What's your plan if Trump wins in November?
I'm feeling so uneasy with everything I've been seeing. I keep thinking about what we will be this time next year, and if shit hits the fan, what is your plan? I'm queer and was politically active in 2020, so I would potentially be considered a political enemy.
The only blueprint I can think of is what you do in an active shooter situation; Flee, Hide, Fight.
I know there's that romantic notion of "don't be a coward, get out and protest", but I remember the brutality of the 2020 protests firsthand, and even then I thought "thank god I'm going toe to toe with the CPD and not the CCP". Next time is going to be different. The president now has authority to send drone strikes. Protests and riots don't stand a chance agains missiles and live rounds.
Flee- I have an Uncle in Montreal who my family could potentially use as a way to at least temporarily escape the chaos. The hope I'd have is that Canada and other countries would accept American refugees, however that's not a guarantee.
Hide- If borders are closed, lay low and move away from major cities if possible. If civil war breaks out, try to get away from the violence even if you think your side will win. Todays losers may be tomorrows victors.
Fight- If cellular data/ social media algorithms can keep track of you, and surveillance can make sure there's no movement, this would be the last resort of desperation. I guess if possible try to either find a group for safety in numbers, or conversely go guerrilla as groups of resistance would make easy targets.
Sorry my mind is running and I'm getting scared.
you guys have cried about your guns for two hundred years in case of this exact situation
i think the gun people might be voting for trump
Never underestimate dem/liberal gun ownership. We are just quiet about it and don't make it our entire personality.
I can't be the only one to roll my eyes at comments like this. Like in one respect I get it, we want to say we will fuck up the fascists. But on the flipside, what the fuck are you guys actually suggesting here?
Bear in mind per Propublica reporting that the right-wing extremist groups want to incite a race/Civil War. They hate the fact that there is such a stark contrast in violence between the left and right and it's making them look TERRIBLE.
Bear in mind firearm manufacturers are actively trying to break into the leftist market to sell more guns. Pretty obvious.
Forgetting the evidence that guns for all intents don't make you safer. We need to use our brains before bullets, lest we've all already lost.
I’d say it’s a reaction to where ammosexual conservatives talk as if they have all the guns and would therefore win instantly in the civil war scenarios they masturbate over.
Fair I can see that. In the event they threw the first punch a la Fort Sumter, it may take a while for the left to spin up but I have no doubt they'd get steamrolled as they always do, from the Confederacy to the Third Reich.
After all, we'd just have to wait for their heart meds to run out.
For real, diabetes and war marches don’t exactly pair nicely.
You seem to be taking an "either / or" approach here. In my opinion the left should do everything possible to avoid violence, and also own guns in case these efforts are unsuccessful. It doesn't need to be one or the other.
It's really kind of a matter of definitions to me. In my view, there exist situations where a firearm is about the only way to prevent super bad outcomes for myself. Those situations are uncommon, there are many good ways to avoid them usually, and I hope to never find myself in one. But by definition, if I find myself in a situation like that, having a firearm available is the difference between having agency and having none.
Some people feel that the likelihood of such a scenario is so small that it's a bad idea to prepare for it. Maybe this is how you feel? I do understand that point of view, I simply disagree. I don't really understand points of view that seem to argue there is no scenario where firearms are useful, or that we're magically "past that" as a society (and to be clear, I'm not sure you're taking that stance). To take one example, just look at the response to Hurricane Katrina as an example of how flimsy our law and order really is. Once a situation is bad enough to overwhelm the existing structures we have in place, all bets are off and rules for behavior evaporate. We've seen this happen, in our country, in our lifetimes, more than once. I don't understand the derision - why eye roll?
Fair points.
I view it mostly as either/or chiefly for two reasons:
The statistics to me suggest that the possession of a firearm generate greater alternative risks than the probability of the positive use-case we all imagine in our heads. For me, I am not in a bad neighborhood. Nobody is out to get me. Despite how bad things have become, we are a long ways away from some civil war. So to me it's a net-negative.
Any time focused on firearms is time taken away from focusing on preventative measures to shift this country in the right direction. One more phone conversation with a friend or relative on the fence to alter their vote to me is far more impactful at preventing what we all come to fear.
I roll my eyes because some people get very gung-ho akin to the whole "fuck around find out" vibes of righties that I cannot stand. Big talk almost yearning for civil war when they're focusing on the wrong things.
