Republican secretary of state threatens to kick Biden off the ballot as Trump payback
Missouri Secretary of State Jay Ashcroft said that while he didn’t want to do it, he had to remind people of how “severe” the situation is.
A top Republican official in Missouri is threatening to remove President Joe Biden from appearing on the ballot as retaliation for the determination in two other states that Donald Trump doesn't qualify because he "engaged in insurrection."
"What has happened in Colorado & Maine is disgraceful & undermines our republic," Missouri Secretary of State Jay Ashcroft wrote on the social media site X on Friday. "While I expect the Supreme Court to overturn this, if not, Secretaries of State will step in & ensure the new legal standard for @realDonaldTrump applies equally to @JoeBiden!"
Ashcroft's post came shortly after the Supreme Court agreed to review a decision by Colorado's high court that found Trump could be barred from the state's primary ballot because of his actions leading up to the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol.
So yeah, if Biden commits insurgency, then his should be off the ballot. But last time I checked he hasn't come anywhere close.
But, Republicans would have you believe “fair is fair.” Trump got impeached, so Biden should get impeached. Trump got kicked off the ballot, so Biden should get kicked off the ballot. This has nothing to do with pesky things like details and rule of law, it’s just about my side vs your side, unless my side is winning, then I’ll take the law into consideration again.
The logic of "We're going to punish your guy for what our guy did" makes me laugh... until I cry.
That's what authoritarians literally believe. It's a tribal mentality. "Might makes right." "The ends justify the means."
Still waiting for Harris to become a secret trans woman like Obama.
You're forgetting that for these people, "commit insurgency" means "supports things I don't like".
The real question is what Thomas's dissenting opinion would be when the SC rules otherwise, and if he gets paid by the word.
Excuse me? Are you just going to ignore his wanton use of the word "malarkey"?
He committed an insurgency... against the road when he got into his Mustang and put it in gear back in the 70s.
Eventually, we will have no one on the ballot.
I am really tired of Republicans threatening lawlessness in response to application of lawful consequences.
At this point, they deserve to have some lawless consequences applied to them, if that's what they crave so badly.
Why would you give them what they want?
Some men you just can't otherwise reach.
I mean, good luck, you’ll have to provide better justification than revenge to keep it from being overturned.
They don't care. It's all about the grandstanding.
I almost want to see them try though, just to get smacked down in court.
As though having the rules applied to them won't reenforce their victim complex.
If they lose - even thanks to a GOP judge (a wild concept) it'll be because of the elites... You know - the Jews.
They're somehow both moronic and evil.
Fully expected, and if smacked down, thoroughly entertaining.
Is that some of that librul virtue signalling I hear so much about?
They'll sacrifice their lives for a person who is demonstrably the actual biggest loser in history, and he just gets more loser-y, folks, okay... If any of you are starting to have your memories fade, here's a quick refresher to read this morning and then copy and send to your aunt karen in Missouri.
And a partridge in a pear tree!
Anytime Trump is held slightly accountable, You can count on Republicans to threaten some type of payback.
It's basically Animal Farm.
"We believe in democracy for all... but some are more democratic than others"
"We believe in free speech... but some speech is more free than others."
Animal Farm is one of their guidebooks. Unsurprising since they're a bunch of swine.
The Republicans are using a book based on communism as their guidebook?
Based on a book about how to corrupt a gullible group by selling them a utopia but actually just enriching themselves.
Also, I'm not sure why you would be surprised that Republicans would use such a thing as a guidebook. Despite all their boogeymanning of Saul Alinsky, Republican strategists love Rules for Radicals. They used to distribute it before they decided to associate it with Obama.
Animal Farm is about totalitarianism.
I think you need to do a couple lessons on reading comprehension first then maybe try reading Animal Farm again
Well yes because that means they will be accountable too. And they don’t wanna take personal responsibility over anything.
Responsibility would mean that they acknowledge being dumbasses in an uniroinic sense
Honestly at this point someone just needs to end Trump for the sanity of us all. There stupid fucks won't get over his dick in their ass otherwise.
I feel like Trump's ideology has taken over so much of right-wingers even he is out of the way, it will continue.
Straight out of the Russian playbook. And for the same reason we can't let Putin win, these people can't be allowed to win.
On fucking twatter
If it applies equally to both, Biden shouldn't be taken off since he hasn't been found guilty of sedition ya dipshit.
Because he didn't engage in, not found guilty of.
Trump hasn't been found guilty of sedition either.
Yes, I'm prepared for the down votes from a bunch of idiots who hate reality.
Article 14 doesn’t stipulate guilt, just engaging in which the Colorado court determined he did. His removal is the result of due process. So if they can show in court that Biden did the same then sure…but they cannot.
Not the same, purely partisan BS.
Nor did I say it did.
No, but you said Trump has not been found guilty which is not required for him to be precluded from running for office. It’s an artificial bar some are trying to set unsupported by the text in the Constitution.
In any rational timeline SCOTUS would agree but with these justices who knows.
