Really happy to see replaceable batteries! It's a wear item and guaranteed to brick your device after a number of years if they aren't replaceable.
Replaceable batteries are coming to the EU in general, at least for portable devices, via the EU Batteries Regulation, which is in force already and requires all portable batteries to be easily removable and replaceable by the end user from 2027
EU has single handedly done more to improve myself my life than my own government with this one law.
Damn, how much do you pay your government?
Low income American here, upwards of 24% of everything I make.
And every penny of it used to fund fresh boots for your neck.
Well I do like FDAs, and roads though. But I’d rather have healthcare as well, and I’d like way less of it to go toward it cops and wars. Mainly I want a lot more of the taxes coming from the billionaires.
i hope this eu law makes it happen elsewhere, if anything for them to take better advantage of the economy of scale.
and if they dont ill be coveting some eu devices.
They probably calculate cost saved by economy of scale, vs profit generated from planned obsolescence in other markets.
Might be more profitable to run different SKUs.
The EU is a relatively large market, and it wouldn't make economic sense to develop and produce EU-specific devices. I'm pretty sure you'll also be seeing replaceable batteries.
I don't believe the EU will make earbuds batteries serviceable. Phones and laptops, sure.
The comments on this post are entirelly missing the point. Jesus christ lemmy. Yes, we know you like 3.5 mm jacks. That is not the point. The point is that FairPhone launched earphones with ANC with replaceable batteries. This is good!
We're allowed to want both.
Yes we are and that's okay we're not against headphone jacks, it's just that this post right here is about wireless earbuds
I think part of the conversation is about how they got rid of the headphone jack shortly before releasing these. While it is good that these exist, it seems like they exist as a result of a popular anti-consumer business choice that people don't like, and is thus tied to that choice.
I did not think people would perceive it like that, and didn't realize the jack was phased out before bluetooth ear buds were a thing, as I myself had a phone with a headphone jack until at least a couple years later, and by the time I got a phone without a headphone jack, I didn't need it anymore.
I for one have been very happy with wireless headphones because with my job, the wires would get caught on stuff too easily, or I had to run the wires through my shirt, and they barely had enough slack for me to turn my head while my phone was in my pocket. (and btw the job I have is that's unsupervised where I can have an ear bud in while working)
Not when they're twice the price is decent Sonys
You can get a decent pair of sonys for €150? The conversion rate must be better than I thought!
Even the $300+ pairs are hardly ‘decent’. The sound signature is all over the place & overly bassy.
Can you replace the battery at the Sonys?
Yes. I just replaced the ones in my wife's Sony earphones by following a step by step guide on ifixit. Cost me $15 for the batteries including shipping, and they're not even any sort of exotic type or size.
Edit: okay just read the article. Guess these are a lot more convenient to replace than the Sony ones.
That's the point. If you have devices where parts can be replaced easily and, ideally, inexpensively, I'm happy to spend a little more money.And support the project.
Wired headphones do not have the need for replaceable batteries.
And get caught on everything.
I can't be bothered with the inconvenience of wires. Bluetooth quality is good enough for what I need it for, and the convenience of simply putting them on gives me sound is hard to beat.
I have a pair of noise-canceling Bluetooth headphones (not buds) from 2008 that still work. Battery life isn't what it was, but whatever - they work fine for how I use them (as one pair of several). I could replace the battery if I felt like it, just not worth the effort.
But I get that some people prefer the wired for their use-case.
The simple point is, no one forces you to use wires. Bluetooth has been a thing for decades.
But basically every (yes some exceptions) company that makes phones forced you to use wireless ones.
And in the case of Fairphone it is just simply hypocritical.
And in the case of Fairphone it is just simply hypocritical.
I agree. I get that they're a business and all but I haven't seen a legitimate explanation for them removing headphone jacks and, like every other manufacturer, simultaneously introducing expensive Bluetooth ones.
The only reason the headphone jack was ever removed is to sell you wireless earbuds.
People will deny this but this is the only real reason for doing that. The other reason is copying apple, which isn't really another reason as apple removed it for the first reason.
Fairphone just went the extra mile to claim that headphones are wasteful, in essence they're making an excuse to cover up their reason why and also trying to force others to do it as well.
or a adapter at greater than 20x cost
YUP! I'm sorry, Apple earned more money than Spotify purely based on their airpod market. I refuse to believe otherwise.
If they truly cared about repairability/maintainability they'd give me a headphone jack phone with a replaceable module in case it wears down.
I freaking hate dongles, I always have one when I don't need one and can never find one when I don't. They randomly don't work or I don't know if this AliExpress one I bought is actually stealing my data. Just give a built-in jack, please!
I velcro’d dongles to some wired pairs of headphones, but haven’t been using them.
AirPods have been great for stockholders and bad for our planet’s inhabitants. But I cannot deny the flexibility, seamlessness (even across devices), speed to don & doff, and convenience are powerful factors.
All my phones always had headphone jacks, even though I prefer wireless and put those rubber nub dust protectors in them, so they don't get filthy. Nobody forced me to do anything. I had multiple brands. Wiko, Samsung, Honor, etc..
Strange how I've been using wired headphones with my phones until two years ago, even though I haven't had a phone with a headphone jack since 2017...
No one's disputing the utility of wireless. But it's not harming anyone to have a device with both mini-jack and bluetooth; the way it was for nearly 2 decades without any complaint.
Still critical of lack of audio jack but praises FairPhone for including list of all components and board view of where each part is located and a complete schematic. In comparison to other phones manufacturers that's night and day of repair-ability.
I have yet to use a USB-C to 3.5mm dongle for my phone that hasn't gone bust in my pocket in a few months. Probably time to see about a cable for the earphones that terminates in USB-C on the phone end, but that was difficult to search for.
I love my wired ones, and have been nursing some BT earbuds for years, but it's hard to use wired and not to move to BT anymore without buying a phone specifically for the 3.5mm jack.
Get a portable dac amp so you can connect your wired headphone over usb-c and upgrading its sound quality at the same time.
Hyperbole aside, I'd still be worried that any cable physically connected to my phone would break the port over time - mostly because that has happened to me in the past with multiple devices.
I guess there is no way to escape the extra stress to the port. Maybe using this kind of detachable magnetic adapter can help with reducing the strain? They don't conform with usb specification though, so while it may reduce strain to your port, it may carry another risk like making it easier to accidentally shorting some exposed pins.
Nice, I did not know such a connector existed - that will be useful for completely different and unrelated use cases.
While I had toyed with the idea of a portable, Japanese - made DAC for a while, I switched to Bluetooth headphones years ago. Started out with a cheap Philips headset for $50, later on got the Bose QC 35 II (still my daily driver when outside) and finally worked my way up to the Sony WH-1000XM5.
I did not realize how nice active noise cancelation is. Plus, the frequency reproduction of the XM5 with LDAC enabled is absolutely fine.
On the cons side, you're walking around with $300 - $400 on your head, which is an absolutely luxury, plus you'll get headphones that perform equally well in the sound department (minus the excellent ANC and freedom from cables) for a lot less.
Actually, get one with more pins. The one above is for charging only.
I'm the same, those dongles don't last, and are annoying to use. I picked up one of these cables from aliexpress to use with my iems and it works a treat. There's better quality cables out there, but for 10 bucks these are solid.
People keep whining about this but honestly people who listen to music with wired headphonea are a small fraction of a 1%. And they probably have this data from their telemetry.
They are now a small fraction cause this trend is already 8 years old.
Don't wanna be a whiner but wireless in ears never last long enough for me. I'm forced to stop using them after a while because they need to be charged. Even a 2 and a half hour phone call is enough to deplete them. This is a non existing problem with wired ones
I live in a low humidity climate, there is no pain quite as obnoxious as wired headphones static shocking you right across your brain.
Idk what exactly causes this, but I definitely have headphones that never do that. I reckon it’s only on my pricier pairs, so maybe it’s a cable insulation thing?
It depends on the proximity of metal to skin mostly. If you use giant cans with huge ear pads, you're fine. If you use in-ear reference headphones, the metal mesh over the speaker is close enough to the earhole to jump the gap. It also depends if the headphones are plugged into a device on your person versus say, a desktop DAC. And if you use a chair with wheels that roll across plastic, etc. etc. A lot of variables. I still enjoy using wired for audio quality, I just have to make sure I don't plan on moving and/or discharging my bodily static periodically on a grounded surface.
ESD is such an hilarious annoying thing, I once touched a cell phone and the entire display oozed to black starting from the point I touched and then oozed back to picture. Another time, I ESD'd a wall thermostat so hard that it reset back to factory defaults. I may actually be a Van De Graaff generator.
Edit: Just remembered a third, touched a light switch screw one day and static snapped me with enough juice that 200 nearby LED lights blinked on for a split second, and then back off.
Would wearing one of those grounded ESD leashes prevent this? It’s kinda silly, but if it works I’ll absolutely put one of those lil fuckers at my desk.
Funny you mention, I just recently got some ESD shoe harnesses to try out and see if they'll drain it enough to reduce the shock. May have to go full ESD lab with grounded work pads and everything at some point hahaha.
