“Zuck: Yeah so if you ever need info about anyone at Harvard
Zuck: Just ask.
Zuck: I have over 4,000 emails, pictures, addresses, SNS
[Redacted Friend's Name]: What? How'd you manage that one?
Zuck: People just submitted it.
Zuck: I don't know why.
Zuck: They "trust me"
Zuck: Dumb fucks.“
How the fuck did Harvard students act so stupid and give out their info like that? I thought they were like the smartest people in the US. 🤔
Most Harvard students are still just 18-22 year old "kids". Think of how dumb/naive you were at that age.
Try telling that to a 18-22 yr old. You think you know everything at that age. Then you get older and realize no one knows any fucking thing
To be fair, when you're at that age and come into contact with dozens of "adults" that never mentally grew past 12, you're bound to think you're "very smart".
Yea except I know I know everything so I'm built different
There’s a reason second-year students are called sophomores. It’s a compound with the same roots as “sophisticated” and “moron”. It literally means “learned idiot”. It’s referring to the students who have a year of schooling under their belt, and think that they understand everything about the world. It’s basically referring to the Dunning-Krueger Effect, where people who know very little about something are the most likely to overestimate their knowledge on the topic.
As a 21 year old I would be offended but then I remember I just admitted my exact age on the internet
Oh don't worry, I'm still in that age range, I guess I'll find out how dumb I am in a few years from now. 😅
You don’t get any smarter, just wise enough to know how dumb you are.
Maybe.
If you're lucky
smartest people in the US
The problem is that that is a very low bar to overcome
Nah, it's just the kids of the wealthiest people and a handful of diversity admissions.
This is still I think the most telling glimpse into who the "ZUCK" really is. Looking at what meta has become, how it has operated... No matter how professional and respectable he acts.
This is a reminder to lemmy users, that this new meta expriement will use the ActivityPub protocol, meaning that it can interact with other lemmy instances, please urge your lemmy instance admins to de-federate from this crap as soon as it launches!
But why? Isn't the whole point of federation that we can interact with people in other communities? Don't we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub? Completely walling them off seems counterproductive
Interesting and I'd say you're right. If you were to see a mass adoption of the fediverse (such as Twitter imploding and mastadon becoming the replacement) there would be an immediate attempt by the big tech players to gain control of it in some way. And this is exactly how they would try to do it.
Also here is a blog post about how Google killed the Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol (XMPP) using extend, embrace, extinguish.
What’s the alternative? They go with a non activity pub system and woo away all our users anyway?
If people want to crawl back into Meta's clutches I'm not going to stop them. Don't give the one nice thing we have to a corporation that only wants to exploit us.
Are you telling me this perfectly human looking human shouldn't be trusted?
Who cares? I’d rather they stay away from here anyways.
realistically, yes :(
opinion time: not everything has to be about fast/unsustainable growth, in the pursuit of profit. i would prefer that the fediverse grows organically, and entices quality users, posters and commenters to join based on the merits of the service, and not on it's access to inflated VC budgets, huge advertising campaigns, and exploitation of a first-mover advantage.
facebook/meta will slay us, because we are a threat to it's profit model. why are we even contemplating negotiations with a tiger while we have our head in it's mouth? it beggars belief...
Very roughly,
Lemmy and Kbin = Reddit
Masterson = Twitter
So what equals Facebook
Friendica
I think Diaspora* is the federated FB alternative
There was also a crypto backed and "freeze peach absolutist" alternative, Minds, dunno how that one's going
Don't we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub?
No. We don't. The more hands they have in the fediverse pie, the more influence they have over it. The more influence they have, the more control. The more control, the more at the whim of their decisions you are. The more at the whim of their decisions, the more power they have over you.
Were talking about meta here, this is a bait and switch attempt (I see it that way)
They launch their new twitter competitor, everyone moves over to their new twitter clone, they will try and hold the power on standarts of federation (like any big tech corporation that has a smaller rival that succedes more then them, see microsoft vs netscape for refrence)
If they will fail with that, they will try to seduce lemmy and mastodon instaces with monetization and big money handouts, were talking about facebook here after all, they are not short of scummy tactics
Yes. Three words: "Embrace, Extend, Extinguish"
A pratice as old as time, done and proved to work. It's not even theoretical, it's gonna happen. You either are proactive in protecting the network or we will be too late to do anything. Always works like that.
If you think that giving the benefit of the doubt and wait and see is an option, then you already lost.
Don’t we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub?
I certainly don't. I abandoned Facebook years ago because of how BS they were getting with privacy concerns and social manipulation. Last thing I want is to bring those dumpster fires here. They join the platform, I will migrate to whichever Instances defed them or leave Lemmy entirely if necessary.
Simply put, it's been a breathe of rational, civil air here. While it is early days keeping that hostile-to-humanity crap out of here is obvious minimum we should be doing.
If they can embrace and extend the fediverse you know they're gonna extinguish it, too. They're s bad faith actor, we don't want them interacting with us or influencing us.
Don't we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub?
No. We don't. The more hands they have in the fediverse pie, the more influence they have over it. The more influence they have, the more control. The more control, the more at the whim of their decisions you are. The more at the whim of their decisions, the more power they have over you.
This should be common sense at this point.
I don't even know if I disagree with "big platforms" using activitypub. Like Tumblr integration could be cool, but fucking facebook? Eww
I'm don't know how the federation protocol works exactly, but I'm pretty sure Meta can throw more resources into it than all the independent instances combined. Again, I don't know anything about the specifics of the fediverse so I don't know if that applies here, but generally once you control more than 50% of something that does not have a central authority - you became, de facto, that central authority.
We want individuals to adopt ActivityPub. Whether that be in the form of hosting new instances or contributing content. We don't want corporations here trying to turn it into something they can use to make a profit. Once it becomes about the money it is on a death spiral like everything else before it.
The user interface to display what is granted by using the app is... so sanitary. It disguises the ultimate goal of these insidious apps in such a clean and sterile list that it really seems innocuous. I wish that A$pple would start to display an intensity of how much data is collected by these apps. Green for good, red for bad, gradient for in-between. Or something... I suppose that accessibility for colorblind is important oto. Then it would be a bit more obvious to users when an app is really out to get them vs trying to improve performance.
How clean your bedroom is.
For now, anyway.
Don't forget to report it inside Play Store. All of these permissions are not required, thus the app is breaking store rules.
Instagram has all the same stuff and it’s been there for years. Bet it’s also the case with Facebook
It’s meta. Unfortunately I’m sure their lawyers can come up with dumb bullshit excuses for every one of these.
They're not permissions, they're the types of data that may be collected. Every popular closed source app has a similar obscene list of private data they may collect, but in most cases it's the user that chooses to provide that kind of information voluntarily anyways.
What do you mean its not requierd, but then how will meta sell your data and make billions?/s
Yeah, he's a big fan of access. May as well just make an extra category marked "everything".
That's the reason they wanted to make their own phone. They wanted it all
I believe he actually genuinely does. Want it all. Eventually. Hence the heavy pivot into VR and AR years before its actually practical.
Nobody can dethrone google as the gateway guardians to the internet or apple as the almighty hardware lords, but you can beat them to the next thing, whatever that is.
If you want to be the worlds most powerful company, you gotta aim high.
Both of those companies plateaud years ago and have been riding on hype ever since. Neither has done much of any consequence in 5 years or more. They used to at least have a decent product to offer but they, like every other company, have been cutting so many corners in the endless pursuit of growth that the innovation and utility they once provided is quickly disappearing.
Yep. That's because innovation is secondary to marketing and market control once you're already on top.
Innovation comes with risks, that shits for peasants. When you're already on top you have access to better tools. Zuck has to innovate something just because he wants to grow. Or buy someone else's innovation, that works too.
Hey, iPhones are still pretty dang good phones. The issue is that, even assuming they're the best phones on the market, their pricing is still ridiculous.
I run a pair of PiHole instances for DNS on my home network, and I periodically check the logs and look up blocked domains that I don't recognize. Every single time, it's a service that provides telemetry for mobile apps. It's insane how much data apps try to collect.
Well if you download a Facebook owned app you should expect this.
I feel like they just went down the list of permissions and said yes to everything, they probally actually log it all too, disgusting
I'm asking myself how people can accept these conditions. There is a huge work of education on privacy to be done.
There should be some sort of OS-level flag that appears before downloading to inform users along the lines of "This application requests access to more permissions than typical apps in this category do. Are you sure you wish to proceed?" Maybe with a link to an informational site about how apps can use your data and why protecting your privacy is important.
At this point we should really be petitioning Congress. Yeah, I know, I know, but still.
Whilst that would be fantastic. I highly doubt google or apple are even going to entertain the idea, especially when you want to download one of their apps.
one of their apps
I know Apple Bad (TM), but they’re probably the most privacy-focused big company in existence. With their current model/values/whatever, they would never collect enough data to need to slap that warning on any of their apps.
Huh. Honestly, fair enough. To be honest., I don't usually look into any companies at that much of a deeper lever. So I just assumed they'd be the same.
I’m actually shocked that any company values privacy at this point. It’s definitely reflected in the price, since you’re not subsidizing your cost with your data for ads, but it’s still refreshing to me. I hope they stay that way. I’m a hardcore PC user, but I like having my phone stuff private/locked down so I’ve been on iPhone for a long time.