He was responding to another poster who said not being found guilty should make Biden immune to being taken off.
That's the context in which that was said, and you're ignoring that context. There's a big difference between saying it's also true of trump, for consistencies sake, and someone bringing it up out of the blue to advocate for trump.
You either have poor reading comprehension or you are responding in bad faith.
I understood it perfectly - my point which applies to both comments is that nothing in the 14th stipulates or indeed even mentions conviction, it does specifically exclude insurrection which applies, as determined by the Colorado court, solely to Trump.
The original response was flawed in its premise, agreed, but the guilt angle is Constitutionally irrelevant regardless - that was my point.
Not in a court of law; but given all the evidence you have to be willfully ignorant to believe he isn't guilty of it and wouldn't receive a conviction if/when there actually is a trial.
I think he's guilty of it. But we shouldn't be talking about guilt because it's not part of the amendment.
That's just being pedantic. What's a better word to use to say "he fucking did it?"
.... Did you really just dismiss something that relies, literally, on pedantry, as a system of understanding, for being.... Pedantic?
Guilt isn't part of the amendment, just engaging in sedition is enough, not being found guilty of it.
Guilty being the operative word, which has legal definitions, feel free to ignore/dismiss actual meanings of words for convenience but that is an odd stance to be taking if you aren't a MAGA? (I've interacted with you before, and you're better than that which is why I'm confused)
He engaged in it. Another way to say that is he is guilty of it. I didn't say he was convicted. So the question still stands: Do you have a better word that means "he fucking did it" that isn't "guilty?" Because this isn't a court room and we're not lawyers. Reasonable people understood what I meant.
Correct. Trump hasn't been found guilty of sedition. He has been found guilty of insurrection by the Colorado supreme Court. He also hasn't been criminally convicted of insurrection, because this isn't a criminal case.
Sedition and insurrection are different, and parts of different laws. Criminal and civil guilt are also different mechanisms of our laws, but the 14th amendment doesn't state someone needs to have a criminal conviction to be considered ineligible for office.
An interesting thing I hadn't thought about. Thanks.
You're not wrong. However by the text of the Constitution a guilty verdict isn't required to invalidate candidacy.
Technically that is true. However, he was impeached for incitement of insurrection by the House of Representatives. The majority of the Senate then voted to remove him after impeachment, but not the 2/3s majority required.
So no, not "found guilty of sedition". But he was impeached for inciting insurrection.
So what, you're suggesting the reality is it was staged? Because we all observed reality with our real eyes in real time.
Yes if Joe Biden engages in insurrection then he should be excluded from the ballot. I just don't think that's particularly likely.
It does. The legal standard does apply equally to everyone. And in fact the same standard has applied for 155 years.
Doublespeak. Republicans actively work to twist the meaning of words to their base to fit their agenda, so that the other side playing by the rules and being fair looks like political cheating. That way Republicans can engage in political cheating themselves and claim self defense.
In today's flavor, "legal standard" means "the ability to make us lose" so they want to apply their own "legal standard" to democrats.
It sounds dumb to anyone paying attention, but their voters will eat this up.
>The legal standard does apply equally to everyone. And in fact the same standard has applied for 155 years.
under the law, in it's fairness, it is just as illegal for the billionaire to sleep under a bridge as it is for the homeless
fuck laws
also, fuck politicians.
Waaaahhhh my candidate got kicked off so I'm going to retaliate and try to kick the other guy off. Good luck at the Supreme Court.
With how stacked the Court is for righties, I wouldn't be surprised.
It’s literally all the GOP really has been trying to accomplish since Nixon. They did it to our guy so we have to get them back somehow.
The reason the government is called a republic is because it follows laws and established proceedures.
Now Team Trump is advocating pure mob rule.
And people think its cool.
They're not actually advocating for mob rule, mob rule is only acceptable if it's the mob rule that accomplishes what they want.
Mobs are usually told what to want.
📢 "and when do they want it?!?!"
Didn't know children could be Secretary of State. Missouri has low standards.
They always did. It's the Florida of the Midwest.
All that comes to mind when I see this guy's face is:
Don't you dare say that. Then Wisconsin will start feeling like they have to become the Alabama of the Midwest and everything will go to hell.
Every so often Missouri does the right thing, like elect a dead guy
I mean... America has low standards, Missouri is just a symptom of the disease.
The DOJ should investigate this guy for supporting insurrection, too.
It's not new. It already applies equally. Biden wasn't part of an insurrection.
I'm voting Biden. But if the Democrats would suggest maybe someone else from the 150million rational thinking American population who are not Republican, I would vote for that person. Joe has done a good job. I just don't wanna be sitting here in my toilet writing about how terrible the situation is 2 years from now when we loose Joe to stress and need a new president. So obviously not Trump or any other rock-like object or non-human organic matter composition. But any human who loves this country and wants us to do even better would be nice.
Yeah I get invited to all the parties.
He's actually made of compressed Cheeto dust.
