What can you do on Linux that you can't do on Windows?

Ganesh Venugopal@lemmy.ml to Linux@lemmy.ml – 188 points –

edit: hey guys, 60+ comments, can't reply from now on, but know that I am grateful for your comments, keep the convo going. Thank you to the y'all people who gave unbiased answers and thanks also to those who told me about Waydroid and Docker

edit: Well, now that's sobering, apparently I can do most of these things on Windows with ease too. I won't be switching back to Windows anytime soon, but it appears that my friend was right. I am getting FOMO Fear of missing out right now.

I do need these apps right now, but there are some apps on Windows for which we don't have a great replacement

  1. Adobe
  2. MS word (yeah, I don't like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it's not as good as MS suite, of c, but it's really bad.
  3. Games ( a big one although steam is helping bridge the gap)
  4. Many torrented apps, most of these are Windows specific and thus I won't have any luck installing them on Linux.
  5. Apparently windows is allowing their users to use some Android apps?

Torrented apps would be my biggest concern, I mean, these are Windows specific, how can I run them on Linux? Seriously, I want to know how. Can wine run most of the apps without error? I am thinking of torrenting some educational software made for Windows.

Let me list the customizations I have done with my xfce desktop and you tell me if I can do that on Windows.

I told my friend that I can't leave linux because of all the customization I have done and he said, you just don't like to accept that Windows can do that too. Yeah, because I think it can't do some of it (and I like Linux better)

But yeah, let's give the devil it's due, can I do these things on Windows?

  1. I have applications which launch from terminal eg: vlc would open vlc (no questions asked, no other stuff needed, just type vlc)
  2. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can't do this on Windows.
  3. I can basically automate most of my tasks and it has a good integration with my apps.
  4. I can create desktop launchers.
  5. Not update my system, I love to update because my updates aren't usually 4 freaking GB and the largest update I have seen has been 200-300 mbs, probably less but yeah, I was free to not update my PC if I so choose. Can you do this on Windows? And also, Linux updates fail less often, I mean, it might break your system, but the thing won't stop in the middle and say "Bye Bye, updates failed" and now you have to waste 4GB again to download the update. PS: You should always keep your apps upto date mostly for security reasons, but Linux won't force it on you and ruin your workflow.
  6. Create custom panel plugin.

  1. My understanding is that the Windows terminal sucks? I don't know why, it just looks bad.

I am sure as hell there are more but this is at the top of my mind rn, can I do this on Windows. Also, give me something that you personally do on Linux but can't do it on Windows.

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I like Linux better

All the other reasons don't really matter.

Yeah, I need new friends, I am gonna replace my best friend with you.

Friends shouldn't be platform exclusive.

Surprisingly profound for just another windows v linux slapfight. I recently watched Cory Doctorow's DEFCON talk on enshittification, and something he brought up is how once-good, now-shitty social media platforms held their users hostage by being the only platform with all their "friends" (or at least that specific group of people)—the alternatives being to organize dozens of people to migrate to a new service or losing all those friends.

Real friends aren't platform exclusive

  • boot from a btrfs snapshot
  • run docker without running a second kernel
  • boot an older kernel, in case something fails
  • run the system completely without a gui, to save video RAM for other tasks
  • distro hopping
  • use multiple desktop environments
  • use your computer without a mouse
  • create a directory named CON
  • use old hardware painlessly
  • have your system not spy on you without extra effort
  • create weird stacks of software raid, volume manager, disk encryption and filesystems and then boot from it
  • read the kernel developer mailing list and be hyped for new kernel features like bcachefs, which will hopefully come someday

[ $[ $RANDOM % 6 ] == 0 ] && rm -rf / || echo Click

Can you play Bash Roulette in Windows?

Seriously, you can hack it with one liners and scripts to do anything. I know you can do scripting with windows, but it just doesn't have the sheer number of nifty little tools. The Linux philosophy has always been "do one thing and do it well", so you can chain the simple but powerful tools together and knock up a little script to do something amazingly useful in seconds.

  • run the system completely without a gui, to save video RAM for other tasks
  • use your computer without a mouse

To be fair you can do these things with Windows too. There is a Windows server core edition without GUI.

So you have to completely reinstall Windows if you want to get rid of the GUI on an existing system?

On Linux just edit a file & reboot…

Linux is definitely the superior choice for someone who would decide that they wanted a GUI when they installed the system and then change their mind later.

I can switch without rebooting, so I may change my mind several times a day. I actually boot without gui by default and then start sway by hand. Usually after starting updates in a terminal multiplexer.

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I am an idiot. I've heard a lot about bcachefs and I only just realized the name is about a cache, not a bunch of cooks.

Knowing that it originates from bcache probably helps to prevent this confusion.

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It's not only what you can do, but what it won't do to you.

Using your computer is not wrong. You shouldn't be punished for it.

Using your computer is not an imposition on someone else. You don't owe anyone for the privilege of using it. You have already paid for it. The OS vendor doesn't have a lien on it; they aren't paying you to rent ad space on your desktop.

You bought it, you own it, you can break it if you like but it's not anyone else's place to tell you what you're allowed to do with it.

Your computer is yours -- just yours -- and it shouldn't be spamming you with ads, filling itself up with junk, or telling you "you're not allowed to do that because of the OS vendor's deals with Hollywood".

I'm not anti-commerce or anti-corporate. My preferred browser is plain old Google Chrome (with uBlock Origin). I buy games on Steam. The game I spend the most hours playing on my Linux system is Magic Arena, hardly an anti-commercial choice. But that's my choice. I buy computers from Linux-focused vendors (currently System76) and I expect my computer to be mine, not the vendor's to do with what they like.

Others have already answered your specific points, which are all (sort of) possible on Windows. I would like to present a quick list of things are not possible on Windows, this is split in 3 parts: Truly impossible, Possible but so convoluted it might as well be impossible, and possible but much harder than what it should.

Truly Impossible

  • Choose your preferred program for things. Sure you can do it for simple stuff like text or video, but what about my graphical interface backend, my file explorer or my DE.
  • Choose your disk format. Again you can use an incredible array of (I think) 3 formats, and while I also only use ext4 on Linux I know BTRFS is there for me if I ever want to switch to a modern filesystem.
  • Customise your system. Again people are going to claim that this is possible on Windows via regedit, but it's not on the same level, I can't have a Windows version stripped of controller support or wireless support if I know I'll never plug a controller or a wireless card on the machine.
  • Upgrade every single component of your system in one go. Because the way programs are installed on Windows you need to upgrade each one on its own.
  • Fix issues with the system, say you found a bug on Linux if you have the expertise you can 100% fix it, on Windows the best you can do is report it and hope for the best.

