Eastern Ukraine isn't an ideal tourist spot at the moment.
But the minefields are a banger scnr
The internet has broken my brain.
scnr is a new one on me and in an attempt to figure it out, my brain did not land on the now rather obvious "sorry, could not resist" but "skibidi cap no rizz" as some kind of ironic initialism
I'm gonna go and find some grass now
skibidi cap no rizz
our brains are mush fr đ
I read it as scenario ÂŻ\_(ă)_/ÂŻ
I read it as scenery. Probably because the thread is about travel.
"smoke copium, non-resident"?
I only git as far as SNCF, the French railway company. Just a transposition and a single pen stroke away.
As a European from elsewhere in Europe, I'm never going back to Milan. Maybe it's fine if you're into fashion, but if you're not there's not much to look at except a cathedral which resembles every other cathedral, and it's impossible to get a photo of it without also having a friendship bracelet scammer in the frame, actively harassing you.
All tourist locations in Italy and France have people trying to scam you (and some non-scammers just trying to sell you cheap toys), but Milan is the only place I've been to where they're straight up harassing you non-stop. Go to Pisa instead, it's super relaxing there and you can marvel at their past mistakes in structural engineering. A far better deal.
Scammers abroad: Troll with randomness. Laugh at inappropriate times. Nod at them while making the eating food gesture. Randomly start pointing down a street like you're trying to give directions but just shrug. Pick a random sports team name and say, "Gooooo EAGLES!" while nodding and dancing. Basically pick some random thing, pretend they said it, and you're going along with it.
If they're pointing to friendship braclets, you say "9 o'clock." even though it's 1:30. If they keep doing it, you just laugh, nod, and clap.
My favourite is pretending I'm deaf and making up signing. When they start gesturing, I repeat the gesture in shock. When they nod, I act disgusted like they're sick in the head.
They will very quickly move on since you're a waste of time. The more awkward you make it, the better, especially if you're drawing looks from others.
I've used very similar techniques on men in bars who don't think no is a complete sentence.
I'm well past the age for shame. I will make a fool of myself if it means some twerp will think twice about harassing a woman who's repeatedly turned them down
I'd never considered doing the same for scammers - great idea! I'm just overly polite and that makes me seem like a target I think.
I have personally yelled, "Fuck off! No means no you fucking creep!" at the top of my lungs in a crowded bar. It was genuine, but over the top so every other person would turn and see them, ruining their chances of "picking up" at that establishment, forcing them to leave.
"Are you okay?"
"Oh, yeah I'm fine. That guy just needed to learn a fucking lesson."
That is hilarious but too much effort. A simple 'Fuck off' should suffice.
That does work too, but not on the ones that put shit on you and demand payment, usually operating as 2+. Their tactic is intimidation and dramaâplaying the victim to youâbut it can not be beaten if you're playing the role of a happy idiot, providing random or exact opposite behaviour to what they're attempting.
One of these guys walked up and gave me a handful of birdseed, prompting a flock of pigeons to come perch on my arms. I most certainly did not hand over the money they wanted for the experience I didnât ask for and was somewhat disgusted by.
Pisa is bad too, it is just the tower and crazy tourist prices.
How about Venice?
Venice kind of has a Disneyland vibe.
There aren't any scammers, the place is filled with history, and is relatively well kept and run. The flip side to it is that feels like a theme park at times.
It also has Disneyland prices.
I was in Venice pre-covid. I spent a day walking around and soaking in the sights and sounds. Sat by myself for an hour listening to some guy play the chello. It was beautiful. Never got harassed by street peddlers or scammers unlike in Milan. The architecture was beautiful like nothing else. Its a city trapped in the Renaissance era.
Funny you should say that; I went to Florence some years back and we took a day trip to Pisa and had to deal with the worst, most aggressive scammers I've ever experienced.
We may have just gotten lucky. I also had a great time in Venice once by wandering off randomly and ending up somewhere I can only assume tourists don't normally go. We bought some fruit off a boat which was both delicious and very affordable, so I assume the target demographic was not tourists. I'm pretty sure that's not the universal experience of Venice either.
I really enjoyed visiting Cimiteiro Monumentale in Milan. A historic cemetery with lots of lavishishly designed huge tombs. Very few tourists there and no scammers whatsoever.
Canary Islands. Great place, but the mass tourism is actually killing them, provoking skyrocketing rent and shortages of power and water.
Indeed. My girlfriend lives there, last time I was over we went to the big demonstration against mass tourism. I felt a bit sick at the airport listening to all the north European pensioners talking about how they rent a place year round for 800âŹ/month just to spend the odd week now and then there. While many locals working in tourism make minimum wage, around 1300âŹ/month I believe.
Hey that's exactly what my rent / wage split was in the UK last year. The only reason anything got better is that minimum wage went up while my rent hasn't yet.
Switzerland. If you've got buckets of money it's fine but donair can easily run you 18 francs and a real meal will cost you 100+. I've visited twice and both times the extreme costs involved have hamstrung my ability to actually enjoy things. The trains and geography are amazing - but the streets full of jewelers and high fashion specifically targeting millionaires or up are an awful example of late stage capitalism.
Sorry but you're exaggerating, a full meal including drinks in a mid-level establishment will be at max. 50 chf and that's being generous. And with cheaper places you can even stay below 20 chf.
Yes, Switzerland is expensive but there's no need to lie about it. Also the stuff about millionaires and all maybe fits a couple streets in Switzerland that are very touristy but there are plenty of places not at all like this.
Donair? What's that? Fancy Doner Kebab made with Don Perignon and air?
My first experience with this food was in Halifax decades ago. The Halifax Donair is a unique thing.
Funny enough you are legally not allowed to call that a Döner in the EU.
(Döner by law must not use ground beef. If they do you can call them Kebab,but not Döner)
Itâs the French transliteration. Doner would be pronounced âdonayâ.
A full meal including drinks will usually run 50 chf per person if you're a couple most meals will run 100+ - it is possible to eat on a budget (we've usually relied on sausage stands and donair). And yea, I'm mostly talking about what you'll find in Lucerne, Zurich, or Geneva where you're likely to visit.
I donât know where youâre eating lol. A döner in zurich is about 14-15 francs at the moment never seen one for 18 francs and they increased prices the last two years as well.
If youâre having a meal and drinks for 50 francs per person you have likely been to a fancy restaurant. Donât get me wrong, it absolutely is possible to easily go over 50 francs, however its also is very easy to stay below that and still have a good experience.
Iâve visited multiple times with a camper, and if you use apps like park for night to find free or cheap places to stay!then buy your own ingredients to cook, itâs actually really acceptable. And the nature is gorgeous!
Same for me, with a bicycle and tent. Camp sites are also ok priced, at least for cyclists. Very much enjoy cycling in switzerland, i also think people are friendly. I used to have different experiences but those were just single persons / crazy people or something.
donair can easily run you 18 francs and a real meal will cost you 100+.
What the fuck...??? đČ
Well it's simply not true, doeners are 10-15, and meals in sitdown restaurants are 12-25. I live in Zurich, restaurants are slightly cheaper than in the US ( plus there is no tip or extra tax, what you see on the menu is what you pay) - but there are less budget options available.
I live in switzerland and my lunch costs CHF 2.50 so I don't know where you've been eating for one hundred + francs for a 'real meal'.
I paid 20⏠for a Pizza Margherita in Oslo once. In some very rich places you can feel like a tourist from a developing country even if you are from a less-rich high-income country yourself.
Andorra. Full of motor bozos, duty free shops, terrible cities in the valleys. A tax haven joke country. Nice mountains i guess.
Hey! I will not tolerate this kind of racism against influencers! /s
Oh influencers. Haven't thought of those, that fits i guess.
What's a motor bozo?
The tax criminals / profiteurs of tax criminality driving their loud fancy sports cars through the andorran valleys and up to the golf courts.
It is a machine that converts electrical energy into mechanical energy and stop calling me Bozo.
Passed through earlier this year specifically to visit Caldea mineral springs. Absolutely worth it if youâre nearby.
That's the same in San Marino. It's nice but come on, it's full of duty free shops and shops that sell arms that are illegal in Italy
As others said Switzerland. It's beautiful and all but really expensive. It really took away a big part of fun when I went there. But not only that, I thought the swiss people seemed sometimes kinda "rude"or maybe a better word for it "cold" and a little annoyed if it came to tourists. I get it, it's a small county and a lot of people are visiting each year, but it still wasn't fun for me to be there and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone to go there.
I thought the swiss people seemed sometimes kinda "rude"or maybe a better word for it âcoldâ and a little annoyed
I have some Swiss-American relatives, and I think this is cultural. They just have a different set of indicators, they're not going to be grinning and hugging.
As an Anglophone who lives in France, I agree. Although where I live (east / south-east) English is not very widely spoken, even in bigger cities, but the people are generally very friendly.
...but it all goes wrong again at the south coast. Even the locals leave for the summer.
cold
This is my experience with Europeans in general tbh
So knowing that European consider Swiss people cold, imagine how cold they are.
They are stone cold to foreigners - so many English speaking wealthy people live there and they are not welcomed into the local communities. It can take a decade to make local Swiss friends.
Then you should visit south europe. Europe is divided by the alps in a lot of things, like potato or tomato as main ingredient in meals. But also in culture itself. Everything north of the alps is kinda cold and seems unhappy/angry and stressed all the time and south of it people seem chill, happy and friendly.
As a counter example, I managed to make friends with a Swiss person while elsewhere in Europe, and then later in my travels got to visit them in Switzerland for a few days. My time there was truly one of the most breathtaking and memorable experiences of my trip.
Maybe it's expensive, maybe Europeans are "cold" personality wise, but God damn they have got some incredible scenery.
Not a place in particular, but if you're driving, avoid any border crossings during peak holiday seasons. Specifically when you're crossing from the EU into non-EU countries or crossing from Schengen into non-Schengen area. During peak times you might be waiting at the border for hours.
Don't drive! You're in Europe... trains go fucking everywhere!
It seems like you've never been to Germany
Wanted to say that too. I mean, technically the train network is pretty well connected but it's so underfunded that trains oftentimes don't drive at all or they're late and then every train after that is also late. It's mostly fine but it happens way too often. I had to stand in freezing cold for an hour or longer too many times in the last three years where I took the train daily.