I’ll volunteer. Am eligible, and was president of an HOA at some point, I’m sure those skills scale. Also, not a Cheeto, nor rock, nor non-human organic matter composition.
I'll vote for you 😉.
Kindergarten recess is more mature than US politics.
It's intentional. Jerry Springer Goes To Congress.
I assume you know he was a politician as well?
Yes.
Neat, I didn't know Biden also engaged in insurrection. This guy seems very wise!
You don't, but they are certain of it. It's clearly been an insurrection all these years, since when the democrats colluded with the lizard people to administer the vaccine and steal the elections. It's obvious if you think about it.
He should be wise. 44 years old and his entire career has been political appointments to cosplay as a lawyer.
Insurrection doesn't seem to be very strongly defined.
Maybe simply running against an incumbent president is insurrectionalist.
The current SCOTUS claims to be using the "common meaning of words" as their interpretation mechanism for the Constitution.
Assuming they have any bit of consistency whatsoever, the common meaning of words gives at least prima facie argument against Trump being able to run with zero argument against Biden being able to run.
And lucky us, the current SCOTUS has not really shown loyalty to Trump as a person. Here's hoping that sticks around.
I'm more worried about future legitimate candidates being excluded. I'm not defending Trump in particular.
You should actually be more worried that violent insurrection becomes the norm.
Historically, if take away someone's democratic option to express themselves then they become more likely to turn to violence.
Actually, the far right are more likely to turn to violence every time they lose, period. That's always been the way of things. You're conflating the Left's values with the Right. The Right do not care about Democracy. Have you never sat through one of those fascist fucks "we're not a Democracy, we're a Republic" defense of minority tyranny? They care about winning at all costs. They're as likely to turn violent is they lose 90/10 as if they lose because their leader was convicted of a felony or taken off a ballot for legitimate reasons.
If fascist win after having Trump removed from the ballot then it makes it even harder to legitimately argue that a particular candidate should stay on a future ballot.
If fascists take over the US, there will never be another legitimate election whether or not we take the correct legal action prior to that point.
But we're talking Beer Hall Putsch leniency on Trump, and all that does is empower the actual fascists to take more extreme action knowing they will never face consequences. People are terrified that if they don't give in to fascists, fascists won't play fair.
Guess what? Fascists already won't play fair.
But when the good guys don't play fair they can become fascists.
Sure. Show me proof the good guys aren't playing fair taking an insurrectionist off the Ballot because the Constitution demands it.
See the conclusions of 2 states and the Senate.
Whose democratic options to express themselves is being taken away?
Statistically it is non-white people, so why is it white people who are turning to violence?
MAGA voters.
Because they are MAGA voters?
How are MAGA voters losing the democratic options to express themselves?
? Not being able to vote for their preferred candidate.
Are you aware the Constitution sets out requirements for eligibility for president? Just because your feelings say you really want a particular person, it doesn't mean you have a constitutional right to vote for them. For example, maybe I really want Arnold Schwarzenegger for president. Just because I prefer Arnold that does not mean he can be president.
Trumpers could vote for Trump in 2020 and they still staged a violent insurrection. So your point is both stupid and moot.
Yes. Trump was impeached for incitement of insurrection but acquitted in the Senate. That's the constitutional rules being followed.
Just because your feelings say you really don't want a particular person, it doesn't mean you have a constitutional right to exclude them.
Consider how violent Trumpers could get if they couldn't vote.
Unfortunately, Republicans don't need Democrats to invent ways for them to be fascist, they're quite capable of finding opportunities on their own
Let's not make it even easier for them in the future.
It won't. It's a trick we've fallen for. We withhold Justice from the corrupt out of fear they use our justice against us illegitimately. Yet what we miss is that it only works if they have the ammo to do the same without using our justice against us. It's a game to them to wrap their horrors in our good deeds, but they can't actually commit more horrors because we do good.
And if we incorrectly apply false justice then it's likely to come back and bite us in the ass.
The case against Trump must be watertight. The Senate and courts in two states don't believe this is the case.
I agree 100%
I'm arguing elsewhere in this thread that we need to be careful to dot our I's and cross our T's in serving justice, but we're talking about the Bad Faith argument here, and not whether the case against Trump was watertight. It doesn't matter if we have a watertight case against Trump, Republicans will try to use this against us. It doesn't matter if we took this action or not, Republicans will try to do things like this against us anyway.
But to your point (which is a real tangent), there's no reason or precedent to apply a criminal burden of proof to a non-criminal statutory requirement, despite the fact some judges seem to want to. The Criminal burden of proof is extremely high because the consequences of criminal conviction are dramatic and possibly horrific, far worse than someone simply being left off a federal ballot. People have already been criminally convicted of collaborating with Trump to commit crimes. By even some civil burdens of proof, Trump has already been found liable for his role in the insurrection attempt.
If leaving someone of the ballot is made trivial then it will be used by bad people against good people.
It won't be the good guys that make it trivial. The bad guys just get off by using real justice against us.
