Missouri law bars divorce during pregnancy – even in cases of violence
The statute, which can lead to reproductive coercion in a state that has banned abortion, has recently gained nationwide attention
At six months pregnant, H decided enough was enough. She had endured years of abuse from her husband and had recently discovered he was also physically violent towards her child. She contacted an attorney to help her get a divorce.
But she was stopped short. Her lawyer told her that she could not finalize a divorce in Missouri because she was pregnant. “I just absolutely felt defeated,” she said. H returned to the house she shared with her abuser, sleeping in her child’s room on the floor and continuing to face violence. On the night before she gave birth, she slept in the most secure room in the house: on the tile floor in the basement, with the family’s dogs.
Under a Missouri statute that has recently gained nationwide attention, every petitioner for divorce is required to disclose their pregnancy status. In practice, experts say, those who are pregnant are barred from legally dissolving their marriage. “The application [of the law] is an outright ban,” said Danielle Drake, attorney at Parks & Drake. When Drake learned her then husband was having an affair, her own divorce stalled because she was pregnant. Two other states have similar laws: Texas and Arkansas.
Missouri is a garbage state.
Why am I not surprised? The sad part is, Texans are delusional enough to think they're better than Florida, lol.
I genuinely believe texans are the most delusional people in the entire US.
Recently met a Texas resident who swore it was the best place "to raise children"
If the news are to be believed, I think it was probably a veiled anti LGBTQ victory lap
It wasn't a great place for Kyu Cho to raise his family.
FUCK Texas
I bet their reasoning somehow boiled down to "taxes." The anti-LGBTQ stuff is just icing on the cake for most of these people.
And the dumb part is that the taxes in Texas are on par with California, just done through different categories. So, you pay the same for significantly worse government services and significantly fewer rights.
Texas: the one star state
I have the delusion that I'm going to escape this state one day.
I sure hope you can. What would that require?
If you can find somewhere affordable in Colorado (unfortunately that would be in the sticks teeming wirh right wing nuts) I can highly recommend it.
You can do it! Just about any state is better than Texas.
Yes, even Missouri!
I still know people who spout texas being the "freesest state in the union"
Maybe for white protestant men?
The freezest state, I'd say.
Only if freedom also means submitting your identification for validation in order to browse porn.
I hate it here
You just offended Florida. They've worked hard for that title man.
Nah Florida knows what it is...
-Typed while unfortunately in Florida.
I am kinda calling BS on this, as I got divorced in Arkansas and there was never a question about my ex wife being pregnant nor was it ever mentioned by any attorney or judge. Maybe it’s only used when there is a clear sign of pregnancy or when the husband wants to control the wife who may have filed for divorce. This could be a new law as I got divorced over 10 years ago.
Oh!? A law that wasn't in effect when you went through the same life situation wasn't in effect when you went through it, so it's BS?
Was Henry Ford's Model T car, the printing press, and the fact that it used to be legal to own people also BS because those things weren't at the store last time you went?
It is not a case of whatever the fuck it is you want to think it maybe it. It is exactly the evil those who kinda call BS have sown, and the thresher is reaping its way to you eventually too.
"I'm calling bs on this" WTF??? Are you misogynistic, ignorant, just stupid, or all the above? Your reasoning is that you didn't hear about it personally 10 years ago when it might have been relevant to you?
When my personal experiences go against what a news article claims, I start to think critically about the source. I’m not disclaiming or debating anything about Missouri law, but by throwing in that comment about Arkansas seems like they are being a bit sensational to get a wider audience reaction. I would not doubt for a second if this law exists in either of those states, but it’s most likely enforced by choice.
Calling bs is disclaiming... think man think.... your tone is strong but tpur words are weak. Why do you think this is?
This law was JUST put in place
No, the law was passed in 1973. At the time, the Missouri legislature was still controlled by Democrats.
It was trying to stop men who would finalize a divorce before the birth of their child in order to avoid establishing their paternity.