Yep. I refuse to buy a FairPhone for this simple reason: I hate bluetooth. It means I have to buy a new expensive device to get audio quality that's worse than before and requires batteries again. Fuck that.
I also find it ridiculous that they call themselves "fair" but making bluetooth buds probably increases pain and suffering, because more materials have to be used to make them than a simple jack headphone.
I don't know about the fairness of this particular company but by that rationale nothing can ever be fair, just by existing we increase the suffering. Its how the world is.
Think headphones jacks don't cause suffering at some point in the chain?
Not that I'm disagreeing, just not sure how things would get named under this specific scheme.
Does it assume that it's generally understood that everything is a little harmful in some way, so as long as you don't claim otherwise, it's cool or would everything need to be measured on some sort of average harmfulness scale and then include the rating in the title.
Like "Horrendously harmful Apple" or "Mildly harmful Colgate"
A bit hyperbolic perhaps.
Genuinely not trying to start a fight, actually interested in what you think would be a good way of doing this, as I've occasionally pondered it myself and never come up with a good answer.
Incidentally, this is one of the core plotlines to later seasons of "The good place"
Incidentally, this is one of the core plotlines to later seasons of “The good place”
Aaaay! Was going to say that too 👍
My only point is that we can work to minimize suffering. Making it necessary to purchase a new accessory adds more suffering than using an old accessory.
I had at least hoped for FastStream. (Essentially bidirectional SBC for good quality audio while using the microphone)
Hang on, is THAT why call quality is abysmal with practically every bluetooth device?
Yes. and why it's wildly complicated on Windows machines where you have an audio output device for headphones and for headset, and once something starts using the mic the output device itself changes.
So joining team chat in a game will either make audio sound horrible or break it entirely if you had specified the output device instead of using default device.
How in the fuck is bluetooth even a competing standard? If it’s “good enough” than so is SD video and VHS tapes.
Bluetooth turns twenty-six this year, maybe we’ll be closer to good integration once it hits it’s thirties.
There's a lot of things that make the Bluetooth experience better.. it's just almost all focused on mobile phones, maybe apple laptops if you stay in their walled gardens, but definitely not stock windows.
I say stock because if you do use windows and want to use Bluetooth you can improve things with a third party driver https://www.bluetoothgoodies.com/a2dp/
it's still not great but at least you can use better codecs than default
I mean even Sony didn't get it working on my XM4s, I don't know why people expect it from $150 earbuds.
Starting to notice a trend with these "specialty" device companies, crap specs and high (relatively) prices.
The FP5, released last year has a SoC that performs worse than the Tensor. The TENSOR, a chip widely regarded as shitty, and can be had on a phone 200$ cheaper. :/
The high prices at least should be obvious, a product using fairly sourced components will always be more expensive.
You can be "fair" and pricey, just put a better competitive SoC, rn it's near budget tier for upper mid range money
And then they expect someone to use it for 10 years? LMAO, that thing is gonna be sluggish AF in another 1 or 2 tops, can't imagine trying to use it in 10 lolol
You can be “fair” and pricey, just put a better competitive SoC, rn it’s near budget tier for upper mid range money
That's the thing, fair SoC's aren't cheap because they aren't available everywhere nor is a fair supply chain easy to setup. Do you think somebody just snapped their fingers or trusted the words written in a contract?
"This supplier says they're fair and ethical, so I'll believe them 🤷 "
Who do you think has to verify suppliers claims? Do you think they are free? Do you think a manufacturer will simply throw out an unfair supplier to be ethical and fair if that meant loss of business or revenue?
Think about it from the extreme: are slaves cheaper than paid employees? Then continue the thoughts from there and the impacts they have on the cost and availability of products.
Just walk through the logistics yourself and compare the cost of doing business ethically vs not. Maybe even write it down to get a better picture.
Or let us amputate the legs of techbros (they're obsolete in the world of cars and electric wheelchairs).
My 3.5mm AUX says hello
(Downvotes incomming) People still use wired headphones? It's a very small market these days and Lemmy users are simply bubbled power users
As a DJ and audiophile in general, yeah I'm not thrilled on headphones using batteries and Bluetooth. I'll give up my hard-line when I'm dead.
Sure, some wireless for exercise or casual use is fine. Full deal breaker if I'm performing though.
You're doing DJ performance from a phone?
Towards the end of my DJ'ing career, I was to the point of showing up to a venue (that had an existing sound system) on my motorcycle with my controller, headphones, microphone (that didn't smell like beer breath) and laptop in a backpack. I'd just plug in and go. But even then the idea of DJ'ing from just a phone or tablet seemed weird to me. I understood the appeal of it but....
The sticking point for most people is stereo. When you throw on AC/DC, you expect to hear the guitar out of the just one speaker but when DJ'ing a large room that doesn't work. Half the room hears the guitar and the other half just hears high hat. So you end up flipping the mono switch, ya know, just for that one song. Then eventually you've done three gigs in a row and realize that it's been mono the whole time and no-one noticed, not even you.
Headphones jacks have two audio out channels. We typically think of them as left and right, but they aren't, that's just how most people use them. Once you get past the mono idea, you realize you have two distinct audio outputs on your phone or tablet. If the music software can do the mono summing instead of the mixer, then then you can hook the "left" output cable to mixer ch 1, and the "right" to ch 2, and play different songs out each. Make sure the same output of the mixer goes to both speakers and you're in business. You just need dj'ing software that can play two different songs at the same time on your phone and interface with a controller, probably via bluetooth.
Now you can show up to a party with just your phone that you were already carrying anyway, plug in to their controller, and make a surprise appearance.
It still weirds me out, but modern phones have the horsepower to do this. They certainly don't have the disk space for a terabyte library, so you aren't going to work a six hour wedding with an iphone, but there are TB SD cards so certain Androids could certainly do this.
There's probably also software that will do everything over bluetooth so a completely wireless phone could work.
I've been out of the game for over a decade. I can't imagine how far the controllers and software have come and don't want to find out because I'm sure my poor wallet can't handle it.
Excellent points, appreciate the write up. Better said than I could myself.
I will also note that in my personal experience phone was more of a hail mary when I'd be doing like a wedding reception or private party and needed a tune for client that wasn't already in my USBs. When the tip depends on it, yes, I absolutely DJ with the phone.
For a while, youtube was a life saver for new songs.
I agree modern phones have the horsepower to do a full on audio production; how does a 3.5mm jack help in this setup that a multi-bus USB-C DAC or mixer can't do a better job than a driver that's confined to 5mm of space?
A DAC is definitely the better option in my opinion, especially if your phone doesnt have great audio quality.
When the controllers first came out, they'd cheap out by making the computer process the audio. My first Bherringer controller would convert the mic input to digital and send it to the computer to mix on the sound card. If the computer was disconnected you couldnt use the mic or hook up a cd player.
Some people are just cheap and manufactures will make whatever people will buy. The phone already has audio, so the controller is just that: a bunch of buttons. You dont have speakers built into a keyboard or mouse. A controller is just an HID.
I'm not a DJ, but I can listen to high end audio from 3.5mm, even a phone, and you just can't over Bluetooth. Its lossy janky and barely a standard.
There is also the latency if you are playing games with audio cues.
Oh. Oh god ive never even tried that. That sounds horrible.
Rhythm game enthusiast use wired headphones & kernel+pipewire settings to further reduce latency—as do musicians for recording on playback. Pro gamers use wired peripherals too for inputs & some even go analog for monitors for lower latency. Is it a stretch to say “wireless” is shorthand for “casual”? 🤔
Musicians (at least in studio) tend to use wired for the quality, which just does not exist in wireless. Less a latency thing. Live performers tend to use a monitor (speaker pointed back at them) AFAIK.
I use Guitarix to emulate effects when jamming by myself & the latency matters quite a lot when trying to hear the audio in my in-ear monitors. I couldn’t image using wireless from the bass guitar back to the laptop back to ear buds… would be too much lag to where you wouldn’t be hearing exactly what you are playing & a lot of folks mention using JACK & different kernel parameters for the latency, but I am no expert in these topics.
AptX over Bluetooth is lossless and has been available since 2016. Android only though.
My experience of Bluetooth has always been settings that I can't change, security issues, and devices that run different implementations on both ends. See 'barely a standard', even when the box for each reads the same standard number.
Which is why I'm so reluctant to call it a standard; it isnt standardized.
No, it isn't. It just has higher bitrates, but still not enough for lossless.
If that's true it seems like the name is fooling people
Saying that AptX is lossless since 2016 is blatantly false. And yes, just like with HDMI and USB, AptX standard naming and Qualcomm feature naming schemes are a misleading mess.
There are 4 flavours of AptX (linked article states this as well), and only the latest supports lossless, but is available only on very few chipsets and devices so I even forget that it exists, because for all practical purposes it doesn't.
