Steam, not Capcom.
It's sad that Japanese developers (and Japanese people in general) have no idea what is going on in the outside world, and are therefore always 10-20 years behind societal development. I remember going there when Pasmo (rechargeable card instead of buying ticket stubs from machines for the subway) was relatively new and having a very proud Japanese person explain to me that Japan was the most convenient place in the world to live because of this. This was in 2011. Fuckers still go to 7/11 to pay their bills.
Not saying you're wrong, but this seems about equal to the shit Western developers pull on their game releases nowadays
Yeah, for years there Capcom was trying to be the next Activision
And for some reason you still can't charge transport cards online or with a credit/debit card if you don't have a japanese phone. Think that's coming in 2035 at this rate? 🤣
You can use your phone or other smart devices as transport card, but it uses a specific wireless tech that is not included in western phones as far as I know.
Yeah, it's the Osaifu-Keitai. Apple has it enabled for all phones on the market, while Android phone manufacturers avoid adding it to theirs outside Japan because they would have to pay fees to Sony for it. The funny part is that Sony itself doesn't enable it for phones outside Japan, even though FeliCa is a subsidiary of Sony :D Another funny bit is that some phones, like the Pixel, are capable of running it on phones made for other markets. Some users were able to force the Osaifu-Keitai app to think the phone was made in Japan, and that was all it took to enable it (although you'd have to root your phone + the manufacturer should have released their phones in Japan, to ensure the chip is capable). So, yeah, although a few years ago it might have been a specific chip being needed in the phone, nowadays it's mostly software that doesn't allow you to use the one you have while in Japan.
All in all, PASMO/Suica/etc is basically a very limited debit card company haha. I guess Japanese people enjoy using it mainly because it puts a cap on how much they can spend (iirc, about 100 euros allowed at once on the card). Japan is a highly consumerist society, so this format was probably adopted (instead of credit/debit cards) mainly to combat it somewhat :D
Yeah for years now (since 2019) in Sydney you can just tap on and off to travel directly with a debit or credit card. You don't need the middleman opal card anymore.
In which other country can you use the same transportation card in so many different cities, as well as a mean of payment in shops? Also, you can pay your bills online too nowadays.
The Netherlands lets you use your bank card for all public transport now (OVpay)
That's nice. How does it work if you have a transportation subscription, like paying once a month?
You need an "OV chipkaart" for that, which then does work on all public transport, but you can't buy things with that card in stores
This is the best summary I could come up with:
As I write this, Capcom's new ARPG Dragon's Dogma 2 is now officially playable on PC through Steam, with the game slated to go live on Xbox and PlayStation consoles in just a few hours.
"Then, after pre-purchasing the Deluxe Edition, I went to install it today and saw a whole page dedicated to it's Micro Transactions in the store," wrote player Superius.
The former monetizes the ability to fast travel wherever you want in the game world — Portcrystals are extremely rare to find in gameplay — while the latter's random nature essentially turns changing your Pawn's inclination into a slot machine you can spend $2 to "re-roll."
We've only been able to find two Art of Metamorphosis tomes for sale at a single NPC's shop despite finishing the game, for example, which suggests that there may be a limit on the number of times you can change your appearance unless you're prepared to fork over some cheddar.
In the past I've received review guides that included developer explanations with PR language that I felt might be designed to try influence my opinion of a game.
It's a slippery slope to ex-EA's John Riccitiello and his infamous "I want to sell bullets in Battlefield" microtransaction quip of yesteryear.
The original article contains 929 words, the summary contains 209 words. Saved 78%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
The disappointment matches the excitement I felt when it got announced
Nothing
Only legislation will stop this.
This abuse is the dominant strategy. If we allow this to continue, there will be nothing else.
Nothing inside a video game should cost real money.
I was watching Suzi's video on this and I was watching if she was gonna blink twice like she was in trouble.
Capcom's dick move with mods already poisoned the well, this is just salting the earth.
She (and other reviewers too ) should post a follow-up, it's the right thing to do IMHO. She's being called shill among other things in the comments although it's obvious she didn't know.