Apple is a company I could see making it a priority, because they tout privacy as a major selling point of iOS. There are entire ad campaigns about it. It's not perfect, but they've done a lot in the name of privacy, even when it costs them money (e.g. all the bad press that came out about iOS when they added a notification for when apps were accessing your clipboard...and it turned out a shit ton of apps were just scraping your clipboard all day).
Google, though...yeah. Android has some privacy control, but in reality they're mainly following Apple's lead so as not to lose customers who care about privacy. I don't think they actually give a damn about consumer data, as long as they get their share of tracking done. There are more privacy-oriented ROMs out there, but the average consumer is never going to use anything other than the version of Android that came with their phone.
It would be nice if there was some third-party entity that performed privacy analysis of popular applications and provided a score on some sort of privacy index that could be featured on that app's storefront. It's a shame that we are just left to assume how much of our data is probably being harvested and there's nothing to be done about it.
I think what people need are clear examples, concisely expressed, of the explicit harm experienced by forgoing a certain quanta of privacy, since the benefits are apparent (eg gain access to a certain service/community/etc).
You'd think the dystopia of China and what they did to Hong Kong would be enough. We hear scary stories about China that you think people would want not want that here. Or episodes of Black Mirror.
None of that can be explained by allowing private companies to collect digital data.
What you've posted is a great example of scaremongering.
Again, if you want to advocate for privacy, you need to make a direct and explicit connection. Not this tinfoil hat, arm waving general conspiracy thinking. It's not compelling
I bet they said something like "we don't use most of that information, we just need access in case we add a new feature in the future that uses it". And then it'll come out that they've always been using it, and it's been associated with your identifying info. And then their server will be hacked (because the admin password was "meta123") and the all the info will leak. The modern internet sucks.
They tried to use the same excuse with their privacy policy for oculus. ie they can even watch the cameras if they want but they promise they won't.....
pinky promise
We need massive punitive fines for misusing data farming. Data leaks of health and financial information should literally put billion dollar businesses out of business for good.
If they can't manage the data they don't deserve it, full stop.
Zuck wants to know your location
Zuck wants to know everything 😏
All this data and other data. No data is safe. How much poop is left on your arse after you wipe? We can make a profit out of that info too.
Not If you never poop!
Maybe we should make a post about how to not poop.
Why do all of Zucc companies terms and conditions have this air of desperation and grubbiness about them? 😂
No other services feel as slimy even though they're all doing mostly the same things.
Meta feels like you're interacting with a drug addicted stalker following you home
Seriously. Why does the Oculus app have to run in the background always using 2-3% of my cpu? They say it's to automatically start up when you connect the Rift but that should take like 0 resources. Can't even turn it off in startup options. You have to go into system tray or something to stop it. Facebook is just a spyware company and we all know it.
The Oculus desktop app is a bloated mess. I wish it was just a tray tool that provided what's necessary to connect Oculus Link and use PCVR apps. Instead it pops up a bloody window every time with zombies and what not and does not even allow you to minimize it to the tray.
Because they are desperate. Facebook has NEVER had any good original product ideas. Ever. Everything they've ever done was brought/stolen from somebody else, including Facebook. All the good things Facebook did are their open source stuff like React and GraphQL, which they don't really make money off.
So now, they are running out of ideas to steal/buy, they probably wanted to buy TikTok with Trump's help, but that failed, and they started a TikTok clone in Instagram Reels, that also failed, so they are trying to start a Twitter clone. No original ideas, EVER. It's as simple as that.
He became extra desperate after Apple blocked the ability for Facebook to track users
Is it safe to say that reels has failed? It definitely didn't eat tiktoks lunch but I've used reels loads without ever using TikTok. I think it largely an age/demographic thing.
Instagram is the only real brand they have left that's not bleeding users quickly (I don't know how they can make more money off Whatsapp), so that's why they are branding everything with Instagram now.
Reels was forced on Instagram users, I don't think they are getting any audience who got Instagram just to use reels.
It has failed with the demographic they were after, which is TikTok users lol
Do not trust apps like this. Facebook mined this shit without any warning originally.
Crazy thought, but people don't need Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, any Twitter replacement, etc. I.e. ya'll don't need 'social media'.
You do know that Lemmy counts as social media too, right?
Meh, not really tho, it's more like forums, instances/forums will never be as big as centralized websites for social media.
None of what you just said makes lemmy not social media.
People really don't. I deleted my FB for years and quit using it. Whole time I've been telling people that it's poison for your mind.
After a few years of not using it I'd forgotten that and began to wonder if it was true or if maybe it was just my mental state at the time.
Solved that question easily. Reinstated my account a few days ago to get in touch with someone and found myself creeping like I used to.
What did I learn immediately from that? It REALLY IS POISON!! It's horrible for your head!
After going without it for a while I effectively had my "blinders" on and was only focused with my daily life. I've been the happiest I've ever been this year.
Within a half hour of browsing Facebook that peace of mind had vanished! I was once again focusing on the lives of others more than myself. I was thinking of things I could post to show that I have a "life" just like them. I checked on people who didn't like me in the past and found myself perceiving their comments or memes they've posted to be about me. I thought to myself "I'll show them, I'll do this and this, wait until they see it!"
I also found myself feeling lessed blessed than I am. Suddenly my recent accomplishments didn't seem so grand in comparison to all the happy pictures I was seeing. My simple life and simple job seemed like it wasn't enough anymore. I didn't feel enough.
I checked up on my exes, women I've been GLADLY apart from for years and got jealous of how well they seemed to be doing in comparison to what I had going on in life. Little things like them having a partner. This was major irony because I've had the chance to have these partners back and it was a hell no.
So quick. Didn't even browse a full hour and it almost killed the peace of mind I've been working all of these years to obtain. I quit browsing, thankfully.
That night when I laid down, I didn't sleep restfully. Instead of my usual happy thoughts routine while drifting out I had all kinds of negative emotions pop up.
It took me a day or two to snap out of it and focus on what I'M doing in life without the worry of others.
Being connected to others is great. Constantly comparing ourselves to others and thinking about them instead of channeling 100% of our energy into OUR lives is not good for anyone.
I feel like we just haven't evolved to handle that properly. In a small village it's important to keep an eye on each other and care about each other.
Caring about, comparing and keeping an eye on everyone in the entire world? No. We're not meant for that.
What strangers are doing is knowledge I just don't need, unless they're posting self help videos or.. anything beneficial really.
99% of the posts I saw were just "Look what I bought! Look how awesome my life is! Vacation!!!"
And people being super fake.
Fb was cool when we just posted text of how we were actually doing. I cared about that sometimes. That wasn't detrimental to my mental health. Everyone acting like their life is perfect isn't good for anyone bc it makes you wonder why your life isn't that "good" not realizing you're just not being informed of all the struggle, or luck that pays for lives that lavish.
Idk much, but I know that shit is poison And could rant about it more but.. Lemmy don't need my pants. Typo, Lemmy don't need my pants, okay I mean rants there but pants is valid too.
They could have saved time by just saying "Everything"
Or “yes, even that”
"What data are you collecting?"
Meta: cue Leonidas
"And what, Gul'dan, must we give in return?"
It's gratifying seeing this because usually when I see these kinds of worrying data permissions it's because a service I really want or need is being held hostage until I agree to this false choice and I have to start figuring out whether there's some way around this or if I'm going to have to embarrassingly explain to someone why I can't use this service they expected me to sign up to.
But then I see this and it's for something I'd never want to sign up to anyway and it's just like a list of dodged bullets. 😎 So nice to just laugh at their bullshit.
What "Other Data"?! Want my fuckin horoscope Zuck? How about the results of my last rectal exam? fuckin hell
What I want to know is why Apple even have some of this data to give them?
Like Purchase History, shouldn't that be between me and the retailer, why do Meta need it?
so what is the difference from Spyware and meta's services
Nothing. As is the case with most social media companies, you are the product. And they do that by spying on you. Same with many other "free" services like, YouTube, email, maps, etc.
well that's make my cybersecurity lesson about spyware irrelevant in this environment, because every Free services are leeches for our information. but the justification for including spyware is where the data is going, and yet again very irrelevant.
If the general public was just aware of how much privacy they lose by downloading these apps, companies like Meta would never be able to get away with stuff like this.
I doubt it. Most of the time when I point out to someone just how much data they're giving up the response is just "so what if a chinese person knows about me"
Privacy for its own sake has lost value with the younger generations. What we really need to do is educate on the consequences and dangers of the lack of privacy.
It hasn't lost its value. Privacy is still important to them as it always was. It's just been distorted a bit.
Anytime someone acts flippant about privacy, ask them to unlock their phone and hand it to you. Look through all of their messages, emails, photos, etc. See how quickly privacy matters. Tell them to shower with the door open or go to the bathroom while you watch.
Tell them you'll accompany them to their doc appointments.
People want privacy. People need it.
New gen here(19). Care about privacy, while most people i know doesn't.
It does not depends on gen. It's just most people of any gen, if they get comfortable with service they would not care if it's gonna take every piece of info they have.
One thing I'm not clear on is how so many people don't care about privacy while mobile operating systems have made permissions labels and privacy controls an important part of the design.