Ah, those are reasonable points of view to me. I think responsible gun ownership is fairly straightforward and the statistics look that way because of the extremely irresponsible folks who don't take it seriously, and because suicide is usually included. Proper gun safety really only requires diligently following a few simple rules, make those consistently followed - habitual - and the additional risk drops to pretty close to zero.
But I concede that owning a gun does - at again just a definitional level - create a path of escalation which is almost always inappropriate to pursue, which is not available without that gun, and that's inherently risky too. It's not a decision to be taken lightheartedly, but we all face risk at varying degrees and have to make our own decisions about what are good and bad tradeoffs there.
There are a lot of folks (of all political persuasion, which is not to say it's evenly distributed at all) who are definitely LARPing, and I think their idiot rhetoric is foolish and potentially harmful. I just think the quiet gun-owning left shouldn't be automatically associated with that group, and if I remember the original comment right, I don't think the poster indicated any hidden desire for violence.
I agree that we should be discussing and insisting on action for way more substantive and impactful stuff, guns are a ridiculous wedge issue that will never be "resolved", and our limited time is definitely better spent trying to force improvements that would benefit and be popular with a majority of people.
As a liberal gun owner, I can't agree more. I hate that I have to own a gun to feel safe. I have been within 1 mile of no less than 5 mass shootings, and in 2 scenarios where I had to put my hands on my gun ready to use in the last 5 years. My wife was 100 yards from the shooter at the Texas State Fair shooting last year.
I own guns to protect my family. I also own them in case civil war breaks out and all my right-wing, crazy neighbors lose their shit.
There never is a suggestion. It’s never thought through. It’s all just abstract. Civil war is an abstract thought that can be talked about without anyone needing to consider how it would actually play out.
So how does it work? Do conservatives from Texas take a greyhound bus to california, get out, and start blasting indiscriminately? Do they stop people on the street and randomly ask their political views before blasting?
It’s hard to have a civil war when your enemy is ill defined. People arent going to be standing in fields with blue and grey uniforms.
What is more likely to happen is simply clashes during protests .
The issue is military and police tend to side with fascists, and fascists know this so it's a 3 way fight
While police will always side with fascists - it's a purely fascist institution, after all - there is some caveats when it comes to the military, and, surprisingly, the prospects of the US military simply joining with fascists does not look promising for them. The problem is that the military-industrial complex has it's bread buttered on both sides by the liberal status quo - it simply has nothing to gain from a fascist regime in any way whatsoever.
The bad news is, of course, is that they might not actually need the military if they just plan on doing it through lawfare as they are currently doing it.
sure, but they're in the minority, and i wouldn't bet on even the majority to win against the national guard and their tanks
Tanks need support personnel.
Ask the Russians how well it goes when the tanks fight alone.
Okay? What's your point? That the national guard will rise up against the system?
The national guard are famously conservative. Which side do you think they'll pick when push comes to shove?
Wait so we're getting Jan 6 Part 2 if Trump wins?
I am still sure that the right has more. Like you might have 1 or 2. A lot of those nutjobs have 1 or 2 hundred.
What, are they going to aim 200 guns at once?
Knowing some of the redneck mother fuckers I've met:
They'll figure out how to do it, yes
"I've gon' an' dun it, y'all! I dun made a weapon to surpass Metal Gear, I tell you hwhat."
Arm their friends? Make boobie traps?
Making boobie traps is illegal they can't do that /s
Well they've only got 2 arms at the most (maybe 3 in Alabama) so they can only hold 2 guns at once. Kinda hard to hold an arsenal dual wielded
Your absolutely right. But how many guns can you shoot at once?
While they have a large number of guns, they can still only operate one at a time.
Not me.
They're still crying about Biden coming for their guns (I'm American), happily ignoring "take their guns first due process second" Trump
Not America’s left. America’s left has wanted gun control.
That said, it’s not like the left leaning cities are hurting for guns. There is a reason the left wants gun control.
And the strong push against gun control isn’t a 200 hundred year old thing. It’s a 40-50 year old thing. The NRA used to be about responsible gun ownership, not saving up for the fallout wasteland.
America's liberals have wanted gun control. go far enough left and you get your guns back.
