Does anyone else feel like fireworks are a complete waste of money and a ridiculous amount of unnecessary Pollution?
300 million lbs of fireworks and 2.7 billion dollars gone in a cloud of smoke.
300 million lbs of fireworks and 2.7 billion dollars gone in a cloud of smoke.
Yup, that could also be said about music, cinema and any other form of art/entertainment/distraction. It doesn't produce anything "useful", but again, what is "useful" varies from one person to another. Some would say the waste of money is the point. You blow fireworks because you can.
Ultimately nothing matters because there is no true meaning of life, so anything that pulls you away from the dark nothingness of existence is good to take.
I can't think of other art forms that blow off the hands of so many people, wake up my daughter in terror at 11PM, and make both dogs and veterans suffer for an extended period of time. I'm fine with the large group spectacle that is planned and controlled. What I can't stand is the widespread uncontrollable nonsense of just anyone buying them and setting them off at any hour on the 4th. Law enforcement can do absolutely nothing about it. I'm just gonna have to deal with it. I'm just surprised we haven't collectively shifted to something less harmful.
Not just dogs or other pets, but also farm and wild animals. And it may not only lead to suffering, but also lead to their deaths.
A local icecream place that also had goats and ducks was fucking setting them off right over the goat pen. They were sprinting from shelter to shelter inbetween explosions.
I don’t plan on going back there now. It’s a shame because it’s one of the better shops nearby.
That's what I'm saying. One day we'll look back in amazement that we let the public buy fireworks willy-nilly. Even the "it was good enough for me!" crowd of angry old-timers will have to go "Well, yeah, people blowed they hands off. And it bothered my vet'ren son and the neighbor's dogs somethin fierce. They're alright. It's prolly fer the best."
Now, I fully admit later today I will be running around in a country field with my friends shooting bottle rockets at each other. But we won't be bothering SOMEONE ELSE, and that's my thing.
Except fireworks has literally been a part of civilization for 1,000 plus years, so I don’t see that changing anytime soon.
One day we’ll look back in amazement that we let people have sex willy nilly and bond with whomever they like on a whim, forming friendships and families without central oversight.
But that doesn’t mean that future we’ll be looking back from in amazement won’t be a dystopian nightmare, or that our perspective won’t be warped by even more decades of infantilization.
As someone who generally is in favor of regulating dangerous things, fireworks are fine as-is. They're basically limited to one night a year, the damage is not very extreme, and the people getting hurt are by and large the people choosing to endanger themselves.
Do you understand why this is our way of celebrating Independence Day? Fireworks are a loud, visible, symbol and example of freedom from authority.
You mean freedom from british authority, we still have authority.
We also have the freedom to self govern. Laws are on the books to prevent firework usage in my state, it is simply ignored one night a year because it turns out mass lawbreaking is hard to handle. I don't have the right to conduct a parade in the middle of whichever street I want whenever I want. I participate in the social contract of sacrificing absolute freedom for mutual gain because I live in a country and am not a sovereign citizen claiming complete supremacy over all others. My taxes pay for a small and well moderated fireworks show at a designated location conducted by a local government for which I had a hand in voting for. My freedom is louder, collective, voted for, and more sensible. Not all freedom must be focused soley on the individual.
Yeah but none of them are anywhere near as ephemeral as a firework display.
That doesn't make them more/less worth it.
If your criteria for worthiness is persistence then is a nice looking meal as worth it as equally nutritious goop ?
Something like a sunset, a blizzard, or a thunderstorm are the more closely comparable natural equivalent. They're special because they're short-lived or rare.
A theater performance is equally ephemeral. Or a concert. Or meeting your favorite celebrity. Or a good meal.
It's a nihilist, Donny!
There's nothing to be afraid of.
Eh. Half of that 2.7 billion being put into research into a disease like Myalgic Enceph. (ME) could probably significantly improve the quality of life of 80 million people who have one of the worlds most disabling diseases.
Fireworks are a cool spectacle, imagine never seeing a fireworks show. Also the money isnt gone, its just changed hands.
They probably shouldnt be how they are now though, where every individual family wants to fire their own, thats a waste and really obnoxious when its in the middle of neighborhoods. Keep it to one centralized show, away from residential areas, and everyone gets to watch a bigger show.
3/4 of the fun is doing it yourself.
For you. Its obnoxious for others.
Technically it's 2.999.../4 of the fun
So technically 3 again?
