Vivaldi is a proprietary rebranding of Chromium. Can't say I'd recommend it over (or in addition to) Firefox.
We need less forks of Chromium. Any one company (Google in this case) having total control over browser engines is dangerous, and is a big reason why the whole Apple/Safari/Webkit situation is such a big deal to begin with.
Remember kids, if it's Chromium based, it's still part of the problem. The Chromium project only exists to provide the illusion of choice. Don't let Google have the power to dictate web standards at will.
The worrisome thing is that there's no alternative other than Firefox, or Safari on Apple platforms. Every single other browser is Chromium.
We must defend Firefox at all costs, it's the last glimmer of freedom.
Every single other browser is Chromium.
One exception I'm aware of: GNOME Web (aka epiphany-browser) uses WebKitGTK, which is based on Apple's WebKit rather than Google's Chromium/Blink. But it's Linux desktops first and foremost. Not on mobile platforms, not exactly intended for Windows (might be usable with Cygwin/WSL) or macOS (seems to be on MacPorts) either, and even on non-GNOME desktops like KDE it might seem a bit out of place.
I daily drive Firefox but Epiphany is my first choice fallback on the rare occasion I encounter a site that's broken on Firefox.
True but if you use Vivaldi and then you try to go back to Firefox, it's like going back in the early 2000s. I always say this, Firefox should have been like Vivaldi. Super customizable and packed with features. Instead you have to rely on extensions and thus put your trust in the creator of said extension that they will not sell it. Heck even with extensions, trying to mimic the new tab page from Vivaldi is a masterclass in patience.
Firefox +50% in Germany, +30% in France
Vivaldi is my go to browser. Brave does a better job with blocking ads. I'm switching to Brave whenever I need to stream something on a site loaded with ads, or when YouTube manages to detect my Adblock for a few days.
Not like uBlock Origin is a thing?
Can it really get better than that and consent-o-matic?
I am using uBlock Origin on my Vivaldi. It doesn't block everything.
"This Other Browser is just as good as Brave*!"
*if you install x, y, and z and uninstall a and b
You are comparing a tool to a tool-belt in terms of capabilities.
You think Firefox is the only browser that can use extensions and add-ons? Brave just doesn't need them for adblock because it's built in. But, like all chromium browsers, you can use loads of extensions for loads of use cases. Anything that works on Chrome works on Brave.
It's maybe a few clicks to find the add-ons store in Firefox then searching "uBlock Origin". Hell, when I switched to Firefox last year, I want to say there was even an onboarding that pointed me to the extension upon setup.
So, back to my original point.
I don't like that you can't use the Dark Reader extension on mobile in Vivaldi. I like all of my websites to be dark.
I guess it does have a built in dark mode
Still better than Edge or Chrome
as someone said, its randomised, and I'm sure that other browsers also saw more downloads
Vivaldi is extremely slow on IOS and 2gb+ big. Firefox has no extensions so no Adblock. Generally there are few privacy friendly/Foss browsers on IOS.
Firefox has no extensions so no Adblock.
That's because so far every browser on iOS had to use WebKit as it's HTML rendering engine, meaning that even if you installed another browser manually you were basically still using Safari under the hood. IIRC the new DMA rules include allowing other browser engines like Gecko, so Mozilla is probably already working on making addons available. I mean they are available on Android, so why wouldn't they make them available on iOS now that they finally can?
I wouldn’t be sure because of how stupid Apples compliance is. But if they do I would definitely switch. I guess it’s just going to be Firefox focus until then.
Generally there are few privacy friendly/Foss browsers on IOS.
Um, Safari is so privacy friendly that Google regularly asks me if I'm human. For example it has "private relay" which is similar to TOR* so trackers don't even know your IP address — combine that with blocking third party cookies (and even some first party cookies) by default and providing false data to fight fingerprinting even if you don't block trackers entirely - and blocking them entirely is as simple as installing an extension. Private Relay also adds a layer of encryption on top of DNS queries and otherwise unencrypted http traffic.... so your ISP/Cellular provider/Work/School/abusive husband/etc can't track you
99.99% of the Safari's code is FOSS — dual licensed under LGPL and BSD.
It's not the browser I use - pretty lacking in the feature department, but it's definitely more pro-privacy than Brave or FireFox. I've never had to jump through a captcha to use Google in those browsers.
(* if anything, it's better than TOR... with that service there's a risk your entry/exit nodes are tracking you. With Private Relay it's always one of Apple's servers for the entry node and a reputable cloud company like Akamai for the exit node. Both would have to be compromised in order to identify you... maybe a nation state can do that, but a big data tracking company definitely can't)
Private relay is more like a VPN than tor.
I mean they did say few. Generally speaking, every browser is basically safari (WebKit) on iOS and apple doesn’t allow support for 3rd party browser extensions (least natively, Orion supports this somehow). So you’re already limited in that regard. If you don’t use safari , a browser like FF + VPN is IMO a better experience. You also have the option of just using wireguard and controlling your traffic at home/VPS if you’re into that.
WebKit might be open source but the browser deployed by apple is not. That’s like saying chrome is open source. They both use open source engines.
it’s definitely more pro-privacy than Brave or FireFox. I’ve never had to jump through a captcha to use Google in those browsers.
You have this backwards. Google showing you captchas is basically them saying they can't match your browser to any know (shadow) profile they have already stored. So they aren't sure you are a human and if so which one specifically. Getting harassed with a captcha is essentially like a badge of honour for your browsers privacy settings.
No they don’t, that’s exactly what they said. Safari makes them do CAPTCHAs so it is the most privacy friendly. It is true that it has better blocking features than Firefox on iOS (because Firefox doesn’t have extensions).
Oh you are right, I misread that. Thanks for pointing it out.
No problem
Vivaldi is proprietary bullcrap. I don't know why people keep sucking their dick
Because it blocks ads out of the box. I know its new tab screen causes a lot of y’all’s buttholes to clench because it mentions cryptocurrency, but there are harder things to ignore
Careful, if you try to advocate or defend Brave on Lemmy, you're stepping on a minefield.
Idk if I would advocate for or defend it, but I find mobile ads especially abhorrent cuz they take up more relative space on the screen and my upload speed isn’t good enough to be VPNing through my pihole anytime I’m outside the house
iOS browsers are just skins for Safari anyways, and Brave addresses my issue out of the box, so yeah
Because it's listed as the first item on the browser choice screen for some reason, probably
The list is randomized, I've seen several screenshots with different order.
I mean it’s probably just alphabetical, but I wouldn’t know for sure.
The second one is Edge, and Aloha Browser exists
Cause Firefox is trash and Mozilla a shell of their former selves?
Also it's so liberating to speak your mind without caring what some scrub with his sweaty fingers on the downvote button thinks
firefox sucks for most people and vivaldi it's too complicated to configure + it looks like pure bloat
Why does it suck though? Works fine for me. Granted, I’m a software engineer, but even looking through my “end user glasses”, I don’t see anything wrong with it.
I wouldn't say Firefox sucks but there are definitely some things that made me use Edge occasionally back when I used Firefox as my main browser. It was mainly stuff like a webpage that doesn't support Firefox and extensions not having a Firefox version. Which sure aren't problems with FireFox, it's more a problem of it not having enough adoption, but to an end user if the thing they wanna use doesn't work in FireFox but works in Chrome then that's FireFox's fault.
I’ve used edge before my university disabled profile syncing (only reason I was using it, to be honest). Edge was fine. Switched to Firefox just to see how it is nowadays, never looked back. Honestly, can’t think of any extension I’m missing. Got quite a few myself, but probably not the same niche as you.