If Trump makes it into the General Election, whether he wins or loses, we are a fallen state whose Constitution is meaningless. And I GUARANTEE the bad people are already using the hell out of that.
Nah. Hyperbole.
The 14th ammendment may need rework, but that doesn't burn the entire document
Genuinely interested in what these bad people are doing regarding the Constitution. Can you give examples?
That's like if you assaulted someone, and then claiming you didn't assault them because you think assault isn't strongly defined.
It's just a very stupid and slimy way of saying you think laws shouldn't apply to you.
No, assault is strongly defined with a large amount of case law to back it up. It is also obvious who committed it.
Violent storming of the Capitol is insurrectionalist and obvious (like assault)
Incitement to insurrection is lacking in case law, and open to interpretation.
I don't know why you think this law is applicable to me personally.
That was not your original statement but it's a lot more correct now, and if we can agree that an obvious insurrection is an insurrection, that's a very good start.
I don't see any honest case to be made that this isn't incitement of insurrection.
Additionally, the 14th Amendment does not require you to prove it was an incitement, it's enough to provide aid or comfort to the insurrectionists. Of which there are numerous examples, including Trump repeatedly offering to pardon the insurrectionists.
Trump also said "I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard."
The phrase "fight like hell" can be used non violently.
Although it sounds like I'm defending Trump, I'm actually attacking future fascist, because...
This can be read in such a way that almost anyone can be struck off the ballot.
I'll give an hyperbolic example. "Instagram star breaks DC window" = followers are insurrectionists. Anyone liking a post is barred from the ballot.
If you shake someone's hand and also punch them, does the handshake cancel out the punch?
You're being slimy and dishonest again. Trump is a politician, he talks out both sides of his mouth. Talking out both sides of your mouth does not cancel out.
You can't tell the difference between double tapping an Instagram post and offering a presidential pardon?
I'm playing devil's advocate.
I can, but maybe a good lawyer can equate them. Is the law well defined enough to tell the difference?
It's interesting that you consider a swampy dishonest lawyer to be a "good" lawyer.
OK, a lawyer with great arguments, low morals and a love for money. Happier?
Trump can do no wrong. Therefore, any action taken against him must be unjustified. So it can only ever be political, and therefore, it's only fair that we do the same to Biden.
The best part is, they recognize that this is terrible for democracy, that this being normalized would be a disaster, and then say they are going to do it anyway. They are admitting that rather than accept the outcome of the legal process for settling these kinds of situations, and respecting the rule of law, they would rather damage our society to get their victory by any means necessary.
Which is pretty much how we got here in the first place, when Trump couldn't accept an election or dozens of court cases all telling him he lost.
TL;DR: they're fascist traitors committing sedition and need to be treated as such.
The fact that democrats don't treat them as such shows that they're complicit in the march to fascism.
You mean to tell me John Ashcroft's son is a bit of a douche, too?!?
Why are you being so nice to Jay Ashcroft by calling him a bit of a douche?
My bad. Full douche. Just like his daddy. Feel free to come up with a more descriptive term if you're feeling creative, too!
A douche bag full of Trumps excrement.
Just to fantasize a bit, it'd be hilarious if these "Duck season! Wabbit season!" Shenanigans resulted in both Democrats and Republicans mutually excluding each other from a majority of ballots, and third parties had to fill in the gaps.
Polite reminder that third parties are not viable in a first past the post voting system, and that Democrats are the ones who have actually been instituting ranked choice voting (while Republicans are the ones taking it away & banning it)
Great insight. Thank you!
I swear these people shouldn't even be trusted with anything sharper than a spoon. This is how you fucking conduct work!? You respond to people's Twatter account about legal actions. Jesus tap dancing Christ.
Oh look, Republicans being less mature than Kindergartners... again
Yeah so THAT wouldn't hold up to a SCOTUS hearing. Rather if it does we may as well ignore SCTOUS forevermore.
Why are the comments here acting like the SCOTUS stands for anything but toeing Republican line? The court is more stacked than it has been for decades and these people will gladly sell-out the Constitution to score political power for Republicans.
Pretty sure three of them literally got their positions in return for their work on the Bush v. Gore case in 2000 that led to the first GW Bush Presidency.
John Roberts, Brett Kavanaugh, and Amy Coney Barrett all worked for the Bush campaign on that case.
People have been lying to themselves about this one for a long time. Roberts is chief justice, and Bush elevated him there in 2005. It's just become much more egregious and mask-off since then because they're pretty damned sure the public can't actually do anything about it so they've stopped giving a shit about pretending.
They didn't let Trump argue his election lies. Sometimes they can surprise you.
My impression is they still know they must feign being apolitical and letting Trump argue election lies would be so far removed from reality that they know everything would change after that.
Whereas this case means all they need to say is, "let the voters decide" and the enlightened centrists, even some of the left, will nod their heads in agreement or just quietly bicker.
Because of their own self-interest and protecting judiciary power for themselves?
do it then, just like the impeachment. quit bitching and do something so we can put you down again you fucking cowards.