I don't know, maybe it's just particularly bad where I live, but I regularly have to the the god damn Schienenersatzverkehr, and even this god damn fucking bus that is supposed to replace the train is always like 20 minutes late. Like how the fuck do you even mess that up DB? HOW?!
Yeah, I had to take a SEV for a while too because there was construction on the train tracks and I came late every single day because apparently nobody at DB thought that 2 full trains (and with full I mean that people always had to stand because there weren't enough seats) couldn't just fit into one bus. That bus was always completely full (people standing in the middle up to the front door) and a lot of people still just wouldn't fit in.
Things get less well connected in the more eastern nations, especially heading down to Greece.
Well, there are some exceptions. This year, I'm travelling by train to all my holiday destinations, but the last connection I will fly because the trains run in such a stupidly way.
Yea - my statement is generally accurate for Western Europe. Eastern Europe, especially the Balkans, is awful for high-speed coverage.
In my case actually Western Europe, but a very specific connection that would either need to go through the alps (which means slow speeds and switching trains a lot) or take a huge detour via Paris.
The high speed Internet coverage is quite the opposite though.
Just to note, this doesn't apply to the UK. Our trains are generally useless and expensive.
I wouldnât say at all cost, but Montenegro isnât fun. Russians have built massive hotel resorts on the beaches there, the locals are unhappy that theyâre there so they donât like tourists. Theyâll try to fight you on the beach because youâre not local. Get hassled by the cops because youâre not local, but youâll be able to buy your way out of your problem if youâre lucky. People donât want to talk to you, everyone is pretty cold and borderline rude. Go to a bar for a drink and you get a glass nominally washed/rinsed in tubs of soapy water behind the bar that the previous 100 glasses went through and hasnât been changed out. The landscape is beautiful in a hostile sort of way, but thereâs just not much reason to visit. Itâs not even particularly inexpensive. The hotels will try to charge you for everything, including a scuff on the wall that you didnât do, a chip on a planter on the balcony, etc. ridiculous money grabs.
idk about the process in montenegro, but it's pretty normal in america for bars to use a three compartment sink with a christmas tree scrub brush stuck to the bottom of the first sink, which is filled about half full with soapy water, a rinse water mixture in the next one and a sanitizer water mixture in the last one.
it's a fast and safe way to do dishes by hand, especially glassware if you always inspect for chips afterward (which you should be doing anyway!).
I understand thereâs a right way to do it, but allow me to assure that the two murky trays behind this bar were not acceptable by any means. I didnât want to get too graphic, but glasses went from the customer hand, a quick slosh and a rub in liquids that would make any civilized health department shriek, wiped âdryâ with a filthy rag that had just wiped the bar top, filled with the next drink and handed to the next customer.
This is the kind of stuff where you see it in a movie like so: the scoundrel hero walks into a dive bar in the spaceport, orders a drink, the camera makes sure you see the pustulent, greasy alien clean the vessel using the above process. The alien pours a questionable liquid into it, and slides it to the observing hero who has been keeping a stone-faced expression but for a hint of discomposure as he receives the drink. After the briefest pause in frame to let you know he questions what he is about to do, he downs the beverage. You canât help but cringe along with the hero and think licking the alien might have been safer.
(Am not comparing or suggesting Montenegrins are in any way shape or form like the hypothetical alien)
Places where you only order highballs due to health concerns ftw.
Common tourist places during tourist season are usually the worst. I took a 10 day trip to Paris one summer and it was a mix of the most popular tourist places (Louvre, Eiffel tower, etc) and some underground shit my sister found.
Every tourist place was jam packed with annoying tourists, costly and had tons of scammers surrounding it. Every less known place was really awesome, aside from one sketchy neighborhood we had to walk through where we were followed for a while.
I'd also say that Northern Europe has generally been much more pleasant to travel through, for me.
Here's what I would avoid when traveling to Poland:
Zakopane, it's overpriced and very crowded. If you want to visit the area the town is in your better off staying in smaller villages, unless you have to use public transit.
Szczecin --not an 'avoid at all cost' but more of a 'there are better cities to visit'-- this-or-that part of the city is always being remodeled/reconstructed and there's no 'old city' with day and night life focused between two shoping centers and some roundabouts in the city center. If you want to go sight-seeing KrakĂłw, WrocĆaw or GdaĆsk are much better choices.
Mazury lake district, beautiful lakes and decent nightlife, shit infrastructure - roads are narrow (two bigger cars can't pass eachother without going offroad) and often lacking sings and other markings
Podlaskie Voivodship, even worse infrastructure than Mazury, it's rural, mainly towns and villages with nothing a tourist might want to see. You might think it's a good place to go star-gazing but Bieszczady are a lot better for that (Tho you should probably go to a Dark Sky Site for that, there's one close to Bieszczady, in Slovakia)
THE SEASIDE, it's crowded, expensive, the sea is cold and it's fumcking wimdy, go to like Italy, Croatia, Portugal or Spain instead
Also in general avoid capital cities, they are often the worst of major cites in a given country.
My wife an I were on a Roadtrip from Germany to Poland for a holiday and did go to a lot of beautiful places. But Zakopane is stuck in my mind as the most touristy place I did ever go to. The High Tatra mountains are still beautiful but we had to wait in line to even enter the hiking trails. And on the trails it was just hundreds of people trying to make photos without other people in the background.
I forgot two places - both as bad as Zakopane - One is the Hel(l) Peninsula, it's as overcrowded as Zakopane; but it has a single road (one lane each way) that gets jammed very fast, you can be stuck there like 5 hours, even though it's only 30 Km long. The second one is Krynica Morska, a town located on the Vistula Spit(separating Vistula Lagoon from GdaĆsk Bay, in the Baltic Sea) and it has the same problem as Hel - it's a popular destination with only one road in and out.
Yes, please don't come to Paris. It's crowded enough as it is. Also we're all very rude.
I once had a French co-worker tell me that the rest of France would divorce you if they could.
Paris is 80% people from the rest of the country. Which their former neighbours promply hate as soon as they move there.
It's traditional.
From what my former Parisian grad school housemate told me, I concur. He once said in reply to a friend (named Roger) asking him why people in Paris were mean to him and hate Americans, my housemate replied, "Oh Rogers, zhee French do not hate Americans, zhey hate EVERYONE, especially zhee other French". My experience in Paris was that the Parisians were surprisingly friendly. But I speak a little French and say Bonjour and Merci when warranted.
My experiences in Rocket League can confirm. People being toxic in chat? Tell them something in chat back -- get the "tg" to confirm French. Every goddamn time, always the French that are so rude.
Why? Why are they having such a bad day every day? Play a game to have fun ffs.
Not to hijack a thread, but what does lemmy consider the BEST place in France? I'd like suggestions.
Please don't hate me: Paris, really.
Bretagne
the south, I'm told.
Toulouse is a pretty laid back larger city that is beautiful without being overly touristy
If you want to stay in Germany and hop across the border, Strasbourg and Colmar are both nice towns. Has German influence but you get the benefits of being near the black forest for a 2 for 1 trip.
Lyon. 3rd sized city. Best food of France. 2 rivers. centre of France so close to anything. should have been the capital of France if the kid of one king didn't die there for some reason, or whatever
Lyon is pretty great. Depending on the vibe you're going for, Marseille is also pretty awesome. I'd avoid it in the middle of the summer, but shoulder season down south is amazing. The weather is great, the people are friendly (if you avoid the worst parts of town, like anywhere) and the food is a nice mix of traditional French and Mediterranean cuisine. And make sure to get a flight of Ricard.
Most places in the south
La Rochelle, Nantes are both nice from my experience.
I really liked Paris đ„Č I did go during the end of October though, so that might've have been a factor. People still didn't want to talk to me in French, but they weren't rude about it.
My favourite place to visit in France was La Rochelle, I feel like I got most of the benefits of visiting Coastal France but without the Marseille/Toulon/Monaco crowds (yes I know, Monaco is not France).
I've been to Paris 3 times, I'm from BC in Canada. April, May and October I went. Had an amazing time every time, people, food, places. It's one of my favorite cities.
The capital cities. If you want authentic Europe, find the weird local festivals where people chase cheese down a hill or celebrate local culture or something. That's real Europe. Fuck the big cities and their galleries and museums.
These are a few things off the top of my head mostly northern and western Europe because it's what I'm familiar with. Also if you want to see something bizarre, go to Finland on free bucket day. But seriously Europe is full of unusual things to do. Or you could go to yet another gallery and pretend to be interested in paintings.
Not sure what answers you looking for, if you want to have a carefree vacation just read some reviews of specific countries and regions.
If you are backpacking or planning a multi-country trip I would check the crime rates of the places, there are many websites with the statistics available, like
THIS
As a general rule of thumb popular places and big cities will have the highest crime rates, while smaller cities and countryside the lowest.
Also I would avoid solo trips and backpacking in general in the rural parts of less-developed countries, like Romania, etc.
Pretty much thats it. Europe as a whole is probably one of the safest travel destinations in the earth with some planning and common sense.
Ignorant North American here but I'm now legit wondering what happens to people backpacking-possibly-solo through places like Romania. đŹ
Natural hazards like "If you twist an ankle you'll get no comms service and be eaten by a bear." aside, of course.
Buddy system is never a bad idea. :)
I'd say Romania is actually relatively safe crime-wise for tourists. Comms services are better than in my homecountry (always had 4G on my last trip to Romania even in rural places in the mountains, while I sometimes do not have any signal in German high-speed trains between two large cities). Dangerous widlife is actually an issue. Lot's of bears, wolfes, snakes, etc. Also bad tourist infrastructure in really rural places.
No problem, its not some golden rule you should follow (especially from an internet stranger) but it's mainly bad roads, bad economy (poor police/ambulance availability), the little Roma villages/gipsy makeshift living areas, where I would not show up alone with any valuables (similar to gipsy ghettos near big cities) and last but not least wildlife. While bears and other predators are not uncommon, rabid dogs are also a possibility.
Before somebody accuses me hating Romania (its a beautiful country with incredible landscapes and the capital and developed parts are very popular tourist destinations), the above is also applicable for many other europen countries. This is why I strongly suggest doing some research before planning such trips, as the relative safety and enjoyment of a holiday can vary from region to region within a small country. This is why its borderline impossible to give a straight answer to the original post.