So far I haven’t encountered broken websites yet. Fingers crossed to keep it that way. Though I’ll probably steer clear of such a website unless absolutely necessary.
Granted, I’m a software engineer,
Lmao love how you inserted "software engineer" there like that supposed to mean something.
In this context, maybe it kinda does. We tend to be techies, so a bit more accustomed to shitty UI/UX than most users.
I have very few issues with Firefox. I fine across a site that does not render properly maybe once every other month. I did have some resource issues with it in Windows 10 with it using too much RAM (regularly using 3-4GB) but that has been fixed since I switch to Linux.
every site i use is slow af in librewolf (basically firefox) and also uses a lot of resources more than chromium based browsers
PS: considering reviewing Brave again. Everyone should contribute to their source code.
Vivaldi is the best!
Currently trying out Floorp as a Firefox fork for the possibility that Google's disabling of adblockers in the manifest will make it impossible to use chromium browsers which is kind of good, too
But Vivaldi rules as long as chromium is an option!
Floorp looks nice and customizable, but in terms of updates it doesn't seem very sustainable yet.
I get updates every other week
but I think it's in a weird spot with not having regular English patchnotes - and afaik they also use an older rendering-engine
Ahh, now that explains why I just saw a smaller number.
Floorp is based on Firefox ESR. Floorp will be updated every 4 weeks, with security updates provided before each Firefox release.
This is too far down.
But in iOS , addons (ublock origin) are not available at least outside EU, so brave is the better choice as it got brave shield . everywhere else I use Firefox.
This isn’t true, Safari has that exact extension
Explain please , I can't figure out how to use ublock origin in iPad
I’m going to do my best to give this answer when I’m less drunk tomorrow
So you’re gonna want do a space+command and type extensions, that should open the App Store to where you want to be, unlock is one of the top extensions.
That’s on macOS, not iOS.
It’s on iPadOS too
Wasn't the Brave CEO formerly the Mozilla CEO, back when Mozilla was doing a good job?
Yes, until he was ousted for being trash as a person.
and Mozilla has been doing poorly since.
Mozilla was doing poorly when he was CEO as well. Google has been doing everything they can to force Chrome.
He was CEO for 11 days and in that time all he did was cause a bunch of websites to show a banner requesting that users install a different browser in order to not support a homophobe.
There was also a boatload of articles about his homophobia that brought Mozilla into disrepute.
The problem is appointing Mozilla leadership based on ideological purity rather than technical merit.
Firstly, who says that's happening?
And secondly, this isn't entirely about purity - even if you personally (and I'm not saying this is your view, btw) don't give the slightest fuck about gay people and you're fine with them having fewer rights/fine with others actively trying to strip their rights away - others aren't, and it's harmful to the business.
Eich was CEO for 11 days and achieved nothing other than a Firefox boycott, dozens of negative Firefox headlines, and Firefox being known as the homophobic browser.
Even from a cold-hearted "fuck human rights, I care only about market share" POV, Eich was still an awful CEO decision.
Would you hire a bigot to run your company so long as the numbers go up? Fuck that mentality.
There is one issues though... Firefox is extremely slow and clunky. I hate to say it, but on mobile it is hard to use all the time for me. On desktop I'm Firefox 95% of the time but some sites don't work very well with the much slower JavaScript engine. This isn't to defend Brave or any chromium browser but we gotta get Firefox up to speed.
This is on iOS. There is no Firefox (geko) or Chromium, there is only skins of Safari so your point is moot. For now.
I feel like Firefox has made some really great strides on the performance front. Especially considering how bloated chrome has gotten as a comparison. But... Yeah that's valid. I love Firefox like 99% of the time but sometimes I'm almost forced to swap to Chrome to get a site to work correctly or reliably.
Site devs need to see the threat from browser engine monopolies too. Valve literally started pouring resources into Linux gaming just because Microsoft looked like they were trying to dominate game stores on Windows. Chromium actually dominates the web. I guess at least base chromium is open source. Still though, one of those markets is way bigger than the other and it definitely isn't Linux gaming. (God I love Proton/WINE and how far we've come!)
Firefox is fine on mobile in my eyes.
At least the Android version, even on my 5 year old Exynos phone it does what I need / want from a browser. Allows (some) extensions, lets me zoom wherever I want to on any page, has a reader mode and is snappy enough on old hardware.
Chrome tries to be / do far too much for me, just fuck off and let me browse the web. I do like the dynamic colours that Chrome on mobile uses on different webpages, is hot.
However Chrome gives me dirty Microsoft vibes, and it's pretty hard to shake that stank.
If your on iOS welcome to the walled garden. Hope you live in the EU.
I just have a shitty phone. Lol don't buy a Pixel 6. (Unless you pick it up really cheap for temporary use)
Brave is garbage. It's a cryptoscam adscam browser based on Chrome. For the love of god, use Firefox (or Vivaldi if you absolutely need chromium)
I can't say I disagree, I've long abandoned it on my PC.
But Brave has superb AdBlocking capabilities compared to every other browser for iPhone, so I'm still using it on my phone.
But Brave has superb AdBlocking capabilities compared to every other browser for iPhone
It is the same on android, it even lets me watch youtube vids without ads and in the background.
On Android you can use Firefox + uBlock Origin now
I just used YouTube revanced and set default YouTube links to go there
Las time I could not watch youtube vids in the background in firefox.
I also had trouble getting files that download multiple files at once to work on firefox.
Unfortunately brave has the best desktop layout when using Samsung DeX.
Better than Kiwi?
Oh, haven't tried that one. I have just experienced the awful aspect ratio on Firefox.
Brave on iOS is one of the more legitimate ways of getting an ad blocker
Firefox has adblockers on mobile
Firefos add-ons don't work on iOS, I literally just googled it to ensure I was informed before writing what you wrote.
I see. Another reaffirmation in my choice to not use iphone.
I have an android from 2018, it still works great and I can run adblock on firefox, eat shit apple!
Check out Orion! Firefox and Chrime add on support.
Edit: Also like Vivaldi. If you want device wide I can highly recommend NextDNS
I’ve been using Safari + AdGuard for a while and I don’t remember seeing any ad.
whats wrong with chromium?
It allows Google to continue controlling the Internet.
At least on android Firefox has Google tracking built into the app among much other tracking/ads. If you don't like Brave you may want to consider a Firefox fork. On IOS Brave is the only big browser with competent adblock afaik until/unless Firefox gets extensions going.
Edit: I forgot criticizing Firefox is wrongthink on the fediverse and will get you donwnvoted no matter what. Even if it's in the context of advising people to switch FROM Brave TO a Firefox fork on Android.
I'm not sure if fennec has it, it's the core Firefox android build that is not published to the store.
Fennec doesn't have any of it (Google Analytics, Pocket, Mozilla Tracking), which is why it's my choice of mobile browser. It's on FDroid
On IOS Brave is the only big browser with competent adblock afaik until/unless Firefox gets extensions going.
Safari + AdGuard gave me no issues so far.
Safari ain’t perfect but it’s leagues better than brave
Brave is great, has configurable keybinds, nice default adblock block list, vertical tabs, syncing sessions without email, etc.
And on android it can play youtube vids on the background.
The crypto ads just get disabled on the new tab page, you don't even have to go to the settings lol. And vivaldi is partially closed source btw.
There are crypto ads involved in the product though? Fuck that, even if it was default off
Brave is an interesting case, they found a way to make money that doesn't involve tracking their users, making deals with google or be closed source lol
If you hate that fine, I definitely prefer that than the other alternatives lol.