I think I will fight that math forever. Getting infinitely closer does not count as actually getting there.
As a veteran with PTSD, I agree
I have a dog who would agree. If he could speak English (he's from Mexico).
https://youtu.be/rLIXd9bzxGE?feature=shared
That's fucking hilarious. What is that from?
I'm old.
Anchorman
Ohhh. Well shit now I might watch that.
My girl only speaks limited English. She is currently in a panic attack and we're about 8 miles away from the fireworks. She agrees.
The long and the short of it is that we live in a society of different people who enjoy different things. Nearly everything is a trade off of some sort. Some people value the enjoyment they get from fireworks more than others. Some hate it. That is true of litterally everything. I strongly dislike the keeping of pets on anything smaller than a farm. But I don't tell people they shouldn't have pets. Being part of a society means living with a mix of things you like and don't. And the society determines what is so commonly disliked that it should be not allowed by the law. Now many will say the fireworks are illegal in a lot of places. Yes so is speeding. Our system has three parts, the laws, the enforcement, and the penalties. Enforcement of fireworks laws are often pretty lax, same with speeding. And the penalties are almost always purely monetary. So society has said it doesn't really care that much about fireworks. And the large number of people who use them and who show up to fireworks shows backs that up.
Can't you say the same about virtually any form of entertainment? The electricity that runs the server you used to post this doesn't come from nowhere.
I don't think this is a fair comparison. Fireworks launch a lot of nanoparticles, metals, and other harmful chemicals in the sky and directly worsen air quality while many Lemmy servers (
lemmy.worldincluded) use renewable energy.I think a fairer comparison in entertainment would be sport. On paper it doesn't produce anything to better humanity, there's a ridiculous amount of fuel used by teams and fans to travel especially when it comes to something like a World Cup because it's on a global scale.
In reality, the world absolutely needs it because that's what people use to entertain themselves. People can't be mindless drones fucking about; they won't just read books all the time or go camping every day. There's something primal that just comes out when it comes to sport and most people can't live without it.
The materials to make the servers don't come from nowhere. And the processes to get those materials are often very polluting.
Bruh we dont have to blow up servers everytime we post and all the materials they are made of are valuable recyclable.
You would be surprised how often parts need to be replaced in a data center. There is a lot more than severs in there to make all this happen. Then you need the device to read it on, and the infrastructure to get the bits to you... a lot of plastic in all that which won't break down for a very line time too.
That's a good point
It’s a totally valid point. Both waste your time and money to distract for a brief moment. You can use all the renewables you want but in the end the consumer is the product and the product needs you to keep consuming it to justify its existence. We need pyrotechnics to excercise ghost as much as we need another season of that marveldisneyfox show to survive. Or the steam summersale to make us think we are saving money by buying more games. Unsub, unfollow, smash the bellbutton and block shit more often.
Waste of money? No more so than any other form of entertainment that is temporary.
Environmentally, yeah…they’re pretty bad. Air pollution is a big issue. Some birds get killed when they run into things because they can’t see very well after being scared off by the fireworks. Any large human event is environmentally bad, like a sporting event.
We generate literal tons of plastic and other human waste when we gather for mass entertainment.
Okay so we generate literal tons of waste. There are also literally hundreds of millions of us, so “tons of waste” would happen if we gathered to eat brownies distributed on napkins.
Well that makes it all right then, doesn’t it?
Yeah but at the end of the day we're handing out explosives for people to play with, even kids. Just feels like it's not the best form of celebration.
Yes. Injury and fires are compounding factors, no denying that.
We already know sterile environments make people allergic.
I am actually concerned about what kind of behavioral “allergies” will arise from a society with no danger. It is not a natural state and it is not something we should be experimenting with lightly.
We already know what happens.
Anti-vax
Pro-war
Pro-authoritarianism
Anti-education
Etc.
Once you’ve divorced yourself completely from the dangers of watching family and people around you die from preventable diseases all the time, the horrors of actually having to live through your city destroyed and people you know be devastated by war, the crushing oppression and greed of authoritarian regimes, your education controlled specifically to prevent you from you getting any ideas about real freedoms, that’s what you get when you remove real danger from society.
But I think you probably meant something more mundane like kids will start making graffiti or something.
Well, I meant more like the dangers of nature.
Having your whole city get destroyed is an unnatural thing that comes with advanced civilization and armies. I’m totally fine with eliminating that kind of “danger” from the world.