That was my favorite when GOP cried for Biden Impeachment and how weak they look when they literally had nothing.
They continue to show how limp dick they are.
What scares me is they look impotent to anyone who is able to think critically or at all, really, but these theatrics are actually effective for their low IQ base. Whenever their latest bullshit plan doesn't work, they just blame some communist conspiracy, which further riles the idiots up.
This rhetoric also spits potential violence at polling places
“Poor, poor Donald Trump. Can you imagine? So rich he don’t have to do nothin but sit around and enjoy life, but he sacrificed everthang to lead this country to greatness. He even lost money to do it. Can you believe that? Poor, poor man gets harassed constantly. They’re doin everthang they can to take him down. Most men would just call it quits and retire to an island, but he knows that Satan wants power. He wonts tuh git in the kids heads and make ‘em all gay and bring the end. The commonists are this close tuh takin’ America. Only thang ‘at can stop it is God and Donald Trump.”
I actually heard someone say this. I felt my eyes rolling back into my melting brain.
You know what bums me out? During the debate with Hillary Clinton he said, “I’ll keep you in suspense.” When asked if he would accept the results of an election if he lost.
Before that I thought, “Well, maybe he’s just playing it up. He’s said some decent shit in the past. Maybe he really is a smart guy and he’s pandering to the right people.” Once he said that I thought, “Oh boy, this is scary. Good thing he said it though. Now everyone will know he’s dangerous.”
January 6 happened and I thought everyone would connect the dots.
Nope. They just went batshit crazy with him.
Thank god his sons have as much charisma as a bowl of pea soup. Maybe this will end when he dies… until the next charismatic character comes along and says all the right things to rile up bigots. Or, wouldn’t it be great if his youngest son becomes a progressive and wins entirely because he’s a Trump? A man can dream haha.
I was so happy in 2008 when we elected the first black president even though I didn’t align with him politically at the time. I knew what was going to follow though, swear to god. The bigots got scared and got political. I mean, it’s more than just that, but that was a huge deal to them.
I wish it had instead made them collectively say, “Ok boys, we’re wrong to feel this way.” Nope.
What a time to be alive.
I hope this is a "growing pains" moment and we'll all band together to overcome hate and greed, but I fear all the bigots, morons, and corporations are going to take power by force since they can't get it by popular vote.
I think it's funny how some people still think Bernie Sanders had a chance when lots of Americans froth in the mouth about Biden being a communist.
He's a moderate right-wing politician at best.
You're right. Bernie was a step in the direction we need to go considering where we're at now, but that's not happening any time soon. Now what little is left of United States democracy is on life support.
It's surreal, watching the United States disintegrate from the inside. I wonder if this is how the Soviets felt in the eighties.
Just a friendly reminder that it is Republicans who are kicking, or attempting to, kick trump off the ballot. If they want to change The Constitution, there is an amendment process. Until then, The Constitution is very clear on the topic.
Wait it is?
Since we're at the primary stage, the only people who have standing to challenge are going to be Republicans and possibly independents (as in Colorado).
It's also important to remember that the reporting you hear like "Michigan and California left Trump on the ballot" doesn't mean the 14A S3 challenges are over in those states. Michigan, for example, does not have jurisdiction to exclude anyone from a primary ballot. (Colorado does, which is why they were able to find him disqualified from the primary ballot - because he is also disqualified from the general in Colorado.) If Trump wins the Republican nomination and is set to appear on the general election ballot, such states will see new challenges.
Sure. If Biden launches his own insurrection I think no one would hold it against you.
I wonder if he also wants the absolute immunity that Trump claims to have to this day to also apply to Biden?
Negatives to Trump must be applied equally
Positives to Biden must be applied equally
Positives to Trump or Negatives to Biden mustn't be
That's what Republicans call "Fairness"
Sounds like Missouri should be taken off the ballot.
Most of the time I forget Missouri exists, it's nice. Then some asshole has to come along and ruin it.
https://youtu.be/_2_I81mlExc?si=KOZAXfMB_yW-y9OU&t=110
Whataboutism politics in action. They're not even defending him, it's just, "Well if you're going to do that we'll just do it back to you!"--
This is always how the GOP responds. Their voters don't know any better and assume everyone is doing the crime because they were told so. If everyone is doing it, it's okay. Zero thought, all emotional rage bait.
Well jokes on them because Biden couldnt get trump back on the ballot in any of the states hes kicked off in even if he wanted to, cuz it really has nothing to do with Biden and he has no control over whats states decide to do or how they interpret the constitution.
And I think if anyone of them do take Biden off the ballot it'll trigger some kind of law suit because they currently cannot show any cause for taking him off.
Don't you just love it how they all completely ignore and fly over the actual reason why trump is being dumped? They just claim it's a disgrace that trump is dropped, as if random people decided to do this on a whim, but will NEVER mention why they made that decision. Never mention that trump instigated an insurrection, we wouldn't want people to get the wrong idea now, would we?