Nothing happens to them because all the bad parts of Romania aren't in places where backpackers would go. Only "bad" part of visiting Romania is that tourism isn't as developed as in other countries. So not as many signs/information/buses to and from places. That also makes lots of places harder to find and reach but also a lot more pristine. Romania's countryside is one of the best, hands down.
Nothing. Romania is generally fine. I hitchhiked an couch surfed solo. Had only good experiences.
Don't come to Greece, over tourism is a huge problem here...
I feel you lol. I wish less people came to Portugal, especially Lisbon and Porto. It's a bit ridiculous sometimes. The culture people come looking for is slowly dying or becoming a fake version of itself because legit stuff is being pushed out of historical centers, in favor or tourist attracting alternatives. The issue of overpricing (because all the English, German, French, etc, visiting Portugal earn way better than us here in average) is ludicrous, it's becoming harder to enjoy the places we used to go 15 or 20 years ago. sigh
It really is sad. For more than 25 years I've been visiting Portugal (so yes, I'm part of the problem...) and every year it gets a bit worse: endless new hotels destroying the beautiful views of the cliffs, villages mostly catering the needs of tourists, ...
I just wish I hadn't told everyone how amazing it is in Portugal đ„Č
It is, the the fault isn't entirely on the tourists (specially if they're respecting and give two fucks about the places they're visiting); the governments have been pushing tons of pro-tourism stuff everywhere for years, hence why we grew that industry so much, often without thinking of long term consequences and economic balance. So now, we have an economy overly dependent on tourism (with all the good but mostly bad stuff that brings), which, in addition to other shitty decisions like massive roadway investment instead of railway (we have one of the best road network in Europe, but a shitty railway one, significantly shrinked down in the last 40 years), have led to lots of serious issues preventing good development of a lot of other industry we could have and once had. The classic example is Algarve (the southernmost region) is so dependent on tourist they had a very hard time during COVID. Outside of Lisbon's (<2M) and Porto's (>1M) metro areas, every other city has less than 500k people, and the vast majority less than 100k, which presents obvious issues.
Was about to say the same for Spain. Fuck you, tourists. Stay at home.
I got dragged to MĂĄlaga against my will (family stuff) and it was horrible. More pubs than tapas places to cater to the British crowds...
But Im planning a Honeymoon and want to enijoy your history. Can I go if I dont use airbnb?
I don't think there is any way right now to come without negatively affecting the locals. Essentially, the tourists to locals ratio is out of hand. A few of the problems we are facing:
Everything is overcrowded. Our public infrastructure is barely equipped to handle the population of 10M, on top of that add the 36M visitors we saw in 2023. It may be fun and exciting if you are here for a couple of days, but living through that all year long is exhausting.
Everything is overpriced. Most people coming to Greece have expendable income we don't have, along with overcrowding, this sets prices we cannot afford. Airbnb has definitely exaggerated the housing crisis, but it's not the only issue. When you are eating, drinking, visiting historical sights, or doing any activity, you are contributing to that.
Our economy is over-reliant on tourism. As someone else commented, no other type of industry can compete with tourism, every year more places lose their identity as they adapt to the ever-growing needs of the tourism industry.
Our history is being erased. Visiting a historical sight may a wonderful experience for you, but every step you make, every photo you take, every trash you throw, impacts the place you are visiting, destroying little by little thousands of years of history.
As a personal note, my income is a few times the national average, and yet I cannot afford to go on vacations this year...
As a (not) fun challenge you can try to limit your budget to around 30 eur per day per person. You will fail, probably won't even find living accommodations within that budget, but it will give you an insight on our struggles.
Feel free to cross post to !yurop@lemm.ee , a laid back discussion community for Europeans
is there a good or suggested community for people looking to move to europe who are looking for advice? or is that place welcome for such discussion? dont want to intrude.
This is definitely a discussion that can take place over there!
Belgorod.
I have read of tourists coming to Vienna and thinking there is anything worth seeing north of the Danube.
Unless you count the UN headquarters, there isn't. All of that is a completely unstructured and boring mix of industrial, commercial and residential zones mostly built after WW2 like you find anywhere in the world.
I visited Vienna in 2015 and that's one of the places where I'd gladly move if I could.
In Sweden/Stockholm:
Avoid Akalla/Hjulsta/Kista
They are all boring and sees a lot of gang crime.
Just avoid Stockholm. Too many stockholmare.
Visit Gothenburg instead
Both Stockholm and Gothenburg are really nice cities - they're pretty safe too unless you seek out drug lords or park your bike without a decent lock. Just don't come here during the winter - you'll be depressed by the lack of daylight.
The worst thing of Copenhagen is that you can see Sweden from there
I don't think many tourists would head out to the far away suburbs by subway. My recommendation is to avoid Drottninggatan and "City" with the exception of some architecture or particular places of interest because it is just really too much busy people and pickpockets and hot asphalt and concrete and glass and tourist traps and chain stores.
France is becoming a far right country on two weeks. Do yourself a favor and stay as far as you can.
So, should I stay on the left side of France?
Hold up, let's see what happens with the front populaire
Yeah, I'm not getting my hopes up unfortunately
Do get your hopes up, and your neighbours voting, please.
Who talks to their neighbors in this day and age? They'll probably vote for the party who wants my death anyway so yeah...
I mean yeah sure we could be surprised, but things aren't really going in the right direction
Honestly, I'll vote for them. But they disgust me with all their power struggle about who's going to be prime minister. In doing so, they're tearing apart the whole thing. They swore that they wouldn't betray us. They're betraying us everyday by showing everybody it's just a struggle between egos. They're paving the way for the far right too with this ridiculous display of inflated heads.
I'll vote for them, then I'll puke. The only frontliner I'm feeling like supporting in the future is, maybe, Manon Aubry.
And Italy, and Switzerland, and Hungary, and Finland....
Just make sure to avoid Brussels. Belgian myself and I hate the place.
Was recommended the same by someone from Brussels.
(He was not 6 foot and full of muscles, to be clear)
The vegemite sandwiches are enough to keep me away.
Back when Australia was still remote and exotic, before Crocodile Dundee even, a lot of people back in the day thought he sang: "He just smiled and gave me a bit of my sandwich",
which would have also made for a fantastic lyric in a very silly way.
Did he speaka your language?
Does this mean you love it and want to keep it all to yourself? Also how does it smell?
No, I would tell you to avoid Ghent at all costs then!
Just got back from a 3 day trip to Brussels, we loved it. Plus, Smurfs (Les Schtroumpfs) everywhere. We did take a day trip to Bruges though, that was even better than Brussels IMHO. Especially since I could walk around saying to my wife "If I grew up on a farm, and was retarded, Bruges might impress me but I didn't, so it doesn't.".
Paris is pretty sweet - just, for the love of God, don't fucking drive. The metro and easy access to long distance trains make it a pretty frequent stop for me.
If you haven't been to France before, make Carcassonne your first stop. It's a wonderful village with an exceptional walled medieval hamlet.
The board game isn't bad either!
Just guessing by the username and domain, they probably heard of it!
I'm French ahah. But sometimes it's nice to see your country from an outside perspective. Being a tourist in your own country can be interesting!
Stopped there for a day on the way back from Spain. The walled Hamlet is beautiful, especially nice to stroll through the streets after dark.
Stay overnight next time! The town surrounding the citadel is actually really pleasant and one of the staples of cuisine local to that area is Cassoulet!
CDG airport. I hate that place so much.
Heathrow, Schiphol and Frankfurt are all so much easier to navigate.
On a serious note though: Iâve never bern anywhere in Europe that I straight up disliked. Sanremo was probably the «least friendly» with locals all pushing us towards the casino at every oportunity. The city was also surprisingly worn down.
Well, yeah, in some places, but there's countries where that's a far worse idea than in Europe.
If you used that rule in US cities, you would both stay alive, and miss out on some really cool bars.
There's one here in the US that doesn't have any signage at all. Just a lightly pink door. It opens down into one of the coolest restaurants and live performance places in the city. It has become pretty popular.
Yea, Philly has a few like this.
Dublin is a kip, you have far better options throughout Ireland, if you want a city go to Cork or Belfast. Galway is a bit boring to me but could be your scene. After that there are loads of little spots with loads going for them. The entire west coast is great.
Dont rent a big car, I mean big by irish sandards.
Zakopane, Poland. Greedy bastards.
Almost every reason given sounds like a description of my home of Florida.
I can assure you that my van and my basement are totally save! So come right in stranger.
Don't go to Amsterdam.
I'm reading this at Amsterdam airport. Trying to get the hell away from here asap.
Why?
because they don't know how to pronounce Schiphol and therefore are probably lost and too touristy to ask for directions
Well, it's more like we don't want them to come here.
As an American (but an immigrant), who wants to go to Amsterdam, what can I do to be mindful and not annoying?
I had a great visit there in 2013. Nearly everyone speaks English, but donât just assume, ask (in Dutch) if they speak English. Very walkable, with pretty great transit. Lots to see just walking around. Just be a normal person and youâll be treated fine.
Tbh even if you speak Dutch, they'll just reply English. That's the weird Amsterdam behavior
This happens in a lot of countries. For me I noticed it particularly with young people in Germany, and pretty much anyone in Norway.
Can make it slightly frustrating when actively trying to learn the language by speaking with people đ
I think that's kinda common in a lot of countries. If you look like you aren't from there then they will speak in English.
I dont think so. I even replied in dutch and they still continued in English. The only place that ever happened to me
Don't get really drunk or stoned and end up being obnoxious.
Try to be aware of traffic (especially bikes) and of blocking sidewalks/alleys etc. Look both ways on every lane of traffic you cross (including both bike lanes).
Try to branch out your trip from the exact center of the city (or by the train station) and don't rent an Airbnb inside the city center (they drive up local rents).
If you're standing on red bricks or red tarmac, you're probably blocking the bike lane.
If you can't see the bike lane, it's likely that you're standing in it (they aren't always marked).
As someone planning on going in a year or two, this is really good advice. Thank you.
Digitalprimate
Oh simply be polite and most of all have a sense of your surroundings/situational awareness, i.e., don't get in the way. You probably want to spend as little time in the main "downtown" area (roughly central station to the Rokin) as possible.