Denon Perl Pro, Bose earbuds and Cambridge Audio M100 are the only non-chinese earphones that I know of that support AptX lossless and the latter are not even listed by my local importer. Plus, you need a very specific (expensive) phone to use them because AptX Lossless is not available for all chipsets. Basically, Asus ROG 8 or Xiaomi Redmi K70 Pro for ones available to buy for me, and then it's not available at every retailer, either, and the b2b wholesalers I have access to through work only list ROG Phone 8 (~1200€ retail).
In conclusion, to make use of lossless AptX you have to jump through many hoops and spend a lot of money—700+€ phone and the 200+€ earphones. The standard is far from being, well, a standard; common and widespread. 99,9% of devices on sale and in use by people only support older AptX standards, mostly AptX HD (which is not lossless!).
no one uses wired headphones until they suddenly really wish they had wired headphones
Well, I do.
Exactly how I bought mine. Only pair I could find in my house were insufferably cheap and hurt to use. Realized I could get a very decent wired pair for like $20. Love those things now
The low-end Chinese IEMs from the likes of MOONDROP, TRUTHEAR, etc. in that $20 range are surprisingly good if anyone is interested in picking up a spare.
I imagine phones no longer having headphone jacks isn't helping the wired headphones market. I'd gladly use wired headphones if it meant I didn't need to charge mine or worry about them dying on me. Aside from working out, it's not like the wire is exactly in the way...
I mean for working out and on the go I use Bluetooth ear buds.
But damn do I sometimes wish I still had a headphone jack on my phone. Like just grabbing my nice pair of open ear headphones, throwing down on the couch and listening to music for example.
And of course I always had backup wired ear buds with me, just in case the battery ran out.
But eh, I can live without the headphone jack, now I just wish they would have used the space for a bigger battery.
I still have 200 euro wired in ear headphones that are my favorite pair so I need to 3,5mm port. But I never got the loud commotion over the disappearance of the port, because you can easily use a 3,5mm to USB-c cable. Having said that,I do still appreciate such a port in my phone because sometimes I forget to take the cable with me or I lose it.
I use both wireless and wired, depending on what I'm doing. The earbuds fall out when I'm exercising, but have better call-quality because of the noise canceling.
And I use wired for chatting, when playing games with friends on playstation. And I still have an ipod I use occasionally... so I just kinda have both.
I prefer to have a headphone jack on my phone, but I have a dongle adapter for usb-c, if I want to use my wired ones. I would just prefer not to use the adapter if I didn't need to, because I've already had issues with my phone's charging port trying to crap-out on me. The charging port isn't as robust, and you do lose some quality with the dongle. I deal with it just fine; but a headphone jack on a phone might tip me towards purchasing that one, if I were looking to buy a new phone. It depends for me, but it's not the end of the world, just an inconvenience that could easily be avoided
There's no way I'm spending a lot on a headphone I need to toss in the garbage when the battery becomes useless.
Pretty sure the market would be bigger if manufacturers didn't remove the feature in order to push to wireless.
What I like about them is not having a battery, meaning they have a lot less impact on the climate. And it isn't needed when they are always connected to an other device with a battery that is less than 1m away.
Some devices cannot use Bluetooth audio devices, or it's buggy or laggy af. I don't mind wireless buds for the gym, but they sound worse and die before a flight across the US is complete. Wired headsets so don't have to be charged, or if they do have ANC, its usually a replacable battery instead of a rechargeable battery.
I dunno if it's just my Fold 4, but when I ride the train or visit an apartment, I get bombarded by pairing requests from Bose headphones and other bluetooth devices like home speakers. It's probably some setting that Samsung quietly flipped on in a recent patch, but it's really annoying. Fuck off, 𝙳𝚊𝚟𝚎'𝚜 𝙱𝚘𝚜𝚎 𝚀𝚞𝚒𝚎𝚝𝙲𝚘𝚖𝚏𝚘𝚛𝚝 𝟺𝟻 𝙷𝚎𝚊𝚍𝚙𝚑𝚘𝚗𝚎𝚜, I don't need pairing notifications every 10 seconds.
Nah I like em because I'm paranoid. I had paranoiac family who weren't power users who behaved similarly at the dawn of this shit.
Nowadays there is an earbuds with USB C wireless adapter like Anker Soundcore P10 or JBL Quantum. that is good and no pairing
Nobody knows what they're missing out on after the early mp3 era conditioned people to be used to shitty audio quality.
Did you guys notice how many ventors that website shares your data with??
816, oof. The internet is unusable without the proper precautions
Every time it comes up I must lament the switch to screens too tall to watch content, the decision to remove wired 3.5mm jacks in order to drive sales of wireless headphones, the switch to increasingly fewer physical buttons. No more IR blaster.
I think you're just finding reasons to nitpick. I agree with the jack but the fuck you need and IR blaster for?
IR blasters were great!
"Shit, where's the remote? Oh well, I'll just use my phone."
cause it's cool and I like it, which should be reason enough. more practically it works for cases when you lose your remote, maybe cases where you want to change the channel on some TV in a pub somewhere, shit like that. it's fun.
Probably a attempt to open source the component they can, in the release note, they list the components that are not working.
FairPhone's is not really the open source crowd though?
They proclaim to value open source and it seems they've tried to do some stuff in the past. I think software freedom is a natural conclusion of hardware repairability but it seems their priority is instead on being green and workers up the chain getting a fair pay.
If only they shipped to the US...at least, I didn't see that option.
First thing I looked at as well. Shame. I’ll buy them when my AirPods die if they offer shipping to the us.
I'd much prefer a 3.5mm jack
There are a plethora of cable earphones.
I don't understand why people complain about wireless.
You're not the target demographic.
Exactly, wired headphones are everywhere.
My wireless earbuds were such a game changer I'll never go back, I don't know why so much hate.
The audio quality is still far inferior to hardline, though Bluetooth audio standards have gotten better over the past recent years.
Nvm replaceable batteries, I keep buying 2-3 pairs of ear buds a year because I keep forgetting them in my pants when I wash them, or I give them a pat down and don't feel them inside of them.
My wife wanted me to buy her a pair of air pods.
I'm like, get a pair of headphones to last you more than a month, then we'll talk.
I can't tell you how many pairs of cheap earbuds we've gone through. Either lost or eaten (damn dog). Almost always just the right earbud. Never the left. I have so many lefts left.
So, you're not all right?
Far from it, but that started long before the first lost earbud.
I've had three sets of earbuds where the right one has died of no apparent cause shortly after the warranty expired.
I'm starting to think it's intentional.
My dog chewed on one of my Buds 2 Pro earpiece after owning them for two months cause I left the door open. Managed to open the case and everything lol
They sell cases for you to attach an airtag to your headphones case. And the pro version of the iheadphones have individual find my capabilities. Should allow you to locate all three items provided you remember to look while they still have batteries.
here's hoping the next Fairphone finally launches new in the US.
Really would love to finally use one.
Wait, why don't they launch in the U.S.?
The US market has three big gatekeepers named Verizon, AT&T and T-Mobile. They charge huge money to certify devices to work on their networks. No certification and phones won't work properly for mission-critical stuff like VoLTE, VoWiFi, and in some cases 5G. Without these features, no-one will buy the phones.
You also need to be selling a big number of those phones to eat the cost of all that certification. And what do you know, the telcos operate the stores that sell the lion's share of phones in the US market.
All that adds up to niche handsets only working on 1 or 2 of the telcos, or only partially, and only selling direct to consumer or on Amazon or Best Buy or wherever in negligible numbers.
And that's why you can't buy a Fairphone at retail in the US.
Ok i never understood this. But can i ask wtf is there a certification required for using volte or vowifi ( particulary VoLTE )?
It's easy to forget that our pocket computers are also telephones, and thus emergency calling devices. These are regulated with good reason. The operator/their partners have to test the device on their network to ensure it is compliant and emergency calls can be made as expected; they also need to build the VoLTE/VoWiFi/IMS settings for that specific network into the handset's software before it will work - VoLTE has many complications, it is not one size fits all. Accordingly, some operators allow BYOD, while others will only whitelist the specific hardware and software combination they have tested and signed off on.
So why exatcly 3g or 2g never had this problem.
Also why is that then that i can use 4g internet but somewhow making a phone call on the same network is not allowed?
They sell an official version with US antennas through Murena!
they sell the fairphone 4 not the 5. And while I'm not against e/os/, that's kind of neat for me I think it'd be awesome if they sold the original model with android with all of Google Spyware lol
The bootloader is open so you could throw Fairphone's Android on there no problem. I think they provide the files for that (didn't check so don't know for sure)
This is true.
Hopefully they will soon sell the 5!
I tossed lineageOS on mine, and have felt pleased with it.
Did you buy it from fairphone or are you saying you got the fairphone 4 with e/os/ from Mureno?
I bought the 4 from Mureno with e/os/ on it.
I'm curious what made you not like e/os/. I'm interested to try it if they do the fairphone 5
I didn't have strong feelings about it, and had extensive experience with LineageOS. I just stuck with what I knew.
Hear me out. I don’t use Bluetooth headphones. They don’t last the commute and work day.
With a jack you can listen and charge you phone at the same time and never worry about charging your headphones/iem.