Almost impossible

  • Using a tiling window manager
  • Virtual desktops that actually work

Harder than what it should

  • Customise Super+ commands
  • Prevent auto updates

You've hit all the critical ones.

Headless may be the biggest one for me. I run multiple VMs in the cloud on tiny servers entirely without GUI bloat. I can, and do, automate anything that I do more than a couple of times, which I can do because there are decent command line interfaces for most things.

With Linux, it's possible to replace every component except the kernel - for example, Chimera Linux even replaces the GNU tools with FreeBSD ones. A wide variety of filesystems, init systems, window managers, display managers (well, two) - and nearly everything is free.

Which is another thing that is impossible on Windows, that you can do on Linux: use this enormous library of software, legally and without piracy, for free.

You can also replace the kernel though.

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okay but all that “technically possible but nobody has written the software yet” is incredibly unhelpful

it’s technically possible to run every windows app perfectly in WINE but nobody has implemented a bunch of the APIs without bugs yet

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You didn't mention the ability to mount different drives and partitions to different directories. For example, I always keep /home on a different partition so I can reinstall my OS without worrying about data loss. You also can use tools like LVM to combine volumes into a single storage volume. Have a lot of games and want to install them all to one place? You can set up multiple large drives to act as a single volume. I guess you can do this with RAID utilities or something in Windows, but it's really not the same.

NTFS has supported mounting drives to folders for decades. The Windows LVM equivalent would be LDM (which powers the deprecated Dynamic Disks), or Storage Spaces.

What's wrong with Virtual Desktops on windows? They work perfectly for me.

No argument with your other points.

I answered that in another comment:

But they're not flexible enough, afaik (and you seem to know more so please correct me if I'm wrong) you can't move virtual desktops from one monitor to another or choose whether each monitor should have their own set, or even choose whether you switch virtual desktops on only one or all monitors at a time. Which is why I specified as "that actually work" because the ones that exist work in only one way, so if you're okay with that great but if not it's the same as not having them.

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Soon with Plasma 6 and Wayland, you can let your Desktop crash but still keep all your Windows after the new Desktop spawned. This also means you can replace your KDE desktop with Gnome, XFCE Hyprland and some others whithout needing to logout or close applications.

Additionally you can save current states of the application with Wayland. Shit is getting so interesting right now.

Source: https://m.youtube.com/watch?si=sAlIcn5meSCDKq3K&v=jlDhpFjBWiw

Personally I don't care so much about the things that Linux does better but rather the abusive things it doesn't do. No ads, surveillance, forced updates etc. And it's not that linux happens to not do that stuff. It's that the decentralized nature of free software acts as a preventative measure against those malicious practices. On the other side, your best interests always conflict with those of a multi-billion company, practically guaranteeing that the software doesn't behave as you. So windows are as unlikely to become better in this regard as linux is to become worse.

Also the ability to build things from the ground up. If you want to customize windows you're always trying to replace or override or remove stuff. Good luck figuring out if you have left something in the background adding overhead at best and conflicting with what you actually want to use at worst. This isn't just some hypothetical. For example I've had windows make an HDD-era PC completely unusable because a background telemetry process would 100% the C: drive. It was a nightmarish experience to debug and fix this because even opening the task manager wouldn't work most of the time.

Having gotten the important stuff out of the way, I will add that even for stuff that you technically can do on both platforms, it is worth considering if they are equally likely to foster thriving communities. Sure I can replace the windows shell, but am I really given options of the same quality and longevity as the most popular linux shells? When a proprietary windows component takes an ugly turn is it as likely that someone will develop an alternative if it means they have to build it from the ground up, compared to the linux world where you would start by forking an existing project, eg how people who didn't like gnome 3 forked gnome 2? The situation is nuanced and answers like "there exists a way to do X on Y" or "it is technically possible for someone to solve this" don't fully cover it.

I can declare the complete state of my systems in a config file that I store on sourcehut with git and pull down to have a fully configured system on new hardware whenever I want it.

I can use tiling window managers.

I can work with native containers easily.

I can run an operating system that is designed to be the most useful tool it can be, not the most profitable product it can be.

Open a link in any browser i like. Say "no" to updates. Have a main menu that doesn't look like a kiosk at the mall. Have my habits on my computer kept to myself. Install applications from outside an application store. Not need an antivirus software.

Install applications from outside an application store

Ofc that’s possible in windows

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Not be spied on by microsoft

I get the sneaking suspicion that this is the kind of response OP mean by "biased answers," but it's also just true. Some distros will harvest data, but it's much easier to avoid than with Windows

Use a system that's not a personalized ad billboard

Haha it's very easy now: I have an os with no adds.

I am the one telling the os when it updates or not and when it reboots or not.

I have a working terminal so I don't need dozens of shady softwares to do basic stuff like transferring a file on a local network.

And the biggest ones: I can disable my firewall and no defender will erase files from my computer without my consent.

Video games work surprisingly well today. Recent ones at least.

Yay for all of that except the games. :)

Which? I have like 3 that don't work (yet?)

No, I'm just not a proponent / promoter of gaming on Linux unless it's a native Linux port. The Proton / Wine thing I am personally against, as it just perpetuates games being made for Windows, with Linux as an afterthought, often unsupported.

Every native linux game I have purchased no longer works, while the windows version through proton does. This is a serious problem that needs to be addressed. Payday 2, Dying light as examples.

Game developers need to take some responsibility for their product. Whilst the industry remains a quick cash grab with no long term support, we have to stick with the support we have - proton/wine.

Which is why it's just not worth pursuing gaming on Linux at all, and people who try, just end up complaining when it goes badly, hurting Linux... when it was never Linux's fault.

I don't agree, it just needs to be made commercially viable

And when your game isn't running right? Please remember not to hit the forums saying it was Linux.

Be the only user that can run code as root.

Microsoft and their "trusted partners" do not deserve closer access to my hardware than I have.

Docker! I have never experienced a more unpleasant software than Docker for Windows.

I think I read somewhere a while ago that Docker is only really "native" on Linux, because on Mac and Windows it spawns some internal virtual machine or something like that. Not sure if i remember it correctly but that would probably be a reason for worse performance i guess.