Maybe I'm more of a moderate but I just want some gun control, like universal background checks and mandatory training.
Not really on board with other things though, for example: Banning certain models of guns is just stupid and ineffective: Ban one and there are probably at least half a dozen other functionally identical firearms they can be replaced with. It's meaningless performative legislature.
You make it sound like these people have a bone in their bodies to take the fight to their government.. all a bunch of hot air. Even the ex military ain't got it in them. Not many people are willing to sacrifice their lives for their ideals.
I sure haven’t. That’s a deluded conservative thing… they say they need guns to defend from an overbearing government, then they’re the idiots who vote for freedom-infringing authoritarians. It also hasn’t made sense in decades at best, given that they’d be gravy seals fighting army or police with their handguns while the government has helicopters, grenades, night vision, comm systems (like, they think they’d have cell service in a civil war?) and so on. Maybe some organized group could pull off an Iraq or Afghanistan style resistance, but it seems unlikely.
Lmfao
The problem is that the cops are on their side.
I've dabbled in ham radio a bit, comms is something that at least some of the right are thinking about with these kinds of things, there's more than a handful of right wing doomsday pepper lunatics in the ham radio circle, if you ever decide to listen in on CB radio chatter, there's a good chance you're gonna hear some lunatic ranting about conspiracy bullshit, I'm pretty sure I saw some pictures of guys at 1/6 with some baofengs (cheap Chinese ham radios, pretty much every ham has one or two kicking around)
I remember when I first started looking into ham radio, I was googling some stuff, clicking into a whole bunch of different results not paying too much attention to where I was, and I found one forum thread that was actually pretty informative until halfway down the thread someone said something really unhinged about race wars or something, and no one called him out about it and some even agreed with him, so I took a look at what site I was on and it was the stormfront forums. Nope I out of there really quick.
Also not the only experience I had like that, few of my hobbies and interests have significant overlap with the right wing lunatics fringe since I'm into some outdoors camping and survivalist type stuff, the algorithms try really hard to suck me into crazytown sometimes.
Honestly. I wish we had more leftest prepped stuff. The darknet hacker scene (privacy is a mixed bag) is decent IMHO, but as soon as you want to prepare for disasters (canning, homesteading, HAM radio, reloading, guns, etc) ALOT of the content and social media is a mix of ethno or Christian nationalism bunk.
We, the left, really should be interested in this stuff. This is how you provide mutual aid in disasters. How you help the marginalized avoid oppression and how you raise the cost of faciest take over.
Small arms like pistols, shotguns, rifles are great against a random meth head that breaks in to your home. But against a coordinated response by the government!? They have machine guns and drones and troops and bombs. And have been known to use them on civilians.
“On Tyranny” has some great guidance on this, as well as some guidance on how to do what you can to help put the brakes on it happening.
TL;DR there’s quite a lot more, but stay off the internet, get used to making small talk, making eye contact. Know who’s in your community physically and who has your back. Renew your passport, make friends in other countries if you can. Make friends. Stay off the internet.
It's really hard to make friends in other countries without the internet. Gonna have to go back to ARPANET.
He didn’t actually say stay off the internet; that was my oversimplified retelling. A little more complete but still oversimplified version would be: Be careful and don’t share more than what you think is safe to share, and try to focus on the real world as much as you can. The real world doesn’t have mass surveillance in quite such a prepackaged and straightforward fashion, and it is where all the real outcomes good or bad will eventually take place anyway, so prioritize it as much as you can.
Curious: Why "stay off the internet" ? It's mentioned twice, so I'm assuming for a good reason.
Is that a mental health thing or a keep from being profiled/targeted thing?
It is soo easy to forget about just how much identifying metadata you leave on the internet just by reading stuff.
You know the cookie banners you see? Those that claim to let you opt out from being tracked by advertisers?
Yeah, those are just the overt tracking mechanism, tracking pixels are far far more insidious.
Lets backtrack a bit, back when Facebook started getting big, companies started embedded Like buttons on their webpages, cool right? You could just click the Like button and it would help you post a link to your Facebook feed to the page you were visiting.
Seems fine, right? What's the issue?
It would be fine if the image of the Like button was stored on the local web server hosting the rest of the site.
But it isn't.