Do they not teach geography in Arkansas? I guess not, so, FYI, Missouri is not Arkansas. They're different states with different state laws.
I think we should stop pitting states against each other in a race to the bottom and see this for what it is: working class people having their rights taken away by the wealthy elite. The more we are divided the easier it is to do this type of thing. The politicians are doing this, not the people. And they have set up and continued to prop up a system that under educated voters, while also underpaying them and blaming it on anyone else they can do everyone is mad at everyone. We need to stop blaming each other and band together and force them to fix it.
Thank you. Being a Texas resident, I'm not especially happy when I hear stuff like "all Texans are delusional", a lot of us simply don't have a choice in the matter of where we live. Some of us are trying to make this a better place to be, but it takes time and we're constantly blocked by rich assholes clinging to power like their lives depend on it (and they probably do at this point). Class consciousness is lifting up the less fortunate, don't put us down for laws and policies we had no say in creating.
Missouri was a shit state before this Trainwreck bullshit... nothing about it is redeeming... literally the entrance to the worst parts of this country.
That all being said your argument is correct 💯.
Third-world state government.
Shit hole, even.
This Christofascist shit is getting out of control. On what planet is a woman staying with her abuser a good thing? What do you think is going to happen to her child if she stays?
If a pregnant woman is wanting a divorce, you can be certain of two things: 1) there's a reason for it, and 2) that reason is none of your fucking business. The party of small government, ladies and gentlemen.
Most conservatives around the world claim that they want to be small government, but really what they want is to control everything everybody does and if it all possible thinks. They literally are the opposite of conservatism.
Maybe you should consider whether conservativism has ever meant what they said it meant, considering its historical positions of defending theocracies, monarchism, slavery, and fascism.
Limited government for me, my buddies, and my investments.
…but lots of laws are unfortunately necessary to protect the core of American values (i.e., me, my buddies, & investments) from all the undesirables out there!
/s
“Small government” has been redefined by conservatives. When a democrat says small government, they mean they don’t want regulation in every part of their personal life.
When a conservative says they want small government, they mean they want a government big enough to oppress minorities, but too small to ensure those minorities have their rights respected.
That mentality is also largely why conservatives get so up in arms about the norm being shifted, and new things getting normalized. Because the conservative mindset is entirely focused on conforming to the norm, and excluding those outside of the norm. So if the norm changes, they believe they need to change to fit the new norm or they’ll suddenly find themselves excluded.
It’s why they get so upset about minor shit like blue hair or piercings; As they begin to see it normalized, they begin to think “will I be forced to get piercings or dye my hair just to conform?” They explicitly support changes to the norm that already confirm their worldview and habits, because that further entrenches them as the protected norm. But they rabidly oppose the normalization of anything that doesn’t fit.
So if you’re a white married hetero couple with two kids, that’s what you’ll support. No divorces allowed, because we’re married and can’t normalize divorce. No blue hair allowed, because we’re Wonder Bread white and have never dyed our hair, and therefore can’t allow anything but natural hair colors. No abortions allowed, because childfree couples are a threat to our norm. No gay marriage, because we’re hetero and can’t shift the norm away from that. No drug decriminalizing, because the occasional bottle of wine has always been enough for us and we can’t normalize anything else. Et cetera, et cetera…
America is in its death throes. Republicans and Christians are choking her and the rest of us are just standing around wondering if anyone is going to step in and help.
The judicial branch was bought, the executive branch probably in on it and/or out of touch, the legislature branch is half circus half Corp sponsored... ya we have a 3 way and not that fun holiday vacation consensual kind...
A government that’s just small enough to fit through your front door and rule your personal life.
the same one where a rape victim is forced to give birth to that rapists child.
And, if these Nat-Cs get their way, the biblical rule that a rapist must marry his victim will probably become actual law.
The kid is going to become a neglected ignorant bigoted right-winger. Mission accomplished.
it's been out of control for 40 years since thatcher and reagan. that was its origin and those are the mistakes that need fixing - shitting on education and health care, shitting on mental health, shitting on doing anything the right way because it's not "the american way". honestly fuck america.