If I need to use Bluetooth for connection I still can but overall better battery life
Which ones are you referring to? What's is your actual use time, like 8+ hours a day without charging? I use cheap generic MPOW ones I got for $40 and they easily last me at least 2 days
fun edit:
With a jack you can listen and charge you phone at the same time
With wireless headphones you can also charge your phone and listen at the same time
But any reason to prefer wireless is sort of moot because having a 3.5mm jack doesn't preclude a wireless headphone feature.
So… I was more referring to a 3.5mm jack on the phone.
Commute time is a little over 2hours each way. Office use is 6-8 hours. Listening + calls and needing a microphone.
Would rather not to have to do the dance for multiple devices and chargers vs just one and a single usb input.
Some of the bushes busses and trains have a usb but you have to get lucky and then decide what needs charging more…the phone or the buds.
Give me a wired option any day. Also used less battery power and sounds better.
edit... typo
Unrelated, but how do you tolerate that length of commute every day? I'd last 3 days before either looking for a new job or a new house.
Well.. It's not a commute that I need to do every day. Also I can (to some extent) work on that commute as the majority of it is on an inter-urban train. Timeboxing tasks to 30 mins or an hour can be quite productive. That said, having decent music and or noise blocking configured for your environment helps a lot. I highly recommend these guys - I have their full app and being able to dial just the right frequencies to deal with whatever is bugging you is amazing...
That said, without my device and quality headphones/iem I wouldn't be able to tolerate it.
With wireless headphones you can also charge your phone and listen at the same time
Yes, but that's not the point. The point is that if I want to use wired headphones, I can't charge my phone. Something I was able to do before, and now it's a "privilege" for wireless users. It's bullshit.
What phone do you have where you can't charge it and use wired headphones?!
I might be out of the loop lol. Is that an iPhone thing? I use android.
One thing sibling comments miss is how you can offer a jack & them, as a user, can still use whatever style you want & disregard the jack. It’s a cheap part that takes up some volume but not enough to force an entire redesign. But when manufacturers remove the jack, you are forced users into consuming either the wireless earbuds (that they all ‘conveniently’ sell branded) or cosuming a dongle which takes up the one charging port, are unruly in a way that puts additional stress on the port & make the wires hang awkwardly. Almost all other gear with audio that isn’t a modern smartphone includes the jack which means you can’t bring your existing gear—or it starts prompting every apparatus to start adding Bluetooth capabilities which includes the latency, flakiness, slow pairing but also the security & fingerprinting issues of keeping devices with Bluetooth always on in the first place. Even with replaceable batteries, you still need microcontrollers & firmware delivery.
That is to say, if Fairphone cared about sustainability, they can offer a better earbud on repairability (pressing doubt on the frequency-response curve tho), but they should still be offering a jack on their phones since wired headphones/IEMs are a more sustainable (& private & secure) personal audio option.
With removable batteries, you can swap in a fresh pair. Not ideal, but a possibility now.
If you add a 3,5mm jack to those small earbuds, there definitely won't be any space for a battery. It's one or the other.
I think he meant having the 3,5 mm jack in a phone.
Just to be pedantic; a battery is significantly larger than 2 tiny wires of copper. The battery is almost 50% of the volume in the earbud.
The buds don’t need a jack. Just the lead that connects to the phone or whatever. That takes no real space.
I'd give up the space of a battery for a jack, yes
Nice, how make one with the earbuds attached to each other with a wire and I’ll buy it for sure!
The thing about wired earbuds and headphones is that they're already pretty sustainable. A good pair can last you decades, while wireless buds are usually throwaway products. So I think it's pretty cool that they're doing something about that for those that want wireless earbuds.
I think you misunderstood, I want wireless headphones that have the two earbuds connected via a wire so you know, one doesn’t just pop out if your ear and drop on the street.
Ah, indeed I did.
I think JBL and some other brands do carry such earbuds, but maybe it might not be thz kind of wire you'd fancy.
There are also cheaper options that have a wire linking the two ear buds, but as I said those are usually cheap and might not be up to your standards.
Ugh? I used to burn through wired earbuds at a pace of maybe one pair per month. You basically have to sit and not move if you don't want to damage the wire IME
Some of the better ones have removable cables. You'll usually just yank them out or worst case if the cable is damaged you can easily replace it.
How much are you paying for your headphones? Nicer ones that don't break as easily are probably a cost effective option for you.
You may like Shokz. Their headsets are wireless and bone-conducting. The drivers get pressed to your temples with a flexible wire connecting them and you hear the sound conducting through your head instead of your ear canal. The only downside I've experienced with them is that they can only drown out so much noise, so if you're planning on using them in a noisy environment, probably go with another choice.
A friend of mine has a set of them at work and they work well in our noisy environment - machine shop.
The rule for earbuds is that you can only have one in so the bone conduction are gaining popularity at work.
I wish they fit in my motorcycle helmet. My earbuds fall out all the time when I take my helmet off.
I can use them everywhere. Except my whole subway ride...
Now I just wish that they would bring their phone to a US provider that is not T-Mobile. I can't buy their phone until it runs on a network that I can use.
Jesus your country is so messed up :(
wat?
you cannot buy the phone and then choose the provider yourself?
Yeah most phones in the us are locked to a network. Some of them are unlocked to certain network vendors but won't work with others (for example if a phone works on Verizon its a near guarantee even if its an unlocked phone it won't work on any other networks)
It is a pretty simple thing to look up the bands that the phone supports. All of the providers publish the bands that they work on. This is not difficult. This is a manufactured problem.
It's true. Its not a coincidence the most hostile telecom (Verizon) is also the one that had a former CEO as chairman of the FCC during the Trump administration. It would be very easy for OEMs to introduce more multiband phones to the market but Verizon has some sweet licensing deals on their network brands.
It's mega gross!
Can you not buy the phone and then get whatever sim you want?
looks kinda cool. will probably get them
Awesome, but I'm skeptical. Not because it's Fairphone, but because previous bad experiences.
I bought Sony buds, after reading loads of reviews and those were the best! They cost me around 300 and what I got was just shit.
I (still) own a number of lg 800 Bluetooth headsets (those with a thing you wear around your neck) that cost me 50 bucks each, that have better audio quality, louder audio, better noise cancellation, are more comfortable, and after over 4 years still have a battery life of around 10 hours where those huge ass Sony ones cut out new after like 3-4 hours and they died after 1,5 years. I think those wearable bugs are just too small to be any good at all.
You can get decent TWS buds without paying tons of money. I currently have the Soundcore Space A40, and the battery still lasts for 6-7h after almost two years of constant use (8-10h brand new).
If you're paying over $100, you're probably overpaying.
If they launch a phone similar to zenphone 10. I'll def buy it.
ASUS removed the ability to unlock or root their most recent phones. Not letting users run what they want on the device they own is a hard pass from me.
Wtf! Omg fuck these companies
At least the 10 never had the ability. The 9’s ability was yanked in the middle of its lifecycle. I was 🤏 close to buying a 9 on the 10’s release for a discount & I am so glad I opened a second tab to check what the unlock process would be like before a purchase only remembering not long after release the was an OmniROM version. Additionally I was wise enough to see thru the bullshit department (PR) that the feature would “soon return after maintenance” after the unlock servers had already been down for a couple months. Unsurprisingly they were never brought back online & the unlock app was revoked from the downloads page for the device.
This would be a dream for me too
I've been looking for buds with replaceable batteries ever since my first pair degraded. Good to see FairPhone offering one that does it this time!
I have Samsung Bluetooth earbuds that I have had for a few years and they work great but I rarely use them. I rarely listen to music through headphones. If I were to buy a new pair I may consider that ones from Pine.
Bluetooth is okay. But, I wish they offer USB c dongle connection like JBL or Anker. I hate pairing
Really happy to see replaceable batteries! It's a wear item and guaranteed to brick your device after a number of years if they aren't replaceable.
Replaceable batteries are coming to the EU in general, at least for portable devices, via the EU Batteries Regulation, which is in force already and requires all portable batteries to be easily removable and replaceable by the end user from 2027
EU has single handedly done more to improve
myselfmy life than my own government with this one law.Damn, how much do you pay your government?
Low income American here, upwards of 24% of everything I make.
And every penny of it used to fund fresh boots for your neck.
Well I do like FDAs, and roads though. But I’d rather have healthcare as well, and I’d like way less of it to go toward it cops and wars. Mainly I want a lot more of the taxes coming from the billionaires.
i hope this eu law makes it happen elsewhere, if anything for them to take better advantage of the economy of scale.
and if they dont ill be coveting some eu devices.
They probably calculate cost saved by economy of scale, vs profit generated from planned obsolescence in other markets.
Might be more profitable to run different SKUs.
The EU is a relatively large market, and it wouldn't make economic sense to develop and produce EU-specific devices. I'm pretty sure you'll also be seeing replaceable batteries.
I don't believe the EU will make earbuds batteries serviceable. Phones and laptops, sure.