It is stored on Facebook's servers, it is stored in a way that every single Like button has their own ID, so every time you load up your favourite website about abandoned radiation experiment sites it makes your browser send a request to Facebook's servers as well and depending on how the request is sent they can at minimum log that your IP address loaded the Like button with the ID number X, the ID number X is tied to the specific webpage you visited.
Then you go and do some research on impotense and how to cure it, the pages you read all have Like buttons as above, but with their own ID numbers, Facebook now knows at a minimum that you are a man who is interested in science, technology, society and modern history, you may also suffer from impotense.
Well, you keep browsing the web and read local news, well the Like button is also there, and with the ID number Facebook can add an area of interest to your profile.
It keeps going like this, but with one huge important change, people are starting getting warey of the Like buttons and Facebook in general, so they simply remove the button, while introducing the tracking pixel, a 1px*1px transparent picture, it works like how the Like button loads, and keeps generating data for Facebook.
Facebook is not alone in this, I just used them as an example.
You can read more here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spy_pixel
This is also not even getting into browser fingerprinting.
Oh, yeah. I'm aware of all that. Good info, though.
I meant for the purposes of what moz was saying from that "On Tyranny" TL;DR guidance. Like, should I just assume that metadata is going to be immediately used against me to determine if i'm an "undesirable" ?
May have answered my own question there lol
Well, yes. There's no take backsies, but showing you've dropped off the internet, as sus as it is, also shows you're done with all this, and makes it harder to prove your current status as "undesireableness" by lack of evidence. The longer you wait to disappear, the more relevant the evidence that can be used against you.
I have not read that book, but seeing as the right is on the rise also here in Europe, it might be worth checking it out.
Your IP addresses, home, cellphone, etc.. They all lead back to your actual home address where you can be identified.
Have a pint at the Winchester and wait for it all to blow over
Canada will not accept US citizens as refugees unless things really goes to hell, we're not even accepting refugees who come from other countries via the USA as they're supposed to ask for refugee status in the first of the two country they step in. So yeah, don't get your hopes up, Canada isn't a consolation prize for you guys, fix your own shit.
That doesn't stop you from getting a work visa and moving there.
Temporarily and only if you have qualifications for jobs where we need people
Temporarily can also become permanent. And many folks do have skills worth amassing.
How's the housing market going bud?
Terrible. I could flip this comment but it's all been said before.
🥲
What does that have to do with the subject? Even more reason why we wouldn't take in US citizens for no reason
Ever watched/read the Handmaid's Tale? This scenario basically happens, and Canada has to cater to any refugees they can smuggle out.
Unfortunately/fortunately works of fiction aren't binding on geopolitics. (Depending on the fiction)
Hi, Canadian here. The Handmaid's Tale was seriously over optimistic about what kind of country we are.
Fair enough.
Why so much hate for people just looking to survive?
It's just the truth bud, people living in the richest country in the world can't be bothered to go out and vote (https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/voter-turnout-rate-by-age-usa the majority of electors under 30 support the Democrats) and every US elections research for Canadian immigration laws goes through the roof? If you guys can't make your own country work (even when you've got an amendment made to secure people's right to protect themselves against the shit show your government has become!) then why would you expect other countries to just welcome everyone of you? It's not as if you would extend the same favor, people coming from the poorest countries in the world end up being detained when they cross into the USA.
Suddenly all the people with anti migration sediment might realize how it’s like when the shoe is on the other foot.
We are pretty much screwed any way you slice it. Make sure you’ve got a trusted network of people, make sure you’ve got your passport renewed. Make sure you’ve got some coins stashed away.
But also, get into local government. Go to a city meeting. It sounds dumb but if you’re not involved then you’re not informed and have no power. A lot of cities have the power of ordinances that can make life less hellish.
Look up climate feedback loops cause we’re already over the edge on that crap. Ain’t nothing to be done except start living underground.
We can still lessen the effect. Every .1 degree less average global temperature rise helps.
Yeah that .1 degree might stave off the extinction of several animal and insect species for a bit
A better question would be what are you going to do to make sure the orange Mussolini doesn't win?
Make sure you, your friends, and your family are Registered to vote.
Make sure everyone you know gets to the polls on our before election day.
Become a poll worker.
We need to make sure we vote in numbers too big to steal. In 2000 the election was handed to Bush by the Supreme Court because of one state. Looking at the last term, the court would absolutely find a way to shift the election to the con in chief if it was just one swing state with irregularities.