Holy fuck, that's been a law since the 70s! 50 years of supposed progress and that's still on the books. How far we've come.
It was considered progressive at the time, passed by a Democratic legislature in fact.
This law was meant to stop men from divorcing pregnant women as a way to avoid child support. By forcing men to wait until after birth, courts could set up child support during the divorce proceedings.
You know, from that perspective I can understand the point of it, but there should have been guard rails built in for women to escape abusive relationships. That was an extreme oversight.
Why not just put them on the hook regardless? This seems like a really stupid way to achieve that goal, with horrific consequences.
What the fuck?
How are you surprised?
Did you think conservatives finally started being honest with what they wanted?
They didn't stop with forced births, they won't stop with this, they want to go back to when women were literally property. Under control of their fathers until sold off in marriage for a dowry.
Because that's what the Bible says.
They just know that it's easier one step at a time then all at once.
If they get women as property, they'll push for other races and religions to also be property, because the Bible also says slavery was cool based on race/religion.
They're far right Abrahamic extremists, same as any other.
I am honestly surprised. I don’t live in the US and I just cannot fathom this being a law anywhere. Never in my wildest dreams.
The idea that you want a custody deal in place before the divorce, therefor pregnant women can’t get divorced is absurd and assumes a family law/divorce court wouldn’t ask that question, so I doubt that’s actually the reason.
This law just seems harmful and incentivizes awful awful things.
Welcome to America
The cruelty is the point
They wouldn't want that being determined by a judge who might not agree with them. Isn't too much of a problem anymore, but maybe it was fifty years ago.
Just say Christian. No need to drag Jews, Muslims, Baha'is, etc. into this mess.
They all have far right extremists, and they want the same things. The only difference is what prophets they follow, which I don't care about.
The far right extremists are the same as far as I'm concerned and I refuse to treat any of them as somehow better or worse.
So? Hindus have far-right extremists. Athiests have far-right extremists. If you have a problem with far-right extremism, just say that. If you have a problem with Christian nationalism, then say that. Naming the enemy matters.
What’s next? Gonna take away her ability to have her own credit card and bank account unless a man signs for her like we did in the ‘70s?
If they keep getting their way it probably actually is
But they can still backseat drive right? No? Sorry honey! I'm gonna have to put a gag on you while we drive over to your sister's...
Bad and naughty birds get the helmet of blindness.
Yes, actually. Conservatives believe women are property to be controlled. Misogyny has always been a core tenet of U.S. conservatism. This is just who conservatives are.
It's a law that perfectly demonstrates why religion needs to be completely separated from state affairs.
They simply do not want children born out of wedlock.
They also don't want children that results from adultery. They allow abortions for that. Wait, wait. Sorry, that's just the bible.
America has some serious vindictive fucks running the country
I can’t imagine how mean our government/culture must look to people who live in reasonable developed societies elsewhere. It looks insane from inside the country, and we’re the ones used to it and often related to the vindictive fucks’ voters!
Why the hell is America such a backwater shithole? Like the education system in my country is deeply flawed, but at least we don't have religious zealots.
Perpetuating the cycle of poorly educated religious zealots from a shithole backwater
It’s because the majority of the people, which are people who do not like this stuff, are also complacent as fuck and will tolerate just about anything if it means they don’t actually have to get off the fucking couch.
We've transitioned from 'off the couch' to 'grinding every waking moment to survive and are too tired to care about getting involved in local politics after you just got off shift at your second job '
at least we have strong free speech laws and quite a few states have good self-defense laws. some good, some great, but there's a handful of states that are terrible about any kind of self defense that involves killing a home invader
In quite a few places, you can't use force to remove a trespasser if they decide to camp on your land.
Well, who needs bodily autonomy when you can just use slurs without repercussion. I really don't get why you try to reason with free speech or self defense laws against against this intrusion of your actual freedom.