Although everyone under 80 years old speak near-native English (I exaggerate), you'll endear yourself by learning to say good morning, good evening, thanks, and please in Dutch and to start conversations by asking "Is English ok?" in Dutch.
Basically just don't be a jerk and the native Amsterdamers will happily take your holiday money.
don't get drunk and fall in the canal and drown when you're trying to take a piss
True, but also if you go to Amsterdam as a tourist, you'll end up in the tourist trap places. Shady coffee shops, tours of the red light district, and over priced bars where you have to pay for toilet usage. And you can be rushed through the Anne Frank house for a price.
Fair enough!
It's still possible, in my opinion, to visit as a "tourist" (I live in Haarlem now, so technically I'm a tourist when I go) and avoid all the trashy stuff. You can seek out the cool little neighborhoods like the Jordaan or de Pijp.
this is an extremely tourist friendly city. but it's also filled with drunk pieces of shit at night. they will try to fight you for a cigarette.
Yeah for sure, avoid big groups of British English speaking dudes for sure (and some of my best friends are English and they would agree!)
drunk people are garbage in general but English drunk people in Amsterdam are just fucked
And drugged pieces of shit as well. It's a horrible city if you don't do that kind of stuff
I visited Amsterdam last month and loved every bit of it.
As someone planning on visiting there in a year or two, do you have any advice?
The public transport system will make you feel like you're in the 2030s. Super simple. Have your smart phone or smart watch connected to a credit card, or just have a chipped credit card, and you boop your way in any transport, you boop your way out and it charges you for whatever distance you traveled.
The hotels are incredibly expensive there and we didn't take one in the old city, but somewhere at a reasonable distance from a subway station a little further from the city center.
Do not neglect the possibility to bike in the city. We were walking everywhere, or taking trams or the subway, and I wish we biked more.
Boat tours are cool, you learn a lot. Lots of museums to visit. And if you can afford it, try these restaurants for an extraordinary experience : Wilde Zwijnen (The Wild Pig) and Moeders (Mothers).
You can visit Windmills with a 40 minutes bus ride. Pretty nice things to see and to taste (cheese!!!).
Thanks for the advice! I'll be sure to keep it in mind :)
I was disappointed with Paris in my last visit. It's filthy, dirty and disgusting.
Aah, Paris đ„°
Compared to NYC, Paris is downright spotless.
NYC was also disgusting.
Olten
Shhh Olten doesn't really exist. It's just a railway junction.
Outside of the obvious war, Kaliningrad in certain conditions. If you have local friends there you trust, or you are fluent in Russian, you'll have a great time. Its got a lot of nice history, some nice views, and its cheap. But if you're an obvious tourist, they do not treat you kindly. I wore a tank top and shorts in the city on my way from Svetlagorst beach and got side eyes for my tattoos and attire. If you're used to stereotypically polite service, it's not as prevalent there in Russia. And if you try to be nice, you're seen as a weirdo.
Lithuania is also hit or miss. Vilnius and Klaipeda are nice, but are NOT tourist friendly. I used to live there, but when I went back as a kid, my mom and I spoke English and Russian. They tried to overcharge our meal significantly but my mom knowing Lithuanian caught it. The people at the corner store also questioned why I only speak Russian, and hesitantly spoke with me. Plus people on the street would call out appearances if you look different. Really good fuckin pizza though
Can't exactly blame the Lithuanians for distrusting Russians, tbh. They have been not exactly kind to the country in the recent past, with their russification and whatnot.
Depends. Are you white? Would you be recognizable as a "foreigner"? In the latter case avoid all of Germanys provinces, especially in the former East. Do not travel alone and be wary of the cops. They are usually the same groups as the local Neonazis.
Those who work forces are the same that burn crosses.
I'm white af, but, as an American, I didn't get treated as rudely anywhere else in Germany than Berlin. Still had a great time overall in the city, but, not really in a rush to go back.
My friend and I were standing at a bar mulling over the menu, just kind of murming to one another over what drinks we wanted while we were waiting for the bartender to finish up with his other customers. It wasn't busy, but he was attending to other people. When he was finally done, he approached us and I said "Hi how are you?" with a smile. He didn't say a single word to us, just took the menus from in front of us and put them on the back shelf, and then turned away.
So we left. Our money clearly wasn't good enough there, and we spent it in another bar across the alleyway instead.
Well berlin is certainly a different place than the rest of germany. They are famous for their "berliner schnauze" like new york or paris are famous for honest and/or rude people.
I mean, it's still a place I'd tell people to go visit. The bars/restaurants are awesome, and the (not so distant) history is sobering. I found the Stasi museum hella interesting/terrifying.
I'd just mentally prep people before-hand for the, ah, "bluntness" đ
When he was finally done, he approached us and I said âHi how are you?â with a smile.
There's probably the problem. Don't ask a german "how are you", they will interpret it as the start of a conversation, not a greeting. You might either get weird looks or a detailled personal and medical history of that person. In food service, you get to the point. A "Excuse me" or "Can we order please" is a way better way to initiate an order.
As a Dane Iâd guess they didnât realize Americans use it as a greating and so assumed you to be initiating a conversation unrelated to ordering, possibly with bad intentions.
It would be a little like starting the conversation with a âhow is your motherâ, it would signal way more familiarity than was had, come way out of left field and be generally unwanted when you are working if you donât have time to stop for the conversation that would ensue.
Donât get me wrong, I donât think you did anything wrong necessarily, itâs just a cultural difference that likely causes misunderstandings if none of the parties are aware of it. Iâd liken it to a Eurpean going to a restaurant in the US, not tipping anything and how both parties may feel the other party to be rude after the fact if the server let their dissatisfaction show.
I could of course be wrong and they may just have been an ass, plenty of those in tourist heavy areas for sure. Just something to consider if it could have been the case.
What did that mean ? I'm not sure how to interpret. Why would the barkeep do something like that ?
My friend and I just assumed he could tell we were American and didn't want to serve us. We didn't stick around to ask. And he didn't tell us off or to leave or anything, but just more blatantly ignored us.
Like I said, overall still good time. Everyone else was nice and happy enough to chat/serve us (or at least appeared to be lmao)
So, shitty service one place but fine across the street ? And Berlin kinda sucks?
In the east maybe, its definetly not bad at all in northern germany (Schleswig Holstein).
Rostock is okayish too, we're a tourist town with quite a few foreigners. Just don't go to the rural areas as a non-white person.
Do you mean "provinces" as in federal states or as in hillbilly regions?
"hillbilly regions". But that can include cities with up to 200k 300k inhabitants in the former eastern Germany.
There are over 40 nations in Europe. Most of which have 2000 years of individual history.
What kind of answer are you looking for, exactly ?
Reading the title, I would presume OP wants someone from one of those over 40 nations in Europe to say where tourists should avoid at all costs.
There was a post earlier today complaining about questions that aren't open-ended, and therefore don't adhere to the community rules. So here we are with a question with many possible answers (which makes it properly open-ended).
OP is a close relative of "Hey everyone, I have 5 days to visit Europe, what's the best route to see everything?"
If you go to Naples and the Amalfi coast, everything is expensive. That's expected, but do not for any reason use the trains. Gangs will rob you, possibly worse.
But do go. Sorrento is lovely but very commercial. Find the small towns where the Italians go.
And visit Pompeii, it's extraordinary.
EDIT - I may be wrong about the trains, please see the further comments in the thread.
Really? I took the circumvesuvian railway a couple of years ago and it was just a regular commuter train.
I was warned off by locals and they did look very dodgy. It's entirely possible they were referring to a different, more specific line, but I didn't get that impression and I wasn't about to find out for myself.
Apologies if I'm wrong, I'll edit my comment.
Those trains sure look dodgy, in a post-apocalyptic kind of way. Sometimes people jump to conclusions that it must be full of crime
Public transit seemed relatively safe to me, when I was there 2 years ago. The Amalfi coast is no that great though. Rather go to Naples, use a day for small boat trip to either Capri or Ischia, one day to take the commuter train to Herculaneum. After that take the train from Naples to Salerno, which is a good bit less touristy and ceaper than the real Amalfi coast. Perhaps take a boat from Salerno to look at the Amalfi coast from the sea (more beautiful that way anyway) or enjoye some of the beaches that are reachable with public transit nearby. In Salerno you can also take a train or Bus to Paestum, which is a UNESCO world heritage site has some greek temples from 600 BC.
Bullshit
If you go to Britain, bring your own food.
Britain has some seriously great food - I don't know if you're just memeing but their Indian food is probably the best in the world and traditional fare like pies, sausages, cheeses and fried fish are all delicious.
If you're vegan you are going to have an unpleasant time, though.
The best vegan recipes are indian. You can certainly eat well as a vegetarian in London, but most places will have an indian restaurant with a few veggie choices.
Veggie is a lot easier than vegan. Ghee is used a lot in Indian cooking.
Fair point!
Depends where you go, the vegetarian and vegan scene in Brighton is pretty damn impressive.
I have a friend who went to London and just ate at Whole Foods all the time. So, vegans can survive.
Thatâs actually a good rule of thumb for every scenario in life.
France is beautiful, i'm always coming back.
I mean I'll probably never get over there, but I'd love to visit Carentan (because WWII...well COD2...I loved that map lol) and Suave (because a cartoonist I like lives there.)
Had a couch surfer stay with us a while in Kuwait. He'd been everywhere. He said that, of all places, Moldova had no redeeming qualities. Granted, things might have changed in 10 years. Does anyone care to weigh in?
The news say Eastern Ukraine, though take that with a grain of salt as I haven't been there personally.
Bude. Don't go to Bude. There is nothing to see there.
Eastern Ukraine isn't an ideal tourist spot at the moment.
But the minefields are a banger scnr
The internet has broken my brain.
scnr is a new one on me and in an attempt to figure it out, my brain did not land on the now rather obvious "sorry, could not resist" but "skibidi cap no rizz" as some kind of ironic initialism
I'm gonna go and find some grass now
our brains are mush fr đ
I read it as scenario ÂŻ\_(ă)_/ÂŻ
I read it as scenery. Probably because the thread is about travel.
"smoke copium, non-resident"?
I only git as far as SNCF, the French railway company. Just a transposition and a single pen stroke away.
Russia in general also.