But the danger of riding a motorcycle, or lighting firecrackers, climbing a tree, fighting a beaver, whatever, those are dangers on the level that we evolved to deal with.
Just like in the analogy with sterility, I’m fine with making environments free of bio weapons and meat industry goop full of mega bacteria and the kinds of biological threats that civilization itself creates. But getting rid of the base load of strange micro critters, that yes do pose some danger of sickness and even death, turns out to be taking it too far because it makes people more likely to have allergies and autoimmune problems.
Explosives are actually predictable. Way more predictable than people or animals, for instance. A person can protect themselves when handling explosives by being careful.
But these are just my theories about what the mechanism might be. At the higher level, by analogy it’s just there’s a system we have, that has evolved to protect us, but it’s evolved to learn from encounters with the thing it’s designed to protect us from. If you give ir no encounters, it goes haywire.
I don’t know what the mechanism might be exactly, but I worry our ability to navigate danger might itself be a system that can go haywire.
Ok, I follow. I think we’re already there. Plenty of people are doing stupid things that are dangerous, either out of ignorance, lack of forethought, or nowadays for clout on social media. Pretty sure people have been doing dumb things for a long time, but they were more lethal in the past.
Where’s your science in this?
No allergist or dermatologist I ever met would ever make that claim.
The results are from patient to patient. There’s a whole subset of sensitivities to chemical makeup of the food and another set of sensitivities to the environment the food was grown in. Food and products have dramatically changed and this also creates a lot of reactions. Mass production of food introduced a lot of irritants which we notice now. Then you have a subset of sensitivities that are entirely based on changes in the body with hormone. And then there’s family history.
There isn’t a standard answer with allergies.
A local, professional display uses about 80lb of gunpowder (NEQ). When combusted this will produce about 40lb of CO2. To put this in context, most new internal combustion engines will produce about 190gm of CO2 per mile.
Therefore a single car would need to travel 88 miles to emit the equivalent amount of CO2 of your typical fireworks display. If you consider the a round trip distance for the entire audience to watch a single fireworks display, gunpowder is a fraction of the CO2 footprint.
The problem is pollution, not GHG emissions. Particles, NOx, Plastic debris...
On top of that your local fauna is not at all prepared for the nosie and light pollution.
Again, probably more particles, NOx, Plastic debris etc. from the audience.
Any football game with a flyover is multiple times more polluting.
This guy maths
Fireworks are a celebration of peace. They’re made from the same ingredients as bullets but they make something beautiful instead of death. I’ve always found this a profoundly meaningful thing.
Unless you count birds that abandon their nests, and other animals that flee their homes. Or the heavy metals and other chemicals that are added to the environment. Or the significant increases in particulate matter in the air.
https://earth.org/environmental-impact-of-fireworks/
We can come up with that laundry list of environmental impacts for a lot of things. Should we start with the electronic device you used to type your comment?
If you’re thinking to argue that your phone is essential while fireworks are mere entertainment, all I can say to you is “bread and roses.”
Are you saying "Whatabout..."?
"they make something beautiful instead of death" Agreed, but your neighbor's kid's fingers might not agree after that M-80
I swear I didn't give that kid the M80.
I don’t believe fireworks should be retailed to the public in any form. They’re a very different story from an aeriel display put on by professionals.
Fireworks are like. 000000000000001% of a concern for GHG.
You shut down a coal plant for 1 days because you switched to solar temporarily and you probably offset the output.
The impact on nature goes beyond climate gases. At least here in Germany fireworks produce 1% of the yearly pm10 particulates. That's not nothing.
It's not nothing, but 1% goes to show just how much is no5 made by the giant 1 day full of sky explosions, and how likely 70-80% is from transport and energy sector.
Eliminating all fireworks from earth and banning them tomorrow would have a near 0 impact on anything, and be completely erased if a coal plant runs an extra day or two.
Assuming there would be a single source responsible for the remaining 99% of yearly pm10 particulates, let's say a giant coal power plant, then it would take 4 days of it running to have the same impact as fireworks.
Heya, saw this and thought of our conversation.
https://www.hindustantimes.com/cities/delhi-news/delhi-govt-bans-production-sale-use-of-all-firecrackers-till-jan-1-2025-101725904887318.html
Good catch. And yea, at a local level this Wilhelm not exacerbate things.