Well the whole thing can be solved by an actual conviction of treason. If it is obvious his actions were treasonous and he did in fact lead an insurrection, it should be an easy case.
At least they're honest that they are just being fascists and it's not because Biden did anything wrong. Wish that actually mattered here.
Fucking hell of course it’s Missouri… those of us in ST Louis are trying to be decent I swear. The fucking rednecks in the middle of the state drag us down so much though
I just overheard some morons at my workplace complaining how all the "goddamn lib cities" are the reason the Republicans don't have a stranglehold and that votes should be based on how much land you own, not per person. These morons are from Missouri. I'm sorry you have to deal with them.
"how much land you own" lmfaooo remind them how much land Bill Gates owns and watch them trip over their own feet trying to amend that statement.
These guys are so smooth brained, they could provide modern science with cutting edge low-friction technology. I'm a microbiologist and my coworkers are an MPH and a pharmacist. These guys are construction contractors but sit in the next office area over. We overhear them talk politics and "bro science" on the regular. We've overhead genius talking points including:
@SoleInvictus @FaeDrifter Humanity is in serious trouble.
Kansas City too...
Yep KC and STL are the bright spots of an otherwise shit state. We’d be another Mississippi if not for STL and KC
Grandpa Simpson had the right idea.
That's pretty much how it is in every state. Cities have become islands of civilization in a sea of foolishness and ignorance.
The ironic thing is, rural communities can't exist without the subsidies that come from cities. Fox News managed to convince them to hate the very people funding their lifestyle.
They could exist, but only as subsistence farming communities without big trucks and processed goods/drinks. They would instantly be transported back hundreds of years without the city’s taxes funding shipping, roads, electricity, water, etc
Oh yeah, st. Louis, the shining bastion of how great a city can be. Get over yourself.
Not great over there. Rednecks for days. Awful race relations. Like, really bad.
A quick looky-loo at st Louis demographics on Wikipedia tells me there ain't very many rednecks over there. The fuck are you talking about?
Hey bud, St Louis is not a state.
Don't be butthurt. St Louis sucks ass, just fax. Don't think you know how to read anyway, much less a Wikipedia page.
Are you agreeing with me or not?
Now it's confirmed you can't read. Yay for our school system.
Look everyone, it's someone who has nothing intelligent, useful, or interesting to say, yet they still felt like joining in, so instead provided about the most useless, smooth-brained criticism possible.
Gotta love it when someone tries to rip on someone but instead just shows everyone they're a low-effort moron. 5/5 self own.
I get what you're saying here but this isn't the way to say it.
I don't get it, why are you upset at him saying St. Louis is bad but not upset at the guy saying the middle of Missouri is bad?
It's almost like you're biased or something.
Your comment doesn't make any sense as a response to my comment, so I think you responded to the wrong person.
Maybe you need to work on your reading comprehension, then.
You, sir, are a douchebag.
I originally had a diatribe here about you and people like you, then I realized it made me just as bad. Worse even because I know better. To my defense, my father just died, so I'm an emotional wreck.
You misunderstood my original comment and I must have misunderstood your response. The difference is I was polite in my response to you while you were snarky, rude, and unhelpful. You didn't even try to explain what you meant because you don't care about conveying an actual message or being understood. Just like the guy I was originally calling out for being a dick (it had nothing to do with what was being said, simply how it was said), you're just looking for weaknesses to score hits on other people. It's classic bully behavior.
To be fair, I was snarky and extremely rude to the other guy, but I'm pushing back on his being an asshole. I guess I'm just tired of online bullies like you two.
Of course, because Biden is the one who directly violated the 4th Amendment by instigating a failed attempt to overthrow our democracy. So naturally he's the one who should be removed from ballots! /s
Whether they are just deliberately obtuse, utterly engulfed in tribalistic spite, or just so blinded by idiotic conspiracy theories (or some mix of all) doesn't really matter. The people arguing that Biden should be removed on this topic are unfit to be in any position of responsibility or power.
This man's dad lost an election to a fucking corpse, he was such a piece of shit. GWB went and made that piece of shit the country's AG. The shit apple clearly does not fall from the shit tree.
Words of wisdom, Lahey.
Oh Jesus fucking Christ.
I fucking live in this shit hole state. What'll happen if he actually does this?
Biden might not reel in that electoral sweep that's been forecasted for Missouri (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Missouri)...
Real talk though, elections matter and this is not a "both sides bad" situation. Specific policy disagreements with one side and the systematic dismantling of the American government are not equivalent criticisms.
Vote and bring a friend. Every year, the number of eligible voters who don't show up at the polls represent a big enough voting block to win the election outright. While you face almost impossible odds persuading a member of the opposite political party to switch sides, after college age, it is entirely possible to convince someone to get in the car with you and vote (even better to mail in where possible).
Mobilization is what will decide 2024, not persuasion. Everyone needs to remember that despite 2020's outcome, the election was decided by fewer voters than you can fit inside a football stadium (due to our electoral college fun times). If you live in GA, AZ, WI, PN, NC, NV, or MI—You. Must. Vote! ...preferably early.