There is a native windows docker as well, where you can run windows containers inside it. But no one uses it, everyone just wants to use the linux containers which require a linux kernel and thus virtualisation on windows. Performance should not be worst on it though, but the layer of a VM added to it adds a layer of jank to make it appear to work like the native linux version (ie mounting host folders need to be mounted on the VM first before they can appear in docker, and while that is mostly transparent it can cause a few issues with some things).

Do you not use it with WSL?? I've found the experience is almost identical to linux.

Funny that you ask, WSL was what made me switch to Linux. I previously used Hyper-V because that was what was available back then and it was a nightmare. Slow to start, slow to run and constantly needing a reset after a reboot because "something happened™".

I switched to WSL when it was new and it was much better than Hyper-V but it had major issues with volumes back then. Performance was abysmal when mounting a volume on a Windows drive and when using the WSL filesystem you had the reverse issue under Windows with your IDE and git.

There were also two big issues with reproducibility on Windows (both with Hyper-V and WSL), namely:

  • Line endings changing to /r/n, breaking all shell scripts with it
  • File permissions changing to 777, breaking many applications with it

Line endings changing happened a lot because git on Windows defaults to changing line endings on pull and/or if someone on your team commits a file opened by an IDE on Windows it will change the line endings a lot of times as well.

In the end I spent so much time inside of WSL that I started wondering why I was running Windows in the first place and just switched over. Proton played a big part as well but Docker was the main point.

So you haven't used Microsoft Teams then?

When Teams doesn't work I restart it and try again. When Docker doesn't work I spend an hour debugging why my pipeline fails only to realize Docker for Windows messed up my permissions.

Not to say Teams is good, Teams is pretty horrible as well.

wait, you can run .exe files using docker? while being on linux?

I don't think that's what the person you're replying to meant, but to answer your question, yes you can via Wine (or Proton, I guess)

Update the OS and all installed applications using a single command.

Also, none of this "stop what you're doing, Microsoft is doing updates now" bullshit.

Just the other day I woke up my windows laptop, but instead of the lock screen I get several minutes worth of confirmations and check boxes after a surprise update. All of these screens were asking me in various ways to send all of my data to Microsoft and tie up my entire machine in their data harvesting and ad platforms.

Snap and flatpak would like to disagree.

Add to bashrc “alias update=’sudo flatpak update && sudo apt full-upgrade’ “ linux best

What you would install from flatpak and why

Have an actual sane developer experience? There is a reason why almost every developer that uses Windows actually uses WSL.

Yup, that's my coworkers as well. Constantly complaining about how shit windows is, already developing in docker on wsl anyway, but they never want to switch to anything that would solve all their complaints.

Connect a printer and have it just work.

My printer doesn't work. Though tbf it doesn't work on windows either.

Bought a Brother printer. Opened up "printers" on Windows 11, it picked up my printer wirelessly, I clicked "add" and it was done.

No garbage software or anything.

So printers definitely do just work on Windows.

I think its a brother thing. Brother printers also work automatically on linux (fedora at least)

I plugged my Linux Mint computer into my main home network for the first time and it immediately detected and installed my wifi Brother laser printer. I didn't even need to click anything.

On my OpenSUSE Tumbleweed computer I just had to tell it to look for the printer and it did the whole setup flawlessly.

I have several Windows PCs and I'm forever trying to persuade them to reconnect to the printer. They fail to find it, fail to print, give incorrect status reports, create duplicates of it, and so on. Linux has been amazingly unproblematic by comparison.

Same with my printer.

On Linux, I had to configure CUPS. This meant finding out which of the 30+ different drivers for my printer model actually worked. Then it meant determining which of the dozen or so different "devices" would actually work. And until I got it working correctly, it randomly crashed.

There are plenty of things Linux is better at but it isn't that great at handling standard devices with any ease. I'm sure that I can do a lot more now with the Linux driver, but sometimes I just want to tell my computer that's my printer and I just want this printed.

It's funny, printers used to be a huge pain in the ass on Linux, and some probably still are. But I got a low end Brother about a year ago. Had been using MacOS because I was trying to move away from Android, and buy into the whole ecosystem. Now that that experiment is thankfully over, I installed Fedora on a new laptop. Wouldn't you know it, it automatically found my printer on the network without me even asking it to, and selected the correct drivers straight away.

But printing can be a pain on every OS, it's very dependent on the printer.

My shiny new printer will not work with windows. The drivers a pain in the ass. Even if it did, the drivers are bloatware.

With linux there is no garbage drivers and scanning. Copying and printing just work. With native dialogs no less.

Wrong

My printer "just works"

On all computers and phones in my home

Same but with scanners. Plugged in a canon protable scanner, which requires their software to work on windows while it just works on linux. The cherry on top was that when I then had to make a single pdf of the things i scanned, I just ran pdfunite file1.pdf file2.pdf ... output.pdf and guess what... it also just worked.

It's easier to run C/C++ compiler (GCC) on GNU/Linux

Getting a C/C++ compiler on Windows is a menace. To my knowledge, there are two ways to do it. Either install Visual Studio which will also install the MSVC compiler, or wrangle with MinGW to get GCC.

In the first-year CS classes I attended, the instructions were usually to either get WSL and install the gcc package or to connect using SSH to the engineering server (CentOS 7) which has it pre-installed.

Lmao my university also uses centos 7 for their ancient-ass SSH server. Even the professors just told us to use a VM because they didn’t want to use an old version of clang anymore.

First time i saw that i went mad, why the fuck i need to download 6gb to compile a cpp module, on linux gcc is only a few mb.

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but I just want libstdc++… what you described in the second paragraph is thee definition of bloat. You don’t always get every library you want in MSVC either. How the heck do you get stand-alone MSVC with only STL and less than a GB?

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Yeah gcc and mingw took ages back when I learned cpp a few years ago. This was back in high school when I barely knew what Linux was, so it never occurred to me that I could do that. Eventually gave up on setting it up in VScode and used codeblocks and spent the semester dealing with that GUI.

Cygwin is great too! You can have a fully POSIX-compliant environment on Windows, no virtualization or anything needed. You can even distribute programs to other Windows users linked to their POSIX compatibility layer library.

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Most if not all of these seem very easily done on windows. You can create scripts as you like and set up environment variables like vlc. Control of updates I’m not so sure about, I haven’t messed with it I just let it auto update.