Banning firecrackers to not make the problem worse makes sense, given how absolutely bad it will be due to the slash and burn farming practices. But the firecrackers alone (while not good for the atmosphere) aren't like a global warming factor. But for your on-the-ground air quality doesn't help at all.
https://londonair.org.uk/LondonAir/Guide/Fireworks.aspx
Inner-city long-term effects, right there.
Love them. There are tons on unnecessary things we do.
Exactly. Movies, the Internet, traveling.
As a life form, the 4 key aspects of life are:
1). Eat 2). Sleep 3). Defecate 4). Reproduce
Literally everything else you do is irrelevant or secondary to the core mission of life.
It's only a waste if you don't enjoy it. Just like some people think painting a bunch of nonsensical images is a waste of time and money but you might thoroughly enjoy it
I wouldn't say it's ridiculous if it's once a year. If we did it every night...yeah. But people spend more money on a lot dumber stuff, like expensive purses and giant luxury trucks.
Around here (MidWest city), fireworks go off every night for a month before, and then a month after the fourth. And I don't mean a small amount, either. More like some version of the Vietnam War. It's nuts.
Basically, most of summer is devoted to fireworks play, with the fourth being a deluxe version of the "fun."
Yeah, the places that do it every night like Disneyland should get in some real trouble for it.
I think they're amazing. The chemistry of colored flame has fascinated me since I was young, and there's nothing quite like being close to explosions. If I had more time and lived in the US I'd be a hobby pyrotechnician.
I hate fireworks and always have. I get people like them, but I wish they didn't go all night from every direction. If each area had a central park/spot where they did a big firework show for everyone for a little bit I wouldn't mind it as much, but now every street has they're own fireworks that go off randomly through the night.
Also something I don't think a lot of people think about. In my old neighborhood a lot of us had varying forms on PTSD and couldn't deal with the loud bangs. Holidays where fireworks were heavy were treated as a ceasefire/peace day for the most part since basically everyone who had been involved in a shooting was a mess, which was almost everyone. Others took the chance to disrespect that and use the fireworks as cover, they weren't treated well.
I'm sure most veterans feel the same or worse.
It's not just dogs who lose it at fireworks.
I'll disagree on the "most veterans" part. The people who I know who fire off the most and biggest fireworks are vets. They seem to be more comfortable around explosives, or just more used to it. I don't know which.
Of course they are a waste of money, and the plastic packaging is incredibly bad for the environment. And they are fun and I will buy them again next year.
I like them. The big shows are a rare form of artistic expression. And even the stuff you can buy, is a form of fun you cannot get anywhere else.
Drone shows are boring. You can watch them on a screen and lose none of the experience. I mean, the first time you see it it's interesting, but then you remember it's just a bunch of drones, and your going to be stuck in traffic just so you can see a pixilated coke can or something. There's nothing unique or special about the experience I feel. Unlike fireworks, while they can look fine on a screen (if recorded properly) but you can see the difference on someone's face when you're there. You see it, feel it, and smell it. It makes sense why humans have been doing this for hundreds of years.
Try thousand(s) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fireworks
I think they're fun
I am not worried about their environmental impact, but I hate seeing my dog spending the evening shaking because of the explosions. Even sedatives aren't enough. If you could have fireworks without the big booms, I wouldn't care, but the big booms scare the shit out of a lot of animals.
My dog couldn’t use the bathroom or drink water. Had a healthy appetite though lol. I felt so bad for him because I should have went outside earlier in the day. This year my neighborhood went all out. I also feel bad for vets.
Mine did a little better this year because instead of trying a prescribed sedative, the vet suggested we try catnip because (I never knew this before) it has a calming and sedating effect on dogs and it's safe for them. We tested it first because apparently it doesn't work on all dogs, but at least that time only the big fireworks scared her and she was able to be okay through the little ones. But she was still shaking and panting a lot. I was just glad she was able to go to sleep after the big ones ended.
I'm not a vet, so don't just take my word for this obviously, but I thought I'd put that out there in case anyone wanted to ask their vet about it. I did some research after they recommended it and (I have a good vet, but you never know) it seems like there's no health issue if you use it in moderation.
Edit: Our dog is 60 pounds and the vet suggested a half a teaspoon sprinkled in her food.
Mine and my family's literally just vibed with everyone. They might have been dog tired from running around with everybody, but I've never seem a freaked out reaction from a dog that isn't a little ankle-biter.
My dog is 60 pounds. So that's pretty big for a little ankle-biter.