Being forced to keep a pregnancy going and then being forced to stay in marriage won't get better when you can legally say whatever you want or shoot someone trespassing on your land...
Imagine being so delusional, you think those are unique or even worse... Needing those. You fantasise about murdering someone, how about Living in a place where that's not even a consideration? I don't have to worry about someone invading my home and having to defend myself. 3rd world countries are safer than your sorry excuse of a nation.
And that's something else that makes a lot of the world look at America like a backwater shithole. Feeling the need to be able to kill other people - that might be important to many Americans but from the outside looking in it seems ignorant and barbaric.
Every state allows lethal force to protect yourself within your home. It’s a GOP talking point lie that states don’t allow you to defend yourself.
And yet, many (if not most) women who defend themselves from their abuser with a firearm get convicted on murder charges... mostly in the states you mention as having "good self-defense laws".
Imagine that - if someone camps on your land, you can just call the police. They will guide the trespasser out and initiate proceedings.
Wow the USA is surely running backwards full speed
This is a very old law. It's recently garnered attention, and while I don't disagree with you, I don't think the law by itself is a symptom of backsliding because it's been around for a long time.
Old law exist everywhere i have one where i live saying i can't throw little people on sunday the symptom of backsliding is actually using the law
Anti sodomy laws have been in place in many states for over 100 years. You are absolutely correct about enforcement.
Number one cause of death of pregnant people in the US is murder. I wonder what the rates are like in these states versus others.
i'ma go out on a limb here and say... the same? cuz "it's higher" was back over on the main stem...
I've seen this one before, they all gang up on you together and hatch a plan for revenge and the whole thing turns into a comedy.
Yeah, lets abuse a bunch of women for profit, that'll show those abusers! No, wait.. 🤔
One of the most depressing statistics that we all should be aware of: the murder rate for women goes up when they become pregnant.
Saying it goes up is a bit of an understatement. The number one cause of death for pregnant women is homicide. Most people assume it‘s some sort of pregnancy complication. But nope, it’s just straight up homicide. Because when a woman gets pregnant, there’s a good chance that the father is not okay with it.
Both of the major escalations in my relationship were when I was pregnant.
Don't get married and don't have kids, got it.
I'm almost 50, and I can not think of two better peices of advice.
I remember telling a guy years ago, I don't plan on getting married or having kids.."
His response was", Oh no, you got to, that's what the good lord wants. "
I replied with" What he be a good lord if he wanted you to jump off a bridge and kill yourself? "
He just walked away. I don't understand why people feel the need to live a life based on religion. Believe in what you want, but don't shove it in people's mouth like a penis. Just let people live their lives however they want.
It's all about power. People love having power and the men got their sky daddy's favor.
It's not rape if you're married.
Gotta stay married if you're pregnant.
Some states have codified: pregnant, bare foot and chained to the stoves
'Merica!
What the actual fuck is wrong with these people? They aren't even trying to hide the endgame here.
I guess it's time for blue states to start negating residency requirements for divorce. Just another step towards balkanization.
What even is the endgame here though?
So I get conservatives want many babies but without providing any care or (especially) pay, perfectly fuels their pockets this way. But how does this work to their advantage? You just get more abuse this way. How the fuck does that help in their baby factoring scheme?
Broken homes feed into the prison-industrial complex, the only remaining form of slavery currently allowed in our country? It's not just about the babies. You need to make sure they end up poor, desperate, and too broken to hope for better as adults.
It's easier to manipulate uneducated people into voting against their interests as well, so they want them poor and uneducated
the endgame is when they start saying "well I didn't think they were gonna do that" and acting all innocent as their fascist rhetoric turns the country into a fascist hellhole thanks to their violent dipshittery
Control. Power. Compelled obedience.
Seriously? The endgame is clear. Reduce access to education, force people to have kids that will be born in that environment and raise an ignorant neglected bigoted class that is easily controlled and manipulated.
Biblical law.