As a European from elsewhere in Europe, I'm never going back to Milan. Maybe it's fine if you're into fashion, but if you're not there's not much to look at except a cathedral which resembles every other cathedral, and it's impossible to get a photo of it without also having a friendship bracelet scammer in the frame, actively harassing you.
All tourist locations in Italy and France have people trying to scam you (and some non-scammers just trying to sell you cheap toys), but Milan is the only place I've been to where they're straight up harassing you non-stop. Go to Pisa instead, it's super relaxing there and you can marvel at their past mistakes in structural engineering. A far better deal.
Scammers abroad: Troll with randomness. Laugh at inappropriate times. Nod at them while making the eating food gesture. Randomly start pointing down a street like you're trying to give directions but just shrug. Pick a random sports team name and say, "Gooooo EAGLES!" while nodding and dancing. Basically pick some random thing, pretend they said it, and you're going along with it.
If they're pointing to friendship braclets, you say "9 o'clock." even though it's 1:30. If they keep doing it, you just laugh, nod, and clap.
My favourite is pretending I'm deaf and making up signing. When they start gesturing, I repeat the gesture in shock. When they nod, I act disgusted like they're sick in the head.
They will very quickly move on since you're a waste of time. The more awkward you make it, the better, especially if you're drawing looks from others.
I've used very similar techniques on men in bars who don't think no is a complete sentence.
I'm well past the age for shame. I will make a fool of myself if it means some twerp will think twice about harassing a woman who's repeatedly turned them down
I'd never considered doing the same for scammers - great idea! I'm just overly polite and that makes me seem like a target I think.
I have personally yelled, "Fuck off! No means no you fucking creep!" at the top of my lungs in a crowded bar. It was genuine, but over the top so every other person would turn and see them, ruining their chances of "picking up" at that establishment, forcing them to leave.
"Are you okay?"
"Oh, yeah I'm fine. That guy just needed to learn a fucking lesson."
That is hilarious but too much effort. A simple 'Fuck off' should suffice.
That does work too, but not on the ones that put shit on you and demand payment, usually operating as 2+. Their tactic is intimidation and dramaâplaying the victim to youâbut it can not be beaten if you're playing the role of a happy idiot, providing random or exact opposite behaviour to what they're attempting.
One of these guys walked up and gave me a handful of birdseed, prompting a flock of pigeons to come perch on my arms. I most certainly did not hand over the money they wanted for the experience I didnât ask for and was somewhat disgusted by.
I just don't engage. You don't have to talk back and they get the hint rather quickly that there are more rubes nearby.
Pisa is bad too, it is just the tower and crazy tourist prices.
How about Venice?
Venice kind of has a Disneyland vibe.
There aren't any scammers, the place is filled with history, and is relatively well kept and run. The flip side to it is that feels like a theme park at times.
It also has Disneyland prices.
I was in Venice pre-covid. I spent a day walking around and soaking in the sights and sounds. Sat by myself for an hour listening to some guy play the chello. It was beautiful. Never got harassed by street peddlers or scammers unlike in Milan. The architecture was beautiful like nothing else. Its a city trapped in the Renaissance era.
Pisa has a few other places, but you can see the city in a day and not miss anything.
I liked the middle finger statue
Funny you should say that; I went to Florence some years back and we took a day trip to Pisa and had to deal with the worst, most aggressive scammers I've ever experienced.
We may have just gotten lucky. I also had a great time in Venice once by wandering off randomly and ending up somewhere I can only assume tourists don't normally go. We bought some fruit off a boat which was both delicious and very affordable, so I assume the target demographic was not tourists. I'm pretty sure that's not the universal experience of Venice either.
I really enjoyed visiting Cimiteiro Monumentale in Milan. A historic cemetery with lots of lavishishly designed huge tombs. Very few tourists there and no scammers whatsoever.
Canary Islands. Great place, but the mass tourism is actually killing them, provoking skyrocketing rent and shortages of power and water.
Indeed. My girlfriend lives there, last time I was over we went to the big demonstration against mass tourism. I felt a bit sick at the airport listening to all the north European pensioners talking about how they rent a place year round for 800âŹ/month just to spend the odd week now and then there. While many locals working in tourism make minimum wage, around 1300âŹ/month I believe.
Hey that's exactly what my rent / wage split was in the UK last year. The only reason anything got better is that minimum wage went up while my rent hasn't yet.
Switzerland. If you've got buckets of money it's fine but donair can easily run you 18 francs and a real meal will cost you 100+. I've visited twice and both times the extreme costs involved have hamstrung my ability to actually enjoy things. The trains and geography are amazing - but the streets full of jewelers and high fashion specifically targeting millionaires or up are an awful example of late stage capitalism.
Sorry but you're exaggerating, a full meal including drinks in a mid-level establishment will be at max. 50 chf and that's being generous. And with cheaper places you can even stay below 20 chf.
Yes, Switzerland is expensive but there's no need to lie about it. Also the stuff about millionaires and all maybe fits a couple streets in Switzerland that are very touristy but there are plenty of places not at all like this.
Donair? What's that? Fancy Doner Kebab made with Don Perignon and air?
My first experience with this food was in Halifax decades ago. The Halifax Donair is a unique thing.
And it's definitely Donair, not Doner.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donair
Interesting. The creation has a Wikipedia page.
Funny enough you are legally not allowed to call that a Döner in the EU. (Döner by law must not use ground beef. If they do you can call them Kebab,but not Döner)
y'all are missing out on the kapsalon
Itâs the French transliteration. Doner would be pronounced âdonayâ.
A full meal including drinks will usually run 50 chf per person if you're a couple most meals will run 100+ - it is possible to eat on a budget (we've usually relied on sausage stands and donair). And yea, I'm mostly talking about what you'll find in Lucerne, Zurich, or Geneva where you're likely to visit.
I donât know where youâre eating lol. A döner in zurich is about 14-15 francs at the moment never seen one for 18 francs and they increased prices the last two years as well.
If youâre having a meal and drinks for 50 francs per person you have likely been to a fancy restaurant. Donât get me wrong, it absolutely is possible to easily go over 50 francs, however its also is very easy to stay below that and still have a good experience.
Iâve visited multiple times with a camper, and if you use apps like park for night to find free or cheap places to stay!then buy your own ingredients to cook, itâs actually really acceptable. And the nature is gorgeous!
Same for me, with a bicycle and tent. Camp sites are also ok priced, at least for cyclists. Very much enjoy cycling in switzerland, i also think people are friendly. I used to have different experiences but those were just single persons / crazy people or something.
What the fuck...??? đČ
Well it's simply not true, doeners are 10-15, and meals in sitdown restaurants are 12-25. I live in Zurich, restaurants are slightly cheaper than in the US ( plus there is no tip or extra tax, what you see on the menu is what you pay) - but there are less budget options available.
I live in switzerland and my lunch costs CHF 2.50 so I don't know where you've been eating for one hundred + francs for a 'real meal'.
I paid 20⏠for a Pizza Margherita in Oslo once. In some very rich places you can feel like a tourist from a developing country even if you are from a less-rich high-income country yourself.
Andorra. Full of motor bozos, duty free shops, terrible cities in the valleys. A tax haven joke country. Nice mountains i guess.
Hey! I will not tolerate this kind of racism against influencers! /s
Oh influencers. Haven't thought of those, that fits i guess.
What's a motor bozo?
The tax criminals / profiteurs of tax criminality driving their loud fancy sports cars through the andorran valleys and up to the golf courts.
It is a machine that converts electrical energy into mechanical energy and stop calling me Bozo.
Passed through earlier this year specifically to visit Caldea mineral springs. Absolutely worth it if youâre nearby.
That's the same in San Marino. It's nice but come on, it's full of duty free shops and shops that sell arms that are illegal in Italy
As others said Switzerland. It's beautiful and all but really expensive. It really took away a big part of fun when I went there. But not only that, I thought the swiss people seemed sometimes kinda "rude"or maybe a better word for it "cold" and a little annoyed if it came to tourists. I get it, it's a small county and a lot of people are visiting each year, but it still wasn't fun for me to be there and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone to go there.
And North France near the German border like Strasbourg. The city and the region is beautiful as well, but the people are often like the cliché everybody knows and that sucks if you're a tourist. But the south of France like Marseille and the Provence is always worth a visit. The people are chill, enjoying life in the typical mediterranean way and are often friendlier (and often speak English at least in the bigger cities/tourist areas).
I have some Swiss-American relatives, and I think this is cultural. They just have a different set of indicators, they're not going to be grinning and hugging.
As an Anglophone who lives in France, I agree. Although where I live (east / south-east) English is not very widely spoken, even in bigger cities, but the people are generally very friendly.
...but it all goes wrong again at the south coast. Even the locals leave for the summer.
This is my experience with Europeans in general tbh
So knowing that European consider Swiss people cold, imagine how cold they are.
They are stone cold to foreigners - so many English speaking wealthy people live there and they are not welcomed into the local communities. It can take a decade to make local Swiss friends.
Then you should visit south europe. Europe is divided by the alps in a lot of things, like potato or tomato as main ingredient in meals. But also in culture itself. Everything north of the alps is kinda cold and seems unhappy/angry and stressed all the time and south of it people seem chill, happy and friendly.
As a counter example, I managed to make friends with a Swiss person while elsewhere in Europe, and then later in my travels got to visit them in Switzerland for a few days. My time there was truly one of the most breathtaking and memorable experiences of my trip.
Maybe it's expensive, maybe Europeans are "cold" personality wise, but God damn they have got some incredible scenery.
Not a place in particular, but if you're driving, avoid any border crossings during peak holiday seasons. Specifically when you're crossing from the EU into non-EU countries or crossing from Schengen into non-Schengen area. During peak times you might be waiting at the border for hours.
Don't drive! You're in Europe... trains go fucking everywhere!
It seems like you've never been to Germany
Wanted to say that too. I mean, technically the train network is pretty well connected but it's so underfunded that trains oftentimes don't drive at all or they're late and then every train after that is also late. It's mostly fine but it happens way too often. I had to stand in freezing cold for an hour or longer too many times in the last three years where I took the train daily.
I don't know, maybe it's just particularly bad where I live, but I regularly have to the the god damn Schienenersatzverkehr, and even this god damn fucking bus that is supposed to replace the train is always like 20 minutes late. Like how the fuck do you even mess that up DB? HOW?!