I love animals. So I would agree with you. I do enjoy watching fireworks but it's not worth the suffering of innocence creatures.
What are your hobbies, OP?
Fire, explosions and bang sounds are fun. It gets old quick (I'm not a fan of firework shows), but I do enjoy lighting a small bunch of fireworks with some friends once a year or two.
Edit: I hear the argument for poor puppers, and I'm not saying I don't care about them, but I'm pointing out the argument that they're not just a complete waste of money/pollution
I'm the opposite, I think a proper show with professional fireworks is super fun but clowns setting off tiny loud POS fireworks randomly over the course of several hours are just annoying. They don't have the boom boom, they don't make much light, and people just set them off in residential areas near kids/dogs.
It hurts so many animals too.
Fireworks are a funny one because you're completely right and also not completely right I think. It's one of those unresolvable dichotomies of life where two opposing ideas are both true at the same time. I've often thought fireworks were the most obvious way to set fire to a lot of money that could be better used somewhere else. However, what is also true is that humans have a deep need to celebrate and to come together in large groups and have shared experiences. Fireworks are perfect for that. You can put a million people together and launch a massive firework display and they will all immediately connect with each other through the shared experience of going "Oooooohh" and "Aaaaaaahh" :) Fireworks are awesome and also, personally I feel they remind me that there are bigger things out there than the daily grind of existence.
Isn't that what parades are for?
There are other ways to get that. The universe is huge, look up on a quiet night with little light pollution.
Kinda. Parades are also for showing off nuclear warheads and how precisely your soldiers can march.
Fireworks are a more non centralized version of it. Everyone can participate in the fireworks, not just stand there and watch.
Also they burst in air, giving them better visibility than something that just flows down the street in front of you.
Don't we just stand there when we watch fireworks too 🤣
"Your existential fulfillment is wrong, do it my way instead."
But parades are boring
People need novelty in life, if it's there every day it's not special.
That's fair, I just think there are ways to get that besides blowing things up once a year, especially given that fireworks produce a lot of unnecessary waste and pollution in the environment.
I mean, I think it's good that people get to safely experience explosions, something most people probably wouldn't experience in their lives otherwise.
I wouldn't say it's necessarily safe, ERs are full of people who almost blew off their hand or other appendages around 4th of July.
Fair enough, but why does every single person need their own firework? That connection is conpletely lost then
I obviously can't speak for everyone, but whenever we do fireworks on the 4th or New Year's, it's with a group of a solid 15-30 people. I don't think we'd ever set off fireworks by ourselves
Yup, we have a solid 30 people put together a show. It catches on fire every year and it is awesome!
Every single person needs the opportunity to get their own firework and contribute. We’ve never had a rule like “everyone needs their own firework”.
Everyone needs the option. That is important. It’s not important that everyone takes it, but it’s important everyone is given the option.
I just don't get it. It terrifies people's pets, and the wildlife outside, it's incredibly noisy (meaning you can't get away from it if you live near someone doing it), and it produces tons of waste and pollution. Can't we just have a big BBQ like we do the rest of the year when we celebrate stuff?
... you know that's not how money works right?
Yes they are. Somebody extracted the ressources. Somebody processed them into materials. Now someone put them together into the pyrotechniques and finally someone set it off.
All of this labor and capital usage went into creating a short display of pretty lights and bangs, of which afterwards nothing but smoke and memories remain. This is the purest consumption in the economic sense.
Compare that with people using that labor to produce cars instead. Those cars take years before needing renewal and they can be used productively, so they are investments in the economic sense.
Finally lets take clothes, while also consumption they address an immediate human need and are reuseable for some time, so while they are also consumption they are quite different form fireworks.
Do food next and don't skimp on the poo talk
Food is also consumption. But without food people die, so this consumption directly contributes to keeping the value of the economy up by keeping the workforce alive.
As for the poo safely removing it in WWTPs also costs more money than what can be recovered in energy or hopefully phosphate in the near future. Also the capital investments are significant and as they age and need replacement this value is also gone.
However the alternative is people dying of Cholera and other shitty diseases en masse, so both the investments as well as the expenditures are well spent.
Just so we're clear for anybody else reading since they chose to ignore the easy refutation lol.
That the money is still present in the economy and provides jobs to hundreds of thousands of people in the supply chain both through sales, materials production, assembly, and labor, entertainment, and local economy boons from festivals.