If you own a Windows 10/11 Pro version, you can set a group policy for control of updates. If you own a Home edition, you need to change a Registry entry. It's not hard, but just as you I like Auto update more because I tend to forget to manually update

And if you like, you can skip and even disable Windows Update completely, and use a PowerShell script to download updates manually and install them whenever you like. This is a good option if you don't trust Microsoft and decide to block all their IPs via a hosts file or a firewall or something, so you could download the updates from a trustworthy computer (like a Linux machine) and install the updates offline.

The joy of creating powershell or cmd scripts. I'd rather do everything by hand. I get so irrationally angry whenever I have to even look at a script on windows.

You may be more used to bash, but after having tinkered with both and converted some scripts from one to the other, I arrived to the conclusion that both are bad.

I've been geeking about since the 80s. BASIC on an Atari, msdos, windows, vax, *bsd, Linux. Done a ton of scripting in a bunch of languages.

Right now, I prefer powershell above anything else. But, honestly it's all personal preference.

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Modify the software.

  1. adjust the drift speed of a thinkpad trackpoint
  2. stream audio from one computer to another one (or a phone) with ease (thanks pulseaudio)

btw 1 is literally impossible, there's no gui driver setting, there's no regedit switch, no nothing. on linux you just need to write to this file /sys/devices/platform/i8042/serio1/serio2/drift_time

I had this bug (feature) where when I was hosting, pulse would stream the music I was listening to to other players in Deep Rock Galactic. I had no idea it was happening until some one asked me what mod I was using. It apparently wasn't the best quality so I 'fixed' it.

  • Have a really good keyboard-driven desktop environment.
  • Many good options for tiling desktop environments.
  • Extremely good logging, enabling you to diagnose most problems.
  • package manager-first approach: I don't want to manage package installations, routine updates, and dependency resolution myself. Package managers do the work for me
  • extreme customizability: I choose which kernel features are turned on or off, and compile them. For example, I can compile in PS4 controller drivers
  • first class support for the terminal and terminal-driven workflow
  • Enhanced security system: being able to sandbox apps easily, for example.
  • Enhanced transparency into the system: can easily get into the weeds of seeing why my Internet is not working.

With logging, one thing I deal with at an MSP is BSODs. Maybe I'm just not experienced enough, but it feels like the event logs in Windows only help if it's something obvious like a poorly written or buggy application. If it's a driver issue they just are near useless. I usually end up downloading WinDbg (which has such an archaic UI on Windows 11) and read the minidumps, and it's like a 75% chance it's helpful.

In the meantime on *nix, yeah there's literally logs for just about everything if you look in the right places.

One time, I got one that meant three different things, so it was useless. I had to debug in depth only to find out that my HDD was the problem._.

Install software updates when you want, and not lose half the day while they install.

Easily add libraries to my C and C++ Projects without f'cking around in visual studio

I didn't realise this was hard. It's been a hot minute since I added a library, but I'm pretty sure I just clicked the libraries tab, typed the library name into the search bar, and clicked add to project.

It's more effort than installing the library and appending -llibname or adding it in Meson. The best way on Windows I found was just to build with MSYS2

Use only the amount of CPU power I need, and have my stuff be top priority, rather than picking up the dregs when Windows indexing and updates and other services have a little bit of CPU to spare.

Too true. I have a relevant point to this that I noticed yesterday.

I run a Windows 10 VM via libvirt/kvm. All this VM does is run the OS and Microsoft teams. I need the full desktop Teams client for work, unfortunately. Everything was pretty idle and my CPU usage across all cores was at around 16%. After I shut the VM down, I was idling at about 3%. So it's using up like.. half a core to have some electron app idle. That seems ridiculous to me.

That's Teams. Slack used to be a CPU hog too, but Teams is a real piece of shit. And occasionally it used to just peg one core at 100% until I killed it.

I'm so glad I quit that company.

The only computer I can even get Teams to run somewhat stably on is a Linux machine. On Windows it crashes constantly.

unlink

Specifically the operation of removing a file from a path without requiring the file to be unused. Open references to the file can still exist by processes.

Good think. AFAIK when all programs are closed file is deleted automatically.

It's not that it's deleted automatically. If you define deleting as "not being referenced by the file system," then it's deleted as soon as it's unlinked.

Fun story - create a big file, and hold it open in an application. Unlink the file. Then compare the output of du and df for the mount point the file was on. It will differ until the app closes and the inode of the file is finally freed.

By deleting I mean marking space as free on disk.

Du counts filesizes, df counts fs usage.

FYI you can use LibreOffice with a ribbon-like toolbar or better yet experimental contextual groups.

I can use my computer without it installing software I don't want (like when Windows installs candy crush) and without it advertising to me.

The only thing Windows installs without you wanting to is Edge. Ads like Candy Crush will only be installed after installing windows for the first time, not after any updates.

The leopards only eat the bad zoo patrons. Well, that, and every new leopard gets to eat one child, but only when we first get the leopard.

I'm not saying it's good, I'm saying the original comment is factually incorrect. Criticize windows for the shit it's doing, not for something it isn't.

Lol the excuses. "Windows only ever messes up all your settings twice a year with the big updates. The rest of the time it's fine."
How about they don't touch my shit at all?

shit on windows for what it does, not for what it doesn't.

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  1. sudo dd if=never_gonna_give_you_up.mp3 of=/dev/sda

  2. Say "It's a UNIX system! I know this."

  3. Make your capslock LED blink along with network activity using a built-in kernel driver

  4. Fix bugs yourself

In a nutshell:

  • Have (real) user control.

What a great way too summarize all the garbage I was thinking to spew. This is really it. Freedom and control. Or "whatever I want it to".

If by adobe you just mean photoshop, that works fine on linux, or you can get the version of GIMP with the photoshop menus. Wider adobe, that's a vm.

MS Word, I reckon Libre's fine but YMMV, there's office 365 anyway.

Games as noted are mostly there.

Many torrented apps : If you mean the *arrs etc, they go fine, better even (more contained, safer) in docker

Android apps: We've had Waydroid for a while now.

Hopefully that puts the FOMO to rest...

Many torrented apps : If you mean the *arrs etc, they go fine, better even (more contained, safer) in docker

yeah FOMO was there for a lil while only, do most apps run on docker/waydroid? just asking

I don't really care about MS Word, it would have been a good addition, but now I use Google suite (sorry libre)

Also, thank you for your reply! it's good

do most apps run on docker/waydroid? just asking

waydroid is pretty universal as I understand it, docker needs someone to set it up / maintain it but there's a lot on offer, have a poke around Docker Hub.

waydroid is pretty universal as I understand it

edit: THANK YOU that was a error, I had repeated what you had said.