The total numbers are so small that the shape of the line barely matters. 7-10k installs daily? In the mobile browser market? There are plant identification apps with better numbers.
That graph is trash. The baseline needs to be at zero.
That graph hurts my data scientist heart
Could you please clarify why the baseline needs to be at 0? I'm genuinely curious.
This graph gives the impression that the total installation number has been multipliés x4 or X5 while it is not the case when looking at the raw numbers.
Any variation can look impressive if you zoom enough, that's why you need a baseline at 0. This way you see thé entire scale of the phenomenon
This graph gives the impression that the total installation number has been multipliés x4 or X5
How so? It goes from ~7 to ~11. That's not even x2.
It goes from ~7 to ~11. That’s not even x2.
Yes but the graph goes from 2 rectangles above the bottom line to 8 rectangles above the bottom line in that final surge.
So visually, it looks like it has quadrupled.
While I agree for the sake of clarity, a bigger problem is that it only goes back less than 2 months. Has the number of installs been steady at 7k for a long time? Or does it fluctuate wildly like this occasionally for reasons totally unrelated to laws?
I was just clarifying the original comment about the baseline not being 0.
Tbh, I hadn't even looked at it properly and only noticed now that the timeline isn't one month per box.
No it doesn't.
It's meant to illustrate a change and it does so perfectly fine. It's not a scientific paper.
It's a 32-34% increase looking at the graph. That's significant enough to shout about.
Imagine any change you could make surprising competition by 25% in any market. That's huge.
It’s meant to illustrate a change and it does so perfectly fine
Define "perfectly fine". It is clearly exaggerating the change. At a glance it looks more like a 5 times increase, not a 30% increase.
Of lies, damned lies, and statistics this graph is certainly one of them.
Did you know that disco record sales were up 400% for the year ending 1976, if these trends continue...AY!
It’s a 32-34% increase looking at the graph
But you don't get that percentage from looking at the graph. You get that from looking at the numbers.
The graph height increases by 300% in the last 3 months 9 days.
You could say the same about a 0.001 difference if you zoom in on the y-axis. You don't know what you're talking about.
A 0.001 difference on a 0.004 total would be worth showing.
That was a bad example. Try 1,000,000 moving up to 1,000,069.
I'm sticking with relevance. A >25% rise is what we're talking about.
A 25% raise would show up with the y shits at zero. As would any significant increase.
True.
Brave would definitely not be my choice 😂
That is fine, as long as people have a choice.
Certainly, but it's probably happening for all browsers on iOS right now.
....in europe
I mean sure I guess... but brave as a browser is atrocious. I don't trust their bullshit at all.
After all who doesn't want a crypto wallet in their browser? that's the safest place for it right?
I guess if you have no experience with it then that's a perfect response. Meanwhile I've got $72 worth of BAT in mine and if it vanished I'd be perfectly fine losing money I never actually owned. I donate to DDG and Wikipedia each month with mine. That's money they didn't have so they are fine with that.
I used to have a lot less but this crypto spike has increased it by a lot so my holdings are exceeding my donations. Might need to give away more.
I'm seeing a lot of down votes but no counter arguments.
Reminder that this graph does not start at zero. Still a ~(EDIT: 50)% increase.
take home message from this graph: if we shift the graph down by ~7K, you can see that we have roughly increased our user base by a factor of 100!
9.33262154 × 10157% is a pretty sick increase, all things considered.
I've been using Firefox on my android phones for years though, I don't remember it ever being more involved then setting it as default on the popup on first launch.
Android is a fenced garden compared to the fortress that is iOS.
I guess, but it's like a 2 foot high fence
Did the same on iOS… not a huge difference. Download app from store, set as default.
On iOS the browser isn’t really Firefox. It’s just a re-skinned Safari due to apples rules. I think now they are allowed to ship their own engines
I have been using Firefox as the default browser on my iPhone for a while now. It wasn’t complicated to setup either.
Same here but it's not Firefox with its own Engine, it's a Firefox frontend for WebKit with some of Apple's restriction.
There are a bunch of apps that strictly require Chrome for their in-app custom tabs, though. I have to re-install Chrome on occasion because I can't log into apps without it. Also, having Chrome installed at all makes it impossible to NOT set a default browser (i.e. to have it ask every time), which is what I prefer since I use several different browsers for different use cases. (Note: this is on Pixel. Never had that problem on my older phones.)
I have Firefox set up and never was the in-app browser firefox
How I know? I have dark reader active on those pages and usually websites don't reflect system primary settings.
I think it used to be possible to set your default "custom tabs" browser as well, but I don't think it is anymore. I'm not totally sure though.
I don't know why these apps use custom tabs in the first place. It's always struck me as a solution in search of a problem.
That graph looks exaggerated but this is over a few days which is crazy
It is misleading. In a reputable graph, your y axis would start at zero
Nah. I hear your complaint but look up any stock ticker. Starting at 0 would simply cause too much white space and make it hard to see movements.
The y-axis is clearly labeled allowing us to see that it’s about a 40% jump.
No the axis shows a detailed increase with clearly stated numbers. This is just the first impression.
We are not talking about Apple graph madness
Not really, no. You use a point of reference that's clearly labeled. If you'd start the graph at zero, you would just end up with a lot of dead space.
The axis is somewhat misleading. A jump from 8k to 11k installs is nothing.
Edit: just saw from the comments this is the number of installs per day so its bigger than I thought
A jump from 8k to 11k installs is nothing.
It's about a third. Imagine if your income went up by 30% in 24 hours, I reckon you'd be pretty happy about that.
Also - it tends to take months for a new version of iOS to reach a large number of users, and years to reach everyone. So a rapid growth rate (probably not 30%, but still fast) is likely to be sustained over quite a while.
It’s been one day
Yeah, I'm sure a lot of people are trying it out. I'm curious what the other options look like and how many continue using them after the initial install.
Misleading graph trying to make a 150% increase look like a 1000% increase.
that's a ~40% increase looking like a 300% increase
Read the left side? 7k-11k, the removed useless information, provided you read what is actually there first.
no one reads that. didn't even bother to look. should be more transparent IMO but whatever
If you don’t how are you supposed to know what information it’s telling you? It could shades of purple for all you know.
If you realize how most people act and think, you can tell them lies while telling the truth. Which is what people are usually trying to do when they start graphs away from zero.
Or it’s removing white space so you can actually see the difference in the data. Like stocks, if stocks started at zero, you wouldn’t be able to see day to day or even a week to week difference…. Not everything can be covered by general rules.
You can only properly understand the data by reading it, if you glance at it and make assumptions and conclusions, that only speaks volumes about yourself.
If counting from 1 to eleven is too hard for you, I don't think observing that the scale is from 7 to 11 is within your grasp. So, why do this. Absolutely, there are reasons to not start a scale from zero, stocks are a great example, but I don't think those reasons apply to this graph or the information they're trying to convey.
Yeah… it just doesn’t work with the given information, there is actually a reason why they specifically posted the other one….
well yea but this also isn't like important stuff so I didn't bother looking
So keep your idiocy to yourself next time.
you say that as if everyone analyses every aspect of everything they encounter. most people will glance at the graph, see a huge jump, and not look into it more. that's why statistics are so easy to falsify or make misleading
If you want to engage in a conversation or use that information, yes you should properly read it. What could possibly be added to a discussion otherwise? Just having people have to correct and call out your bullshit? Lmfao.
Since you are engaging in comments within a post about this, everyone would assume you read the graph properly, since you obviously can’t add to a conversation without actually knowing the information.