I also wouldn't mind the 💩 talk lol.
in this part of the world, we are blessed with stray dogs who are also protected by our supreme court. it's quite literally against the law, for example, to prohibit the feeding of strays by animal lovers.
i once saw one of them shudder and whine at the sound of fireworks. its tail scrunched under and it pissed itself in fear and confusion. its plaintive moans were drowned out by the incessant blasts of the "mala" crackers (a literal garland of 10,000 or so crackers strung out in sequence that goes on bursting for an hour or so). the poor thing just did not know what was happening and it became a shivering ball of anxiety until the blasts stopped.
anyone who sees an innocent animal suffer like that will never, ever, want to light a firecracker again.
I hate fourth of july because of this. Fuck your declaration of independence, i piss on it. My dog hid under the bed. I fed her some chicken hearts to calm her down, and received many belly rubs.
I'm ok with professional firework shows.
I'm not ok for every kid in the neighborhood having access to little explosives.
A good compromise. When 20000 people have a great time watching a scheduled event that seems fair. Peeps can make preparations to participate or avoid.
Backyard rocketry is imo something to be celebrated, a bit less if it's just buying premade fireworks, but kids learning chemistry and engineering in an exciting way isn't bad- it also helps with developing a sense of responsibility when you will probably mess up and hurt yourself
i think fireworks are nice but they're to a large degree something from a different age and at this point we should only really be using smaller volcano-style ones, and like holy shit we have drone technology, why aren't drone displays standard in any vaguely populated area?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lnBmYAiduo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyEWcfn7rT0
look at this shit, it's so cool! can we please push for this to be the standard?
Good news then!
NPR: Why drone light shows are replacing traditional July 4th fireworks
What makes them “something from a different age”?
I definitely think they can and are often overdone. Where I'm from civilian fireworks use is very uncommon unless you're out in the sticks. So we get at most 2 municipal fireworks display per year, New year's eve and Canada day. New year's eve fireworks happen some years and don't others.
I personally love fireworks. The awe of the display is never lost upon me. I can see it becoming old if it's something you deal with all the time. That isn't an issue here though and I always step outside to watch them when a display is done locally.
I mean, yes and no. The festivals I visit and my gaming PC are also a complete waste of energy when you view it like that. I hate the dangerous situations we have every year in the Netherlands with fireworks. The heavy fireworks and loud bangs, the vandalism. But I'm okay with the people who send a lot of nice colourful fireworks into the sky around new year's eve, and the farmers with their loud "carbid" launchers.
It's like asking a texan to get rid of their monster truck. Sure they live with their parents and never use the truck for work. But it's just not gonna happen buddy.
I live in a city that has criminalized all fireworks, including pop-its. We're talking arrest and jail time are on the table just for transporting them in your car through city limits (I'm sure this violates the Commerce Clause).
However, drugs are legal. I love their priorities.
Oh, and cutting down or trimming trees on your property is illegal without a permit. My neighbor was hit by a $10,000 fine because the street tree died and they didn't pull a permit for it.
Talk about taking it to an extreme. It's almost like the whole city is managed by an HOA.
My city had a drone show this year and it kinda sucked. I probably won't go again
They also scare the crap out of my dog, and cause a lot of accidents. Though, they can be beautiful...
I absolutely hate them. Birds die because of them, and they terrify my dog.
They also keep people awake and can trigger PTSD in combat veterans.
Personally I hate them and I think they are more harm than good.
Let's do some clarification: I can appreciate the high in the sky fireworks, while I simply hate those you fire by hand in between the legs of other bystanders.
Overall I think they are dangerous and should not be freely sold, while keep doing the big ones in the sky.
But, honestly, a form of art that harms so many people and animals maybe should be banned after all.
The danger is the fun part though. Big shows are boring because there’s no risk to you, and only the guys you can’t see.
Launching bottle rockets by hand, or shooting your friends with Roman candles is the best.
This year we leveled up our game and launched them from the drone.
no i think they are beautiful
For pollution, at least CO2, 300M lb is 136k metric tons. I didn't know the water to CO2 ratio for solid rocket motors, but I'd guess maybe half is CO2. Cars produce 1.5B tons of CO2 per year in the US, so the CO2 would be about equivalent to about 24 min of driving cars. That doesn't seem too unreasonable.
But maybe you were taking about the metals? I don't know how much of an issue those are.
Unfortunately this isn't complete combustion. There's a shit ton of PM and everything else. Ever go to a big show? They have to take pauses for the smoke to clear so that you can see the next batch.