Talk to people about project 2025 and what it will mean. This is how the guardrails from 2017 are removed. This is how we start a Christian theocracy. If we vote blue all the way down, the Dems may be able to put stronger rails in place. If it's not Project 2025 it will be Project 2029. These conservative think tanks have been doing this since Reagan, but this is by far the scariest.
Talk to friends and family about the Biden administration wins. It's not just Biden you're voting for, it is a continuation of his administration.
Bottom line, this is likely the most important election of many of our lives. All of us must participate.
Be really mad amd then do nothing
your honesty is refreshing, if not a bit depressing
Nice try, DHS. I'm just a silly wittle unarmed kitty :3
(You better fucking read this into evidence during my military tribunal)
how should
wethey prounce the smiley?Colon 3
As a non American living outside of the US; I'm much more concerned about a second Trump term.
The first one was mostly just annoying, funny and embarrassing for you guys.
This time he'll be taking over with war in Europe and the whole Israel/Gaza thing. There is quite a lot of damage he can do...
Don't underestimate the US military, as an ally. They are primarily younger, and the upper echelons are educated and all take their oath very seriously, to defend the Constitution, from enemies foreign and domestic. Of course there will be factions that will stick to Trump, like certain national guards, but that will fracture command and weaken our ability to react internationally. The military understand those implications, the potential literal end of the world. In the end, they push the button, not the president. The lower ranks have no desire to fight American civilians either, it's antithetical to everything they are taught, and the age range is generally people in their 20's and 30's.I trust a Marine, a soldier, an airman, a seaman heheh, coast guard too, oh and the spacemen, way more than a cop, to do the right thing.
A vet.
The US military's entire existence is so they can attack other countries to keep rich americans rich. I dont think they will now suddenly change and care about the life of anyone not rich.
I had a similar conversation about this with a Marine yesterday, and I definitely trust the lower ranks and their commitment to the American people, but it is after all an authoritarian hierarchy. I’ve heard of privates coerced into taking vaccines under the threat of disappearing, and if soldiers can fire on their own civilians in other countries, I have every reason to believe they can here. And I know some of them readily would.
Keep my head down and power through the next 4 years same as last time.
This is VERY MUCH not last time. There's intent this time, you really need to tune in.
I hate to say it but if Trump wins, it will not be the same as last time. Trump and the Republicans have both learned a lot from their last go around, and they've got the benefit of a captive supreme court at their back this time. Last time they had no clear plan for what to do if they won. This time around their plan is very clear and very scary.
Last time there was a pandemic that killed millions of people....
As someone who might be targeted and killed as this drags on, I'm not really worrying about it much. Control whatever you can, be aware obviously, but what more could you possibly do? Monday's ruling is already in the past - I mean to say that we've already made our choices, long ago (some people have seen this coming for nearly a decade now), and all that is left is to live (or whatever) with them. It "helps" that climate change awaits to kill us all regardless of who wins the next election. To be clear, no I do not say that lightly.
Hypothetical illustration: let's say that you are a deer caught in the headlights of a car. Do you jump forward? Backwards? Remain still? Duck? Jump straight up vertically into the air as high as you can? Once in this position, no matter what you do there are risks, and your choices are limited, with the outcome of your decisions mostly not up to you. Side-note: you could maybe not have jumped out straight in front of a speeding car... but that choice is behind you now, and you can only deal with what is, not what you wish had been.
So don't panic unduly - that isn't helpful - just focus on doing the next correct thing, and the rest... well, isn't up to you.
Get up, send my kids to school and go to work.
"What did you learn at school?"
"That life begins at contemplation"
You guys make this sound like some kind of doomsday movie.
I'm not downplaying how bad things are, but if you really have the several thousand dollars you'd need to actually uproot your entire life just sitting around, good for you. Most people don't have that kind of free money.
And good luck moving if you have pets, or have family members you care for. Have you guys even been to your "target" countries? Do you have plans for how you'll make income? How does healthcare work in your target country?
If you have all that figured out, and have nothing to leave behind, then good for you, I really do hope you end up better off. But this panicked response of "What are you waiting for, run!!!!!" is way more entitled than people seem to think.
Don't think you know what is 110% coming if Republicans get the presidency back.