So yes, leave your idiocy elsewhere next time, read the shit, or don’t add your opinion, really simple concept.
That doesn't surprise me, and yes it was always because of anti-competitive practices, so I'm all for more neutrality, I'll just add 2 shower thoughts:
Seeing that Brave is at the top of the browser list, I wonder how many selected Brave just because it's at the top of the list and thought that this must be a good choice then, not because they actually like Brave.
It's nice to have such a thing for browsers, but it would have to be expanded to other apps as well, e.g. mail client. Oh well, maybe in another 10 years or so.
Cool icon? iOS users? Surely not!
The position is randomized.
I'm so glad they included a key otherwise I wouldn't know what the green line represented.
I used to use brave before they were soured. Ther BAT token disappearing from my account was another nail in the coffin.
Arguably soured from the very beginning depending on how much you care about the CEO financially supporting a bill to strip gay people of their right to marry, plus supporting a politician who said that AIDS is good because it cleanses the earth of gay people.
I dont know wtf this is about; I have NEVER had a problem switching default browsers in ANY environment.
After you install the 17.4 update or when setting up the phone it'll ask what browser you want as your deafult. Before this and still in other countries you have to manually search and download a browser and set it as the default.
I was a bit confused too. So all that's changed is a specific splash screen during new phone setup prompting the user to pick a default browser?
yes, because the average user doesn't even know there are different browsers, and that they can change the default one, which is great to "vendor lock" your own browser, in this case Safari from iOS
Gotcha, but even in that case, what's convincing most of those average users from picking a different browser? The logo? "Ooh pretty lion?"
Some might be aware others exist but not be quite tech savvy enough to figure out how to have it be the default. I downloaded Firefox for my ex on her phone but the default was still chrome so whenever she clicked a link on an app it would just open on chrome. If this pop up had happened she would have chosen to make Firefox her main browser when opening links and stuff. She did use it when browsing normally, Chrome was just the default for all other apps.
Hell you dealing with iPhone users here, they barely know that the device they use in this technically a computer. You've got to basically spoon feed them basic stuff like other browsers exist.
IPhone and Mac users in general. A friend of mine was an Apple sales rep for many many years and holy crap I dont know how he didnt go on a killing spree
I used to work for Apple technical support and the stupidity of your average Apple user drive me up the wall, it's left me with a very negative view of their clientele.
My favorite was the person that threatened to sue me personally because he had dropped his iPhone on a glass table and it had broken the glass table and the iPhone. And he was mad that Apple wouldn't cover his costs.
My friend dealt with the frustration by making cheap cartoons. An example:
So basically all this is nanny state-ing for idiots? Darwin would be so pissed now
Hurry USA! Better find some smallish company to sue for anti trust instead of working on any real issues like this
To whoever mentioned Librewolf previously as a better alternative to FireFox: Thank you.
Does Firefox containers work on it
3,000 people clicked a button out of curiosity or by mistake. If this is statistically relevant for their install base, there really is nobody using Brave. I have as many users randomly come and go into my game on a daily basis.
Maybe Europeans like crypto scamware
I don't use Brave due to lack of uBlock Origin support. Otherwise it seems like a decent browser.
Thing is, on iOS, at least in the past, Firefox had no uBlock origin support, which pushed Brave's adblocking capability to the #1 spot.
makes sense
Not just in the past, you still can't install addons in (any browser) on iOS. brave is basically the only option because it adblocks without addons.
I thought Safari supports some extensions now, including AdBlock Plus.
But still isn’t it a safari reskin!!
No because the EU forced them to actually allow the browser engines. It turns out that somebody with an actual brain was behind the policy decision.
Shockingly it turns out that despite what apple always claimed it was actually perfectly possible and weirdly isn't actually a security threat after all, who knew.
I don't think people can develop a browser engine that fast, and apple is still scrambling to figure out the least amount of compliance to avoid legal trouble.
So I doubt they are using a different engine at this moment.
You can doubt all you want, but devs have had functioning alternative engines in dev environments for ages. Apple just would not allow them.
What do you mean "develop" they already have the engine on desktop and on Android
I think porting it to iOS still probably takes time, but I am happy to be proven wrong if you have source stating that brave is not using webkit on iOS.
The porting has probably already been done, as sideloading apps, while difficult, was still possible. It'd make sense to have something waiting in the wings, so to speak. So it's doubtful iOS development has just started.
You are right, blink is ported, but it seems like gecko is not there yet.
I think at this point it still is. But it should get a chromium version in future!
Competition is healthy for a market, this is proof that people aren't happy with the default browser and it'll hopefully spur apple into improving their browser and in turn causing brave to improve even more
"brave to improve even more"? Don't you mean stop being a shitty scummy company?
Brave is evil.
Honestly I'd expect a much bigger jump
A choice screen is a baby step that’s not enough to level the playing field.
I don't think this is a good thing, brave is good out of the box but do not provide good browsing experience
And once again, I am seriously questioning Apple's privacy claims. Why else would Apple build such a moat around Safari?
Same reasons as Internet Explorer, probably
Because they can limit it and thus make app more attractive and keep a 30% cut?
There is zero reason to switch browsers on iOS, They all run the same engine.
Safari also has extensions (which I believe 3rd party browsers can't use).
They all run the same engine for now. The EU wants to ban that too.
Eh, that's not true. Yes they run on the same engine, but there can still be different features overlaid on top, plus syncing history/bookmarks with your other devices.
The engine is by far the biggest part of a browser, but it is not the only part of a browser.
Also, EU users will soon have access to "real" different browsers.
Again, this is why this law was such a big deal. Prior to this you were correct. Thanks to the DMA, you are wrong. Firefox will be running Gecko, and Vivaldi, Brave, Chrome, etc are allowed to ship their flavors of chromium.
*in the EU
Normal people don't choose the browser based on the underlying engine
Does that default browser screen allow you to install with setting the OS default?
I can't see the graph in w3m.
The line starts shooting up before March 6th though...
Timezones? The first drastically higher data point seems to be Mar 05
Using Brave since years ago and it goes pretty smooth, good for them but first they should get out of Apple brand tbh.
it's was not hard. you just install one and tap "always" the next time you open a link to set it as the default
Many if not most users were unaware of this possibility though.
maybe because of ios where it wasn't even possible to change the default browser until like .... 2020 i think?
and even now all browsers use webkit and are forbidden from loading their own js (aka extensions) anyway
Yeah but Brave? Why not Firefox or Vivaldi.
Forgive them. They aren't used to choosing their browser yet.
They're Apple users. They aren't used to making any decisions when it comes to how their phones work
I’d defend myself, but I work in digital marketing so I’m not going to dissuade anyone from using AdWords.. I mean Android.
Funny, I see far more ads on iOS than I do Android
Don't tell them about all the different ad blockers we can use!
Where?
Don’t lump us all in with them, Safari with Adblock extensions on mobile, Firefox everywhere else
We don't have to, cuz they work 😉
They work the way Apple wants them to
They also work how I want them to, well instead of having to fight my own phone, it just works, go figure
Sounds more like Stockholm Syndrome
Whatever you need to tell yourself, lol
Ok you get a free pass, make sure it doesn't happen again :)
Well the Brave Twitter account is likely a bit biased toward the Brave browser. 🙂
I'm sure the others were impacted too.
Edit: Firefox installs jumped 50%.
https://www.theverge.com/2024/3/13/24100066/firefox-saw-an-increase-in-users-following-apples-default-browser-changes-in-the-eu
Vivaldi is a proprietary rebranding of Chromium. Can't say I'd recommend it over (or in addition to) Firefox.