The metals are a big thing. Breathing heavy metals is bad for people and animals.
The particulate matter, specifically heavy metals, go through the roof.
There's also a bunch of paperwork involved in removing those measurements from the pollution data sets with a rule that gives a pass for fireworks.
Personally I think it's important to understand Co2 emissions aren't the only factors in the pollution of air quality. Like you mentioned, heavy metals are a big factor in climate (for example how private jets still use leaded fuel).
Sorry, completely off-topic, but your name keeps reminding me of rock-a-doodle. I know his name is completely different, but it has the same flow and a really similar sound. Chanticleer. Prounounced Chant Eclair, a french pun for "sing loud and clear".
So many injuries and fires every year, aside from all the noise and pollution. My friend’s house (old farm) burned down because a firework landed on the roof :(
The art of it has use. However I think drone shows would be an interesting replacement.
Are drones really less pollution than fireworks?
They’re not a replacement for fireworks.
Parent comment claims it would, so my questions refers to that.
Objectively yes.
I'm no expert, but this article covered what I expected: https://en.reset.org/drone-light-shows-could-provide-a-green-alternative-to-dangerous-and-polluting-traditional-fireworks/
Drones wouldn't scare the shit out of local wildlife and people's pets at the very least.
I was surprised and heartbroken to discover my neighborhood did that last night. It's not as good at all. Now I know to check, and go someplace with real fireworks.
No, fireworks are cool and fun and people enjoy them.
Fireworks are art. Art isn't inherently wasteful.
Does anyone else feel like adding salt to food is a complete waste of money?
Yes but we're talking about fireworks now. Have you tried adding fireworks to your food? Could be a huge win.
Doesn't salt act as a preservative for food? There are only a couple things I'll add salt to. Now if we just started eating fresh food and less processed food no doubt we'd be better off. Hell we'd probably offset carbon emissions by eating locally sourced food and not having it delivered to us more than we would by banning fireworks
They also cause fires, severely injure and kill people, trigger people with PTSD, frighten animals and disrupt local wildlife.
As someone who grew up in a country where fireworks are legal and used on every festivity, they suck if you are a baby, a dog or not the one lighting the up.
Bread and circus, boys, bread and circus.
If it weren't for fireworks, we wouldn't have funny stories about dumb people shoving them in their ass cracks, setting them on fire and cauterizing their buttocks.
Yes, I wholeheartedly think this
I'm not totally against fireworks. As others have mentioned, sometimes we do need to just have some fun and not worry about the consequences. But they should be done far from residential area, so that unwilling people (e.g. vets, children, or pets) aren't disturbed. (Honestly though, I wish we didn't have any vets with PTSD, that's the worse problem. As long as we still have wars, I'd say let the people have some fun.)
hey! this person hates freedom! /s
Yes.
A community of ultra redditors must of course be the fun police :(
I love how much the term "Redditor" became an insult. Before it was like "Hah, I use Reddit instead of Facebook!", now it's "Hah, you can't think for yourself and stuck in an abusive relationship"
But.. muh freedum
Nah friend, I spend time, bandwidth, electricity, etc., talking to strangers and morons on the internet, fireworks give me much more bang for my buck.
They seem very backwards when there are drone displays and other forms of entertainment. Humans cling on to things way too long.
I think a big part of it is that they're dangerous. It's fun to experience just a tinge of fear from how big they sound, or even just from being near the little street versions. It's a (relatively) safe way for us to experience something that would otherwise be terror inducing explosives.
And you’re in your 60s or something, wise with age and experience? You’ve at least got half a century under your belt I hope, to criticize the concept of traditions generally?
In many fireworks displays such as the London new year ones there are drone displays incorporated.
I think people should get to do them! I don’t enjoy them, but whatever. If we could make louder noises, flashes and colors with environmentally friendly fireworks, that’d be awesome. I think the noise, flash and color of fireworks is what other people enjoy, but we all suffer the poor air quality afterwards. So I just want something that will make other people get what they want out of fireworks while not damaging the air quality
Several other people feel this way and you're all wrong. Is good food wasted because after you eat it it's gone? Are vacations stupid because once it's over nothing has materially changed? No? So why are fireworks pointless simply because they're temporary?