Perhaps it's for the minority of users who are more discerning? Maybe it gives the OS developers something to do?
Potential hot take-- am in my 30s so I dont know if I qualify in your younger generation denotation or not.
I was raised with the thought process of 'act as if you are always on camera' to get me to act right.
As I aged, it was amended to 'act as if you are always on camera... because you are.'
Both statements were and remain to be correct. That said, I think there is something to be said about the expectation (or lack thereof) of privacy that the younger generations were raised either in or to know.
I don't think that privacy has lost value through its own or the younger generation's volitions. I think it lost value through... everybody always being watched in one way or another.
It hasn't lost its value. Privacy is still important to them as it always was. It's just been distorted a bit.
Anytime someone acts flippant about privacy, ask them to unlock their phone and hand it to you. Look through all of their messages, emails, photos, etc. See how quickly privacy matters. Tell them to shower with the door open or go to the bathroom while you watch.
Tell them you'll accompany them to their doc appointments.
People want privacy. People need it.
Well, that's a creepy way to go about explaining privacy.
It's a little obnoxious, but it gets the point across.
This is why it's so completely insane that politicians are on Twitter.
People who are in positions where they could be black mailed should be more careful with the data they give out.
Let's not forget that they were fined $5 billion for deliberately misleading users about how their personal data was used in regard to the Cambridge Analytica scandal that effectively swayed over 200 elections all over the world, including both Brexit and Trump's 2016 presidential campaign.
Seriously, everyone seems to have forgotten about that shit and it's fucking insane.
Precisely why I don't use Facebook anymore. Fuck 'em.
I can see you put in /s but for anyone who really doesn't know Meta(previously Facebook) was basically constantly in court for various data violations. Anything you give them, they will be selling it and rarely will it be within their own guidelines let alone the law.
Quite literally. What would "Other Data" even be, your inner thoughts?
Almost, probably biometrics and passive camera/mic usage
Quite literally. What would “Other Data” even be, your inner thoughts?
They wanna know when I have a piss. Damn it, that's a trade secret!
It's missing something first born son I think.
Why does Zuck want to know the browser histories of people on the internet? 😳
Why would he need to know Health & Fitness?? Anything related to Facebook/Meta is pure trash.
So he can sell your data to advertisers. Yeah, don’t use anything made by Meta that is connected to the internet.
Worse, they gatekeep your data and only sell your attention to advertisers. That way no one has all the data but them.
Yeah, the data is used to create profiles of you to serve more relevant ads, so that advertisers pay them more. Thats more accurate once I think about it a little.
I mean they already have a bunch of it. You know those social media buttons that could be embedded on a website. Their purpose wasn't to like or share. It was to track you by phoning home.
Yep, thats true.
I do use a VPN and browse via incognito/Firefox though, so my chances of being tracked are pretty low.
Tracking people, in the minds of those doing it, has very little to do with someone's geographical location or which ISP they're using (and in the U.S. they know that anyway even if you use a VPN because each wireless provider throws enough fingerprints onto each model of phone to give out that info with minimal permissions).
They're not tracking you so they can see which path you take to get from your living room to the ice cream shop and back, they're tracking you so they know what you're doing online and in whatever rooms you're in, regardless of where they are.
Whether you're on a VPN or using Incognito mode, any site you visit that does any amount of cookie use, visit tracking, session state management, etc, gets data about someone that they can then compare to their existing datasets and then potentially match up with previous data about you.
The absolute proliferation of javascript on the web almost guarantees that every single time you load a webpage, something, somewhere, is loading nigh-invisibly locally on your device that's feeding one kind of information or another back to a webserver about your current browsing experience on the tab you're in right that instant. This is in stark contrast to decades ago where server-side code which renders everything on the back end and delivers it as mostly HTML to your browser was the primary way to handle things. (because as indicated by the fact that many pages take a while to load, javascript is limited by the local processing power of YOUR device. Not theirs.)
Try and browse the web with NoScript or something like it loaded and you'll see what I mean pretty quickly.
VPNs and Incognito mode have their uses, but they are not doing much to stop you from being tracked in the manner that these things are designed to "track" you.
Are people really going to sign up for another Meta site? I'm sure as shit not. I finally deleted my Facebook account a couple weeks back, and I'm feelin' free!
I assume you wouldn't need to sign up. If you already have a FB or Instagram account, you would just be able to log in directly
I only have a Facebook so I can save data on games that don't accept google. That and so I can download my dad's posts to send to friends, but i just based it off one of my ocs so it's not even me on there
That's a big nope from me lmao. Mastadon seems to have alot of the important accounts I follow from Twitter. Liking it so far, no algorithm playing with your feed, no corporate advertising (unless you subscribe to it), no blue checks spreading insane conspiracies.
I've said it here before and I will say it again: Facebook and Google's entire approach to ads from data is based on an incorrect assumption of using enough data to build a profile on a person to predict what they are going to be interested in, when if you stop and think about it, it doesn't make any sense: people's needs will always change with circumstances at the time, ex. no amount of data in the world will help you predict whether I'll want a burger or Thai food for lunch tomorrow even if you do the digital equivalent of creeping on me outside my window and digging through my trash can. If you want to know what people want to buy, why not ask them?
Unfortunately, they've deluded themselves for more than a decade with the lie, so now the rest of the world also think that internet ads by them actually works.
I'm not going to rag too hard on Facebook here because most thing has been said by others already, but I will say that since literally every single one of their social media product took the same approach of maximize data to sell things, why is it that they are all losing people and their most successful place at selling things is actually Facebook Marketplace?
I agree. I hate the idea of Meta or anybody having that much data on me in one place. However - - even Amazon, which supposedly has some of the most sophisticated purchase data and analytics out there doesn't seem to be able to do anything with it. I mean, I buy a blender there and the next thing they recommend to me is... A blender. That only stops until I buy something else which they then continue to recommend more of, as if I only want multiples of the exact things I've already purchased. The recommendation engine is the whole point of having my data to begin with so but they seem unable to recommend anything new to me at all.
It's like they have all this information written in front of them but they can't read.
While I hate the shady data harvesting practices of companies like Meta, I do want to play devil's advocate here, as far as the value of data goes, if only for the sake of me understanding the shortcomings of it better. If a company were to dig through your trash can to get an idea of what you want to eat, so to speak, they'd probably find data on a history of foods you have eaten, if you've been interested in burgers, or any other foods you've been interested in. Or if you've been an adventurous eater in general or if you prefer to stick to variants of the same stuff you normally eat.
It may not give you a foolproof way of knowing what your next actions will be, but wouldn't it give a company an educated guess, at the very least? Enough to improve the chances of targeted ads being more effective, as opposed to missing altogether.
If catching the user's interest is a dice roll, then wouldn't the data at least improve the odds of rolling a number you want?
Ok, think of it this way, if your friend ask you for a local restaraunt recommendation, would you dig through their trash to find their leftover to figure out what kind of food they like, or would you just ask them what they usually like to eat?
That's why people went to forums like reddit for help with everything, because people helping people with volunteered info always work better than being a creep.
Oh yeah, I agree it's more effective, by far. I imagine that's why Google has Opinion Rewards and other companies use surveys to directly understand the needs of their customers. Though getting people in mass to volunteer that info, especially without some small profit incentive like Opinion Rewards might be tricky.
At least in the realm of targeted advertising, the closest example to user input would be when you set up an account, you're prompted to select your interests. Like with Windows 10, when you're setting it up for the first time, you'll be asked about your interests, which Microsoft will then use to send ads and news pertaining to those categories.
But yeah, I see what you mean
Ads are so backwards in general.
Why would I trust a brand just because they inconvenience me for 30 seconds before I can watch a YouTube video I'm actually interested in? Or the branding that interrupts me reading an article with a "trendy and hip", horribly made auto-play clip that bolsters an audio volume level so high, it almost deafens me?
I almost actively avoid products that I see advertisement for on a daily basis because they piss me off so much.
I get wanting to promote your product and it's not the company's fault that many places aggressively spam ads in your face to nickle and dime their user base.
I really feel like ad revenue should not be based on how many ads you show, but how much return the advertiser gets. Google's ad service has a return of about 4%, which means for every 100 bucks a company pays to Google to advertise a product, they can expect to recoup 4. I dunno how that is even worth it.
They can't identify particular and specific interests, but they definitely can predict trends on consumer behaviour. I don't think Google wants your data to predict when you will want Thai. That's preposterous.
They are reaping billions on ad revenue, it definitely works, it won't forever, but it does at the moment.
I agree with what you say as one aspect of it. But there could be insidious uses of your data. What if your insurance company pays a couple of raccoons to sort through your trash and find out you eat fatty burgers and fries for most meals? When the raccoons get back with that report, what is to prevent your insurance company from raising your premium since you are at risk (according to them) of a heart attack?
Don't allow Zuck and the billionaire anti-democracy tech bros into Federation.
This. We're all bashing on reddit but the reason why I went to reddit and then here was to take a break from meta-owned social media. They don't only take and sell our data, they also exploit small businesses and creatives by making them pay or post several times a day for "visibility" (translation: not to be shadowbanned) without providing anything back.
Seems reasonable. Where do I put in my social security number and mother's maiden name?