We need less forks of Chromium. Any one company (Google in this case) having total control over browser engines is dangerous, and is a big reason why the whole Apple/Safari/Webkit situation is such a big deal to begin with.
Remember kids, if it's Chromium based, it's still part of the problem. The Chromium project only exists to provide the illusion of choice. Don't let Google have the power to dictate web standards at will.
The worrisome thing is that there's no alternative other than Firefox, or Safari on Apple platforms. Every single other browser is Chromium.
We must defend Firefox at all costs, it's the last glimmer of freedom.
One exception I'm aware of: GNOME Web (aka epiphany-browser) uses WebKitGTK, which is based on Apple's WebKit rather than Google's Chromium/Blink. But it's Linux desktops first and foremost. Not on mobile platforms, not exactly intended for Windows (might be usable with Cygwin/WSL) or macOS (seems to be on MacPorts) either, and even on non-GNOME desktops like KDE it might seem a bit out of place.
I daily drive Firefox but Epiphany is my first choice fallback on the rare occasion I encounter a site that's broken on Firefox.
True but if you use Vivaldi and then you try to go back to Firefox, it's like going back in the early 2000s. I always say this, Firefox should have been like Vivaldi. Super customizable and packed with features. Instead you have to rely on extensions and thus put your trust in the creator of said extension that they will not sell it. Heck even with extensions, trying to mimic the new tab page from Vivaldi is a masterclass in patience.
Firefox +50% in Germany, +30% in France
Vivaldi is my go to browser. Brave does a better job with blocking ads. I'm switching to Brave whenever I need to stream something on a site loaded with ads, or when YouTube manages to detect my Adblock for a few days.
Not like uBlock Origin is a thing?
Can it really get better than that and consent-o-matic?
I am using uBlock Origin on my Vivaldi. It doesn't block everything.
"This Other Browser is just as good as Brave*!"
*if you install x, y, and z and uninstall a and b
You are comparing a tool to a tool-belt in terms of capabilities.
You think Firefox is the only browser that can use extensions and add-ons? Brave just doesn't need them for adblock because it's built in. But, like all chromium browsers, you can use loads of extensions for loads of use cases. Anything that works on Chrome works on Brave.
It's maybe a few clicks to find the add-ons store in Firefox then searching "uBlock Origin". Hell, when I switched to Firefox last year, I want to say there was even an onboarding that pointed me to the extension upon setup.
So, back to my original point.
I don't like that you can't use the Dark Reader extension on mobile in Vivaldi. I like all of my websites to be dark.
I guess it does have a built in dark mode
Still better than Edge or Chrome
as someone said, its randomised, and I'm sure that other browsers also saw more downloads
Vivaldi is extremely slow on IOS and 2gb+ big. Firefox has no extensions so no Adblock. Generally there are few privacy friendly/Foss browsers on IOS.
That's because so far every browser on iOS had to use WebKit as it's HTML rendering engine, meaning that even if you installed another browser manually you were basically still using Safari under the hood. IIRC the new DMA rules include allowing other browser engines like Gecko, so Mozilla is probably already working on making addons available. I mean they are available on Android, so why wouldn't they make them available on iOS now that they finally can?
I wouldn’t be sure because of how stupid Apples compliance is. But if they do I would definitely switch. I guess it’s just going to be Firefox focus until then.
Um, Safari is so privacy friendly that Google regularly asks me if I'm human. For example it has "private relay" which is similar to TOR* so trackers don't even know your IP address — combine that with blocking third party cookies (and even some first party cookies) by default and providing false data to fight fingerprinting even if you don't block trackers entirely - and blocking them entirely is as simple as installing an extension. Private Relay also adds a layer of encryption on top of DNS queries and otherwise unencrypted http traffic.... so your ISP/Cellular provider/Work/School/abusive husband/etc can't track you
99.99% of the Safari's code is FOSS — dual licensed under LGPL and BSD.
It's not the browser I use - pretty lacking in the feature department, but it's definitely more pro-privacy than Brave or FireFox. I've never had to jump through a captcha to use Google in those browsers.
(* if anything, it's better than TOR... with that service there's a risk your entry/exit nodes are tracking you. With Private Relay it's always one of Apple's servers for the entry node and a reputable cloud company like Akamai for the exit node. Both would have to be compromised in order to identify you... maybe a nation state can do that, but a big data tracking company definitely can't)
Private relay is more like a VPN than tor.
I mean they did say few. Generally speaking, every browser is basically safari (WebKit) on iOS and apple doesn’t allow support for 3rd party browser extensions (least natively, Orion supports this somehow). So you’re already limited in that regard. If you don’t use safari , a browser like FF + VPN is IMO a better experience. You also have the option of just using wireguard and controlling your traffic at home/VPS if you’re into that.
WebKit might be open source but the browser deployed by apple is not. That’s like saying chrome is open source. They both use open source engines.
You have this backwards. Google showing you captchas is basically them saying they can't match your browser to any know (shadow) profile they have already stored. So they aren't sure you are a human and if so which one specifically. Getting harassed with a captcha is essentially like a badge of honour for your browsers privacy settings.
No they don’t, that’s exactly what they said. Safari makes them do CAPTCHAs so it is the most privacy friendly. It is true that it has better blocking features than Firefox on iOS (because Firefox doesn’t have extensions).
Oh you are right, I misread that. Thanks for pointing it out.
No problem
Vivaldi is proprietary bullcrap. I don't know why people keep sucking their dick
Because it blocks ads out of the box. I know its new tab screen causes a lot of y’all’s buttholes to clench because it mentions cryptocurrency, but there are harder things to ignore
Careful, if you try to advocate or defend Brave on Lemmy, you're stepping on a minefield.
Idk if I would advocate for or defend it, but I find mobile ads especially abhorrent cuz they take up more relative space on the screen and my upload speed isn’t good enough to be VPNing through my pihole anytime I’m outside the house
iOS browsers are just skins for Safari anyways, and Brave addresses my issue out of the box, so yeah
Because it's listed as the first item on the browser choice screen for some reason, probably
The list is randomized, I've seen several screenshots with different order.
I mean it’s probably just alphabetical, but I wouldn’t know for sure.
The second one is Edge, and Aloha Browser exists
Cause Firefox is trash and Mozilla a shell of their former selves?
Also it's so liberating to speak your mind without caring what some scrub with his sweaty fingers on the downvote button thinks
firefox sucks for most people and vivaldi it's too complicated to configure + it looks like pure bloat
Why does it suck though? Works fine for me. Granted, I’m a software engineer, but even looking through my “end user glasses”, I don’t see anything wrong with it.
I wouldn't say Firefox sucks but there are definitely some things that made me use Edge occasionally back when I used Firefox as my main browser. It was mainly stuff like a webpage that doesn't support Firefox and extensions not having a Firefox version. Which sure aren't problems with FireFox, it's more a problem of it not having enough adoption, but to an end user if the thing they wanna use doesn't work in FireFox but works in Chrome then that's FireFox's fault.
I’ve used edge before my university disabled profile syncing (only reason I was using it, to be honest). Edge was fine. Switched to Firefox just to see how it is nowadays, never looked back. Honestly, can’t think of any extension I’m missing. Got quite a few myself, but probably not the same niche as you.
So far I haven’t encountered broken websites yet. Fingers crossed to keep it that way. Though I’ll probably steer clear of such a website unless absolutely necessary.
Lmao love how you inserted "software engineer" there like that supposed to mean something.
In this context, maybe it kinda does. We tend to be techies, so a bit more accustomed to shitty UI/UX than most users.