And the even longer list of consequences that would result if these things came to be
Damn, I guess you're right. It's a shame I don't have the money to move.
I'll have to abandon my elderly family, put my pets up for adoption, and stow away on a local fishing boat for a few months. I guess it's the only way.
...but seriously, this is my point. Yes, this is all bad, but what do you want me to do? Being able to just jump ship is a privilege I do not have. If the building is burning, then I'm not getting out in time.
I'm sorry about your situation. But asking this question "what if a fascist dictator comes to power in your country," is not some veiled attack on you personally. Calling people "entitled" because they're considering fleeing a fascist takeover of their government... ok. thanks for chiming in.
Now? Vote. Tell good people to vote. Convince bad people not to vote.
There are more extreme options too but I'm not going to ask someone to do things I'm not willing to do myself.
Free money? People have been running/fleeing, are still running/fleeing, from regimes/ideologies, etc. today. Running for your life is not an entitled act, it's survival. Running while expecting to just continue your life as is (income, luxuries, etc,) that could be described as entitled.
So the question is - is this a survival moment? The answer might be no, we're blowing this out of proportion. Or yes, now is the time.
I personally believe that if we had the highest voter turnout in US history, it would absolutely nail Trump. People need to exercise their right to vote, like their life depends on it.
What you forgot to mention is that the “target” country has to want you. Even progressive Americans seem to have the belief (american exceptionalism) that they can just “move” to another country if they wake up in November to find the wrong guy won. In reality, you have to apply to immigrate to a country. Your application is gone through with a fine tooth comb. It will be 50 pages of information including blood work, urine tests, xrays, and FBI background checks. You may be granted a visa if you have something the country wants or needs, like a higher qualification or a job offer. But chicken and egg, it will be near impossible to get a job offer without a visa. And if you have a high BMI, medical issues, or an arrest record, you may as well forget about it. Many countries require that you have a 4 figure wad of free cash to get yourself started. If your target country has already met its immigration quota for the year then forget about it. If your target country has thousands of applicants (which most “good” countries do at any time), then your application has to rise above the others e.g., you have a job offer and a phd. Assuming you get through all this, it will take months to well over a year to get through the process. Want to bring your pets? Factor in 5-10k USD each for shipping, veterinary, and quarantine fees.
The bottom line is… stop yammering on about moving to another country if the orange shitstain wins. If you haven’t started the process yet of your own volition then you’ve likely not the tenacity to work that Sisyphean task.
Instead, vote.
Hit Facebook, Lawyer the Gym, Delete Up
It’s a good movie though.
Stay and vote. The way I see it, Canada is fucked if PP wins anyways, and will be hurt by Trump regardless. Europe is fucked if the alt right wins in France and hobbles Germany in the next couple elections. Nigel Farage is going to parasitically eat the conservatives from the inside out in the UK. Trump will pull put of NATO, which means war on Europe's doorstep and probably all of south east Asia if China decides they don't mind war.
Running isn't going to work. Voting and protesting and political action is what will keep us all at peace and ever vigilant against populism and later, fascism. All hope isn't lost. We still can undo the damage and categorically reject hate and corruption that is threatening democracies worldwide (and already dooming authoritarian countries with massive population gaps and economic damage)
Western Europe is pretty decent if you can move and get a job here.
Europe, who is already seeing far right insurgencies due to a few immigrants? Yeah, good idea. And if Trump wins you can basically say goodbye to any sort of future that isn't a hellscape. We're already far behind our dues on climate change and this will be the final nail in the coffin.
So not everywhere in Europe is right wing (but there are similar trends in certain countries like the US). If the US falls, Europe will be the last stronghold for democracy (which might also fail in a few years).
Yup. That is the problem.
Fascism is on the rise around the world. And the countries that have stood firm in the face of it? They are juicy targets for strongman leaders needing an easy win.
At the risk of showing my indoctrinated "american excellence" ass... the US is really a big factor in global security. Because (unless you are on our side) we have a ridiculously large and over funded military and love proxy wars.
Strongman leaders? Yeah, vote for Eddie Hall, Tom Stoltman, Brian Shaw, Zydrunas Savickas, Hafthor Bjornsson, Mitchell Hooper, etc.
The only solace to be had is that the pendulum eventually swings back. But there's going to be a lot of fuckin misery before that happens.