You can also include your passport ID and bank information in the “extra notes” field. Thanks for all your data! 🙏
why does need health and fitness? does not make sense but is excessively harvesting data
More information = more accurately targeted advertising
Insurance companies are thirst for that info.
Their justification will be some hokey crap that they can tell whether your active from your movement, which they can detect using the health/fitness via step counts etc.
Lol not sure why people are surprised
I (and probably others) are surprised that it's so brazen. I think most companies wouldn't dare do this. Not because they're morally superior, but because it's such a bad look.
Yeah, as people would expect seeing something else here.
Stay fucking away from facebook, meta and zuckerberg as much as you can people
Not defending this, but isn't this basically also what Instagram (and every other mainstream social media app) takes? Doesn't make it right obviously but considering 99% of users for this thing are coming from Instagram/Facebook in the first place Meta already knows everything about them anyway.
so basically everything they can get from you?
Click on “see details” link and scroll endlessly through it all.
On android you can take away all permissions though and it still works fortunately. On my phone i didn't give it one single permission. Or is there some way to gather sensitive data anyway for the app?
I don't think these are permissions, just a list of collected data categories. Google Play's equivalent is the "Data Safety" section and lists the data collected, shared with third parties, and security practices in use. Basically just a more readable privacy policy, but agreeing to that by installing the app does not grant the app with the equivalent permissions automatically.
This app will know whether or not you're circumcised
When Instagram replacement on Fediverse? Fediverse also needs youtube replacement. Lets go all the way and hit these greedy mfers where it hurts. Unfortunetly my dev skills are poor, but I can offer moral support.
Fediverse won't likely see a video replacement for YouTube. Data is heavy and expensive.
Can anyone explain how these are different from the data Meta already collects from its Facebook, Instagram, and Messenger users? I've been slowly moving my online presence away from Meta products, but I feel like Threads isn't going to do much better than BlueSky, or Hive, or Post, or even our beloved Mastodon.
I doubt they are that different, so this should not be a shock to an existing member of the Meta ecosphere. it would be ideal however if those who are not already part of Meta’s userbase saw this and just decided not to join.
They misspelled their service, should be: threats (to your privacy).
There's some fediverse Instagram clone instances known as pixelfied and plemora, check out fediverse.info
People complain about Lemmy's privacy policy, but... I mean... gestures
Sadly people will still jump there. It will eventually overtake Mastodon in numbers because people are dependent on the convenience of walled gardens.
Meta knows they can’t fix their terrible privacy record so they might as well milk it.
Financial Info, Identifiers, Sensitive Info... Woudn't it be easier just to give them my wallet and passport.
Wouldn’t be enough information
Hell give them your Social Security card.
Health and Fitness
Dude I have a step counting app that doesn't even need that shit. It just goes off the gyro. Definitely have no reason to be giving a social media app access to that shit.
1 permission short of asking for the soul of your first born...
That's the "other" category.
That's gonna be a NOPE for me, chief.
99% of apps are just a data miner placed in front of a website.
They're the same as for Facebook and Instagram and since this one is perhaps most geared towards existing Instagram users, there won't be much more data given because you've probably already done it.
This is why I ditched Facebook many years ago. The first time they started to change their TOS and privacy stuff I noped out.
Does it want a semen sample too? Christ.
Meta is sickening. You have to have it for promoting events, artists and such, but it’s toxic and needs to be replaced.
As a music artist, I don’t know how to avoid platforms like Instagram and such while still promoting my art.
Have you tried bandcamp for music purposes? I use it for discovery and it seems less evil than others. Also I like that it gives FLAC downloads. Not sure about events though.
Absolutely laughable that all these corporate dumbasses are tripping over themselves to explain why their platform is more user friendly but even with near unlimited resources to build a decent product Meta et al still can't figure out a way to justify their existence without quantifying and selling their users' private behaviors
Because this information is very valuable to advertisers who want to target to customer base. If Meta sells them the users who happen to be X, Y, and Z and also happen to be searching recently for a similar product, Boom they’ve got themselves a likely customer. Much easier than advertising to the masses and hoping 0.1% will bite.
It’s all about discreet money making. The advertisers and Meta only care about how to make money off you.
Yeah I'm gonna say no thanks.
"sensitive information" I think...a good chunk of this is already sensitive information what else do you want T.T
Smells like a failure. The reason people use twitter was it is the only one that is twitter by then, now we have thousands of twitter-alike, why bother to join an ads server, XD.
What not even call logs? Lame
I was somewhat optimistic about this app given that they were embracing federation, felt like an important milestone like when AOL had to stick a full featured web browser in their app. But this is just gross. Don't want to be a data slut for Zuck.
Any big major for profit company embracing federation is purely for their own revenue generating goals and have no explicit want to be actually good stewards of the Internet, its communities, and about their participation.
Participating in Federation is another way for Meta to suck up as much data as it can to sell its advertising services.
do they also need nude pictures of me?, or with the blood type and a medical history is enough
The unfortunate bit is that most people still on Instagram/FB won't care and will happily use it.
Nah thanks.
I´m happy in mastodon and lemmy.
Also already have whatsapp, instagram and facebook don't need any other app from meta.
Dont have Instagram or Facebook won't be getting this either.
oh.... I saw a meme about this and thought it was just a joke.
Sad that it’s even allowed. And how many people will “agree” to this without thinking twice about what it means.
Almost every app is tracking these things. Get an app tracker blocker and it really opens your eyes. You don't even have to agree to it, they'll still track you.
Hackers/script kiddies must be having a heck of a party right now.
What else could be „other data“ if the rest is basically everything ? o_o
It doesn’t mean everything, it just means everything not listed. I honestly didn’t know there where that many categories. This is why I deny every permission they ask for. If it fails to run in the dumpster it goes
It's a perfectly named app. They're pulling on the thread of privacy protection until it's all undone.
Nope the fuck out of there
Think it is missing: Your first born child
I cant believe apps tracking user data this much can even be allowed on app stores
Twitter has the same amount of required permissions tho. Of course it collects a lot more data than any fediverse application or site but for proprietary software its about average
Holy shit! That’s terrifying, especially from a company like Facebook
On iOS at least, a lot of these (location, contact info, health & fitness, etc), you can deny access to via a popup prompt when the app tries to access them.
It’s a Meta app though so at a bare minimum it’s absolutely going to track the heck out of how you use the app.
I don't know about this particular app, but if I remember right, for a while blocking these requests would actually cause the app to break completely. I'm sure it had nothing to do with the permissions being needed but primarily just to punish people who didn't give them access to their data.
So, all that isn't even enough, "other info" is needed too? This honestly will just get every single thing they can get of ya.
Hmm no.
Hmm no.
To this day I have refused to download messenger for mobile since "needing it" is totally bullshit since you can just hit "view desktop site" in Chrome mobile. Won't ever get this bs either.
Man, it really looks like a lot when you stack it like that!
Wow, that's crazy. So "in your face" that they want EVERYTHING
I have to praise Apple for forcing developers to show this information about their apps. The transparency is a really good thing for consumer awareness.
They’ll create a shadow profile for you without you needing to download this app or use their service.
That’s a no for me dawg
To play devils advocate, is it possible these permissions are just placeholders until the app is actually released?
😟 Shiettt, do I have to delete my Instagram account? I only use it to stay "connected" to old friends.
What about using the Instander app which is what I use to access Instagram? Is it still the same privacy invasion?
“Zuck: Yeah so if you ever need info about anyone at Harvard
Zuck: Just ask.
Zuck: I have over 4,000 emails, pictures, addresses, SNS
[Redacted Friend's Name]: What? How'd you manage that one?
Zuck: People just submitted it.
Zuck: I don't know why.
Zuck: They "trust me"
Zuck: Dumb fucks.“
How the fuck did Harvard students act so stupid and give out their info like that? I thought they were like the smartest people in the US. 🤔
Most Harvard students are still just 18-22 year old "kids". Think of how dumb/naive you were at that age.
Try telling that to a 18-22 yr old. You think you know everything at that age. Then you get older and realize no one knows any fucking thing
To be fair, when you're at that age and come into contact with dozens of "adults" that never mentally grew past 12, you're bound to think you're "very smart".
Yea except I know I know everything so I'm built different
There’s a reason second-year students are called sophomores. It’s a compound with the same roots as “sophisticated” and “moron”. It literally means “learned idiot”. It’s referring to the students who have a year of schooling under their belt, and think that they understand everything about the world. It’s basically referring to the Dunning-Krueger Effect, where people who know very little about something are the most likely to overestimate their knowledge on the topic.
As a 21 year old I would be offended but then I remember I just admitted my exact age on the internet
Oh don't worry, I'm still in that age range, I guess I'll find out how dumb I am in a few years from now. 😅
You don’t get any smarter, just wise enough to know how dumb you are.
Maybe.
If you're lucky
The problem is that that is a very low bar to overcome
Nah, it's just the kids of the wealthiest people and a handful of diversity admissions.
This is still I think the most telling glimpse into who the "ZUCK" really is. Looking at what meta has become, how it has operated... No matter how professional and respectable he acts.
This is who he really is.
Woah! How is this real?
This is a reminder to lemmy users, that this new meta expriement will use the ActivityPub protocol, meaning that it can interact with other lemmy instances, please urge your lemmy instance admins to de-federate from this crap as soon as it launches!