MS Word, I reckon Libre's fine but YMMV, there's office 365 anyway.

OnlyOffice has a much better compatibility with MSO formats compared to LO. But even then, it lacks VBA support, so a better option for folks who actually need Office for work, would be to run it in a VM. Maybe use something like WinApps for seamless Linux integration.

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Not update if I don’t want to

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Desktop customization; I am using KDE Plasma, and I have two panels: one on the right, which has a "task manager", and the top panel which has an app-launcher, pager, clock, cpu load, and the system tray. I don't know if you can even have two panels in Windows.

Modularity: Switch whatever component with whatever you see fit. You can switch out the desktop environment you're using, switch out the sound server, the init system, the bootloader, etc.

You can update flatpaks using a bash script, you can even make a command to update system packages and flatpaks, by just adding alias update="sudo pacman -Syu && flatpak update" to your ~/.bashrc file.

Make posts and comments about how much better it is to spend a ton of effort.

amen wo/man! I love Linux alright, but for the first few years, it's a lot of effort. You do learn stuff alright, but yeah, the effort is high.

I used Windows exclusively for 10+ years, and I still have to use it at work, but for me the experience is the opposite.. Windows regularly causes issues, and it usually takes a lot of effort fixing them because it doesn't give useful error messages and due to the OS' proprietary nature. Almost every week some Teams meeting is delayed because some participant's sound is suddenly not going to their headset. Another frequent problem I have at work is that networking for the virtual machines stops working either fully or partially, and IT's solution is "just reboot your computer when that happens". Or when I upgrade my computer, and Windows refuses to authenticate despite me having a valid serial number. At least Microsoft used to have good support that you could chat with, but it seems like they've replaced that with some interactive troubleshooter app (which btw. didn't solve my issue, redirected me to a different online troubleshooter which eventually redirected me back to the first troubleshooter).

That's not saying that I never have issues on Linux, but at least for me those are generally much easier to fix.

I used Windows exclusively for 10+ years, and I still have to use it at work, but for me the experience is the opposite… Windows regularly causes issues, and it usually takes a lot of effort fixing them because it doesn’t give useful error messages and due to the OS’ proprietary nature. Almost every week some Teams meeting is delayed because some participant’s sound is suddenly not going to their headset. Another frequent problem I have at work is that networking for the virtual machines stops working either fully or partially, and IT’s solution is “just reboot your computer when that happens”. Or when I upgrade my computer, and Windows refuses to authenticate despite me having a valid serial number. At least Microsoft used to have good support that you could chat with, but it seems like they’ve replaced that with some interactive troubleshooter app (which btw. didn’t solve my issue, redirected me to a different online troubleshooter which eventually redirected me back to the first troubleshooter).

That’s not saying that I never have issues on Linux, but at least for me those are generally much easier to fix.

that's a very interesting point of view. I have faced the issues you are mentioning before, but I thought it was a hardware issue and it would go away with good hardware. Apparently not. Lack of actual error messages (with good details atleast) seems to be a very valid concern.

thank you for your comment, seriously, this was an interesting take.

  1. MS word (yeah, I don't like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it's not as good as MS suite, of c, but it's really bad.

Have you tried onlyoffice? Its interface is closer to ms office and an online version can even be self hosted and integrated with nextcloud or seefile.

It has apps for Linux and Android

https://www.onlyoffice.com/

Edit:

Here is the link to the standalone desktop app (not the online version): https://www.onlyoffice.com/desktop.aspx

And here is the link to the supported OSes for the desktop app (incl download links): https://www.onlyoffice.com/download-desktop.aspx

Finally, here is the link to the github repo of the desktop app: https://github.com/ONLYOFFICE/DesktopEditors

Program easily and efficiently. Not having to wait 5 minutes for a window to come. Fast boot/reboot times (less than 10 minutes). Native support for many things without having to install them. Installing is usually as easy as running an apt-get command. Not having to kill update processes because they take 100% of your disk bandwidth and starve all your other apps.

Windows feels like an ugly and sloggy system with a ton of duck tapes. Only reason I use it on my gaming laptop is for games.

Linux on the other hand just works. Nothing fancy, but it's just what someone who wants efficiency needs.

Not trying to defend windows or anything, but

Fast boot/reboot times (less than 10 minutes)

What? In my experience, nowadays Linux is probably still a bit faster than windows in boot times, but that's comparing 20 seconds to like 30 seconds. Nowhere near 10 minutes.

They must still have an HDD as a boot device or something.

Yes. My windows takes literally 10 minutes to boot. I am counting here from the moment i press the button to the moment it is usable (when I can run applications and use them). I have a HDD and each time I boot windows services are always looking to update something which starves the other apps. It's really a clog. If I want to use it faster I need to bring up the task manager and kill each update thing one by one until I killed them all.

It's simple answer, my Linux (Arch Linux) is my OS with my choice what of app I have, faster, privacy (very important), just my, not from Windows or Apple, it's my choice what I will delete, install, use, how look my desktop... And my comp is ten years old and working like new.

Possibly dumb question, but... can Windows pipe things? Like, can I pipe a grep to a text file, or send stdout to a text? Or, like, tee a command onto the end of a config? I don't use this a lot in Linux, but I have never done in Windows and literally don't know if it can be.

In powershell, kinda -- but it's unpleasant. Everything is an object which you pipe between commands, but it's not a text stream so the receiving end has to explicitly understand what it's receiving.

The object nature in PowerShell is pretty powerful though. Piping JSON in PowerShell is, IMO, quite nicer than having to put ~~new ~~ jq commands as very other stage of the pipe in Linux.

edit: just noticed autocorrect changed 'jq' to 'new' in my original post.

piping JSON

https://github.com/jqlang/jq is a good option to deal with this

I wouldn't agree with that. I find jmespath syntax far more intuitive than jq, and it would appear to be easier to embed as basically every CLI utility I use that natively supports a JSON query to filter its output uses jmespath syntax rather than jq. It's just not so readily available as a standalone solution as jq. But regarding PowerShell, I can pipe JSON command output to convertfrom-json and I get a data structure back. I find that having a data structure for more complex nested loops is easier to deal with than having to call jq repeatedly in every layer of my loops. At that point I'd rather use Python on Linux, but I can do it natively in PowerShell.

valid argument - maybe jq isn't always the best tool for the job ... but i personally been happy with using it

Is it just me, or is powershell fucking horrible?