Yeah, I had to take a SEV for a while too because there was construction on the train tracks and I came late every single day because apparently nobody at DB thought that 2 full trains (and with full I mean that people always had to stand because there weren't enough seats) couldn't just fit into one bus. That bus was always completely full (people standing in the middle up to the front door) and a lot of people still just wouldn't fit in.
Average DB experience
Things get less well connected in the more eastern nations, especially heading down to Greece.
Well, there are some exceptions. This year, I'm travelling by train to all my holiday destinations, but the last connection I will fly because the trains run in such a stupidly way.
Yea - my statement is generally accurate for Western Europe. Eastern Europe, especially the Balkans, is awful for high-speed coverage.
In my case actually Western Europe, but a very specific connection that would either need to go through the alps (which means slow speeds and switching trains a lot) or take a huge detour via Paris.
The high speed Internet coverage is quite the opposite though.
Just to note, this doesn't apply to the UK. Our trains are generally useless and expensive.
I wouldnât say at all cost, but Montenegro isnât fun. Russians have built massive hotel resorts on the beaches there, the locals are unhappy that theyâre there so they donât like tourists. Theyâll try to fight you on the beach because youâre not local. Get hassled by the cops because youâre not local, but youâll be able to buy your way out of your problem if youâre lucky. People donât want to talk to you, everyone is pretty cold and borderline rude. Go to a bar for a drink and you get a glass nominally washed/rinsed in tubs of soapy water behind the bar that the previous 100 glasses went through and hasnât been changed out. The landscape is beautiful in a hostile sort of way, but thereâs just not much reason to visit. Itâs not even particularly inexpensive. The hotels will try to charge you for everything, including a scuff on the wall that you didnât do, a chip on a planter on the balcony, etc. ridiculous money grabs.
idk about the process in montenegro, but it's pretty normal in america for bars to use a three compartment sink with a christmas tree scrub brush stuck to the bottom of the first sink, which is filled about half full with soapy water, a rinse water mixture in the next one and a sanitizer water mixture in the last one.
it's a fast and safe way to do dishes by hand, especially glassware if you always inspect for chips afterward (which you should be doing anyway!).
I understand thereâs a right way to do it, but allow me to assure that the two murky trays behind this bar were not acceptable by any means. I didnât want to get too graphic, but glasses went from the customer hand, a quick slosh and a rub in liquids that would make any civilized health department shriek, wiped âdryâ with a filthy rag that had just wiped the bar top, filled with the next drink and handed to the next customer.
This is the kind of stuff where you see it in a movie like so: the scoundrel hero walks into a dive bar in the spaceport, orders a drink, the camera makes sure you see the pustulent, greasy alien clean the vessel using the above process. The alien pours a questionable liquid into it, and slides it to the observing hero who has been keeping a stone-faced expression but for a hint of discomposure as he receives the drink. After the briefest pause in frame to let you know he questions what he is about to do, he downs the beverage. You canât help but cringe along with the hero and think licking the alien might have been safer.
(Am not comparing or suggesting Montenegrins are in any way shape or form like the hypothetical alien)
Places where you only order highballs due to health concerns ftw.
Common tourist places during tourist season are usually the worst. I took a 10 day trip to Paris one summer and it was a mix of the most popular tourist places (Louvre, Eiffel tower, etc) and some underground shit my sister found.
Every tourist place was jam packed with annoying tourists, costly and had tons of scammers surrounding it. Every less known place was really awesome, aside from one sketchy neighborhood we had to walk through where we were followed for a while.
I'd also say that Northern Europe has generally been much more pleasant to travel through, for me.
Here's what I would avoid when traveling to Poland:
Also in general avoid capital cities, they are often the worst of major cites in a given country.
My wife an I were on a Roadtrip from Germany to Poland for a holiday and did go to a lot of beautiful places. But Zakopane is stuck in my mind as the most touristy place I did ever go to. The High Tatra mountains are still beautiful but we had to wait in line to even enter the hiking trails. And on the trails it was just hundreds of people trying to make photos without other people in the background.
I forgot two places - both as bad as Zakopane - One is the Hel(l) Peninsula, it's as overcrowded as Zakopane; but it has a single road (one lane each way) that gets jammed very fast, you can be stuck there like 5 hours, even though it's only 30 Km long. The second one is Krynica Morska, a town located on the Vistula Spit(separating Vistula Lagoon from GdaĆsk Bay, in the Baltic Sea) and it has the same problem as Hel - it's a popular destination with only one road in and out.
Paris, it's the WORST city in all of France.
Yes, please don't come to Paris. It's crowded enough as it is. Also we're all very rude.
I once had a French co-worker tell me that the rest of France would divorce you if they could.
Paris is 80% people from the rest of the country. Which their former neighbours promply hate as soon as they move there.
It's traditional.
From what my former Parisian grad school housemate told me, I concur. He once said in reply to a friend (named Roger) asking him why people in Paris were mean to him and hate Americans, my housemate replied, "Oh Rogers, zhee French do not hate Americans, zhey hate EVERYONE, especially zhee other French". My experience in Paris was that the Parisians were surprisingly friendly. But I speak a little French and say Bonjour and Merci when warranted.
My experiences in Rocket League can confirm. People being toxic in chat? Tell them something in chat back -- get the "tg" to confirm French. Every goddamn time, always the French that are so rude.
Why? Why are they having such a bad day every day? Play a game to have fun ffs.
Not to hijack a thread, but what does lemmy consider the BEST place in France? I'd like suggestions.
Please don't hate me: Paris, really.
Bretagne
the south, I'm told.
Toulouse is a pretty laid back larger city that is beautiful without being overly touristy
If you want to stay in Germany and hop across the border, Strasbourg and Colmar are both nice towns. Has German influence but you get the benefits of being near the black forest for a 2 for 1 trip.
Lyon. 3rd sized city. Best food of France. 2 rivers. centre of France so close to anything. should have been the capital of France if the kid of one king didn't die there for some reason, or whatever
Lyon is pretty great. Depending on the vibe you're going for, Marseille is also pretty awesome. I'd avoid it in the middle of the summer, but shoulder season down south is amazing. The weather is great, the people are friendly (if you avoid the worst parts of town, like anywhere) and the food is a nice mix of traditional French and Mediterranean cuisine. And make sure to get a flight of Ricard.
Most places in the south
La Rochelle, Nantes are both nice from my experience.
I really liked Paris đ„Č I did go during the end of October though, so that might've have been a factor. People still didn't want to talk to me in French, but they weren't rude about it.
My favourite place to visit in France was La Rochelle, I feel like I got most of the benefits of visiting Coastal France but without the Marseille/Toulon/Monaco crowds (yes I know, Monaco is not France).
I've been to Paris 3 times, I'm from BC in Canada. April, May and October I went. Had an amazing time every time, people, food, places. It's one of my favorite cities.
"Nobody goes there, it's too crowded"
Correct, it's the worst most popular place
Done. Iâve been on vacation in France many times, visited many regions and provinces. Never been to Paris.
The capital cities. If you want authentic Europe, find the weird local festivals where people chase cheese down a hill or celebrate local culture or something. That's real Europe. Fuck the big cities and their galleries and museums.
https://www.egremontcrabfair.com/
https://airguitarworldchampionships.com/en/home/
https://www.latomatinatours.com/
https://riddu.no/en
https://www.theshed.co.uk/independent
https://cipc.pipeclubs.com/events/british-pipe-smoking-championship-2/
https://www.visitvoss.no/en/smalahovetunet
https://www.sbf.se/sportgrenar/folkrace
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinkensport
https://eukonkanto.fi/en/front-page/
https://www.uphellyaa.org/
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3200955/Festival-girls-dress-shire-horses-boys-push-tiny-ploughs.html
https://www.gloucestershirelive.co.uk/news/cheltenham-news/man-shatters-toes-winning-world-8977482
These are a few things off the top of my head mostly northern and western Europe because it's what I'm familiar with. Also if you want to see something bizarre, go to Finland on free bucket day. But seriously Europe is full of unusual things to do. Or you could go to yet another gallery and pretend to be interested in paintings.
Not sure what answers you looking for, if you want to have a carefree vacation just read some reviews of specific countries and regions.
If you are backpacking or planning a multi-country trip I would check the crime rates of the places, there are many websites with the statistics available, like THIS
As a general rule of thumb popular places and big cities will have the highest crime rates, while smaller cities and countryside the lowest.
Also I would avoid solo trips and backpacking in general in the rural parts of less-developed countries, like Romania, etc.
Pretty much thats it. Europe as a whole is probably one of the safest travel destinations in the earth with some planning and common sense.
Ignorant North American here but I'm now legit wondering what happens to people backpacking-possibly-solo through places like Romania. đŹ
Natural hazards like "If you twist an ankle you'll get no comms service and be eaten by a bear." aside, of course.
Buddy system is never a bad idea. :)
I'd say Romania is actually relatively safe crime-wise for tourists. Comms services are better than in my homecountry (always had 4G on my last trip to Romania even in rural places in the mountains, while I sometimes do not have any signal in German high-speed trains between two large cities). Dangerous widlife is actually an issue. Lot's of bears, wolfes, snakes, etc. Also bad tourist infrastructure in really rural places.
No problem, its not some golden rule you should follow (especially from an internet stranger) but it's mainly bad roads, bad economy (poor police/ambulance availability), the little Roma villages/gipsy makeshift living areas, where I would not show up alone with any valuables (similar to gipsy ghettos near big cities) and last but not least wildlife. While bears and other predators are not uncommon, rabid dogs are also a possibility.
Before somebody accuses me hating Romania (its a beautiful country with incredible landscapes and the capital and developed parts are very popular tourist destinations), the above is also applicable for many other europen countries. This is why I strongly suggest doing some research before planning such trips, as the relative safety and enjoyment of a holiday can vary from region to region within a small country. This is why its borderline impossible to give a straight answer to the original post.
Nothing happens to them because all the bad parts of Romania aren't in places where backpackers would go. Only "bad" part of visiting Romania is that tourism isn't as developed as in other countries. So not as many signs/information/buses to and from places. That also makes lots of places harder to find and reach but also a lot more pristine. Romania's countryside is one of the best, hands down.
Nothing. Romania is generally fine. I hitchhiked an couch surfed solo. Had only good experiences.