The comments on this post are entirelly missing the point. Jesus christ lemmy. Yes, we know you like 3.5 mm jacks. That is not the point. The point is that FairPhone launched earphones with ANC with replaceable batteries. This is good!
We're allowed to want both.
Yes we are and that's okay we're not against headphone jacks, it's just that this post right here is about wireless earbuds
I think part of the conversation is about how they got rid of the headphone jack shortly before releasing these. While it is good that these exist, it seems like they exist as a result of a popular anti-consumer business choice that people don't like, and is thus tied to that choice.
I did not think people would perceive it like that, and didn't realize the jack was phased out before bluetooth ear buds were a thing, as I myself had a phone with a headphone jack until at least a couple years later, and by the time I got a phone without a headphone jack, I didn't need it anymore.
I for one have been very happy with wireless headphones because with my job, the wires would get caught on stuff too easily, or I had to run the wires through my shirt, and they barely had enough slack for me to turn my head while my phone was in my pocket. (and btw the job I have is that's unsupervised where I can have an ear bud in while working)
Not when they're twice the price is decent Sonys
You can get a decent pair of sonys for €150? The conversion rate must be better than I thought!
Even the $300+ pairs are hardly ‘decent’. The sound signature is all over the place & overly bassy.
Can you replace the battery at the Sonys?
Yes. I just replaced the ones in my wife's Sony earphones by following a step by step guide on ifixit. Cost me $15 for the batteries including shipping, and they're not even any sort of exotic type or size.
Edit: okay just read the article. Guess these are a lot more convenient to replace than the Sony ones.
That's the point. If you have devices where parts can be replaced easily and, ideally, inexpensively, I'm happy to spend a little more money.And support the project.
That isn't the point, the cost is.
Yes, it is good, but this step forward is only the result of an arguably bigger step backward, which is why people are bringing it up.
Let's not forget this here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRdL0StldJM
Wired headphones do not have the need for replaceable batteries.
And get caught on everything.
I can't be bothered with the inconvenience of wires. Bluetooth quality is good enough for what I need it for, and the convenience of simply putting them on gives me sound is hard to beat.
I have a pair of noise-canceling Bluetooth headphones (not buds) from 2008 that still work. Battery life isn't what it was, but whatever - they work fine for how I use them (as one pair of several). I could replace the battery if I felt like it, just not worth the effort.
But I get that some people prefer the wired for their use-case.
The simple point is, no one forces you to use wires. Bluetooth has been a thing for decades.
But basically every (yes some exceptions) company that makes phones forced you to use wireless ones.
And in the case of Fairphone it is just simply hypocritical.
I agree. I get that they're a business and all but I haven't seen a legitimate explanation for them removing headphone jacks and, like every other manufacturer, simultaneously introducing expensive Bluetooth ones.
The only reason the headphone jack was ever removed is to sell you wireless earbuds.
People will deny this but this is the only real reason for doing that. The other reason is copying apple, which isn't really another reason as apple removed it for the first reason. Fairphone just went the extra mile to claim that headphones are wasteful, in essence they're making an excuse to cover up their reason why and also trying to force others to do it as well.
or a adapter at greater than 20x cost
YUP! I'm sorry, Apple earned more money than Spotify purely based on their airpod market. I refuse to believe otherwise.
If they truly cared about repairability/maintainability they'd give me a headphone jack phone with a replaceable module in case it wears down.
I freaking hate dongles, I always have one when I don't need one and can never find one when I don't. They randomly don't work or I don't know if this AliExpress one I bought is actually stealing my data. Just give a built-in jack, please!
I velcro’d dongles to some wired pairs of headphones, but haven’t been using them.
AirPods have been great for stockholders and bad for our planet’s inhabitants. But I cannot deny the flexibility, seamlessness (even across devices), speed to don & doff, and convenience are powerful factors.
All my phones always had headphone jacks, even though I prefer wireless and put those rubber nub dust protectors in them, so they don't get filthy. Nobody forced me to do anything. I had multiple brands. Wiko, Samsung, Honor, etc..
Strange how I've been using wired headphones with my phones until two years ago, even though I haven't had a phone with a headphone jack since 2017...
No one's disputing the utility of wireless. But it's not harming anyone to have a device with both mini-jack and bluetooth; the way it was for nearly 2 decades without any complaint.
A follow-up video "Why I was wrong about fairphone" by Louis Rossmann: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAogtqyN22M
Still critical of lack of audio jack but praises FairPhone for including list of all components and board view of where each part is located and a complete schematic. In comparison to other phones manufacturers that's night and day of repair-ability.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://www.piped.video/watch?v=EAogtqyN22M
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
I have yet to use a USB-C to 3.5mm dongle for my phone that hasn't gone bust in my pocket in a few months. Probably time to see about a cable for the earphones that terminates in USB-C on the phone end, but that was difficult to search for.
I love my wired ones, and have been nursing some BT earbuds for years, but it's hard to use wired and not to move to BT anymore without buying a phone specifically for the 3.5mm jack.
Get a portable dac amp so you can connect your wired headphone over usb-c and upgrading its sound quality at the same time.
Hyperbole aside, I'd still be worried that any cable physically connected to my phone would break the port over time - mostly because that has happened to me in the past with multiple devices.
I guess there is no way to escape the extra stress to the port. Maybe using this kind of detachable magnetic adapter can help with reducing the strain? They don't conform with usb specification though, so while it may reduce strain to your port, it may carry another risk like making it easier to accidentally shorting some exposed pins.
Nice, I did not know such a connector existed - that will be useful for completely different and unrelated use cases.
While I had toyed with the idea of a portable, Japanese - made DAC for a while, I switched to Bluetooth headphones years ago. Started out with a cheap Philips headset for $50, later on got the Bose QC 35 II (still my daily driver when outside) and finally worked my way up to the Sony WH-1000XM5.
I did not realize how nice active noise cancelation is. Plus, the frequency reproduction of the XM5 with LDAC enabled is absolutely fine.
On the cons side, you're walking around with $300 - $400 on your head, which is an absolutely luxury, plus you'll get headphones that perform equally well in the sound department (minus the excellent ANC and freedom from cables) for a lot less.
Actually, get one with more pins. The one above is for charging only.
I'm the same, those dongles don't last, and are annoying to use. I picked up one of these cables from aliexpress to use with my iems and it works a treat. There's better quality cables out there, but for 10 bucks these are solid.
People keep whining about this but honestly people who listen to music with wired headphonea are a small fraction of a 1%. And they probably have this data from their telemetry.
They are now a small fraction cause this trend is already 8 years old.
Don't wanna be a whiner but wireless in ears never last long enough for me. I'm forced to stop using them after a while because they need to be charged. Even a 2 and a half hour phone call is enough to deplete them. This is a non existing problem with wired ones
I live in a low humidity climate, there is no pain quite as obnoxious as wired headphones static shocking you right across your brain.
Idk what exactly causes this, but I definitely have headphones that never do that. I reckon it’s only on my pricier pairs, so maybe it’s a cable insulation thing?
It depends on the proximity of metal to skin mostly. If you use giant cans with huge ear pads, you're fine. If you use in-ear reference headphones, the metal mesh over the speaker is close enough to the earhole to jump the gap. It also depends if the headphones are plugged into a device on your person versus say, a desktop DAC. And if you use a chair with wheels that roll across plastic, etc. etc. A lot of variables. I still enjoy using wired for audio quality, I just have to make sure I don't plan on moving and/or discharging my bodily static periodically on a grounded surface.
ESD is such an hilarious annoying thing, I once touched a cell phone and the entire display oozed to black starting from the point I touched and then oozed back to picture. Another time, I ESD'd a wall thermostat so hard that it reset back to factory defaults. I may actually be a Van De Graaff generator.
Edit: Just remembered a third, touched a light switch screw one day and static snapped me with enough juice that 200 nearby LED lights blinked on for a split second, and then back off.
Would wearing one of those grounded ESD leashes prevent this? It’s kinda silly, but if it works I’ll absolutely put one of those lil fuckers at my desk.
Funny you mention, I just recently got some ESD shoe harnesses to try out and see if they'll drain it enough to reduce the shock. May have to go full ESD lab with grounded work pads and everything at some point hahaha.
But also see:
https://piped.video/watch?v=EAogtqyN22M
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://www.piped.video/watch?v=bRdL0StldJM
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Yep. I refuse to buy a FairPhone for this simple reason: I hate bluetooth. It means I have to buy a new expensive device to get audio quality that's worse than before and requires batteries again. Fuck that.
I also find it ridiculous that they call themselves "fair" but making bluetooth buds probably increases pain and suffering, because more materials have to be used to make them than a simple jack headphone.
::: spoiler Anti Commercial AI thingy CC BY-NC-SA 4.0 :::
I don't know about the fairness of this particular company but by that rationale nothing can ever be fair, just by existing we increase the suffering. Its how the world is.
Think headphones jacks don't cause suffering at some point in the chain?
Not that I'm disagreeing, just not sure how things would get named under this specific scheme.
Does it assume that it's generally understood that everything is a little harmful in some way, so as long as you don't claim otherwise, it's cool or would everything need to be measured on some sort of average harmfulness scale and then include the rating in the title.