Cynics who tell you otherwise do not understand how much harder it is to rebuild a system than it is to maintain one. This one needs significant maintenance, like back to the shop engine work. We will not have a repair shop left to go to if we don't get out the vote right now.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_turnout_in_United_States_presidential_elections
I thought Republicans support state's rights
Only for the having of slaves
Nonsense, don't you know your history? Democrats were the ones who owned slaves! It was the republicans that freed them!
Party switch? What party switch? And what does the Confederate flag on my pickup have to do with anything?
A sophisticated and formidable legal mind in a pleasant, debonaire package. Truly his cup overfloweth.
How did Missouri get so lucky?
good luck moron
reactionaries run their mouth first and seek method as an afterthought
Especially when they aren't reelected for saying something so idiotic.
They all have the thought process of a 12 year old and so that’s how democracy dies I guess.
Nah, it's easy to win intellectual fights with 12yr olds. Don't stop fighting, their arguments are hollow, and the have ineffective arguments.
There is no intellectual fight going on, they just say whatever needs to be true to justify their shitty action at any given moment. They know they're full of shit, they don't care.
I'm acually surprised that they used "social media site X" and didn't add "formerly known as Twitter" First time I'm seeing this.
They really think it was done for political reasons and is just a team sport
You may be giving them too much credit. They know what they tried to do.
Agreed. We need to stop pretending GOP leadership are idiots and treat them like the organized threat they are.
I think that they are both idiots, and an organized threat to democracy. Like the CIA during the Project Condor years. Those guys were mostly morons, but they had a firehose of money, and tons of manpower. Very similar to the GOP at this point.
Haha fair, the teaparty and then Maga kind of got away from them at first. They were able to exploit the teaparty so I feel like they are gonna come out of maga stronger than ever.
Undermines the dictatorship we want….
What happened in the national capitol on Jan6 is disgraceful and undermines the republic.
The people trying to clean up after that mess are not the problem, you pandering old windbag.
Is there an equivalent of /r/JustFuckMyShitUp here? Yikes, this guy is rocking one atrocious haircut.
Go for it. It'll get overturned in court and we'll get more news coverage of why Trump getting removed from the ballot is valid, but Biden getting removed isn't.
Nothing will get through to Trump's cult. They're incapable of seeing that Trump is facing consequences for breaking the law, because to them he can literally do no wrong. All they'll ever see is people being mean to their Lord and Savior.
The problem with this "oh, yeah! Just you wait, I'll get you back!" Is that the states that removed Trump had a legal justification. He on the other hand is just talking shit, and that doesn't hold up in court.
Unfortunately it will with Maga judges
Good thing Missouri secretary of state isn't in any way shape or form a real job. Or him wasting taxpayers dollars with this political stunt would really piss off the overweight illiterate trailer park inhabitants of the state.
It's honestly better for them as it gives this writhing mass of cancerous maggots parading as a human and it's staff less time to research and decline to participate in federal aid programs that don't specifically give the money to corporations and police.
Pretty sure that is sedition
A 200lb sack of bleached all-purpose flour with a four-dollar Flowbee haircut
What is Mike Pence?
Damnit, that's basically all of them.
deleted by creator
Steal his look for less!… oh wait.
A wild troglodite appeared.
Ashcroft is a real piece of shit garbage. Even shittier than his father, which is saying something. The embodiment of the Mitchell and Webb "Are we the baddies?" Nazi bit.
Maybe we can collectively have all the states kick both Biden and Trump off the primary?
No u
Yeah, that’s not how this works.
Exactly!
Biden shouldn't be thrown off it.
Honestly I'm surprised they didn't do this sooner
Is payback Law And Order?
Don't forget that trump wished for his political enemies to "rot in hell" as part of his Merry Christmas message, , and he also shared a word cloud that prominently featured "revenge" and "dictatorship" with no context.
People who say "I'm not Trump" is not good enough of a reason to vote for a candidate are being petulant children. Trump has said he'd pardon all January 6th convicts if elected day 1. This will embolden political violence like none other, because if "your guy" gets in, you will face no consequences, so the amount of lying, cheating, and stealing when it comes to elections will go through the goddamn roof.
This man is on a hateful warpath. He will abuse the hell out of the office because of his ego. And people like the state secretary mentioned here will be in power while cheering him on.
Called it.
Down the slippery slope we go…
Before long republicans won’t be on the ballots for democratic states and democrats won’t be on the ballot in republican states.
Guess what happens next?
We finish the job we failed to complete in 1865?
You're conflating Republicans threatening to break the law with Democrats trying to follow it. GTFO with that bullshit.
On the contrary.
Can we just have a civil war already, I'd rather get it over with now than when I'm in my forties and in even more pain than I am now.
Congress should pass a resolution removing Trump's disqualification.
That would satisfy the 14th amendment without setting a nasty political precedent while at the same time serving as an official recognition that Trump committed acts that triggered the 14th amendment.