But why? Isn't the whole point of federation that we can interact with people in other communities? Don't we want these big platforms to adopt ActivityPub? Completely walling them off seems counterproductive
Not defending Meta, just curious
this is why
there is a very good chance that this project by meta is the thin end of the wedge
(edited to include "the blogpost", link here)
Interesting and I'd say you're right. If you were to see a mass adoption of the fediverse (such as Twitter imploding and mastadon becoming the replacement) there would be an immediate attempt by the big tech players to gain control of it in some way. And this is exactly how they would try to do it.
Also here is a blog post about how Google killed the Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol (XMPP) using extend, embrace, extinguish.
What’s the alternative? They go with a non activity pub system and woo away all our users anyway?
If people want to crawl back into Meta's clutches I'm not going to stop them. Don't give the one nice thing we have to a corporation that only wants to exploit us.
Are you telling me this perfectly human looking human shouldn't be trusted?
Who cares? I’d rather they stay away from here anyways.
realistically, yes :(
opinion time: not everything has to be about fast/unsustainable growth, in the pursuit of profit. i would prefer that the fediverse grows organically, and entices quality users, posters and commenters to join based on the merits of the service, and not on it's access to inflated VC budgets, huge advertising campaigns, and exploitation of a first-mover advantage.
facebook/meta will slay us, because we are a threat to it's profit model. why are we even contemplating negotiations with a tiger while we have our head in it's mouth? it beggars belief...
Is there a fediverse version of Facebook?
Very roughly,
Lemmy and Kbin = Reddit
Masterson = Twitter
So what equals Facebook
Friendica
I think Diaspora* is the federated FB alternative There was also a crypto backed and "freeze peach absolutist" alternative, Minds, dunno how that one's going
Presumably Facebook's move into ActivityPub is to prevent or limit users moving to a decentralised alternative to Facebook?
Diaspora as said was it long ago. Nowadays I guess the Movim project based on xmpp can give and experience similar to it.
No. We don't. The more hands they have in the fediverse pie, the more influence they have over it. The more influence they have, the more control. The more control, the more at the whim of their decisions you are. The more at the whim of their decisions, the more power they have over you.
This should be common sense at this point.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish
Were talking about meta here, this is a bait and switch attempt (I see it that way)
They launch their new twitter competitor, everyone moves over to their new twitter clone, they will try and hold the power on standarts of federation (like any big tech corporation that has a smaller rival that succedes more then them, see microsoft vs netscape for refrence)
If they will fail with that, they will try to seduce lemmy and mastodon instaces with monetization and big money handouts, were talking about facebook here after all, they are not short of scummy tactics
Yes. Three words: "Embrace, Extend, Extinguish"
A pratice as old as time, done and proved to work. It's not even theoretical, it's gonna happen. You either are proactive in protecting the network or we will be too late to do anything. Always works like that. If you think that giving the benefit of the doubt and wait and see is an option, then you already lost.
I certainly don't. I abandoned Facebook years ago because of how BS they were getting with privacy concerns and social manipulation. Last thing I want is to bring those dumpster fires here. They join the platform, I will migrate to whichever Instances defed them or leave Lemmy entirely if necessary. Simply put, it's been a breathe of rational, civil air here. While it is early days keeping that hostile-to-humanity crap out of here is obvious minimum we should be doing.
If they can embrace and extend the fediverse you know they're gonna extinguish it, too. They're s bad faith actor, we don't want them interacting with us or influencing us.
No. We don't. The more hands they have in the fediverse pie, the more influence they have over it. The more influence they have, the more control. The more control, the more at the whim of their decisions you are. The more at the whim of their decisions, the more power they have over you.
This should be common sense at this point.
I don't even know if I disagree with "big platforms" using activitypub. Like Tumblr integration could be cool, but fucking facebook? Eww
I'm don't know how the federation protocol works exactly, but I'm pretty sure Meta can throw more resources into it than all the independent instances combined. Again, I don't know anything about the specifics of the fediverse so I don't know if that applies here, but generally once you control more than 50% of something that does not have a central authority - you became, de facto, that central authority.
We want individuals to adopt ActivityPub. Whether that be in the form of hosting new instances or contributing content. We don't want corporations here trying to turn it into something they can use to make a profit. Once it becomes about the money it is on a death spiral like everything else before it.
What decade are you from, dude?
I don’t understand why people call Facebook Meta now
I don’t accept that name
It’s Facebook
I believe they actually changed their corporations name to Meta. As crazy as that rebranding is.
They did indeed, but I hate them so much I will never abide by that.
Data this app collects: yes.
"other data"
If we're going to cast the Zuck as a sci-fi android, I'd put him as closer to Isaac (The Orville) than Data.
He may want to consume data about human interactions, but you know he's going to pepper any conversation with the phrase "inferior biologicals."
jUsT gIvE mETa A cHAnCe iN tHe fEdIVeRsE DuRRrrpH
Meta rolling into the fediverse like the martians in Mars Attacks.
“Don’t run! We’re you’re your friends!”
I have heard this in Zucc’s voice and it still made total sense.
Isn't that just...everything?
Like is there anything they aren't requesting?
The user interface to display what is granted by using the app is... so sanitary. It disguises the ultimate goal of these insidious apps in such a clean and sterile list that it really seems innocuous. I wish that A$pple would start to display an intensity of how much data is collected by these apps. Green for good, red for bad, gradient for in-between. Or something... I suppose that accessibility for colorblind is important oto. Then it would be a bit more obvious to users when an app is really out to get them vs trying to improve performance.
How clean your bedroom is.
For now, anyway.
Don't forget to report it inside Play Store. All of these permissions are not required, thus the app is breaking store rules.
Instagram has all the same stuff and it’s been there for years. Bet it’s also the case with Facebook
It’s meta. Unfortunately I’m sure their lawyers can come up with dumb bullshit excuses for every one of these.
They're not permissions, they're the types of data that may be collected. Every popular closed source app has a similar obscene list of private data they may collect, but in most cases it's the user that chooses to provide that kind of information voluntarily anyways.
What do you mean its not requierd, but then how will meta sell your data and make billions?/s
Yeah, he's a big fan of access. May as well just make an extra category marked "everything".
That's the reason they wanted to make their own phone. They wanted it all
I believe he actually genuinely does. Want it all. Eventually. Hence the heavy pivot into VR and AR years before its actually practical.
Nobody can dethrone google as the gateway guardians to the internet or apple as the almighty hardware lords, but you can beat them to the next thing, whatever that is.
If you want to be the worlds most powerful company, you gotta aim high.
Both of those companies plateaud years ago and have been riding on hype ever since. Neither has done much of any consequence in 5 years or more. They used to at least have a decent product to offer but they, like every other company, have been cutting so many corners in the endless pursuit of growth that the innovation and utility they once provided is quickly disappearing.
Yep. That's because innovation is secondary to marketing and market control once you're already on top.
Innovation comes with risks, that shits for peasants. When you're already on top you have access to better tools. Zuck has to innovate something just because he wants to grow. Or buy someone else's innovation, that works too.
Hey, iPhones are still pretty dang good phones. The issue is that, even assuming they're the best phones on the market, their pricing is still ridiculous.
Pretty sure that's the "sensitive information." Seriously, look at the other categories and tell me what's left.
I run a pair of PiHole instances for DNS on my home network, and I periodically check the logs and look up blocked domains that I don't recognize. Every single time, it's a service that provides telemetry for mobile apps. It's insane how much data apps try to collect.
Well if you download a Facebook owned app you should expect this.
I feel like they just went down the list of permissions and said yes to everything, they probally actually log it all too, disgusting
I'm asking myself how people can accept these conditions. There is a huge work of education on privacy to be done.
There should be some sort of OS-level flag that appears before downloading to inform users along the lines of "This application requests access to more permissions than typical apps in this category do. Are you sure you wish to proceed?" Maybe with a link to an informational site about how apps can use your data and why protecting your privacy is important.
At this point we should really be petitioning Congress. Yeah, I know, I know, but still.
Whilst that would be fantastic. I highly doubt google or apple are even going to entertain the idea, especially when you want to download one of their apps.
I know Apple Bad (TM), but they’re probably the most privacy-focused big company in existence. With their current model/values/whatever, they would never collect enough data to need to slap that warning on any of their apps.
Huh. Honestly, fair enough. To be honest., I don't usually look into any companies at that much of a deeper lever. So I just assumed they'd be the same.
I’m actually shocked that any company values privacy at this point. It’s definitely reflected in the price, since you’re not subsidizing your cost with your data for ads, but it’s still refreshing to me. I hope they stay that way. I’m a hardcore PC user, but I like having my phone stuff private/locked down so I’ve been on iPhone for a long time.
Apple is a company I could see making it a priority, because they tout privacy as a major selling point of iOS. There are entire ad campaigns about it. It's not perfect, but they've done a lot in the name of privacy, even when it costs them money (e.g. all the bad press that came out about iOS when they added a notification for when apps were accessing your clipboard...and it turned out a shit ton of apps were just scraping your clipboard all day).
Google, though...yeah. Android has some privacy control, but in reality they're mainly following Apple's lead so as not to lose customers who care about privacy. I don't think they actually give a damn about consumer data, as long as they get their share of tracking done. There are more privacy-oriented ROMs out there, but the average consumer is never going to use anything other than the version of Android that came with their phone.