Like "Horrendously harmful Apple" or "Mildly harmful Colgate"
A bit hyperbolic perhaps.
Genuinely not trying to start a fight, actually interested in what you think would be a good way of doing this, as I've occasionally pondered it myself and never come up with a good answer.
Incidentally, this is one of the core plotlines to later seasons of "The good place"
Aaaay! Was going to say that too 👍
My only point is that we can work to minimize suffering. Making it necessary to purchase a new accessory adds more suffering than using an old accessory.
::: spoiler Anti Commercial AI thingy CC BY-NC-SA 4.0 :::
That's reasonable
if you hate bluetooth. USB C dongle earbuds are quite impressive nowadays like JBL or anker. no pairing
That'll have to be the middle ground should I ever be forced to buy a phone without an audio jack.
::: spoiler Anti Commercial AI thingy CC BY-NC-SA 4.0 :::
> only support AAC and SBC codecs
> available for 149
Eh.
I had at least hoped for FastStream. (Essentially bidirectional SBC for good quality audio while using the microphone)
Hang on, is THAT why call quality is abysmal with practically every bluetooth device?
Yes. and why it's wildly complicated on Windows machines where you have an audio output device for headphones and for headset, and once something starts using the mic the output device itself changes.
So joining team chat in a game will either make audio sound horrible or break it entirely if you had specified the output device instead of using default device.
How in the fuck is bluetooth even a competing standard? If it’s “good enough” than so is SD video and VHS tapes.
Bluetooth turns twenty-six this year, maybe we’ll be closer to good integration once it hits it’s thirties.
There's a lot of things that make the Bluetooth experience better.. it's just almost all focused on mobile phones, maybe apple laptops if you stay in their walled gardens, but definitely not stock windows.
I say stock because if you do use windows and want to use Bluetooth you can improve things with a third party driver https://www.bluetoothgoodies.com/a2dp/ it's still not great but at least you can use better codecs than default
I mean even Sony didn't get it working on my XM4s, I don't know why people expect it from $150 earbuds.
Starting to notice a trend with these "specialty" device companies, crap specs and high (relatively) prices.
The FP5, released last year has a SoC that performs worse than the Tensor. The TENSOR, a chip widely regarded as shitty, and can be had on a phone 200$ cheaper. :/
The high prices at least should be obvious, a product using fairly sourced components will always be more expensive.
Other's make it cheaper because they don't care about "fair". How do you think cheap products become cheap? Think about it for a second.
::: spoiler Anti Commercial AI thingy CC BY-NC-SA 4.0 :::
You can be "fair" and pricey, just put a better competitive SoC, rn it's near budget tier for upper mid range money
And then they expect someone to use it for 10 years? LMAO, that thing is gonna be sluggish AF in another 1 or 2 tops, can't imagine trying to use it in 10 lolol
That's the thing, fair SoC's aren't cheap because they aren't available everywhere nor is a fair supply chain easy to setup. Do you think somebody just snapped their fingers or trusted the words written in a contract? "This supplier says they're fair and ethical, so I'll believe them 🤷 "
Who do you think has to verify suppliers claims? Do you think they are free? Do you think a manufacturer will simply throw out an unfair supplier to be ethical and fair if that meant loss of business or revenue?
Think about it from the extreme: are slaves cheaper than paid employees? Then continue the thoughts from there and the impacts they have on the cost and availability of products. Just walk through the logistics yourself and compare the cost of doing business ethically vs not. Maybe even write it down to get a better picture.
::: spoiler Anti Commercial AI thingy CC BY-NC-SA 4.0 :::
Please, just give us back the headphone jacks!
Or let us amputate the legs of techbros (they're obsolete in the world of cars and electric wheelchairs).
My 3.5mm AUX says hello
(Downvotes incomming) People still use wired headphones? It's a very small market these days and Lemmy users are simply bubbled power users
As a DJ and audiophile in general, yeah I'm not thrilled on headphones using batteries and Bluetooth. I'll give up my hard-line when I'm dead.
Sure, some wireless for exercise or casual use is fine. Full deal breaker if I'm performing though.
You're doing DJ performance from a phone?
Towards the end of my DJ'ing career, I was to the point of showing up to a venue (that had an existing sound system) on my motorcycle with my controller, headphones, microphone (that didn't smell like beer breath) and laptop in a backpack. I'd just plug in and go. But even then the idea of DJ'ing from just a phone or tablet seemed weird to me. I understood the appeal of it but....
The sticking point for most people is stereo. When you throw on AC/DC, you expect to hear the guitar out of the just one speaker but when DJ'ing a large room that doesn't work. Half the room hears the guitar and the other half just hears high hat. So you end up flipping the mono switch, ya know, just for that one song. Then eventually you've done three gigs in a row and realize that it's been mono the whole time and no-one noticed, not even you.
Headphones jacks have two audio out channels. We typically think of them as left and right, but they aren't, that's just how most people use them. Once you get past the mono idea, you realize you have two distinct audio outputs on your phone or tablet. If the music software can do the mono summing instead of the mixer, then then you can hook the "left" output cable to mixer ch 1, and the "right" to ch 2, and play different songs out each. Make sure the same output of the mixer goes to both speakers and you're in business. You just need dj'ing software that can play two different songs at the same time on your phone and interface with a controller, probably via bluetooth.
Now you can show up to a party with just your phone that you were already carrying anyway, plug in to their controller, and make a surprise appearance.
It still weirds me out, but modern phones have the horsepower to do this. They certainly don't have the disk space for a terabyte library, so you aren't going to work a six hour wedding with an iphone, but there are TB SD cards so certain Androids could certainly do this.
There's probably also software that will do everything over bluetooth so a completely wireless phone could work.
I've been out of the game for over a decade. I can't imagine how far the controllers and software have come and don't want to find out because I'm sure my poor wallet can't handle it.
Excellent points, appreciate the write up. Better said than I could myself.
I will also note that in my personal experience phone was more of a hail mary when I'd be doing like a wedding reception or private party and needed a tune for client that wasn't already in my USBs. When the tip depends on it, yes, I absolutely DJ with the phone.
For a while, youtube was a life saver for new songs.
I agree modern phones have the horsepower to do a full on audio production; how does a 3.5mm jack help in this setup that a multi-bus USB-C DAC or mixer can't do a better job than a driver that's confined to 5mm of space?
A DAC is definitely the better option in my opinion, especially if your phone doesnt have great audio quality.
When the controllers first came out, they'd cheap out by making the computer process the audio. My first Bherringer controller would convert the mic input to digital and send it to the computer to mix on the sound card. If the computer was disconnected you couldnt use the mic or hook up a cd player.
Some people are just cheap and manufactures will make whatever people will buy. The phone already has audio, so the controller is just that: a bunch of buttons. You dont have speakers built into a keyboard or mouse. A controller is just an HID.
I'm not a DJ, but I can listen to high end audio from 3.5mm, even a phone, and you just can't over Bluetooth. Its lossy janky and barely a standard.
There is also the latency if you are playing games with audio cues.
Oh. Oh god ive never even tried that. That sounds horrible.
Rhythm game enthusiast use wired headphones & kernel+pipewire settings to further reduce latency—as do musicians for recording on playback. Pro gamers use wired peripherals too for inputs & some even go analog for monitors for lower latency. Is it a stretch to say “wireless” is shorthand for “casual”? 🤔
Musicians (at least in studio) tend to use wired for the quality, which just does not exist in wireless. Less a latency thing. Live performers tend to use a monitor (speaker pointed back at them) AFAIK.
I use Guitarix to emulate effects when jamming by myself & the latency matters quite a lot when trying to hear the audio in my in-ear monitors. I couldn’t image using wireless from the bass guitar back to the laptop back to ear buds… would be too much lag to where you wouldn’t be hearing exactly what you are playing & a lot of folks mention using JACK & different kernel parameters for the latency, but I am no expert in these topics.
AptX over Bluetooth is lossless and has been available since 2016. Android only though.
My experience of Bluetooth has always been settings that I can't change, security issues, and devices that run different implementations on both ends. See 'barely a standard', even when the box for each reads the same standard number.
Which is why I'm so reluctant to call it a standard; it isnt standardized.
No, it isn't. It just has higher bitrates, but still not enough for lossless.
If that's true it seems like the name is fooling people
https://www.whathifi.com/advice/aptx-lossless-what-is-the-breakthrough-bluetooth-codec-how-can-you-get-it
Saying that AptX is lossless since 2016 is blatantly false. And yes, just like with HDMI and USB, AptX standard naming and Qualcomm feature naming schemes are a misleading mess.
There are 4 flavours of AptX (linked article states this as well), and only the latest supports lossless, but is available only on very few chipsets and devices so I even forget that it exists, because for all practical purposes it doesn't.