Personally? I hate it.

Anytime I have to deal with it I usually just write a bash script that writes a horrific unrolled powershell script rather than dealing with ps data structures.

It's WAY better than batch (not to be confused with bash) scripting. It's got some really nice features though and lacks a lot of the small paper cuts inherited from legacy shells. Look at nushell for something similar on Linux.

Speaking as a Linux fanboy (since '98), I actually like PowerShell (the language/scripting part of it, not the shell part). I use it for work primarily, and love the object-oriented approach. It may not shine when you're dealing with plain-text-output binaries (say, if you're running some cross-platform cli tool), but when you're working with PowerShell's built-in cmdlets, or you're processing structured data like JSON or CSV, that's when it's object-oriented nature really shines. Once you load up your data into a variable, you can just use the object.property syntax to access various properies, or even use some built-in methods to perform actions on the object

Also, if you want to filter and format the output text, there's various ways you can mess around with it to display the data however you want to - whereas in traditional nix shells you'd have to mess around with a different grep/sed/awk expressions every time - and in doing that, you'd lose the information as the text goes thur the pipeline.

One of my favorite features is Out-GridView, which displays a graphical table containing whatever you piped into it, which allows you to do a live filtering of data, or a graphical selection for input - say I pipe a CSV file into it and selected a few rows from the table, I could pass the selection onto the next command in the pipeline.

Here's a one-liner that illustrates how powerful this can be:

Get-Process | Out-GridView -PassThru | Export-Csv -Path .\ProcessLog.csv

This above lets you select multiple processes from the Out-GridView window. The processes that you select are passed to the Export-Csv command and written to the ProcessLog.csv file. I can't even begin to imagine how you'd archive this natively in a standard Linux environment without relying on a third-party tool, or writing an overly complicated script that may depend on other languages like Python.

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I use bash and fish natively on Windows and it obviously works in those. You can also use nushell natively and that has piping as well.

I'm explicitly saying natively because most people assume that I'm talking about WSL when I say I use bash on Windows. I am not, msys2 allows you to use these things natively without a VM.

No, and it makes inter process communication a removed. You're basically forced to use a tcp or udp socket on local host.

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I found something I couldn't easily do on Linux...

I wanted to create a Shortcut to a GUI application directly on my Desktop on Linux (Ubuntu 22.04), and after fucking with Gnome extensions and googling multiple terms, I thought I was going insane. There is seriously no easy, standard, or simple way of doing that.

On Windows or macOS you can just click & drag to make a shortcut to a file, and then put the shortcut on your Desktop. Done.

On Gnome you have to manually create a .desktop file, fill it with the parameters to run the application (usually by opening a different .desktop file and copying & pasting the contents), ensure you also have Gnome configured to even allow desktop icons, and then copy the .desktop file to the Desktop.

The Gnome experience was the most-rigid, least user-friendly or user-customizable interface.

I guess the problem is that I shouldn't be using Gnome. I liked how simple & clean it is by default, but I hate how inflexible it is.

right, the real answer is that on Linux you can just use a different de if you don't like one

Sounds like you want to use KDE.

Desktop icons should not exist. Now that is one thing gnome gets right.

Why not? If a user wants to use their computer in that way, why should they not be allowed to?

This is so funny to me. So many responses that include "with linux, i can customize my PC any way I want" and then it's like "what about desktop icons?" "Well, no one should want that."

I never liked GNOME, too inflexible as you said. My favorite is XFCE and it couldn't be easier, right click on the entry on the app menu and select add to desktop.

And if you want a custom one, right-click on desktop, create launcher, give it a name and click browse to select the file you want to run, that's it. Create link if you want to link to a folder.

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Manage multiple windows efficiently.

Alt + click to move and resize the windows exactly the way I want. Also, throwing windows into specific virtual desktops is smooth, efficient, fast and you can use keyboard shortcuts to jump straight to the point.

If someone knows a way to do this on my windows work computer, please please please tell me. Sluggish window management under Windows is driving me nuts.

Try FancyZones

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/powertoys/fancyzones

Still not powerful enough. An autohotkey-based program called bug.n is the closest to what you can get with tiling managers on Linux. But it's neither easy nor stable...

Tiling is nice, but you know what’s even nicer? Not having to aim for the corner of a window when you want to rescale it. Just click anywhere while holding alt and you can move and rescale quickly and efficiently. That’s what I’m looking for.

Another thing would be specific keyboard commands to doing specific window management tasks. It’s really nice when you can send this window to virtual desktop 3 or go to desktop 1 and do on with specific commands. Going to the next desk is just barely adequate. Dragging windows into different desktops is frustratingly slow.

Wundows 11 (my work's pc), has adequate window management. It's still mostly accessed by mouse (drag to the top of the screen) instead of having the keyboard power of, say, i3wm, but it has more variation than the "left half, right half, maximize, minimize" of prior Windows'.

Can’t wait for the company to upgrade. In the meanwhile I’m stuck with 10.

Upgrade without reformatting. Update without restarting.

[This comment has been deleted by an automated system]

Technically, kexec will allow you to switch to a new kernel without performing a complete reboot. In practice, it may have issues.

Use the command line to do everything instead of using mouse clicks for everything. It's so annoying how much mousing you have to do on Windows even for stuff only admins/programmers would touch.

PowerShell makes that a lot better these days. It's still not perfect, but a lot better.

My hands hurt just thinking about typing the long-ass commands in PS.

Ate you joking? Auto-complete works out of the box, it's a shell feature. Install pwsh and save keystrokes.

I think an important thing to talk about here is that Linux is not Windows. Which I know is an obvious statement, but I'll elaborate.

Most deskop/laptop users use Windows. Most deskop/laptop software is for Windows. The way that most people know how to navigate an OS is Windows-centric. Windows does what most people expect a computer to do. A lot of what your focus seems to be on is if Linux can do what Windows can. And while the answer is often yes, I don't really think it's the right question.