It would be nice if there was some third-party entity that performed privacy analysis of popular applications and provided a score on some sort of privacy index that could be featured on that app's storefront. It's a shame that we are just left to assume how much of our data is probably being harvested and there's nothing to be done about it.
I think what people need are clear examples, concisely expressed, of the explicit harm experienced by forgoing a certain quanta of privacy, since the benefits are apparent (eg gain access to a certain service/community/etc).
You'd think the dystopia of China and what they did to Hong Kong would be enough. We hear scary stories about China that you think people would want not want that here. Or episodes of Black Mirror.
None of that can be explained by allowing private companies to collect digital data.
What you've posted is a great example of scaremongering.
Again, if you want to advocate for privacy, you need to make a direct and explicit connection. Not this tinfoil hat, arm waving general conspiracy thinking. It's not compelling
I bet they said something like "we don't use most of that information, we just need access in case we add a new feature in the future that uses it". And then it'll come out that they've always been using it, and it's been associated with your identifying info. And then their server will be hacked (because the admin password was "meta123") and the all the info will leak. The modern internet sucks.
They tried to use the same excuse with their privacy policy for oculus. ie they can even watch the cameras if they want but they promise they won't.....
pinky promise
We need massive punitive fines for misusing data farming. Data leaks of health and financial information should literally put billion dollar businesses out of business for good.
If they can't manage the data they don't deserve it, full stop.
Zuck wants to know your location
Zuck wants to know everything 😏
All this data and other data. No data is safe. How much poop is left on your arse after you wipe? We can make a profit out of that info too.
Not If you never poop!
Maybe we should make a post about how to not poop.
Why do all of Zucc companies terms and conditions have this air of desperation and grubbiness about them? 😂
No other services feel as slimy even though they're all doing mostly the same things.
Meta feels like you're interacting with a drug addicted stalker following you home
Seriously. Why does the Oculus app have to run in the background always using 2-3% of my cpu? They say it's to automatically start up when you connect the Rift but that should take like 0 resources. Can't even turn it off in startup options. You have to go into system tray or something to stop it. Facebook is just a spyware company and we all know it.
The Oculus desktop app is a bloated mess. I wish it was just a tray tool that provided what's necessary to connect Oculus Link and use PCVR apps. Instead it pops up a bloody window every time with zombies and what not and does not even allow you to minimize it to the tray.
Because they are desperate. Facebook has NEVER had any good original product ideas. Ever. Everything they've ever done was brought/stolen from somebody else, including Facebook. All the good things Facebook did are their open source stuff like React and GraphQL, which they don't really make money off.
So now, they are running out of ideas to steal/buy, they probably wanted to buy TikTok with Trump's help, but that failed, and they started a TikTok clone in Instagram Reels, that also failed, so they are trying to start a Twitter clone. No original ideas, EVER. It's as simple as that.
He became extra desperate after Apple blocked the ability for Facebook to track users
Is it safe to say that reels has failed? It definitely didn't eat tiktoks lunch but I've used reels loads without ever using TikTok. I think it largely an age/demographic thing.
Instagram is the only real brand they have left that's not bleeding users quickly (I don't know how they can make more money off Whatsapp), so that's why they are branding everything with Instagram now.
Reels was forced on Instagram users, I don't think they are getting any audience who got Instagram just to use reels.
It has failed with the demographic they were after, which is TikTok users lol
Do not trust apps like this. Facebook mined this shit without any warning originally.
Crazy thought, but people don't need Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, any Twitter replacement, etc. I.e. ya'll don't need 'social media'.
You do know that Lemmy counts as social media too, right?
Meh, not really tho, it's more like forums, instances/forums will never be as big as centralized websites for social media.
None of what you just said makes lemmy not social media.
People really don't. I deleted my FB for years and quit using it. Whole time I've been telling people that it's poison for your mind.
After a few years of not using it I'd forgotten that and began to wonder if it was true or if maybe it was just my mental state at the time.
Solved that question easily. Reinstated my account a few days ago to get in touch with someone and found myself creeping like I used to.
What did I learn immediately from that? It REALLY IS POISON!! It's horrible for your head!
After going without it for a while I effectively had my "blinders" on and was only focused with my daily life. I've been the happiest I've ever been this year.
Within a half hour of browsing Facebook that peace of mind had vanished! I was once again focusing on the lives of others more than myself. I was thinking of things I could post to show that I have a "life" just like them. I checked on people who didn't like me in the past and found myself perceiving their comments or memes they've posted to be about me. I thought to myself "I'll show them, I'll do this and this, wait until they see it!"
I also found myself feeling lessed blessed than I am. Suddenly my recent accomplishments didn't seem so grand in comparison to all the happy pictures I was seeing. My simple life and simple job seemed like it wasn't enough anymore. I didn't feel enough.
I checked up on my exes, women I've been GLADLY apart from for years and got jealous of how well they seemed to be doing in comparison to what I had going on in life. Little things like them having a partner. This was major irony because I've had the chance to have these partners back and it was a hell no.
So quick. Didn't even browse a full hour and it almost killed the peace of mind I've been working all of these years to obtain. I quit browsing, thankfully.
That night when I laid down, I didn't sleep restfully. Instead of my usual happy thoughts routine while drifting out I had all kinds of negative emotions pop up.
It took me a day or two to snap out of it and focus on what I'M doing in life without the worry of others.
Being connected to others is great. Constantly comparing ourselves to others and thinking about them instead of channeling 100% of our energy into OUR lives is not good for anyone.
I feel like we just haven't evolved to handle that properly. In a small village it's important to keep an eye on each other and care about each other.
Caring about, comparing and keeping an eye on everyone in the entire world? No. We're not meant for that.
What strangers are doing is knowledge I just don't need, unless they're posting self help videos or.. anything beneficial really.
99% of the posts I saw were just "Look what I bought! Look how awesome my life is! Vacation!!!"
And people being super fake.
Fb was cool when we just posted text of how we were actually doing. I cared about that sometimes. That wasn't detrimental to my mental health. Everyone acting like their life is perfect isn't good for anyone bc it makes you wonder why your life isn't that "good" not realizing you're just not being informed of all the struggle, or luck that pays for lives that lavish.
Idk much, but I know that shit is poison And could rant about it more but.. Lemmy don't need my pants. Typo, Lemmy don't need my pants, okay I mean rants there but pants is valid too.
They could have saved time by just saying "Everything"
Or “yes, even that”
"What data are you collecting?"
Meta: cue Leonidas
"And what, Gul'dan, must we give in return?"
It's gratifying seeing this because usually when I see these kinds of worrying data permissions it's because a service I really want or need is being held hostage until I agree to this false choice and I have to start figuring out whether there's some way around this or if I'm going to have to embarrassingly explain to someone why I can't use this service they expected me to sign up to.
But then I see this and it's for something I'd never want to sign up to anyway and it's just like a list of dodged bullets. 😎 So nice to just laugh at their bullshit.
What "Other Data"?! Want my fuckin horoscope Zuck? How about the results of my last rectal exam? fuckin hell
What I want to know is why Apple even have some of this data to give them?
Like Purchase History, shouldn't that be between me and the retailer, why do Meta need it?
They need to know your blood type, for reasons....
so what is the difference from Spyware and meta's services
Nothing. As is the case with most social media companies, you are the product. And they do that by spying on you. Same with many other "free" services like, YouTube, email, maps, etc.
well that's make my cybersecurity lesson about spyware irrelevant in this environment, because every Free services are leeches for our information. but the justification for including spyware is where the data is going, and yet again very irrelevant.
If the general public was just aware of how much privacy they lose by downloading these apps, companies like Meta would never be able to get away with stuff like this.
I doubt it. Most of the time when I point out to someone just how much data they're giving up the response is just "so what if a chinese person knows about me"
Privacy for its own sake has lost value with the younger generations. What we really need to do is educate on the consequences and dangers of the lack of privacy.
It hasn't lost its value. Privacy is still important to them as it always was. It's just been distorted a bit.
Anytime someone acts flippant about privacy, ask them to unlock their phone and hand it to you. Look through all of their messages, emails, photos, etc. See how quickly privacy matters. Tell them to shower with the door open or go to the bathroom while you watch.
Tell them you'll accompany them to their doc appointments.
People want privacy. People need it.
New gen here(19). Care about privacy, while most people i know doesn't. It does not depends on gen. It's just most people of any gen, if they get comfortable with service they would not care if it's gonna take every piece of info they have.
One thing I'm not clear on is how so many people don't care about privacy while mobile operating systems have made permissions labels and privacy controls an important part of the design.
Perhaps it's for the minority of users who are more discerning? Maybe it gives the OS developers something to do?
Potential hot take-- am in my 30s so I dont know if I qualify in your younger generation denotation or not.
I was raised with the thought process of 'act as if you are always on camera' to get me to act right. As I aged, it was amended to 'act as if you are always on camera... because you are.'
Both statements were and remain to be correct. That said, I think there is something to be said about the expectation (or lack thereof) of privacy that the younger generations were raised either in or to know.
I don't think that privacy has lost value through its own or the younger generation's volitions. I think it lost value through... everybody always being watched in one way or another.
It hasn't lost its value. Privacy is still important to them as it always was. It's just been distorted a bit.