Denon Perl Pro, Bose earbuds and Cambridge Audio M100 are the only non-chinese earphones that I know of that support AptX lossless and the latter are not even listed by my local importer. Plus, you need a very specific (expensive) phone to use them because AptX Lossless is not available for all chipsets. Basically, Asus ROG 8 or Xiaomi Redmi K70 Pro for ones available to buy for me, and then it's not available at every retailer, either, and the b2b wholesalers I have access to through work only list ROG Phone 8 (~1200€ retail).
In conclusion, to make use of lossless AptX you have to jump through many hoops and spend a lot of money—700+€ phone and the 200+€ earphones. The standard is far from being, well, a standard; common and widespread. 99,9% of devices on sale and in use by people only support older AptX standards, mostly AptX HD (which is not lossless!).
no one uses wired headphones until they suddenly really wish they had wired headphones
Well, I do.
Exactly how I bought mine. Only pair I could find in my house were insufferably cheap and hurt to use. Realized I could get a very decent wired pair for like $20. Love those things now
The low-end Chinese IEMs from the likes of MOONDROP, TRUTHEAR, etc. in that $20 range are surprisingly good if anyone is interested in picking up a spare.
I imagine phones no longer having headphone jacks isn't helping the wired headphones market. I'd gladly use wired headphones if it meant I didn't need to charge mine or worry about them dying on me. Aside from working out, it's not like the wire is exactly in the way...
I mean for working out and on the go I use Bluetooth ear buds.
But damn do I sometimes wish I still had a headphone jack on my phone. Like just grabbing my nice pair of open ear headphones, throwing down on the couch and listening to music for example.
And of course I always had backup wired ear buds with me, just in case the battery ran out.
But eh, I can live without the headphone jack, now I just wish they would have used the space for a bigger battery.
I still have 200 euro wired in ear headphones that are my favorite pair so I need to 3,5mm port. But I never got the loud commotion over the disappearance of the port, because you can easily use a 3,5mm to USB-c cable. Having said that,I do still appreciate such a port in my phone because sometimes I forget to take the cable with me or I lose it.
I use both wireless and wired, depending on what I'm doing. The earbuds fall out when I'm exercising, but have better call-quality because of the noise canceling.
And I use wired for chatting, when playing games with friends on playstation. And I still have an ipod I use occasionally... so I just kinda have both.
I prefer to have a headphone jack on my phone, but I have a dongle adapter for usb-c, if I want to use my wired ones. I would just prefer not to use the adapter if I didn't need to, because I've already had issues with my phone's charging port trying to crap-out on me. The charging port isn't as robust, and you do lose some quality with the dongle. I deal with it just fine; but a headphone jack on a phone might tip me towards purchasing that one, if I were looking to buy a new phone. It depends for me, but it's not the end of the world, just an inconvenience that could easily be avoided
There's no way I'm spending a lot on a headphone I need to toss in the garbage when the battery becomes useless.
Pretty sure the market would be bigger if manufacturers didn't remove the feature in order to push to wireless.
What I like about them is not having a battery, meaning they have a lot less impact on the climate. And it isn't needed when they are always connected to an other device with a battery that is less than 1m away.
Some devices cannot use Bluetooth audio devices, or it's buggy or laggy af. I don't mind wireless buds for the gym, but they sound worse and die before a flight across the US is complete. Wired headsets so don't have to be charged, or if they do have ANC, its usually a replacable battery instead of a rechargeable battery.
I dunno if it's just my Fold 4, but when I ride the train or visit an apartment, I get bombarded by pairing requests from Bose headphones and other bluetooth devices like home speakers. It's probably some setting that Samsung quietly flipped on in a recent patch, but it's really annoying. Fuck off, 𝙳𝚊𝚟𝚎'𝚜 𝙱𝚘𝚜𝚎 𝚀𝚞𝚒𝚎𝚝𝙲𝚘𝚖𝚏𝚘𝚛𝚝 𝟺𝟻 𝙷𝚎𝚊𝚍𝚙𝚑𝚘𝚗𝚎𝚜, I don't need pairing notifications every 10 seconds.
Nah I like em because I'm paranoid. I had paranoiac family who weren't power users who behaved similarly at the dawn of this shit.
Nowadays there is an earbuds with USB C wireless adapter like Anker Soundcore P10 or JBL Quantum. that is good and no pairing
Nobody knows what they're missing out on after the early mp3 era conditioned people to be used to shitty audio quality.
Did you guys notice how many ventors that website shares your data with??
816, oof. The internet is unusable without the proper precautions
Every time it comes up I must lament the switch to screens too tall to watch content, the decision to remove wired 3.5mm jacks in order to drive sales of wireless headphones, the switch to increasingly fewer physical buttons. No more IR blaster.
I think you're just finding reasons to nitpick. I agree with the jack but the fuck you need and IR blaster for?
IR blasters were great!
"Shit, where's the remote? Oh well, I'll just use my phone."
cause it's cool and I like it, which should be reason enough. more practically it works for cases when you lose your remote, maybe cases where you want to change the channel on some TV in a pub somewhere, shit like that. it's fun.
Is their app open source?
Their website has a page that says they "embrace open source"
I couldn't find the source code specifically for their app. Maybe this?
https://github.com/fairphone/android_device_fairphone_FP5
Honestly have no clue what I'm looking at there. There seems to be no iOS equivalent, so who knows.
Otherwise, their app permissions seem pretty reasonable:
• discover and pair nearby Bluetooth devices
• Access Bluetooth settings
• Pair with Bluetooth devices
• connect to paired Bluetooth devices
But yeah, if no open source, that can definitely be a deal-breaker for the market they seem to be targeting.
This seems like part of their android os for FP5, TWRP is a common open source android recovery image: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/TWRP_(software)
Probably a attempt to open source the component they can, in the release note, they list the components that are not working.
FairPhone's is not really the open source crowd though?
They proclaim to value open source and it seems they've tried to do some stuff in the past. I think software freedom is a natural conclusion of hardware repairability but it seems their priority is instead on being green and workers up the chain getting a fair pay.
If only they shipped to the US...at least, I didn't see that option.
First thing I looked at as well. Shame. I’ll buy them when my AirPods die if they offer shipping to the us.
I'd much prefer a 3.5mm jack
There are a plethora of cable earphones.
I don't understand why people complain about wireless.
You're not the target demographic.
Exactly, wired headphones are everywhere.
My wireless earbuds were such a game changer I'll never go back, I don't know why so much hate.
The audio quality is still far inferior to hardline, though Bluetooth audio standards have gotten better over the past recent years.
You're being downvoted, but yours is a legitimate request.
This!
Fairbuds: replaceable batteries
Fairerbuds: open source app
Fairestbuds: open source firmware
Nvm replaceable batteries, I keep buying 2-3 pairs of ear buds a year because I keep forgetting them in my pants when I wash them, or I give them a pat down and don't feel them inside of them.
My wife wanted me to buy her a pair of air pods.
I'm like, get a pair of headphones to last you more than a month, then we'll talk.
I can't tell you how many pairs of cheap earbuds we've gone through. Either lost or eaten (damn dog). Almost always just the right earbud. Never the left. I have so many lefts left.
So, you're not all right?
Far from it, but that started long before the first lost earbud.
I've had three sets of earbuds where the right one has died of no apparent cause shortly after the warranty expired.
I'm starting to think it's intentional.
My dog chewed on one of my Buds 2 Pro earpiece after owning them for two months cause I left the door open. Managed to open the case and everything lol
They sell cases for you to attach an airtag to your headphones case. And the pro version of the iheadphones have individual find my capabilities. Should allow you to locate all three items provided you remember to look while they still have batteries.
here's hoping the next Fairphone finally launches new in the US.
Really would love to finally use one.
Wait, why don't they launch in the U.S.?
The US market has three big gatekeepers named Verizon, AT&T and T-Mobile. They charge huge money to certify devices to work on their networks. No certification and phones won't work properly for mission-critical stuff like VoLTE, VoWiFi, and in some cases 5G. Without these features, no-one will buy the phones.
You also need to be selling a big number of those phones to eat the cost of all that certification. And what do you know, the telcos operate the stores that sell the lion's share of phones in the US market.
All that adds up to niche handsets only working on 1 or 2 of the telcos, or only partially, and only selling direct to consumer or on Amazon or Best Buy or wherever in negligible numbers.
And that's why you can't buy a Fairphone at retail in the US.
Ok i never understood this. But can i ask wtf is there a certification required for using volte or vowifi ( particulary VoLTE )?
It's easy to forget that our pocket computers are also telephones, and thus emergency calling devices. These are regulated with good reason. The operator/their partners have to test the device on their network to ensure it is compliant and emergency calls can be made as expected; they also need to build the VoLTE/VoWiFi/IMS settings for that specific network into the handset's software before it will work - VoLTE has many complications, it is not one size fits all. Accordingly, some operators allow BYOD, while others will only whitelist the specific hardware and software combination they have tested and signed off on.
So why exatcly 3g or 2g never had this problem. Also why is that then that i can use 4g internet but somewhow making a phone call on the same network is not allowed?