No. I'd rather the fascists try to get violent and get put down than let that fucker win any fight unchallenged.
How would that overrule the 14th?
It wouldn't. The 14th specifically says Congress can remove the insurrection disqualification.
Gotcha. I didn't know that part.
I’m not actually sure that would be a bad outcome for dems…but I think the optics would make it a non starter.
Let's go dictator! all hail dictator whoever the fuck!
Can't wait for tropico to play out in USA in my lifetime. We can finally bring more equality to the world by bringing down the last real bastion of democracy. I wonder what world power will step in to take over for us?
Yes please. Get Genocide Joe off the ballot so someone else can run.
Looking forward to all the people guilt tripping me for not voting when it's Biden running unopposed in half the states and Trump running unopposed in half the states.
I mean, there's still plenty of other elections going on....
I'll vote if there's ballot questions, this presidential race is just a circus
I don’t like trump and agree he belongs in jail but how the democrats are doing it is wrong we are innocent until proven guilty in the court of law he is on trial right now but has yet to be convicted of a crime so he should not be removed until he is proven guilty in a court of law. The trail likely won’t be over until after the election so the are using dirty tactics to remove him before he is found guilty so I am not surprised if the start removing Biden from state ballots as well. We will see what the Supreme Court says but I would assume the would say the same but could very well be wrong nobody should vote for trump but we gotta do it correctly.
Firstly, the amendment does not require any conviction. It is simply a prerequisite. Secondly, Colorado literally held a trial to determine this. It was determined in a court of law after reviewing all the evidence and holding a trial that he was not eligible. This was not done “by the democrats”. This is the legal system and election officials doing their jobs
That’s the thing it is too vague and why it will be all hell I have a feeling both trump and Biden will be missing from ballots and if that happens both are not eligible.
It's not vague at all. Engage in an insurrection, you can't hold office. Trump incited an insurrection that was broadcast on national television.
Biden hasn't incited an insurrection, but if he did, he would also be ineligible for office.
The problem with Republicans is they actually don't give the smallest shit about the law or the US Constitution. They're fascists, the don't have integrity or values, except to value seizing and maintaining power, by any means necessary.
Yeah Republicans and Democrats both bad choices i do not like any of them but i do believe Biden shouldn't hold office he is too old and honestly smells of corruption from Hunter Biden scandal. Trump yeah hard no i do not want him in office lets not repeat time to move on we need different candidates from both party's. Lets get some fresh options.
There's lots of good reasons to be anti-Biden.
BUT PER THE LAW, Biden is eligible to run and Trump is not.
This has nothing to do with feelings or even policy. Nothing to do with sides.
This is just the straight up facts. Trump has engaged in insurrection. Biden has not. The 14th Amendment is clear that insurrectionists are not eligible for office.
If you want to be eligible for office, dotn engage in insurrection. It's not fucking complicated.
Cool I don’t really care enough to keep this conversation going I rarely get into politics and even then who cares it’s always a bad choice either way.
Laws are important, I'm sure if someone broke into your home and stole all your stuff you wouldn't want the law to just shrug and go who cares.
I never said laws where not important I just lack the interest to further this I’ll let the people already taking care of it do it.
Why should he be treated any differently than anyone else that was disqualified under the 14th amendment?
The big distinction here would be that everyone else disqualified under Section 3 was a public officer in a major political organization (the CSA) who was in open war with the US. No question of fact whatsoever.
While Trump was too much of a wuss to openly lead his insurrection himself, so some government entity should probably be responsible for determining whether or not section 3 applies, and what standard they have to meet to do so. There are probably good arguments why qualification for a federal office isn't properly decided by a state judge or official.
That is not a distinction actually made by section 3. Oath breakers are disqualified, not rebels per se.
State elections officials already do that for things like age, residency requirements, etc. It's part of federalism that the state governments administer federal elections.
I am not saying he should all candidates suck honestly don’t want any of them but. Nothing you can do unfortunately I am just stating an opinion you should have to be convicted of an actual crime like treason which I think they could charge him with and then remove him based on that charge.
Requiring a conviction in the first place is the special treatment I'm referring to.
Disqualification is not a criminal penalty. If it were then it could be removed by a presidential pardon.
Instead it can only be removed by Congress--a body that is specifically prohibited from passing laws that set or alter someone's criminal liability.
I agree then let’s congress decide and not the court my only point is now the create where we are now the could remove Biden and say it’s because of hunter biden and the would not be wrong that’s my only point.
congress can decide by a 2/3 majority that his insurrection doesn't bar him from running. it's in the constitution. failure to pass that resolution is congress deciding that his insurrection counts and he's disqualified.
Congress can only remove the disqualification, they can't impose it.
It's a problem that the amendment doesn't tell us how it's supposed to work, but the fact that other disqualifying factors (age, residency, etc.) are determined by the states suggests that the states can determine disqualification on the insurrection factor too, and through the same procedural mechanisms.
This makes much more sense thanks for the clarification. 🖖