Anytime someone acts flippant about privacy, ask them to unlock their phone and hand it to you. Look through all of their messages, emails, photos, etc. See how quickly privacy matters. Tell them to shower with the door open or go to the bathroom while you watch.
Tell them you'll accompany them to their doc appointments.
People want privacy. People need it.
Well, that's a creepy way to go about explaining privacy.
It's a little obnoxious, but it gets the point across.
This is why it's so completely insane that politicians are on Twitter.
People who are in positions where they could be black mailed should be more careful with the data they give out.
Lol fuck that, I’ll stick with mastodon
Anyone know Meta's track record with data?
It's got to be great if they ask for all this /s
Let's not forget that they were fined $5 billion for deliberately misleading users about how their personal data was used in regard to the Cambridge Analytica scandal that effectively swayed over 200 elections all over the world, including both Brexit and Trump's 2016 presidential campaign.
Seriously, everyone seems to have forgotten about that shit and it's fucking insane.
Precisely why I don't use Facebook anymore. Fuck 'em.
I can see you put in /s but for anyone who really doesn't know Meta(previously Facebook) was basically constantly in court for various data violations. Anything you give them, they will be selling it and rarely will it be within their own guidelines let alone the law.
So just everything then.
Quite literally. What would "Other Data" even be, your inner thoughts?
Almost, probably biometrics and passive camera/mic usage
They wanna know when I have a piss. Damn it, that's a trade secret!
It's missing something first born son I think.
Why does Zuck want to know the browser histories of people on the internet? 😳
Why would he need to know Health & Fitness?? Anything related to Facebook/Meta is pure trash.
So he can sell your data to advertisers. Yeah, don’t use anything made by Meta that is connected to the internet.
Worse, they gatekeep your data and only sell your attention to advertisers. That way no one has all the data but them.
Yeah, the data is used to create profiles of you to serve more relevant ads, so that advertisers pay them more. Thats more accurate once I think about it a little.
I mean they already have a bunch of it. You know those social media buttons that could be embedded on a website. Their purpose wasn't to like or share. It was to track you by phoning home.
Yep, thats true.
I do use a VPN and browse via incognito/Firefox though, so my chances of being tracked are pretty low.
Tracking people, in the minds of those doing it, has very little to do with someone's geographical location or which ISP they're using (and in the U.S. they know that anyway even if you use a VPN because each wireless provider throws enough fingerprints onto each model of phone to give out that info with minimal permissions).
They're not tracking you so they can see which path you take to get from your living room to the ice cream shop and back, they're tracking you so they know what you're doing online and in whatever rooms you're in, regardless of where they are.
The microphones listen and record just enough data that they can tell what shows you're watching, etc, without blowing absolutely all of your bandwidth. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross-device_tracking?useskin=vector
Whether you're on a VPN or using Incognito mode, any site you visit that does any amount of cookie use, visit tracking, session state management, etc, gets data about someone that they can then compare to their existing datasets and then potentially match up with previous data about you.
The absolute proliferation of javascript on the web almost guarantees that every single time you load a webpage, something, somewhere, is loading nigh-invisibly locally on your device that's feeding one kind of information or another back to a webserver about your current browsing experience on the tab you're in right that instant. This is in stark contrast to decades ago where server-side code which renders everything on the back end and delivers it as mostly HTML to your browser was the primary way to handle things. (because as indicated by the fact that many pages take a while to load, javascript is limited by the local processing power of YOUR device. Not theirs.)
Try and browse the web with NoScript or something like it loaded and you'll see what I mean pretty quickly.
VPNs and Incognito mode have their uses, but they are not doing much to stop you from being tracked in the manner that these things are designed to "track" you.
Are people really going to sign up for another Meta site? I'm sure as shit not. I finally deleted my Facebook account a couple weeks back, and I'm feelin' free!
I assume you wouldn't need to sign up. If you already have a FB or Instagram account, you would just be able to log in directly
I only have a Facebook so I can save data on games that don't accept google. That and so I can download my dad's posts to send to friends, but i just based it off one of my ocs so it's not even me on there
That's a big nope from me lmao. Mastadon seems to have alot of the important accounts I follow from Twitter. Liking it so far, no algorithm playing with your feed, no corporate advertising (unless you subscribe to it), no blue checks spreading insane conspiracies.
So, what do they not collect?
Tax returns
I'm sure that counts under, "Other data"
Dirty laundry.
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I've said it here before and I will say it again: Facebook and Google's entire approach to ads from data is based on an incorrect assumption of using enough data to build a profile on a person to predict what they are going to be interested in, when if you stop and think about it, it doesn't make any sense: people's needs will always change with circumstances at the time, ex. no amount of data in the world will help you predict whether I'll want a burger or Thai food for lunch tomorrow even if you do the digital equivalent of creeping on me outside my window and digging through my trash can. If you want to know what people want to buy, why not ask them?
Unfortunately, they've deluded themselves for more than a decade with the lie, so now the rest of the world also think that internet ads by them actually works.
I'm not going to rag too hard on Facebook here because most thing has been said by others already, but I will say that since literally every single one of their social media product took the same approach of maximize data to sell things, why is it that they are all losing people and their most successful place at selling things is actually Facebook Marketplace?
I agree. I hate the idea of Meta or anybody having that much data on me in one place. However - - even Amazon, which supposedly has some of the most sophisticated purchase data and analytics out there doesn't seem to be able to do anything with it. I mean, I buy a blender there and the next thing they recommend to me is... A blender. That only stops until I buy something else which they then continue to recommend more of, as if I only want multiples of the exact things I've already purchased. The recommendation engine is the whole point of having my data to begin with so but they seem unable to recommend anything new to me at all.
It's like they have all this information written in front of them but they can't read.
While I hate the shady data harvesting practices of companies like Meta, I do want to play devil's advocate here, as far as the value of data goes, if only for the sake of me understanding the shortcomings of it better. If a company were to dig through your trash can to get an idea of what you want to eat, so to speak, they'd probably find data on a history of foods you have eaten, if you've been interested in burgers, or any other foods you've been interested in. Or if you've been an adventurous eater in general or if you prefer to stick to variants of the same stuff you normally eat.
It may not give you a foolproof way of knowing what your next actions will be, but wouldn't it give a company an educated guess, at the very least? Enough to improve the chances of targeted ads being more effective, as opposed to missing altogether.
If catching the user's interest is a dice roll, then wouldn't the data at least improve the odds of rolling a number you want?
Ok, think of it this way, if your friend ask you for a local restaraunt recommendation, would you dig through their trash to find their leftover to figure out what kind of food they like, or would you just ask them what they usually like to eat?
That's why people went to forums like reddit for help with everything, because people helping people with volunteered info always work better than being a creep.
Oh yeah, I agree it's more effective, by far. I imagine that's why Google has Opinion Rewards and other companies use surveys to directly understand the needs of their customers. Though getting people in mass to volunteer that info, especially without some small profit incentive like Opinion Rewards might be tricky.
At least in the realm of targeted advertising, the closest example to user input would be when you set up an account, you're prompted to select your interests. Like with Windows 10, when you're setting it up for the first time, you'll be asked about your interests, which Microsoft will then use to send ads and news pertaining to those categories.
But yeah, I see what you mean
Ads are so backwards in general.
Why would I trust a brand just because they inconvenience me for 30 seconds before I can watch a YouTube video I'm actually interested in? Or the branding that interrupts me reading an article with a "trendy and hip", horribly made auto-play clip that bolsters an audio volume level so high, it almost deafens me?
I almost actively avoid products that I see advertisement for on a daily basis because they piss me off so much.
I get wanting to promote your product and it's not the company's fault that many places aggressively spam ads in your face to nickle and dime their user base.
I really feel like ad revenue should not be based on how many ads you show, but how much return the advertiser gets. Google's ad service has a return of about 4%, which means for every 100 bucks a company pays to Google to advertise a product, they can expect to recoup 4. I dunno how that is even worth it.
They can't identify particular and specific interests, but they definitely can predict trends on consumer behaviour. I don't think Google wants your data to predict when you will want Thai. That's preposterous.
They are reaping billions on ad revenue, it definitely works, it won't forever, but it does at the moment.
I agree with what you say as one aspect of it. But there could be insidious uses of your data. What if your insurance company pays a couple of raccoons to sort through your trash and find out you eat fatty burgers and fries for most meals? When the raccoons get back with that report, what is to prevent your insurance company from raising your premium since you are at risk (according to them) of a heart attack?
Don't allow Zuck and the billionaire anti-democracy tech bros into Federation.
This. We're all bashing on reddit but the reason why I went to reddit and then here was to take a break from meta-owned social media. They don't only take and sell our data, they also exploit small businesses and creatives by making them pay or post several times a day for "visibility" (translation: not to be shadowbanned) without providing anything back.
Seems reasonable. Where do I put in my social security number and mother's maiden name?
You can also include your passport ID and bank information in the “extra notes” field. Thanks for all your data! 🙏
why does need health and fitness? does not make sense but is excessively harvesting data
More information = more accurately targeted advertising
Insurance companies are thirst for that info.
Their justification will be some hokey crap that they can tell whether your active from your movement, which they can detect using the health/fitness via step counts etc.