I'm not sure, I assume due to the lock in to carrier stores in the US? Or just expenses of doing business. I can't even order those earbuds to the US.
there is the fairphone 4 on Murena with e/os/ but they don't even have fairphone 5 😭
They sell an official version with US antennas through Murena!
they sell the fairphone 4 not the 5. And while I'm not against e/os/, that's kind of neat for me I think it'd be awesome if they sold the original model with android with all of Google Spyware lol
The bootloader is open so you could throw Fairphone's Android on there no problem. I think they provide the files for that (didn't check so don't know for sure)
This is true. Hopefully they will soon sell the 5! I tossed lineageOS on mine, and have felt pleased with it.
Did you buy it from fairphone or are you saying you got the fairphone 4 with e/os/ from Mureno?
I bought the 4 from Mureno with e/os/ on it.
I'm curious what made you not like e/os/. I'm interested to try it if they do the fairphone 5
I didn't have strong feelings about it, and had extensive experience with LineageOS. I just stuck with what I knew.
Wired 3.5mm jack.
Hear me out. I don’t use Bluetooth headphones. They don’t last the commute and work day.
With a jack you can listen and charge you phone at the same time and never worry about charging your headphones/iem.
If I need to use Bluetooth for connection I still can but overall better battery life
Which ones are you referring to? What's is your actual use time, like 8+ hours a day without charging? I use cheap generic MPOW ones I got for $40 and they easily last me at least 2 days
fun edit:
With wireless headphones you can also charge your phone and listen at the same time
But any reason to prefer wireless is sort of moot because having a 3.5mm jack doesn't preclude a wireless headphone feature.
So… I was more referring to a 3.5mm jack on the phone.
Commute time is a little over 2hours each way. Office use is 6-8 hours. Listening + calls and needing a microphone.
Would rather not to have to do the dance for multiple devices and chargers vs just one and a single usb input.
Some of the
bushesbusses and trains have a usb but you have to get lucky and then decide what needs charging more…the phone or the buds.Give me a wired option any day. Also used less battery power and sounds better.
edit... typo
Unrelated, but how do you tolerate that length of commute every day? I'd last 3 days before either looking for a new job or a new house.
Well.. It's not a commute that I need to do every day. Also I can (to some extent) work on that commute as the majority of it is on an inter-urban train. Timeboxing tasks to 30 mins or an hour can be quite productive. That said, having decent music and or noise blocking configured for your environment helps a lot. I highly recommend these guys - I have their full app and being able to dial just the right frequencies to deal with whatever is bugging you is amazing...
https://mynoise.net
That said, without my device and quality headphones/iem I wouldn't be able to tolerate it.
Yes, but that's not the point. The point is that if I want to use wired headphones, I can't charge my phone. Something I was able to do before, and now it's a "privilege" for wireless users. It's bullshit.
What phone do you have where you can't charge it and use wired headphones?!
I might be out of the loop lol. Is that an iPhone thing? I use android.
One thing sibling comments miss is how you can offer a jack & them, as a user, can still use whatever style you want & disregard the jack. It’s a cheap part that takes up some volume but not enough to force an entire redesign. But when manufacturers remove the jack, you are forced users into consuming either the wireless earbuds (that they all ‘conveniently’ sell branded) or cosuming a dongle which takes up the one charging port, are unruly in a way that puts additional stress on the port & make the wires hang awkwardly. Almost all other gear with audio that isn’t a modern smartphone includes the jack which means you can’t bring your existing gear—or it starts prompting every apparatus to start adding Bluetooth capabilities which includes the latency, flakiness, slow pairing but also the security & fingerprinting issues of keeping devices with Bluetooth always on in the first place. Even with replaceable batteries, you still need microcontrollers & firmware delivery.
That is to say, if Fairphone cared about sustainability, they can offer a better earbud on repairability (pressing doubt on the frequency-response curve tho), but they should still be offering a jack on their phones since wired headphones/IEMs are a more sustainable (& private & secure) personal audio option.
With removable batteries, you can swap in a fresh pair. Not ideal, but a possibility now.
If you add a 3,5mm jack to those small earbuds, there definitely won't be any space for a battery. It's one or the other.
I think he meant having the 3,5 mm jack in a phone.
Just to be pedantic; a battery is significantly larger than 2 tiny wires of copper. The battery is almost 50% of the volume in the earbud.
The buds don’t need a jack. Just the lead that connects to the phone or whatever. That takes no real space.
I'd give up the space of a battery for a jack, yes
Nice, how make one with the earbuds attached to each other with a wire and I’ll buy it for sure!
The thing about wired earbuds and headphones is that they're already pretty sustainable. A good pair can last you decades, while wireless buds are usually throwaway products. So I think it's pretty cool that they're doing something about that for those that want wireless earbuds.
I think you misunderstood, I want wireless headphones that have the two earbuds connected via a wire so you know, one doesn’t just pop out if your ear and drop on the street.
Ah, indeed I did.
I think JBL and some other brands do carry such earbuds, but maybe it might not be thz kind of wire you'd fancy. There are also cheaper options that have a wire linking the two ear buds, but as I said those are usually cheap and might not be up to your standards.
I have a set of those from Jabra
Ugh? I used to burn through wired earbuds at a pace of maybe one pair per month. You basically have to sit and not move if you don't want to damage the wire IME
Some of the better ones have removable cables. You'll usually just yank them out or worst case if the cable is damaged you can easily replace it.
How much are you paying for your headphones? Nicer ones that don't break as easily are probably a cost effective option for you.
Why would you want that? I can't imagine to ever going back to non wireless buds
Wired still has some advantages. Mainly sound quality.
I like the infinite battery life wired headphones have.
Don't forget the little string so you can easily pop em out and let em dangle without losing them.
You may like Shokz. Their headsets are wireless and bone-conducting. The drivers get pressed to your temples with a flexible wire connecting them and you hear the sound conducting through your head instead of your ear canal. The only downside I've experienced with them is that they can only drown out so much noise, so if you're planning on using them in a noisy environment, probably go with another choice.
A friend of mine has a set of them at work and they work well in our noisy environment - machine shop.
The rule for earbuds is that you can only have one in so the bone conduction are gaining popularity at work.
I wish they fit in my motorcycle helmet. My earbuds fall out all the time when I take my helmet off.
I can use them everywhere. Except my whole subway ride...
Now I just wish that they would bring their phone to a US provider that is not T-Mobile. I can't buy their phone until it runs on a network that I can use.
Jesus your country is so messed up :(
wat? you cannot buy the phone and then choose the provider yourself?
Yeah most phones in the us are locked to a network. Some of them are unlocked to certain network vendors but won't work with others (for example if a phone works on Verizon its a near guarantee even if its an unlocked phone it won't work on any other networks)
It is a pretty simple thing to look up the bands that the phone supports. All of the providers publish the bands that they work on. This is not difficult. This is a manufactured problem.
It's true. Its not a coincidence the most hostile telecom (Verizon) is also the one that had a former CEO as chairman of the FCC during the Trump administration. It would be very easy for OEMs to introduce more multiband phones to the market but Verizon has some sweet licensing deals on their network brands.
It's mega gross!
Can you not buy the phone and then get whatever sim you want?
looks kinda cool. will probably get them
Awesome, but I'm skeptical. Not because it's Fairphone, but because previous bad experiences.
I bought Sony buds, after reading loads of reviews and those were the best! They cost me around 300 and what I got was just shit.
I (still) own a number of lg 800 Bluetooth headsets (those with a thing you wear around your neck) that cost me 50 bucks each, that have better audio quality, louder audio, better noise cancellation, are more comfortable, and after over 4 years still have a battery life of around 10 hours where those huge ass Sony ones cut out new after like 3-4 hours and they died after 1,5 years. I think those wearable bugs are just too small to be any good at all.
https://scarbir.com/ is my go-to for TWS reviews.
You can get decent TWS buds without paying tons of money. I currently have the Soundcore Space A40, and the battery still lasts for 6-7h after almost two years of constant use (8-10h brand new).
If you're paying over $100, you're probably overpaying.
They going to get all my business.
"I want my two dollars!"
If they launch a phone similar to zenphone 10. I'll def buy it.
ASUS removed the ability to unlock or root their most recent phones. Not letting users run what they want on the device they own is a hard pass from me.
Wtf! Omg fuck these companies
At least the 10 never had the ability. The 9’s ability was yanked in the middle of its lifecycle. I was 🤏 close to buying a 9 on the 10’s release for a discount & I am so glad I opened a second tab to check what the unlock process would be like before a purchase only remembering not long after release the was an OmniROM version. Additionally I was wise enough to see thru the bullshit department (PR) that the feature would “soon return after maintenance” after the unlock servers had already been down for a couple months. Unsurprisingly they were never brought back online & the unlock app was revoked from the downloads page for the device.
This would be a dream for me too
I've been looking for buds with replaceable batteries ever since my first pair degraded. Good to see FairPhone offering one that does it this time!
I have Samsung Bluetooth earbuds that I have had for a few years and they work great but I rarely use them. I rarely listen to music through headphones. If I were to buy a new pair I may consider that ones from Pine.
Bluetooth is okay. But, I wish they offer USB c dongle connection like JBL or Anker. I hate pairing