Seeing this fuckery from Capcom has given me sight closure and a bit happy that MegaMan is dead
Oh, but it isn't! They keep releasing collections to test the waters. Also, there's a Megaman gacha game! A fucking gacha!
For my part, I'll never forgive them for Megaman X 6 and beyond. The story was clearly written to end with Megaman X 5, then transition into the Zero series of games, but Capcom was too greedy to leave it alone.
Oh man, I got so many Vietnam flashbacks with Gears of War 4 and beyond. Microsoft really massacred my favorite video game saga :c
Dragon's Dogma 2 shits the bed after being one of the most anticipated games of the year.
Coulda been great sought profit instead, receives neither.
I was suspicious when it was multiplayer only. This usually means the game will be shit.
Damn what a shame looked bad ass. Oh well was not going to pick it up until I finished the first one (if I do since I dropped it within a couple hours....)
The first one takes a bit to get into, but once you're on it it's pretty fun and addicting.
If at least to see where the story goes.
All the playing I did, around 10 hours, I still couldn't find a storyline to follow.
Yea I definitely plan on returning to it at some point. I started it then got addicted to BG3 and just have not gone around to it again.
Yeah I get it, I would never pay for microtransactions. I'm enjoying the game so far. I used mods to get all 999 of the items they sell so I don't have to be bothered. It runs well enough on my system so imma keep enjoying it. I'll leave a negative review for yall
I'm glad you can still mod it.i thought it being always online precluded that
How disappointing... At one time Capcom was my all time favourite video game developer, I grew up playing the Breath of Fire series and it remains one of my all time favourite video games. Such a shame that they turned into such short-sighted idiots.
I was looking forward to this game and I would have 100% purchased this if it lacked micro-transactions and the Denuvo bloatware/malware. In their attempt to make more money, they at least received less money from me.
Man the update sure made the author look chastened huh? I wonder if they were pressured at all?
Anyway, new topic:
I would be interested in whether the steam rating is being "review (what do you call the opposite of bombed? Review bumped?) bombed" in a ⏫ direction. Anyone read those positive reviews? How do they seem?
I'm going to be downvoted to hell, but I'm loving the game, and all the mtx and complaints about the easy to travel and such are from people that didn't play the original, honestly. This game is like the original but better, maintaining the spirit of the original.
Yes, you could buy revival stones in the original too.
The legit complains are the performance issues and crashes, but anything else... Idk what to tell you, they knew that the slow gameplay that is expected of the player would not be well received but wanted to conserve the original feel, so if you want to bypass the original feel go for it. I won't.
I think you're missing the point.
The fact that these microtransactions were sort of hidden by reviewers and then added just a day before launch is shitty.
And if the game was designed to not have easy fast travel, they should have stuck to that vision and not introduced mtx to get over it. Offering these things to players shows a lack of adherence to their own design principles and instead shows their greed.
The negative reviews are well deserved.
i hate microtransactions, but as they go, this implementation is fairly benign.
Well. We, the gamers, get what we deserve. Did we purchase shit like this before? Yes.
Did we buy Skyrim's horse-armour and started it all? Yes.
Do we now pay for cheat-codes in a 70-moneyz single-player-game? Also Yes.
Obviously, or companies would stop to come up with such turds coz it wouldn't sell.
I will wait for a crack even though i couldn't await this game. But this? Nooooo. It hurts my fefes.
I will die on the hill of "Oblivion's horse armor DLC was not the beginning of micro transactions"
Because it wasn't. There were micro transactions for games long before the hore armor thing. Also, horse armor was a one-time purchase for that mechanic.
I think Double Dragon 3 unlocked certain moves depending on how many quarters you've put into the arcade machine. Also some of those cryptic NES games would have hint hotlines that would cost a ton of money, this stuff is old as hell.
It also had literally no game impact. It was purely cosmetic. There are far more egregious examples.
It was armor. It's... of fucking course it had mechanical impact, that was the point. Only the color was cosmetic.