Lol not sure why people are surprised
I (and probably others) are surprised that it's so brazen. I think most companies wouldn't dare do this. Not because they're morally superior, but because it's such a bad look.
Yeah, as people would expect seeing something else here.
Stay fucking away from facebook, meta and zuckerberg as much as you can people
Well, that's a big nope....
Not defending this, but isn't this basically also what Instagram (and every other mainstream social media app) takes? Doesn't make it right obviously but considering 99% of users for this thing are coming from Instagram/Facebook in the first place Meta already knows everything about them anyway.
so basically everything they can get from you?
Click on “see details” link and scroll endlessly through it all.
On android you can take away all permissions though and it still works fortunately. On my phone i didn't give it one single permission. Or is there some way to gather sensitive data anyway for the app?
I don't think these are permissions, just a list of collected data categories. Google Play's equivalent is the "Data Safety" section and lists the data collected, shared with third parties, and security practices in use. Basically just a more readable privacy policy, but agreeing to that by installing the app does not grant the app with the equivalent permissions automatically.
This app will know whether or not you're circumcised
When Instagram replacement on Fediverse? Fediverse also needs youtube replacement. Lets go all the way and hit these greedy mfers where it hurts. Unfortunetly my dev skills are poor, but I can offer moral support.
Fediverse won't likely see a video replacement for YouTube. Data is heavy and expensive.
https://joinpeertube.org/
you're in luck, both already exist. check out pixelfed and peertube.
If you have instagram installed you almost certainly already grant all of this.
instander for android
Is there anything left where they don’t want any permission? Ooof
i don't know why anyone would want to go from something as bad as twitter to a Facebook owned twitter
Most people really don't care :/
Those people are why we have so many problems in the world.
I know meta is shit anyways, but what is the idea behind their Twitter competitor, like what is their selling point?
Sadly, that's likely all they need at the moment
Can anyone explain how these are different from the data Meta already collects from its Facebook, Instagram, and Messenger users? I've been slowly moving my online presence away from Meta products, but I feel like Threads isn't going to do much better than BlueSky, or Hive, or Post, or even our beloved Mastodon.
I doubt they are that different, so this should not be a shock to an existing member of the Meta ecosphere. it would be ideal however if those who are not already part of Meta’s userbase saw this and just decided not to join.
Fuck off Zuck you fucking weirdo
User: So how many permissions does your app need?
Threads: Yes!
Sensitive Info, Health Data? õÔ
Is that.. all of them??? Lmao
They misspelled their service, should be: threats (to your privacy).
There's some fediverse Instagram clone instances known as pixelfied and plemora, check out fediverse.info
People complain about Lemmy's privacy policy, but... I mean... gestures
Sadly people will still jump there. It will eventually overtake Mastodon in numbers because people are dependent on the convenience of walled gardens.
Meta knows they can’t fix their terrible privacy record so they might as well milk it.
Financial Info, Identifiers, Sensitive Info... Woudn't it be easier just to give them my wallet and passport.
Wouldn’t be enough information
Hell give them your Social Security card.
Dude I have a step counting app that doesn't even need that shit. It just goes off the gyro. Definitely have no reason to be giving a social media app access to that shit.
1 permission short of asking for the soul of your first born...
That's the "other" category.
That's gonna be a NOPE for me, chief.
99% of apps are just a data miner placed in front of a website.
They're the same as for Facebook and Instagram and since this one is perhaps most geared towards existing Instagram users, there won't be much more data given because you've probably already done it.
This is why I ditched Facebook many years ago. The first time they started to change their TOS and privacy stuff I noped out.
Does it want a semen sample too? Christ.
Meta is sickening. You have to have it for promoting events, artists and such, but it’s toxic and needs to be replaced.
As a music artist, I don’t know how to avoid platforms like Instagram and such while still promoting my art.
Have you tried bandcamp for music purposes? I use it for discovery and it seems less evil than others. Also I like that it gives FLAC downloads. Not sure about events though.
Absolutely laughable that all these corporate dumbasses are tripping over themselves to explain why their platform is more user friendly but even with near unlimited resources to build a decent product Meta et al still can't figure out a way to justify their existence without quantifying and selling their users' private behaviors
Because this information is very valuable to advertisers who want to target to customer base. If Meta sells them the users who happen to be X, Y, and Z and also happen to be searching recently for a similar product, Boom they’ve got themselves a likely customer. Much easier than advertising to the masses and hoping 0.1% will bite.
It’s all about discreet money making. The advertisers and Meta only care about how to make money off you.
Yeah I'm gonna say no thanks.
"sensitive information" I think...a good chunk of this is already sensitive information what else do you want T.T
Smells like a failure. The reason people use twitter was it is the only one that is twitter by then, now we have thousands of twitter-alike, why bother to join an ads server, XD.
What not even call logs? Lame
I was somewhat optimistic about this app given that they were embracing federation, felt like an important milestone like when AOL had to stick a full featured web browser in their app. But this is just gross. Don't want to be a data slut for Zuck.
Any big major for profit company embracing federation is purely for their own revenue generating goals and have no explicit want to be actually good stewards of the Internet, its communities, and about their participation.
Participating in Federation is another way for Meta to suck up as much data as it can to sell its advertising services.
do they also need nude pictures of me?, or with the blood type and a medical history is enough
The unfortunate bit is that most people still on Instagram/FB won't care and will happily use it.
Nah thanks. I´m happy in mastodon and lemmy. Also already have whatsapp, instagram and facebook don't need any other app from meta.
Dont have Instagram or Facebook won't be getting this either.
oh.... I saw a meme about this and thought it was just a joke.
Sad that it’s even allowed. And how many people will “agree” to this without thinking twice about what it means.
Almost every app is tracking these things. Get an app tracker blocker and it really opens your eyes. You don't even have to agree to it, they'll still track you.
Hackers/script kiddies must be having a heck of a party right now.
Can't Musk and Zuck just fight instead?
Apparently they are going to?!!
Nah, Elon's mum called off the match. Literally: https://www.bizpacreview.com/2023/06/27/musks-mother-pulls-mom-card-says-cage-fight-with-zuck-has-been-canceled-1372180/ 🤣
Fucking lol.
But also, good. That shit was wierd.
It feels like some rich people never graduated high school.
What else could be „other data“ if the rest is basically everything ? o_o
It doesn’t mean everything, it just means everything not listed. I honestly didn’t know there where that many categories. This is why I deny every permission they ask for. If it fails to run in the dumpster it goes
It's a perfectly named app. They're pulling on the thread of privacy protection until it's all undone.
Nope the fuck out of there
Think it is missing: Your first born child
I cant believe apps tracking user data this much can even be allowed on app stores
No, this is the data they would like to collect from those foolish enough to grant it.
Defed the Thread.
Twitter has the same amount of required permissions tho. Of course it collects a lot more data than any fediverse application or site but for proprietary software its about average
Thanks but no thanks
this_is_fine.gif
Holy shit! That’s terrifying, especially from a company like Facebook
On iOS at least, a lot of these (location, contact info, health & fitness, etc), you can deny access to via a popup prompt when the app tries to access them.
It’s a Meta app though so at a bare minimum it’s absolutely going to track the heck out of how you use the app.
I don't know about this particular app, but if I remember right, for a while blocking these requests would actually cause the app to break completely. I'm sure it had nothing to do with the permissions being needed but primarily just to punish people who didn't give them access to their data.
So just everything then.
Seriously I am already struggling to get meta out of my life enough to sign in to a new service with them.
Yuck.
Is the app out already? Or is this just the App Privacy dashboard for Instagram??
I'm also confused what I'm looking at.
Is this real, or a meme? What is "sensitive info"?
Pretty sure it's real. The app leaked accidentally on the app store a few days ago.
It's for the new app. It's on preview on the app store
So, all that isn't even enough, "other info" is needed too? This honestly will just get every single thing they can get of ya.
Hmm no.
Hmm no.
To this day I have refused to download messenger for mobile since "needing it" is totally bullshit since you can just hit "view desktop site" in Chrome mobile. Won't ever get this bs either.
How invasive is this really when compared to the first party Twitter app?
Not sure about Twitter, but I checked last night and these are the same permissions as Instagram.
Man, it really looks like a lot when you stack it like that!
Wow, that's crazy. So "in your face" that they want EVERYTHING
I have to praise Apple for forcing developers to show this information about their apps. The transparency is a really good thing for consumer awareness.
They’ll create a shadow profile for you without you needing to download this app or use their service.
That’s a no for me dawg
To play devils advocate, is it possible these permissions are just placeholders until the app is actually released?
Yikers
Health & fitness?? tan seme??
I'm sure they are missing some data.
I wonder if this will change the current ToS for Facebook and regular IG
Where do I sign?!
Bruh I thought this was the dick size edit again at first before looking further lmao
Basically like Instagram
It literally says Instagram. Is this post an inside joke?
The developer is Instagram Inc.
The actual app is not Instagram, it's the new facebook spyware app that I don't know the name of.
this is completely terrifying.
Is it out? I can’t find it. (Not that I would actually use it lol)
Looks like it is out on Friday
https://apps.apple.com/us/app/threads-an-instagram-app/id6446901002
😟 Shiettt, do I have to delete my Instagram account? I only use it to stay "connected" to old friends. What about using the Instander app which is what I use to access Instagram? Is it still the same privacy invasion?