I have very few issues with Firefox. I fine across a site that does not render properly maybe once every other month. I did have some resource issues with it in Windows 10 with it using too much RAM (regularly using 3-4GB) but that has been fixed since I switch to Linux.
every site i use is slow af in librewolf (basically firefox) and also uses a lot of resources more than chromium based browsers
For god sakes don’t use Brave. Brave has been caught doing shady shit in the past, and the CEO is a piece of shit on top of that.
Use Firefox with privacy addons.
Don't worry, Firefox downloads in the EU have also skyrocketed.
https://www.theverge.com/2024/3/13/24100066/firefox-saw-an-increase-in-users-following-apples-default-browser-changes-in-the-eu
Vivaldi and Firefox are better choices.
PS: considering reviewing Brave again. Everyone should contribute to their source code.
Vivaldi is the best!
Currently trying out Floorp as a Firefox fork for the possibility that Google's disabling of adblockers in the manifest will make it impossible to use chromium browsers which is kind of good, too
But Vivaldi rules as long as chromium is an option!
Floorp looks nice and customizable, but in terms of updates it doesn't seem very sustainable yet.
I get updates every other week
but I think it's in a weird spot with not having regular English patchnotes - and afaik they also use an older rendering-engine
Ahh, now that explains why I just saw a smaller number.
This is too far down.
But in iOS , addons (ublock origin) are not available at least outside EU, so brave is the better choice as it got brave shield . everywhere else I use Firefox.
This isn’t true, Safari has that exact extension
Explain please , I can't figure out how to use ublock origin in iPad
I’m going to do my best to give this answer when I’m less drunk tomorrow
So you’re gonna want do a space+command and type extensions, that should open the App Store to where you want to be, unlock is one of the top extensions.
That’s on macOS, not iOS.
It’s on iPadOS too
Wasn't the Brave CEO formerly the Mozilla CEO, back when Mozilla was doing a good job?
Yes, until he was ousted for being trash as a person.
and Mozilla has been doing poorly since.
Mozilla was doing poorly when he was CEO as well. Google has been doing everything they can to force Chrome.
He was CEO for 11 days and in that time all he did was cause a bunch of websites to show a banner requesting that users install a different browser in order to not support a homophobe.
There was also a boatload of articles about his homophobia that brought Mozilla into disrepute.
The problem is appointing Mozilla leadership based on ideological purity rather than technical merit.
Firstly, who says that's happening?
And secondly, this isn't entirely about purity - even if you personally (and I'm not saying this is your view, btw) don't give the slightest fuck about gay people and you're fine with them having fewer rights/fine with others actively trying to strip their rights away - others aren't, and it's harmful to the business.
Eich was CEO for 11 days and achieved nothing other than a Firefox boycott, dozens of negative Firefox headlines, and Firefox being known as the homophobic browser.
Even from a cold-hearted "fuck human rights, I care only about market share" POV, Eich was still an awful CEO decision.
Would you hire a bigot to run your company so long as the numbers go up? Fuck that mentality.
There is one issues though... Firefox is extremely slow and clunky. I hate to say it, but on mobile it is hard to use all the time for me. On desktop I'm Firefox 95% of the time but some sites don't work very well with the much slower JavaScript engine. This isn't to defend Brave or any chromium browser but we gotta get Firefox up to speed.
This is on iOS. There is no Firefox (geko) or Chromium, there is only skins of Safari so your point is moot. For now.
I feel like Firefox has made some really great strides on the performance front. Especially considering how bloated chrome has gotten as a comparison. But... Yeah that's valid. I love Firefox like 99% of the time but sometimes I'm almost forced to swap to Chrome to get a site to work correctly or reliably.
Site devs need to see the threat from browser engine monopolies too. Valve literally started pouring resources into Linux gaming just because Microsoft looked like they were trying to dominate game stores on Windows. Chromium actually dominates the web. I guess at least base chromium is open source. Still though, one of those markets is way bigger than the other and it definitely isn't Linux gaming. (God I love Proton/WINE and how far we've come!)
Firefox is fine on mobile in my eyes.
At least the Android version, even on my 5 year old Exynos phone it does what I need / want from a browser. Allows (some) extensions, lets me zoom wherever I want to on any page, has a reader mode and is snappy enough on old hardware.
Chrome tries to be / do far too much for me, just fuck off and let me browse the web. I do like the dynamic colours that Chrome on mobile uses on different webpages, is hot.
However Chrome gives me dirty Microsoft vibes, and it's pretty hard to shake that stank.
If your on iOS welcome to the walled garden. Hope you live in the EU.
I just have a shitty phone. Lol don't buy a Pixel 6. (Unless you pick it up really cheap for temporary use)
Brave is garbage. It's a cryptoscam adscam browser based on Chrome. For the love of god, use Firefox (or Vivaldi if you absolutely need chromium)
I can't say I disagree, I've long abandoned it on my PC.
But Brave has superb AdBlocking capabilities compared to every other browser for iPhone, so I'm still using it on my phone.
It is the same on android, it even lets me watch youtube vids without ads and in the background.
On Android you can use Firefox + uBlock Origin now
I just used YouTube revanced and set default YouTube links to go there
Las time I could not watch youtube vids in the background in firefox.
I also had trouble getting files that download multiple files at once to work on firefox.
Unfortunately brave has the best desktop layout when using Samsung DeX.
Better than Kiwi?
Oh, haven't tried that one. I have just experienced the awful aspect ratio on Firefox.
Brave on iOS is one of the more legitimate ways of getting an ad blocker
Firefox has adblockers on mobile
Firefos add-ons don't work on iOS, I literally just googled it to ensure I was informed before writing what you wrote.
https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/add-ons-firefox-ios#:~:text=Add%2Dons%20for%20the%20desktop,%2C%20Mac%2C%20Windows%20and%20Linux
I see. Another reaffirmation in my choice to not use iphone.
I have an android from 2018, it still works great and I can run adblock on firefox, eat shit apple!
Check out Orion! Firefox and Chrime add on support.
Edit: Also like Vivaldi. If you want device wide I can highly recommend NextDNS
I’ve been using Safari + AdGuard for a while and I don’t remember seeing any ad.
whats wrong with chromium?
It allows Google to continue controlling the Internet.
At least on android Firefox has Google tracking built into the app among much other tracking/ads. If you don't like Brave you may want to consider a Firefox fork. On IOS Brave is the only big browser with competent adblock afaik until/unless Firefox gets extensions going.
Edit: I forgot criticizing Firefox is wrongthink on the fediverse and will get you donwnvoted no matter what. Even if it's in the context of advising people to switch FROM Brave TO a Firefox fork on Android.
I'm not sure if fennec has it, it's the core Firefox android build that is not published to the store.
Fennec doesn't have any of it (Google Analytics, Pocket, Mozilla Tracking), which is why it's my choice of mobile browser. It's on FDroid
Safari + AdGuard gave me no issues so far.
Safari ain’t perfect but it’s leagues better than brave
Brave is great, has configurable keybinds, nice default adblock block list, vertical tabs, syncing sessions without email, etc.
And on android it can play youtube vids on the background.
The crypto ads just get disabled on the new tab page, you don't even have to go to the settings lol. And vivaldi is partially closed source btw.
There are crypto ads involved in the product though? Fuck that, even if it was default off
Brave is an interesting case, they found a way to make money that doesn't involve tracking their users, making deals with google or be closed source lol
If you hate that fine, I definitely prefer that than the other alternatives lol.