Suffering. Suffering is the endgame. They get off by causing those they feel are lesser to suffer as much as they can.
Never assume that there's an endgame. Some people just like watching others suffer.
Life is a journey, not a destination. <3
/s
Where did this shift of this country becoming full evil? It felt like people were learning to be more empathic then a huge sudden turn the other way.
There was a big shift after 9/11 that kept growing and amplifying
Edit: hate breeds and fosters hate. 9/11 injected a lot of hate
This goes back to the 70s at least. Desegregation and the sexual revolution really pissed off conservatives. They saw how the court was expanding rights and realized the power controlling the courts allowed. Since then their project has been to seize control of the judicial system by any means necessary.
https://www.commondreams.org/opinion/corporate-takeover-american-politics
This is what you're probably referring to. I highly recommend reading the document mentioned. It's enlightening to say the least.
Oh. So it's innate. Neat.
It's not a bug, it's a feature!
It's always been a feature which boiled up to the civil war, but instead of actually solving the issue, we kept kicking the can down the road. This is the government of stakeholders, just because on paper we broadened the election rights to a larger pool of people, doesn't mean your vote means anything in who gets paid and who's interest gets represented. That being said,, plz vote D in the general. Just go read the project 2025 if you're not convinced.
Obama got elected, and the white Nationalists and nazis came out of the slime. After 8 years of war on terrorism and extreme nationalism around it, they found an entire political party willing to hear and act on poisoned words.
The pump was primed, and here we are. Get to the polls and get everyone you know to go.
i too, once naively believed i lived in a unique time and that my generation would be the one to break the cycle. now i realize that only bullets can stop the cycle.
What is wrong with these people?
We need to start an organization that helps to rehome any woman in one of these states to a state with sane laws.
I feel truly sorry for the women who have been brainwashed since birth to agree with these laws that subjugate them, and continue to vote for the people passing them.
America ~~> Hold my beer!
To think divorce during pregnancy is allowed here, but not in the US. Maybe people in the US shouldn't fear Shariah law if they are adopting even more regressive laws.
The only reason she can't leave in this situation is because divorce would grant her an equal share of assets earned during the marriage thus allowing her to afford shelter and food for her and the kid. Under Islamic law the wife is not entitled to this so would be in an even worse situation.
Of course your country may have secular laws that do entitle fair division and protections, but that's not the question.
I was under the impression the reason she couldn't leave was because she was pregnant. I'll reread the article, but I didn't notice it being because she was entitled to half the property they acquired as a couple.
You think that she's a prisoner and can't leave physically because she's pregnant? I know america is wild but married women still have autonomy, the only reason she'd need to stay is economic.
Ahh yes, the wealthiest country on Earth and if you're pregnant, it would not be economical to not be beaten by a POS human that beats you and your child.
Seriously though, had she left and crossed state lines, she could have lost both her kids.
The ex wife is entitled to an allowance from her ex husband as are the children, she is also entitled to keep the gift her husband gave her to marry her. The state provides welfare too from monthly allowance to other services. She is not going to be homeless or sick without care if she ends poorer after the divorce.
Of course not all Muslim countries interpret Sharia exactly the same. I’m from Saudi Arabia which is on the more conservative side but has strong welfare. There are conditions on which the ex wife is not entitled to an allowance such as if she initiated the divorce. The courts can force the husband to divorce her but at the cost of waiving her financial benefits.
I think most people in the US still don’t get that many countries offer things like housing, healthcare and education as a right. A woman doesn’t need to be married to be financially secure here.
You're painting a pretty picture but the reality of life for women in this situation in your country is not something American woman would accept, maybe you're the one not aware how it is in the rest of the world.
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/03/08/saudi-arabia-law-enshrines-male-guardianship
I'm not from the US and I'm not a huge fan of their legal system but reality is reality.