Don't come to Greece, over tourism is a huge problem here...
I feel you lol. I wish less people came to Portugal, especially Lisbon and Porto. It's a bit ridiculous sometimes. The culture people come looking for is slowly dying or becoming a fake version of itself because legit stuff is being pushed out of historical centers, in favor or tourist attracting alternatives. The issue of overpricing (because all the English, German, French, etc, visiting Portugal earn way better than us here in average) is ludicrous, it's becoming harder to enjoy the places we used to go 15 or 20 years ago.
sigh
It really is sad. For more than 25 years I've been visiting Portugal (so yes, I'm part of the problem...) and every year it gets a bit worse: endless new hotels destroying the beautiful views of the cliffs, villages mostly catering the needs of tourists, ...
I just wish I hadn't told everyone how amazing it is in Portugal đ„Č
It is, the the fault isn't entirely on the tourists (specially if they're respecting and give two fucks about the places they're visiting); the governments have been pushing tons of pro-tourism stuff everywhere for years, hence why we grew that industry so much, often without thinking of long term consequences and economic balance. So now, we have an economy overly dependent on tourism (with all the good but mostly bad stuff that brings), which, in addition to other shitty decisions like massive roadway investment instead of railway (we have one of the best road network in Europe, but a shitty railway one, significantly shrinked down in the last 40 years), have led to lots of serious issues preventing good development of a lot of other industry we could have and once had. The classic example is Algarve (the southernmost region) is so dependent on tourist they had a very hard time during COVID. Outside of Lisbon's (<2M) and Porto's (>1M) metro areas, every other city has less than 500k people, and the vast majority less than 100k, which presents obvious issues.
Anyway, sorry for the shit dump đ
That's really sad, because one day I wanted to go and learn Jogo do PĂŁo. I hear it's a dying art but they're trying to keep it alive.
lol
I believe "jogo da bolacha" is a more common name here X)
Lmao I was confused but I think I see where I got it wrong. I said "bread game" instead of "stick game". XD
Apologies for butchering the language. :)
...Lol the machine translation of "jogo do pau" appears to be...Less than polite? Hahaha.
So, clarification: I think rural stick fighting from Portugal would be really cool to learn. :) lol
Oh, you're a feisty one, aren't you!
ÎÎÎ ÎÎÎΩ. Even though my family works in the tourism industry (because my island literally only has that. Any sort of local economy was eradicated and everything is incredibly overpriced and imported), I have felt the negative effects deep in my soul, so much so I wish it would just dissolve even if that means they need to find another way to make a living. I'll be damned if I ever willingly work for traditional tourism (ecotourism I will consider)
Was about to say the same for Spain. Fuck you, tourists. Stay at home.
I got dragged to MĂĄlaga against my will (family stuff) and it was horrible. More pubs than tapas places to cater to the British crowds...
But Im planning a Honeymoon and want to enijoy your history. Can I go if I dont use airbnb?
I don't think there is any way right now to come without negatively affecting the locals. Essentially, the tourists to locals ratio is out of hand. A few of the problems we are facing:
As a personal note, my income is a few times the national average, and yet I cannot afford to go on vacations this year...
As a (not) fun challenge you can try to limit your budget to around 30 eur per day per person. You will fail, probably won't even find living accommodations within that budget, but it will give you an insight on our struggles.
Feel free to cross post to !yurop@lemm.ee , a laid back discussion community for Europeans
is there a good or suggested community for people looking to move to europe who are looking for advice? or is that place welcome for such discussion? dont want to intrude.
This is definitely a discussion that can take place over there!
Belgorod.
I have read of tourists coming to Vienna and thinking there is anything worth seeing north of the Danube.
Unless you count the UN headquarters, there isn't. All of that is a completely unstructured and boring mix of industrial, commercial and residential zones mostly built after WW2 like you find anywhere in the world.
I visited Vienna in 2015 and that's one of the places where I'd gladly move if I could.
In Sweden/Stockholm:
Avoid Akalla/Hjulsta/Kista
They are all boring and sees a lot of gang crime.
Just avoid Stockholm. Too many stockholmare. Visit Gothenburg instead
Both Stockholm and Gothenburg are really nice cities - they're pretty safe too unless you seek out drug lords or park your bike without a decent lock. Just don't come here during the winter - you'll be depressed by the lack of daylight.
The worst thing of Copenhagen is that you can see Sweden from there
I don't think many tourists would head out to the far away suburbs by subway. My recommendation is to avoid Drottninggatan and "City" with the exception of some architecture or particular places of interest because it is just really too much busy people and pickpockets and hot asphalt and concrete and glass and tourist traps and chain stores.
France is becoming a far right country on two weeks. Do yourself a favor and stay as far as you can.
So, should I stay on the left side of France?
Hold up, let's see what happens with the front populaire
Yeah, I'm not getting my hopes up unfortunately
Do get your hopes up, and your neighbours voting, please.
Who talks to their neighbors in this day and age? They'll probably vote for the party who wants my death anyway so yeah...
I mean yeah sure we could be surprised, but things aren't really going in the right direction
Honestly, I'll vote for them. But they disgust me with all their power struggle about who's going to be prime minister. In doing so, they're tearing apart the whole thing. They swore that they wouldn't betray us. They're betraying us everyday by showing everybody it's just a struggle between egos. They're paving the way for the far right too with this ridiculous display of inflated heads.
I'll vote for them, then I'll puke. The only frontliner I'm feeling like supporting in the future is, maybe, Manon Aubry.
And Italy, and Switzerland, and Hungary, and Finland....
Just make sure to avoid Brussels. Belgian myself and I hate the place.
Was recommended the same by someone from Brussels.
(He was not 6 foot and full of muscles, to be clear)
The vegemite sandwiches are enough to keep me away.
Back when Australia was still remote and exotic, before Crocodile Dundee even, a lot of people back in the day thought he sang:
"He just smiled and gave me a bit of my sandwich",
which would have also made for a fantastic lyric in a very silly way.
Did he speaka your language?
Does this mean you love it and want to keep it all to yourself? Also how does it smell?
No, I would tell you to avoid Ghent at all costs then!
Kinda enjoyed my 2 day trip....
I visited Brussels this a month ago, I loved it.
Just got back from a 3 day trip to Brussels, we loved it. Plus, Smurfs (Les Schtroumpfs) everywhere. We did take a day trip to Bruges though, that was even better than Brussels IMHO. Especially since I could walk around saying to my wife "If I grew up on a farm, and was retarded, Bruges might impress me but I didn't, so it doesn't.".
The green dots are all fascinating places that I've visited or want to visit in France
Note that none of them are in Pđ€źris
Paris is pretty sweet - just, for the love of God, don't fucking drive. The metro and easy access to long distance trains make it a pretty frequent stop for me.
Years ago Paris was great fun to drive around. Getting on and off the PĂ©riph can be hair raising but when you make it, the sense of elation makes you feel so alive!
I'm not selling it, am I?
Some people are into extreme sports. Driving in Paris can definitely be classified as such
Is it possible for you to share your list?
If you haven't been to France before, make Carcassonne your first stop. It's a wonderful village with an exceptional walled medieval hamlet.
The board game isn't bad either!
Just guessing by the username and domain, they probably heard of it!
I'm French ahah. But sometimes it's nice to see your country from an outside perspective. Being a tourist in your own country can be interesting!
Stopped there for a day on the way back from Spain. The walled Hamlet is beautiful, especially nice to stroll through the streets after dark.
Stay overnight next time! The town surrounding the citadel is actually really pleasant and one of the staples of cuisine local to that area is Cassoulet!
CDG airport. I hate that place so much.
Heathrow, Schiphol and Frankfurt are all so much easier to navigate.
On a serious note though: Iâve never bern anywhere in Europe that I straight up disliked. Sanremo was probably the «least friendly» with locals all pushing us towards the casino at every oportunity. The city was also surprisingly worn down.
The local market was awesome though.
Not a European, but I'm going with dark alleys.
Well, yeah, in some places, but there's countries where that's a far worse idea than in Europe.
If you used that rule in US cities, you would both stay alive, and miss out on some really cool bars.
There's one here in the US that doesn't have any signage at all. Just a lightly pink door. It opens down into one of the coolest restaurants and live performance places in the city. It has become pretty popular.
Yea, Philly has a few like this.
Dublin is a kip, you have far better options throughout Ireland, if you want a city go to Cork or Belfast. Galway is a bit boring to me but could be your scene. After that there are loads of little spots with loads going for them. The entire west coast is great.
Dont rent a big car, I mean big by irish sandards.
Zakopane, Poland. Greedy bastards.
Almost every reason given sounds like a description of my home of Florida.
I can assure you that my van and my basement are totally save! So come right in stranger.
Don't go to Amsterdam.
I'm reading this at Amsterdam airport. Trying to get the hell away from here asap.
Why?
because they don't know how to pronounce Schiphol and therefore are probably lost and too touristy to ask for directions
Well, it's more like we don't want them to come here.
As an American (but an immigrant), who wants to go to Amsterdam, what can I do to be mindful and not annoying?
I had a great visit there in 2013. Nearly everyone speaks English, but donât just assume, ask (in Dutch) if they speak English. Very walkable, with pretty great transit. Lots to see just walking around. Just be a normal person and youâll be treated fine.
Tbh even if you speak Dutch, they'll just reply English. That's the weird Amsterdam behavior
This happens in a lot of countries. For me I noticed it particularly with young people in Germany, and pretty much anyone in Norway.
Can make it slightly frustrating when actively trying to learn the language by speaking with people đ
I think that's kinda common in a lot of countries. If you look like you aren't from there then they will speak in English.
I dont think so. I even replied in dutch and they still continued in English. The only place that ever happened to me
Don't get really drunk or stoned and end up being obnoxious.
Try to be aware of traffic (especially bikes) and of blocking sidewalks/alleys etc. Look both ways on every lane of traffic you cross (including both bike lanes).
Try to branch out your trip from the exact center of the city (or by the train station) and don't rent an Airbnb inside the city center (they drive up local rents).
If you're standing on red bricks or red tarmac, you're probably blocking the bike lane.
If you can't see the bike lane, it's likely that you're standing in it (they aren't always marked).
As someone planning on going in a year or two, this is really good advice. Thank you.