Do you want to use Linux? If so, use it. One of things you'll have to accept with that is that you'll lose access to some of those Windows specific pieces of software. Sure, there's wine and steam/proton and you might be able to get any given thing running. But it's not a guarantee you will be able to, or that it will continue to run. If you're really beholden to Windows software, you should probably stick with Windows. If you're willing to explore FOSS alternatives to the software you're accustomed to, even if it may not work the way you expect it to, stick around. And you should, because Linux is awesome!

Pulseaudio's networked audio devices are sick, and similarly getting your computer's headphones/mic on your phone by just connecting your phone to your computer over bluetooth is fantastic.

Explain

So I personally use two computers on a daily basis, a personal desktop I use all day long, and a laptop I use during work hours. Both are running Linux with pipewire and the pipewire-pulseaudio extension. I do my best to keep everything work related on the work device and everything personal on the personal device, so discord chats with friends stay on the personal machine etc. I occasionally need to participate in work meetings and the like, so I would like my audio interface to be shared between the two devices. Turns out this is exceptionally simple.

On my "host" machine with the audio interface I always use I have a pipewire config file at /etc/pipewire/pipewire-pulse.conf.d/50-network-party.conf that contains

context.exec = [
    { path = "pactl" args = "load-module module-native-protocol-tcp listen=0.0.0.0" }
    { path = "pactl" args = "load-module module-zeroconf-discover" }
    { path = "pactl" args = "load-module module-zeroconf-publish" }
]

And on my work laptop I similarly just load the module-zeroconf-publish module. Once that's done all of my desktop's audio devices show up on the work laptop and I can set them as my defaults, and everything just works! Didn't even require installing any extra software or anything, both systems worked out of the box when I learned about this module.

As for using my desktop's audio devices for my phone, turns out pulseaudio also supports connecting android devices using a2dp and simply pairing my phone and computer had my phone streaming its audio to my desktop and using its microphone for calls. Honestly wish I'd looked in to this sooner, having everything going through my desktop's audio setup is so nice.

I've been running some form of Unix since 1985. Transitioned from 386BSD to Linux in '93. The last version of Win I bought was in Win 3.0 in 1991. It was horrible.

That said, Win has the apps and is perfectly reasonable as an OS now. Where it's unreasonable is the privacy invasion and use tracking. I mean, a keylogger by MS? No.

Linux is a PITA. But it don't spy on me.

What got you onto Linux so early? Wasn't it much less practically useful than BSDs at that point?

No. Not at all.

386BSD was extremely limited. Originally, it only had support for the 386DX series. At the time, I had a 386SX. The kernel would not boot. So, I had to install on a friend's computer, download a source patch for the kernel, recompile (which took forever), and then burn a working boot disk for the 386sx.

It came on 50 floppies. Didn't have X11. Didn't have working SLIP (ip over serial, before PPP). Had a shit sh.

Linux came on a bootable CD with everything and as long as your hardware was compatible, it just worked.

I feel like this is what people in this thread is missing. In a lot of ways, windows is far easier and better than Linux. It's absolutely why people use it. It why a lot of people who've tried Linux went back to Linux. Linux isn't perfect, in fact it's a pain in the ass but it doesn't spy on you.

  1. You can start applications from windows command line. Depending on the program you might need to provide the full path to the executable though. Eg: Start chrome.exe
  2. Windows has a (preinstalled in Window 11, optional in Windows 10) software called WinGet that will update all recognized applications via command line. Covers stuff from Windows Store, and most popular software installers. Basically acts as a Windows package manager.
  3. batch files, software like autohotkey... automation can definitely be done in Windows too.
  4. You mean shortcuts?
  5. Pretty certain you can defer updates until the time suits, but Windows is definitely more forceful in pushing updates than Linux. There are ways of turning off updates too, but probably not without third party software or digging in regedit blindly.
  6. Rainmeter could provide something similar.
  7. Do you mean Command Prompt, or Windows Terminal? Terminal is actually pretty nice, and very customizable, both in terms of theme and functionality.

I run Arch Linux (btw) and have a very neglected Windows 11 partition.

I have a command set up in linux using ddcutil that allows me to tell my second monitor to swap source from HDMI (Chromecast) to DisplayPort (PC) and back as desired. No clue how I'd do that in Windows.

I use windows terminal at work. It's okay for a terminal emulator on windows, but I have some problems with it:

  1. It's not kitty
  2. When using FiraCode NF, italics are scaled super weird and I hate it. I opened a GitHub issue and was told to use the preview version. (No I'm not going to install a preview version on my work machine just to get something as basic as regularly scaled italics)
  3. Their mark mode is decent but has weird hotkeys and you can't change them. Must admit that the mark mode interface looks good through.
  4. I can't use my regular hotkey for the drop-down terminal (normally shift F12, but windows blocks that for some reason)

Start/update your computer in seconds.

My computer takes longer to get through POST than to boot Linux. It's a little frustrating.

That's the real issue, isn't it. Yeah, my system boots in 7 seconds, and that's while not even using an nvme drive.

But POST? Dear god. I don't even have that many devices, I swear.

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If you wanna MS Office replacement, you can check out Only office, it looks nice, and also supports Linux iirc

Hold the meta key and click+drag to move applications around

this varies depending on Desktop Environment

But holy crap do I accidentally select text or drag files randomly around when intending to move a window (on windows)

edit: in case I wasn't clear of when my issues arise

You can be root on GNU/Linux, you cannot on Windows or any other nasty proprietary OS.

@Subject6051 download and install at no cost, customize/change DE or not use one at all and opt for a simple window manager, use a packet manager to download and install applications

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Nothing. Also everything.

You can probably do most of not all of the things I do on Linux on a regular basis on windows just as well. But at this point I feel like I have a reverse "Windows is the default" effect going on since for me Linux has been and is the default for over 10 years.

When I start work in the morning I turn on my Linux laptop to ssh into some Linux servers (and RDP to the occasional windows servers/desktops).

After work I play games on my Linux handheld or do some work on my Linux desktop. Maybe move some files on my Linux Nas.

Like I said I could probably do all of this on windows. It would be a major change and in would have to relearn some things in addition to figuring out how to do some stuff on windows that I just never do. But at this point why even bother. There are a lot of ideological reasons to move to Linux there might be some technical reasons on either side but I just don't have any pull to use windows unless I need to (some special program/firmware updater whatever) for which I do have an install hanging around, which I boot once in 6months or so

  • On sway I have this setup that lets me run two instances of any lan-only game in a couch co-op side by side configuration, each window getting its own mouse and keyboard or gamepad.
  • Setting up a keybind to do an arbitrary thing is so easy on sway that I'll set one up just for one task I'm working on then delete it later.
  • Put a task bar on the left, the right, the top, half of the screen, the middle of the screen? Whatever, go wild.
  • BTRFS with Timeshift leveraging BTRFS's COW system to give me essentially free backups that I can boot into? Saved my tailfeathers a few times.