But mounted combat in Oblivion wasn't really a thing, so your horse having armour never ended up mattering.
Horses pick fights in Oblivion. A lot of them get killed. Horse Armor was a direct response to player complaints.
But it was the "beginning" with the most exposure to the average gamer. Everyone hated it, nobody wanted it, yet seemingly more than enough still bought it, which ultimately lead us here.
Yet, which game exactly started it, isn't important for my point being. It somewhere started, and we still purchased and decided with our moneyz if such practices are fine with us. And obviously it was fine or else this thread Wouldn't be there.
The first game I remember seeing MTX in was gunbound, a game that was like worms Armageddon. You could earn in game currency to buy equipment or you could spend a bit of real world money on them. And before that, gold farmers and their buyers would get banned in waves on WoW. I knew instantly when seeing the gunbound system that it would make money.
Personally, I always had contempt for anyone who would pay money to gain an advantage in a game, but the fact that they kept banning more farmers and buyers in WoW told me the demand was there even when it was risky, so when the game itself was selling that shit, it would do even better.
Though I can also thank Turok for N64 for teaching me that using cheats just increases the rate at which the game stops being fun. Paying to win would do the same thing, only it costs you money to ruin the game.
The currency-selling started way before wow too. In one mmo the money-spiral went so far the drain that people who played 8 or more accounts simultaneously were the tits. You had to buy a 2nd acc at the very least to be half-way competitive. It disgusted me so bad that i ultimately quit this otherwise beautiful game (dark age of camelot).
As to cheats. I love cheats and use them to my hearts desire. Be it to see everything on the first run (there are too many games in my backlog nowadays) or to make a fun 2nd run, or just to skip things i don't enjoy (like carryweight in an rpg, me being a hoarder). I never cheated in online games of course. That would beat the purpose. Using denuvo anticheat on a singleplayergame just to make cheating impossible so that people buy their cheats... That's where they can really suck my schlong and I'll just pirate.
Yeah, anti-cheat is clearly being used here to try to prevent mods that can give the mtx items for free. Or, maybe worse, allow people passionate about the game to come in and make a better version than the people selling it made because a passion for the thing itself tends to give better results than just the passion for money the business majors calling the shots have.
Oblivion's Horse Armor was probably the start of DLC though, maybe. At least with consoles?
Speak for yourself. I don't buy any games with pay-to-win elements at all, And there are developers out there who are giving the correct example. Larian, for one. And Arrowhead is killing it with Helldivers II as well, which is another game that puts the player firstl and doesn't try to nickle & dime you to death.
Lion king for super nes was kiiiiinda microtransactional (not really) cuz Disney made the game exceptionally hard on purpose so you had to rent it many times
It reminds me of Rocket Knight for Genesis. The Japanese version is deliberately easier and the correct way to play. The US version is buggered
Helldivers is as p2w as dragons dogma 2. Both currencies are earned in-game.
Not to mention the kernel level anti cheat there too.
So these are just speed up purchases that you can get in game? Seems scumy but not a deal breaker. There were what 3 or 4 easy port crystals in the first game, and to get the the max you had to keep restarting the game or playing it over and over. And once you knew where you were going and had some port crystals in good spots, you could get through main story in less then an hour. You have the chance to easily get multiple of any item. If its the same or similar in the sequel, why waste money, unless you have limited time to play games or maybe you're just not into sinking dozens of hours into anything. Honestly its stupid, but as long as no one is blocked from getting the items in game this is such a non issue.
It's a 70$ single player game mate. There is zero reason for this.
Found the employee
Copium
It's still a bullshit move, and I'm gonna get some hate here, but you're not wrong. I don't think most of the folks commenting played the first game. Fast travel is kinda defeating the purpose of a lot of the design too.
Again, still a silly move for them and ZERO excuse for the character edit vouchers.
It will always be an issue to sell cheats, they even put denuvo anticheat to stop cheat engine use.
Don't know if it works since I won't buy it now, but Capcom already said that mods are an issue for them, not something they like.