Oh simply be polite and most of all have a sense of your surroundings/situational awareness, i.e., don't get in the way. You probably want to spend as little time in the main "downtown" area (roughly central station to the Rokin) as possible.
Although everyone under 80 years old speak near-native English (I exaggerate), you'll endear yourself by learning to say good morning, good evening, thanks, and please in Dutch and to start conversations by asking "Is English ok?" in Dutch.
Basically just don't be a jerk and the native Amsterdamers will happily take your holiday money.
don't get drunk and fall in the canal and drown when you're trying to take a piss
True, but also if you go to Amsterdam as a tourist, you'll end up in the tourist trap places. Shady coffee shops, tours of the red light district, and over priced bars where you have to pay for toilet usage. And you can be rushed through the Anne Frank house for a price.
Fair enough!
It's still possible, in my opinion, to visit as a "tourist" (I live in Haarlem now, so technically I'm a tourist when I go) and avoid all the trashy stuff. You can seek out the cool little neighborhoods like the Jordaan or de Pijp.
this is an extremely tourist friendly city. but it's also filled with drunk pieces of shit at night. they will try to fight you for a cigarette.
Yeah for sure, avoid big groups of British English speaking dudes for sure (and some of my best friends are English and they would agree!)
drunk people are garbage in general but English drunk people in Amsterdam are just fucked
And drugged pieces of shit as well. It's a horrible city if you don't do that kind of stuff
I visited Amsterdam last month and loved every bit of it.
As someone planning on visiting there in a year or two, do you have any advice?
The public transport system will make you feel like you're in the 2030s. Super simple. Have your smart phone or smart watch connected to a credit card, or just have a chipped credit card, and you boop your way in any transport, you boop your way out and it charges you for whatever distance you traveled.
The hotels are incredibly expensive there and we didn't take one in the old city, but somewhere at a reasonable distance from a subway station a little further from the city center.
Do not neglect the possibility to bike in the city. We were walking everywhere, or taking trams or the subway, and I wish we biked more.
Boat tours are cool, you learn a lot. Lots of museums to visit. And if you can afford it, try these restaurants for an extraordinary experience : Wilde Zwijnen (The Wild Pig) and Moeders (Mothers).
You can visit Windmills with a 40 minutes bus ride. Pretty nice things to see and to taste (cheese!!!).
Thanks for the advice! I'll be sure to keep it in mind :)
Why? Amsterdam is always a great time.
wat is dit nou weer voor onzin?
it's one of the more friendly capitols in europe
Ten opzichte van welke andere hoofdsteden?
Berlin
I was disappointed with Paris in my last visit. It's filthy, dirty and disgusting.
Aah, Paris đ„°
Compared to NYC, Paris is downright spotless.
NYC was also disgusting.
Olten
Shhh Olten doesn't really exist. It's just a railway junction.
Outside of the obvious war, Kaliningrad in certain conditions. If you have local friends there you trust, or you are fluent in Russian, you'll have a great time. Its got a lot of nice history, some nice views, and its cheap. But if you're an obvious tourist, they do not treat you kindly. I wore a tank top and shorts in the city on my way from Svetlagorst beach and got side eyes for my tattoos and attire. If you're used to stereotypically polite service, it's not as prevalent there in Russia. And if you try to be nice, you're seen as a weirdo.
Lithuania is also hit or miss. Vilnius and Klaipeda are nice, but are NOT tourist friendly. I used to live there, but when I went back as a kid, my mom and I spoke English and Russian. They tried to overcharge our meal significantly but my mom knowing Lithuanian caught it. The people at the corner store also questioned why I only speak Russian, and hesitantly spoke with me. Plus people on the street would call out appearances if you look different. Really good fuckin pizza though
Can't exactly blame the Lithuanians for distrusting Russians, tbh. They have been not exactly kind to the country in the recent past, with their russification and whatnot.
Kursk
Gelsenkirchen and Duisburg are kinda famous atm.
Depends. Are you white? Would you be recognizable as a "foreigner"? In the latter case avoid all of Germanys provinces, especially in the former East. Do not travel alone and be wary of the cops. They are usually the same groups as the local Neonazis.
Those who work forces are the same that burn crosses.
love me some rage
I'm white af, but, as an American, I didn't get treated as rudely anywhere else in Germany than Berlin. Still had a great time overall in the city, but, not really in a rush to go back.
My friend and I were standing at a bar mulling over the menu, just kind of murming to one another over what drinks we wanted while we were waiting for the bartender to finish up with his other customers. It wasn't busy, but he was attending to other people. When he was finally done, he approached us and I said "Hi how are you?" with a smile. He didn't say a single word to us, just took the menus from in front of us and put them on the back shelf, and then turned away.
So we left. Our money clearly wasn't good enough there, and we spent it in another bar across the alleyway instead.
Well berlin is certainly a different place than the rest of germany. They are famous for their "berliner schnauze" like new york or paris are famous for honest and/or rude people.
I mean, it's still a place I'd tell people to go visit. The bars/restaurants are awesome, and the (not so distant) history is sobering. I found the Stasi museum hella interesting/terrifying.
I'd just mentally prep people before-hand for the, ah, "bluntness" đ
There's probably the problem. Don't ask a german "how are you", they will interpret it as the start of a conversation, not a greeting. You might either get weird looks or a detailled personal and medical history of that person. In food service, you get to the point. A "Excuse me" or "Can we order please" is a way better way to initiate an order.
As a Dane Iâd guess they didnât realize Americans use it as a greating and so assumed you to be initiating a conversation unrelated to ordering, possibly with bad intentions.
It would be a little like starting the conversation with a âhow is your motherâ, it would signal way more familiarity than was had, come way out of left field and be generally unwanted when you are working if you donât have time to stop for the conversation that would ensue.
Donât get me wrong, I donât think you did anything wrong necessarily, itâs just a cultural difference that likely causes misunderstandings if none of the parties are aware of it. Iâd liken it to a Eurpean going to a restaurant in the US, not tipping anything and how both parties may feel the other party to be rude after the fact if the server let their dissatisfaction show.
I could of course be wrong and they may just have been an ass, plenty of those in tourist heavy areas for sure. Just something to consider if it could have been the case.
What did that mean ? I'm not sure how to interpret. Why would the barkeep do something like that ?
My friend and I just assumed he could tell we were American and didn't want to serve us. We didn't stick around to ask. And he didn't tell us off or to leave or anything, but just more blatantly ignored us.
Like I said, overall still good time. Everyone else was nice and happy enough to chat/serve us (or at least appeared to be lmao)
So, shitty service one place but fine across the street ? And Berlin kinda sucks?
In the east maybe, its definetly not bad at all in northern germany (Schleswig Holstein).
Rostock is okayish too, we're a tourist town with quite a few foreigners. Just don't go to the rural areas as a non-white person.
Do you mean "provinces" as in federal states or as in hillbilly regions?
"hillbilly regions". But that can include cities with up to 200k 300k inhabitants in the former eastern Germany.
Beware of blind Belgian nuns
Aberdeen. It smells like piss.
Usa
What part of europe is that?
There are over 40 nations in Europe. Most of which have 2000 years of individual history.
What kind of answer are you looking for, exactly ?
Reading the title, I would presume OP wants someone from one of those over 40 nations in Europe to say where tourists should avoid at all costs.
There was a post earlier today complaining about questions that aren't open-ended, and therefore don't adhere to the community rules. So here we are with a question with many possible answers (which makes it properly open-ended).
OP is a close relative of "Hey everyone, I have 5 days to visit Europe, what's the best route to see everything?"
If you go to Naples and the Amalfi coast, everything is expensive. That's expected, but do not for any reason use the trains. Gangs will rob you, possibly worse.
But do go. Sorrento is lovely but very commercial. Find the small towns where the Italians go.
And visit Pompeii, it's extraordinary.
EDIT - I may be wrong about the trains, please see the further comments in the thread.
Really? I took the circumvesuvian railway a couple of years ago and it was just a regular commuter train.
I was warned off by locals and they did look very dodgy. It's entirely possible they were referring to a different, more specific line, but I didn't get that impression and I wasn't about to find out for myself.
Apologies if I'm wrong, I'll edit my comment.
Those trains sure look dodgy, in a post-apocalyptic kind of way. Sometimes people jump to conclusions that it must be full of crime
Public transit seemed relatively safe to me, when I was there 2 years ago. The Amalfi coast is no that great though. Rather go to Naples, use a day for small boat trip to either Capri or Ischia, one day to take the commuter train to Herculaneum. After that take the train from Naples to Salerno, which is a good bit less touristy and ceaper than the real Amalfi coast. Perhaps take a boat from Salerno to look at the Amalfi coast from the sea (more beautiful that way anyway) or enjoye some of the beaches that are reachable with public transit nearby. In Salerno you can also take a train or Bus to Paestum, which is a UNESCO world heritage site has some greek temples from 600 BC.
Bullshit
If you go to Britain, bring your own food.
Britain has some seriously great food - I don't know if you're just memeing but their Indian food is probably the best in the world and traditional fare like pies, sausages, cheeses and fried fish are all delicious.
If you're vegan you are going to have an unpleasant time, though.
The best vegan recipes are indian. You can certainly eat well as a vegetarian in London, but most places will have an indian restaurant with a few veggie choices.
Veggie is a lot easier than vegan. Ghee is used a lot in Indian cooking.
Fair point!
Depends where you go, the vegetarian and vegan scene in Brighton is pretty damn impressive.
I have a friend who went to London and just ate at Whole Foods all the time. So, vegans can survive.
Everybody did. Now we have everything.
Feck off. Have a curry, ffs.
What a trope
No, no, let's let this play out.
Skelmersdale.
You should avoid France.
Thatâs actually a good rule of thumb for every scenario in life.
France is beautiful, i'm always coming back.
I mean I'll probably never get over there, but I'd love to visit Carentan (because WWII...well COD2...I loved that map lol) and Suave (because a cartoonist I like lives there.)
Had a couch surfer stay with us a while in Kuwait. He'd been everywhere. He said that, of all places, Moldova had no redeeming qualities. Granted, things might have changed in 10 years. Does anyone care to weigh in?
The news say Eastern Ukraine, though take that with a grain of salt as I haven't been there personally.
Bude. Don't go to Bude. There is nothing to see there.