@AMDIsOurLord@lemmy.ml @FatCat@lemmy.world Brave may have its flaws but at least it has an offline Dino game, what does Firefox have?
an offline breakout game
>Cryptoscam
I turned it off
>Adscam
I turned them off
>Based on chrome
Chromium
>use Firefox
No.
Cope and Seethe
Are you saying you don’t like Firefox because they don’t like propaganda?
*Links article about one of the best takes ever made by an online company
Wild
Chart is a little misleading starting at 7% instead of zero, but still a nice surge nevertheless.
True. Other people asked so they posted another one.
IMO, this makes it look even worse.
That's why they started with the one they did
Even then, this is still a solid 30-40% increase in downloads. That's statistically significant right there.
Worse, or... "better"?
Does not look as nice, but is way less misleading
The total numbers are so small that the shape of the line barely matters. 7-10k installs daily? In the mobile browser market? There are plant identification apps with better numbers.
Is that 7% or 7,000 installs total? The axis isn’t labeled!!
I see a k following the numbers, so I'm assuming that's total number of downloads.
Article states installs per day
Not even seven percent. Lol. Seven thousand which is probably like .0001 percent.
That's new daily installs though, so cumulative number. I don't think they're trying to draw a comparison, just show the increase.
That graph is trash. The baseline needs to be at zero.
That graph hurts my data scientist heart
Could you please clarify why the baseline needs to be at 0? I'm genuinely curious.
This graph gives the impression that the total installation number has been multipliés x4 or X5 while it is not the case when looking at the raw numbers.
Any variation can look impressive if you zoom enough, that's why you need a baseline at 0. This way you see thé entire scale of the phenomenon
How so? It goes from ~7 to ~11. That's not even x2.
Yes but the graph goes from 2 rectangles above the bottom line to 8 rectangles above the bottom line in that final surge.
So visually, it looks like it has quadrupled.
While I agree for the sake of clarity, a bigger problem is that it only goes back less than 2 months. Has the number of installs been steady at 7k for a long time? Or does it fluctuate wildly like this occasionally for reasons totally unrelated to laws?
I was just clarifying the original comment about the baseline not being 0.
Tbh, I hadn't even looked at it properly and only noticed now that the timeline isn't one month per box.
No it doesn't.
It's meant to illustrate a change and it does so perfectly fine. It's not a scientific paper.
It's a 32-34% increase looking at the graph. That's significant enough to shout about.
Imagine any change you could make surprising competition by 25% in any market. That's huge.
Define "perfectly fine". It is clearly exaggerating the change. At a glance it looks more like a 5 times increase, not a 30% increase.
Of lies, damned lies, and statistics this graph is certainly one of them.
Did you know that disco record sales were up 400% for the year ending 1976, if these trends continue...AY!
But you don't get that percentage from looking at the graph. You get that from looking at the numbers.
The graph height increases by 300% in the last
3 months9 days.You could say the same about a 0.001 difference if you zoom in on the y-axis. You don't know what you're talking about.
A 0.001 difference on a 0.004 total would be worth showing.
That was a bad example. Try 1,000,000 moving up to 1,000,069.
I'm sticking with relevance. A >25% rise is what we're talking about.
A 25% raise would show up with the y shits at zero. As would any significant increase.
True.
Brave would definitely not be my choice 😂
That is fine, as long as people have a choice.
Certainly, but it's probably happening for all browsers on iOS right now.
....in europe
I mean sure I guess... but brave as a browser is atrocious. I don't trust their bullshit at all.
After all who doesn't want a crypto wallet in their browser? that's the safest place for it right?
I guess if you have no experience with it then that's a perfect response. Meanwhile I've got $72 worth of BAT in mine and if it vanished I'd be perfectly fine losing money I never actually owned. I donate to DDG and Wikipedia each month with mine. That's money they didn't have so they are fine with that.
I used to have a lot less but this crypto spike has increased it by a lot so my holdings are exceeding my donations. Might need to give away more.
I'm seeing a lot of down votes but no counter arguments.
Reminder that this graph does not start at zero. Still a ~(EDIT: 50)% increase.
take home message from this graph: if we shift the graph down by ~7K, you can see that we have roughly increased our user base by a factor of 100!
9.33262154 × 10157% is a pretty sick increase, all things considered.
I've been using Firefox on my android phones for years though, I don't remember it ever being more involved then setting it as default on the popup on first launch.
Android is a fenced garden compared to the fortress that is iOS.
I guess, but it's like a 2 foot high fence
Did the same on iOS… not a huge difference. Download app from store, set as default.
On iOS the browser isn’t really Firefox. It’s just a re-skinned Safari due to apples rules. I think now they are allowed to ship their own engines
They are but it's not ready AFAIK https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1882872
Can't wait to use it though and be able to install WebExtensions.
I have been using Firefox as the default browser on my iPhone for a while now. It wasn’t complicated to setup either.
Same here but it's not Firefox with its own Engine, it's a Firefox frontend for WebKit with some of Apple's restriction.
There are a bunch of apps that strictly require Chrome for their in-app custom tabs, though. I have to re-install Chrome on occasion because I can't log into apps without it. Also, having Chrome installed at all makes it impossible to NOT set a default browser (i.e. to have it ask every time), which is what I prefer since I use several different browsers for different use cases. (Note: this is on Pixel. Never had that problem on my older phones.)
I have Firefox set up and never was the in-app browser firefox
How I know? I have dark reader active on those pages and usually websites don't reflect system primary settings.
I think it used to be possible to set your default "custom tabs" browser as well, but I don't think it is anymore. I'm not totally sure though.
I don't know why these apps use custom tabs in the first place. It's always struck me as a solution in search of a problem.
Still wouldn't touch Brave Browser due to their past crypto shenanigans.
Please forgive my ignorance. Can’t you shut that shit off? Does shenanigans still apply?
They apply after you shut them off
I hate how they cut off the graph...
Yeah, that graph is sus af
At least it's drawn to scale, but yeah I get it. Starting at 7k probably makes it easier to read.
They are probably just trying to pump their token with these posts.
That graph looks exaggerated but this is over a few days which is crazy
It is misleading. In a reputable graph, your y axis would start at zero
Nah. I hear your complaint but look up any stock ticker. Starting at 0 would simply cause too much white space and make it hard to see movements.
The y-axis is clearly labeled allowing us to see that it’s about a 40% jump.
No the axis shows a detailed increase with clearly stated numbers. This is just the first impression.
We are not talking about Apple graph madness
Not really, no. You use a point of reference that's clearly labeled. If you'd start the graph at zero, you would just end up with a lot of dead space.
The axis is somewhat misleading. A jump from 8k to 11k installs is nothing.
Edit: just saw from the comments this is the number of installs per day so its bigger than I thought
It's about a third. Imagine if your income went up by 30% in 24 hours, I reckon you'd be pretty happy about that.
Also - it tends to take months for a new version of iOS to reach a large number of users, and years to reach everyone. So a rapid growth rate (probably not 30%, but still fast) is likely to be sustained over quite a while.
It’s been one day
Yeah, I'm sure a lot of people are trying it out. I'm curious what the other options look like and how many continue using them after the initial install.
Misleading graph trying to make a 150% increase look like a 1000% increase.
that's a ~40% increase looking like a 300% increase
Read the left side? 7k-11k, the removed useless information, provided you read what is actually there first.
no one reads that. didn't even bother to look. should be more transparent IMO but whatever
If you don’t how are you supposed to know what information it’s telling you? It could shades of purple for all you know.
If you realize how most people act and think, you can tell them lies while telling the truth. Which is what people are usually trying to do when they start graphs away from zero.