This is a country that literally only started requiring the brides consent in marriage less than twenty years ago. Where women need to use the absher app on their phone which notifies and requests permission from their male guardian if they try to use their passport to travel. Let's not try and pretend a woman in the same situation as in the ops article would be better off in SA - especially as you yourself sat if she was in the same situation she would not be eligible as the initiator.
I think you should no more about Saudi Arabia. I think you are assuming that Saudi Arabia by default will be worse, but I see the differences as a matter of tradeoffs. When it comes to financial and material conditions the average woman in Saudi Arabia is better off than the average woman in the US. You could argue for other social or personal issues, but not when it comes to money.
She would definitely accept the free healthcare and more accessible abortions if she ever needed it 1 2 3
Are you sure about this? from what I know the current law states any women 21 or above doesn't need a permission from any male guardian. I know it was the case for my sister and female cousins. Either you or HRW are citing an old law.
She won't be eligible for an allowance from her husband, but she may still be eligible for a welfare allowance from the government. My sister initiated the divorce with her husband, and took him to court to force him to divorce her, and she is doing just fine financially, it helped that she was making more than him, but if she was poor she would qualify for housing and allowance from the government. Her son has a monthly allowance from the government in addition to the allowance paid by his father.
That is perfectly consistent within Missouri. In their eyes, allowing same-sex marriages is "bad" while doing things like this is "good".
Ironically, despite what the Bible says - e.g. in Peter 3:7 commanding husbands to likewise treat their wives with respect, and the punishment of literal death commanded for adultery.
So they are doing the opposite of what the Bible commands themselves, while still using that book as justification for working to overturn things like Roe v. Wade for everyone else. Jesus Himself must be livid at how these hypocrites are abusing His name, and polluting the message of "show love/kindness to one another my dudes, especially those who you disagree with". People are literally dying.
We need a revised Bible that just says, "Treat your wife as a bro."
If only wives could have the same rights as a frozen embryo!? 🥲
If only.
Alright, so it's quite obvious to me now that the US government is full of people with a breeding kink and it's enough to make bills pass, what happened to sexual deviance diversity!
I could absolutely see many of them being in favor of forced birth for ordinary non-sexy reasons.
If you are so broken that you think society’s first priority is the growth of you and your buddies’ investments, then it’s not much of a leap to support shitty ways to keep the working class growing.
Yeah okay, this is fucked up.
... Or Fargo season 5 prologue
If this had been a law for me, I and my children might very well be dead now.
Misery indeed
Everyone needs to realize white supremacists have disguised themselves as Christians to push white supremacy ideology. These are not Christians
Nor be they Scottsmen
They absolutely are and Christians were much worse towards women before social progress forced them to change their official positions or become irrelevant.
It is now apparent that they never really changed their ideas.
Just divest yourself from religion, it's only used for corruption
I’ve never been religious
They absolutely are true christians.
This looks like words straight out of the Bible to me. Any Christian saying this isn't Christianity is the one that isn't a true Christian.
A true follower is so rare as to be virtually extinct. Think of these church mega pastors with hundred million dollar net worths. What would jesus do with that money? Probably give it all away to feed starving children all around the world. Every penny, probably to the point of only having two articles of clothing and driving around in a van lol. Christians are such hypocrites.
Also, he probably would've voted for Bernie haha. Not kidding though.
jesus wouldn't have it in the first place and that is the sole and only point. To have accumulated dragon-level wealth is to have been an evil fucker. Period!
No many of them are. They just don't represent all Christians
Conservatives believe women are property. Property does not get to make decisions. Only property owners may make decisions.
There is no "good conservative" alive today.
tardmerica strikes again
who can stop them in their spree of retardation??
I don't particularly like calling christofascists that. They know exactly what they are doing.
This isn’t new - it’s the case in multiple states and has been for a while. The justification is that usually the husband is assumed to be the “father” for the purpose of the birth certificate. It’s bullshit but Y’all’queda has been running Missouri for a loooong time
The "we just want to stop wh*res to use abortion as birth control" crowd does not stop at just abortion...