The major difference between fireworks and those other examples, is that fireworks directly affect others around you. In my city, people go out and buy the big fireworks that are illegal here because they go into the sky and make lots of sparks and they shoot them off in the city. Fireworks majorly affect all the animals in a pretty wide radius. Which is why I hate them, because the people have no respect for how much they are traumatizing the animals or how much they are affecting their neighbors. And don't forget they are a fire hazard.
This becomes more of an argument about peoples' irresponsible use of fireworks rather just the use of fireworks at this point.
To be fair, my dog is equally scared of thunder and the jets from a nearby Airforce base. But I agree they're a pretty unnecessary addition.
Backyard fireworks, yes. Professionally done fireworks at a planned place and time, no.
Professionally done fireworks are usually pretty amazing and fun to watch. They usually happen right around 9pm and last 15-30 minutes.
Backyard fireworks in dense neighborhoods are pretty fucking lame. One mortar every 30 seconds is not the spectacle you think it is. And it typically goes on for hours in my neighborhood. It terrifies dogs and is completely unpredictable. Maybe if everyone agreed to light everything they had between 9 and 9:30 it would be more impressive and less annoying, but that’ll never happen because “muh freedom” or something lol
Asceticism is a dead end.
Fireworks are a complete waste of other people’s money. Besides the regular fireworks show (taxes), I like watching people’s money go up in smoke. It’s fun!
They're worth it when it's a sanctioned display, and they've spent enough money to make it worthwhile.
I'll never understand why people set them off in their own garden. Fireworks aren't cheap, and unless you spend some proper money you're basically just setting off fireworks for a dick-swinging contest with your neighbourhood.
Honestly I just don't care about them anymore, they are all basically visually the same, once I've seen one professional fireworks show it starts to feel like I've seen them all. It's loud as fuck too, it hurts my ears more than it used to, I just stayed in yesterday.
Same goes for all american flags.
Yep
I don't like the loud noises, the smoke, or the debris leftover.
Maybe 200 years ago they were impressive. All the color and whatnot up in the sky. But we live in a modern age. We have things way more entertaining than colorful explosions that don't have such immediate drawbacks.
It's also supremely annoying and like a microcosm of everything wrong with humanity that some folks will be like "I don't like them for a set of valid reasons" and a bunch of people will be like "but I like them so I don't see the problem and won't stop"
Drone displays are increasingly popular.
He's one: https://youtube.com/watch?v=LLhkrj1HDNo
The average number of drones for a Sky Elements performance is 300 typically costing $45,000 all included. Though costs have been dropping, they're still usually higher than for a large fireworks production, which averages about $1,000 a minute and usually lasts about 20 minutes.
Those are really boring. It’s the same experience wether watching on TV or in person.
They need drones that shoot fireworks!
Hell yeah! Wait, I think we have those. They are just really big and use really big fireworks.
here and there are fine, I think sometimes they have their place but I'm really not a fan. the noise bothers me and I hate that people shoot them off to celebrate the same veterans that suffer ptsd during firework shows. I hope some communities start to move to drone shows in the future. https://youtu.be/pZ-zJ0Vq0FU Much quieter and leaves way more room to switch it up year to year.
It's not really pollution since the materials at the end are trace minerals necessary for biological processes. But the fire hazard is going to get them banned some day soon. Maybe they should move the 4th of July to February or March. You know, one of those wet months.
search perchlorate and fireworks, and you immediately get to know which country I'm from.
That is just wrong. Even if it were all just relly cool stuff everything needs to be alive. You still should not breath it.
Yes, they should be replaced by drones or LED light shows
Yeah, it's a silly tradition. But old habits die hard and traditions like this die even harder.
Yes. They only exist for brainless people who think blowing useless things up, annoying neighbors, scaring pets, and waking sleeping babies is fun.
I love organized fireworks.
You truly are a redditor
I agree and have felt this way for a long time, and is why I have not taken part in firework displays nor been interested in them for years.
It just seems like an excuse to pollute the air on a massive scale, beyond other issues. I would much rather see drone shows today than fireworks.
I dislike when they're used to excess
I agree for a multitude of reasons but I much prefer the drone shows. They look much cooler.
Careful, soon there will be Russians having their PTSD triggered by the sound of a drone.
Just the noise here. Dont see any pretty sky lights
but the volcanoes do more damg tho
No
No.
And noise pollution
Bring back the drones! They were way cooler.
Not sure if art good or just lights up
Hey, most of us drive about in small, fuel-efficient cars the whole year
Ban our fireworks once you ban your millions of tiny-penis trucks!