Or it’s removing white space so you can actually see the difference in the data. Like stocks, if stocks started at zero, you wouldn’t be able to see day to day or even a week to week difference…. Not everything can be covered by general rules.
You can only properly understand the data by reading it, if you glance at it and make assumptions and conclusions, that only speaks volumes about yourself.
If counting from 1 to eleven is too hard for you, I don't think observing that the scale is from 7 to 11 is within your grasp. So, why do this. Absolutely, there are reasons to not start a scale from zero, stocks are a great example, but I don't think those reasons apply to this graph or the information they're trying to convey.
Yeah… it just doesn’t work with the given information, there is actually a reason why they specifically posted the other one….
well yea but this also isn't like important stuff so I didn't bother looking
So keep your idiocy to yourself next time.
you say that as if everyone analyses every aspect of everything they encounter. most people will glance at the graph, see a huge jump, and not look into it more. that's why statistics are so easy to falsify or make misleading
If you want to engage in a conversation or use that information, yes you should properly read it. What could possibly be added to a discussion otherwise? Just having people have to correct and call out your bullshit? Lmfao.
Since you are engaging in comments within a post about this, everyone would assume you read the graph properly, since you obviously can’t add to a conversation without actually knowing the information.
So yes, leave your idiocy elsewhere next time, read the shit, or don’t add your opinion, really simple concept.
That doesn't surprise me, and yes it was always because of anti-competitive practices, so I'm all for more neutrality, I'll just add 2 shower thoughts:
Cool icon? iOS users? Surely not!
The position is randomized.
I'm so glad they included a key otherwise I wouldn't know what the green line represented.
I used to use brave before they were soured. Ther BAT token disappearing from my account was another nail in the coffin.
Arguably soured from the very beginning depending on how much you care about the CEO financially supporting a bill to strip gay people of their right to marry, plus supporting a politician who said that AIDS is good because it cleanses the earth of gay people.
I dont know wtf this is about; I have NEVER had a problem switching default browsers in ANY environment.
After you install the 17.4 update or when setting up the phone it'll ask what browser you want as your deafult. Before this and still in other countries you have to manually search and download a browser and set it as the default.
I was a bit confused too. So all that's changed is a specific splash screen during new phone setup prompting the user to pick a default browser?
yes, because the average user doesn't even know there are different browsers, and that they can change the default one, which is great to "vendor lock" your own browser, in this case Safari from iOS
Gotcha, but even in that case, what's convincing most of those average users from picking a different browser? The logo? "Ooh pretty lion?"
Some might be aware others exist but not be quite tech savvy enough to figure out how to have it be the default. I downloaded Firefox for my ex on her phone but the default was still chrome so whenever she clicked a link on an app it would just open on chrome. If this pop up had happened she would have chosen to make Firefox her main browser when opening links and stuff. She did use it when browsing normally, Chrome was just the default for all other apps.
Hell you dealing with iPhone users here, they barely know that the device they use in this technically a computer. You've got to basically spoon feed them basic stuff like other browsers exist.
IPhone and Mac users in general. A friend of mine was an Apple sales rep for many many years and holy crap I dont know how he didnt go on a killing spree
I used to work for Apple technical support and the stupidity of your average Apple user drive me up the wall, it's left me with a very negative view of their clientele.
My favorite was the person that threatened to sue me personally because he had dropped his iPhone on a glass table and it had broken the glass table and the iPhone. And he was mad that Apple wouldn't cover his costs.
My friend dealt with the frustration by making cheap cartoons. An example:
https://youtu.be/V3kCZjdXIv8?si=QFwoHJzX1lBHqTdl
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/V3kCZjdXIv8?si=QFwoHJzX1lBHqTdl
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
So basically all this is nanny state-ing for idiots? Darwin would be so pissed now
Hurry USA! Better find some smallish company to sue for anti trust instead of working on any real issues like this
To whoever mentioned Librewolf previously as a better alternative to FireFox: Thank you.
Does Firefox containers work on it
3,000 people clicked a button out of curiosity or by mistake. If this is statistically relevant for their install base, there really is nobody using Brave. I have as many users randomly come and go into my game on a daily basis.
Maybe Europeans like crypto scamware
I don't use Brave due to lack of uBlock Origin support. Otherwise it seems like a decent browser.
Thing is, on iOS, at least in the past, Firefox had no uBlock origin support, which pushed Brave's adblocking capability to the #1 spot.
makes sense
Not just in the past, you still can't install addons in (any browser) on iOS. brave is basically the only option because it adblocks without addons.
I thought Safari supports some extensions now, including AdBlock Plus.
But still isn’t it a safari reskin!!
No because the EU forced them to actually allow the browser engines. It turns out that somebody with an actual brain was behind the policy decision.
Shockingly it turns out that despite what apple always claimed it was actually perfectly possible and weirdly isn't actually a security threat after all, who knew.
I don't think people can develop a browser engine that fast, and apple is still scrambling to figure out the least amount of compliance to avoid legal trouble.
So I doubt they are using a different engine at this moment.
You can doubt all you want, but devs have had functioning alternative engines in dev environments for ages. Apple just would not allow them.
What do you mean "develop" they already have the engine on desktop and on Android
I think porting it to iOS still probably takes time, but I am happy to be proven wrong if you have source stating that brave is not using webkit on iOS.
The porting has probably already been done, as sideloading apps, while difficult, was still possible. It'd make sense to have something waiting in the wings, so to speak. So it's doubtful iOS development has just started.
You are right, blink is ported, but it seems like gecko is not there yet.
But brave still uses webkit as of now, according to wikipedia: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave_(web_browser)
I think at this point it still is. But it should get a chromium version in future!
Competition is healthy for a market, this is proof that people aren't happy with the default browser and it'll hopefully spur apple into improving their browser and in turn causing brave to improve even more
"brave to improve even more"? Don't you mean stop being a shitty scummy company?
Brave is evil.
Honestly I'd expect a much bigger jump
A choice screen is a baby step that’s not enough to level the playing field.
I don't think this is a good thing, brave is good out of the box but do not provide good browsing experience
And once again, I am seriously questioning Apple's privacy claims. Why else would Apple build such a moat around Safari?
Same reasons as Internet Explorer, probably
Because they can limit it and thus make app more attractive and keep a 30% cut?
There is zero reason to switch browsers on iOS, They all run the same engine. Safari also has extensions (which I believe 3rd party browsers can't use).
They all run the same engine for now. The EU wants to ban that too.
Eh, that's not true. Yes they run on the same engine, but there can still be different features overlaid on top, plus syncing history/bookmarks with your other devices.
The engine is by far the biggest part of a browser, but it is not the only part of a browser.
Also, EU users will soon have access to "real" different browsers.
Again, this is why this law was such a big deal. Prior to this you were correct. Thanks to the DMA, you are wrong. Firefox will be running Gecko, and Vivaldi, Brave, Chrome, etc are allowed to ship their flavors of chromium.
*in the EU
Normal people don't choose the browser based on the underlying engine
Does that default browser screen allow you to install with setting the OS default?
I can't see the graph in w3m.
The line starts shooting up before March 6th though...
Timezones? The first drastically higher data point seems to be Mar 05
Using Brave since years ago and it goes pretty smooth, good for them but first they should get out of Apple brand tbh.
it's was not hard. you just install one and tap "always" the next time you open a link to set it as the default
Many if not most users were unaware of this possibility though.
maybe because of ios where it wasn't even possible to change the default browser until like .... 2020 i think?
and even now all browsers use webkit and are forbidden from loading their own js (aka extensions) anyway