Isn't this a TV series on netflix... Oh yeah The Handmaid's Tale...
So Idiocracy and Handmaids tale are manuals now.
Sounds like these southern courts should meet the peoples militia.
“Proud Slave State” Missouri has that law??
Weird.
Blessed be the fruit.
I adore a lot of individual Americans. Some of the best people I know have lived their entire lives in the USA. But for the last 20 or so years official US policy decisions have become harder and harder to agree with and this is an example of that. So many US citizens are better than their system - they really need to demand a change to politicians/justice systems/etc that better represent them.
Our nation is infested with conservatism. If history is our guide, the cure for this disease is not peaceful.
I was wanting to move to Missouri so my commute to work wouldn't be as long as it is but every time I hear something of the states politics recently it's something horrible
I live in Kansas and it's freakin bizarre to look across the state line and realize I'm living in the less crazy state. Missouri just went straight off the rails in the past 20 years.
Another state to avoid at all costs.
Bringing the total to fifty.
What the fuck‽
I remember when California had law like this. The spirit of the law was basically judicial efficiency: The state didn't want two different hearings for divorce and child custody, so if a baby was on the way they wanted to wait so that all details of the divorce could be decided at once.
Of course, enforcement of this law is awful for women absent any other measures to protect them from abuse, so California wisely repealed the law.
No chance a red state will give a shit about women enough, unfortunately. This will be deliberately used to harm women.
I'm embarrassed for my state.
Let me guess: also one of those states where you can't charge your spouse for rape either.
The article makes it clear that the intent of the legislation was more positive, albeit fraught, than many seem to think from the text here alone. However, it is clear to most that it is misapplied in many cases. It also goes on that there is recently introduced, currently pending legislation to improve the situation. Let’s hope it succeeds.
Another flyover State.....but it's Boeing so I ain't going.
The proud state of child marriage, inbreeding, and the kkk.
Can’t you just lie and say you are not pregnant? By the time they prosecuted you wouldn’t be pregnant anymore. Also, fuck Missouri
Divorce takes several months and even years. You'd definitely be showing long before. Plus I'm sure this will lead to requiring women to be tested for pregnancy before they can even file for divorce. Remember, Handmaids Tale levels of control over women is their ultimate goal hear.
Showing doesn’t matter but pretty sure if you required women to take a pregnancy test you would have to require men to do the same, and or take a fertility test or what not. Whatever the long term goal is, we steal have to deal with whatever legal reality we are currently in, not where we would be if whoever had their way.
I want to know what happens if you're 3 weeks pregnant or something when you file and you don't know you're pregnant yet. Does this law annul such a divorce?
No they'll probably just put the mom on the new and improved gas chamber now with N2 gas.
Disgusting
When a culture has high levels of conscientiousness and low levels of openness, it results in this. It did in the 30s as well.
As ridiculous as this law is, it seems like the article makes out that not being able to get divorced means more domestic violence but I don’t quite understand the implication. You can still move out/leave whether a piece of paper says you’re married or not, right?
Why did she return? So if she was told she could get divorced would she have returned?
Very likely the reasons were financial. With multiple kids, depending on how much she works, she could sue for child support/alimony if she was divorced. But if she's not divorced, he might control all the finances.
Good point, I didn’t think about that aspect
Divorce opens up legal options. She may not be able to legally move out of state for example.
I'm sure there are plenty of couples where people live separately for a period time because of work, how can the law prevent someone from just moving?
Five minutes ago I would have asked how a law can possibly ban divorce during a pregnancy. Never ever give Republicans the benefit of the doubt.
Good point.
I feel like I got a little heated, but that wasn't intended to be directed at you. Stay safe, wherever you live 🙂
Inability to separate finances/custody arrangements for current children. Ability for your spouse to make medical decisions for you.
Remember, we're talking about people who are already at risk of violence.