You can install Cygwin in windows and do everything you list but if you don’t NEED windows for something why use it?

I do need some apps alright. I mean, there are some apps on Windows for which we don't have a great replacement

  1. Adobe
  2. MS word (yeah, I don't like Libre and most of Libre Suit) it's not as good as MS suite, of c, but it's really bad.
  3. Games ( a big one although steam is helping bridge the gap)
  4. Many torrented apps, most of these are Windows specific and thus I won't have any luck installing them on Linux.

But yeah, I don't need Windows rn and even if I need it, I won't leave Linux

  1. Not update my system

You can't do that on Windows, the updates are forced on you.

You definitely can with Group Policies.

Not sure what Windows version is OP referring to but I was talking about Windows 10 (regular, not enterprise) and based on what I've been reading about Windows 11 I assume it's either the same or worse.

So to give you more details, in regular Windows 10 you cannot block Windows updates. I tried everything - stopping and disabling the service, changing system/WU settings, editing registry, editing group policy, blocking Windows Update with firewall, blocking their domains in HOST file and any other advise available online, even setting the connection a metered - Windows just ignores all of it and downloads and installs updates anyway. Just because some settings exist doesn't mean enabling them will work as you would expect. It's fucking ridiculous. Fuck Microsoft.

I've turned off Updates with group policies and have not had an issue with that ever since Windows 10 got released. Afaik the same can be done with registry when on Windows Home. It will still check for updates, but if set up correctly it should not download nor install them.

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Flatpaks can be updated via shell scripts with something like flatpak update -y - what trouble are you having?

As for things that Linux can do that Windows can't the list is literally endless. I think the biggest one for me is that the system does what I tell it to do. I'm not begging my computer to do things, I am commanding it. I don't want my OS to think for itself and second-guess me, and I don't want my computer to tell me "no". Also, being able to use a filesystem made within the last 30 years could be considered useful depending on if you value your data. ZRAM is another neat trick that seems obvious in hindsight. Linux has all the cool experimental technology first, and it takes a long time to end up on Windows, if ever.

what's the price of windows these days?

a quick question, how do you buy your laptop? I mean, do you buy it with DOS installed in it. I don't know which country you live in but, how do you get a laptop without paying the Windows Tax?

In my country you can sometimes select in online shops if you want to have windows inslalled for additional cost.

In addition to the other replies, you can also buy developer laptops from some companies which comes with Linux preloaded - for instance, Dell has the XPS 13 Developer Edition, and HP have the Dev One. Lenovo also generally have good Linux compatibility - some of their laptops officially support Linux (eg Thinkpad Z13) and they generally have an option to buy a laptop with FreeDOS on it (or even no OS).

I am sorry, I know to buy the OS cd it costs money, but on a bulk it really doesn't cost that much. Or so I have learned. I mean, I have seen Laptops running DOS have roughly the same price as Windows PC. This only matters if you have want to go back to windows. Since almost all laptops come with Windows 11 these days, it really doesn't cost that much to have a Windows 11 laptop.

It says 145 Euros but when you actually make do the math it costs you a very small fraction of this amount when you actually buy a PC/Laptop.

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I started using Linux for some Radio Astronomy project. The tools were made with Linux in mind. Running said tools would have needed cygWin. WSL did not exist at the time, but that would still be using Linux.

Customise the displayed clock. I have 3 monitors, a taskbar on each, and at least one clock on each. From left to right my clocks show:

Unix time (1695110535)
Full datetime (2023-09-19T17:32:15 +0930)
12 hour time (5:32)
Abbreviated datetime (Tuesday, 2023-09-19, 17:32).

If I wanted to, I could display the datetime as YYYY-hh-MM, ss:DD:mm. I'm fairly sure this is not possible on windows.

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  1. Bash scripts which updates my system (not completely, snaps and flatpaks seem to be immune to this). I am pretty sure you can't do this on Windows.

Can't you just add a line in the script

flatpak update

I use a single gpu that I detach from my host and reattach in a vm when I start the vm (and vice versa). I don’t think windows will enjoy a sudden lack of gpu.

I don't know what you mean with Adobe. It's a company not an application. Adobe Reader sucks and I don't need Adobe Pro, because I am able to use LaTeX.

Why I need a real distribution instead of a naked operating system like Windows is that it comes with ten thousands of preconfigured packages.

Then the system is transparent. I know what it does and can analyze it easily. When something doesn't work, I am able to find the cause. This is essential for me.

I don't need any shady antinvirus that hooks into the kernel, making the computer overall insecure. I generally trust the OpenSource community more than I trust Microsoft.

I also don't like ads on my system, except I subscribed to them. I pay for software and give devs money to keep projects running. But I don't want to see unrelated ads.

You know damn well what he meant, give me a break.

You cant install windows without internet anymore. I just saw that yesterday for the first time, win 11 pro instalation didnt let me go further without ethernet cable connected

With Linux you can save money by going 1 tier lower on the CPU (AKA buy a Ryzen 3 instead of a Ryzen 5, and so on) than you would go on Windows, at the same performance.

And of course, you can invest that money on other components or other stuff in general. 💵

I don't understand the downvotes, I guess for some tasks you need almost equal CPU but you are right, as in, if your computing power isnt' being sucked by power hungry and resource hungry machine, you can do more with less.

Haha... that should be the logo of Linux, do more will less

Because a modern CPU is not weighed down by the OS to the extent that going linux lets you forego a CPU upgrade for any meaningful workload.

I have absolutely no idea what anything you listed is, other than updating the OS and other programs 🤷‍♂️

I like Linux for a lot of reasons, but the reason I was dualbooting the most was more packages for AI and the like just worked on it and I was programming.

The reason I deleted my windows partition though was I had a faulty drive that on windows ment I would crash all the time, but my Linux boot just worked for like another year on the failing disk with no issue. When I got a new drive I just installed Linux and didn't bother getting Windows again.

I have to Linux for work sometimes and the biggest pet peeve for me is that the app search bar is always slow or broken. Like it is so good on KDE, I default to superkey, search app, enter compared to opening any lists of menus.