Because pressure can be applied if you are not divorced, through kids, through money, through property laws, etc. If you take the kids with you and move away, is it kidnapping? Are you going to take that chance of the abuser finding a sympathetic cop in one of these states? Property is usually considered communal in marriage, so if the abuser takes the car it isn't 'theft.' What if the abuser takes the dog and has it put down? Even if the abuser had to travel to where you are, had to take the dog by sneaking into the house you're living in now, and had to take the dog to a vet who was out of the area so they didn't know the abuser (and thus what they were doing), it wouldn't be breaking the law because the dog is technically both of the married individuals' property. You can't prevent the abuser from picking up the kids from their school. The list goes on.
Think of a way an abuser can twist the thumbscrews, and if there is not a divorce, and thus complete legal separation, the law (and I mean the legal rules, not cops by that) either shields them or ignores the issue when they are twisting down. By the by, none of these scenarios are made up. I've seen each one during my brief time working with families that have abusers.
Because leaving a relationship is the single most dangerous time for an abuse victim. Remaining married and not having divorce proceedings in place gives your spouse rights that can let them find and control you more easily if you try to leave. It's safer to keep it secret until you can take necessary steps.
Horrible law but I don't really get what it does in reality. I guess guarantees the husband is on the birth certificate?
Divorce takes a long time, and I don't see why you couldn't get permanently separated and move out for the duration of the pregnancy, do exactly the same things as you would do divorced. They can't force you to live in the same house.
I guess there's financial coercion, if you need child support to pay for things for the kids you wouldn't get it until a divorce is finalized. And you wouldn't be able to buy a house while legally married or it would get tangled up with the divorce.
Like I said, bad law, but the impacts seem a bit muted by the fact that you can't actually force someone to stay in a relationship.
If you're still legally married, your abusive husband still has full custody rights to your children, for one thing.
No. Hard no. What in the world makes you think that?!
Yes, he does. What in the world makes you think otherwise? Parents have equal and open custody without an order otherwise.
American law
I'm a guy and I'm here to say that my wife is angry about this. Hold on let me tell her to stop tapping and wash the dishes and feed the kids!... anyway, yes we want their rights back! 😜
C'mon chicks...revolt! I'm just being sarcastic plus I would never call anyone a chick. But yeah, fuck yeah revolt! WTF!
Marriage is a scam.
Translation: nobody loves me
I don't think it's that simple.
Am married and in long-term relationship. I still feel it's not right for most people e.g. kind of a scam. I would never recommend it to someone because it's too much responsibility to have that recommendation weighing on my conscience.
Y'all are so reactionary it's pitiful. Arizona, Arkansas, California and Texas also have this law. In Michigan the judge makes the call.
Nothing is stopping a woman from leaving or beginning divorce proceedings. All these laws mean is that they cannot finalize a divorce while pregnant. And that makes sense because:
https://www.custodyxchange.com/topics/divorce/divorce-while-pregnant.php
None of those reasons are valid. Not one.
^ There go one now, reacting to the headline, refusing information that goes against the zeitgeist around here. So your argument amounts to, "Nuh UH!"?
And what's your argument against the law? It does nothing to stop a woman from getting away from her husband. The only thing it stops is finalizing the divorce before the above questions are answered.
If you were the woman, wouldn't you rather wait to sign on the dotted line so there's no risk of relitigating anything listed above? As a single mother, you're likely in a bad spot. Want to go back to court, over and over? Or even once? It's painful. I know.
Pick one argument you made that you think is the best, and I'll show you why it's erroneous.
And no, I wouldn't want to wait. I've been the woman in this scenario. I was three months pregnant when my husband physically attacked me. You need a swift legal end. It's easy to write a divorce agreement that deals with situations that don't yet exist. Most every single one deals with at least a few. (When the house sells, at retirement age, when taxes are due, etc.) Why not when a baby is born?
Until that line is signed by a judge, men like my husband continue to drag you back because they think they own you under the law.
Your arguments sound great to anyone who hasn't actually been in that situation. But every one of them can be addressed without forcing a woman to stay married to her abuser.