By that time we'll see massive streams of climate refugees, water shortages, crop failures, etc.
I didn’t say it was a LOT of solace. 😁
But yeah I lean more towards “we are well and truly fucked” every year.
A few immigrants ? Remember that Europe got a whole bunch of refugees from Ukraine to look after.
And the USA is huge compared to Europe, especially to some small countries in Europe like Belgium, Holland.
The problem of the rise of far-right is more complex.
As a German I'm well aware about the amount of people we took in. Still nothing to get riled up over.
I'd like to second that. When it comes to "far-right boiling point" several countries in Europe look like a breeze compared to Project 2025 minded US. Far right is on the rise in Western-Europe but things are not so bad yet. Not sure about the specific gay friendliness per country but countries like Germany (except the East and part of the South), Portugal, Spain, Ireland, Holland, Belgium, France could be interesting to read more about. Portugal actually had its borders wide open for some time for immigrants to work and live there but they now have some (but not so bad?) restrictions for non-EU citizens.
France is 2 days away from an election which will see the Far Right grab the most seats ever in Parliament, the only question (hope really) is "will they get absolute majority or not".
Holland fell not so long ago.
Belgium kinda holds through "sacred union" that vows to never sign an alliance with it, but at cities level it's too late.
And Hungary is deep into it with Orban since a while now. Hungary which turn it is to lead the European Parliament (a rotating position). First political act? Go shake hands with Putin.
It's gonna get complicated over here.
Isn't this a kind of positive feedback circle though? Right-wing wins, left-wing people move and leave the country, leaving more and more right-wing people left. Then obviously right wing wins again next election, more left-wing people leave and so on and so on.
This can also happen with just people moving from right-wing states to left-wing states. I suspect this is a contributing factor to the increasing split in american politics as people tend to stay where their politics align and leave where it doesn't.
This doesn't seem sustainable? Unless the states split into more independent nations that don't have to align on federal politics.
Hey. We got through the last trump presidency. If it happens, we'll fight like hell to protect the ones who are most vulnerable, and we'll figure it out. Personally I am still hopeful that it won't happen. We all need to vote and not get complacent, but this panic is good, electorally speaking. One reason Clinton lost in 2016 was that a lot of people didnt take trump's chances of winning seriously. Biden's polling low right now because leftists are mad at him (and rightly so). But as the election starts to ratchet up more and more, we'll hopefully see people fall in line on at least keeping Trump out of office.
I hate it, personally. I hate that we get government-induced anxiety every election year, just to get people to vote the way they should. All this attention on Trump and Project 2025 is meant to force the undecideds to choose where they stand. If you've already decided how you'll be voting in November, take a break for your own mental health. Last election cycle I made myself crazy listening to political podcasts, checking 538, analysing polling data. I can't do it this year, so I'm trying not to get too deep into it.
I will note that not everyone got through the last Trump presidency. Clinton would have had an actual response to Covid because she wouldn't have disbanded the NSC unit that would have saved most of the 1.1 million Americans who died of Covid-19.
That's absolutely true. But we can do more about the future than we can the past.
Germany got through Hitler and the beer hall putsch, go read about what happened next time when he regrouped and tried again.
This would NOT be the same thing and you (and folks like you) really need to accept that.
I understand your sentiment internet friend. It made me insane too (and I have dual citizenship and have lived outside the States for a very long time).
But with the recent SCOTUS rulings + the planning that went into P25, this time is truly, uniquely different. If Trump wins this time, it is game over for any future ways to save democracy and anyone but cis, white, het Xian men and the women who remain subservient to them. There will be no "close your eyes and think of England" for four years then back to normal. There will be no way back to normal for generations.
So my thought is that anything, anything that gets the attention of even one more prospective Dem voter is ok.
Sic semper tyrannis…
Was what Boothe shouted when he shot Lincoln. But Lincoln was no tyrant and history has proven him to be the best President we ever had.
I wonder what historically interesting quotes will occur in the future.
Did you know it's illegal to say "I want to kill the president of the United States of America"?
To be considered a threat under 18 U.S.C. § 871, the statement must meet certain criteria:
Objective Test: Would a reasonable person interpret the statement as a serious expression of intent to harm or kill the President?
Subjective Component: Was the threat made with some degree of intent, seriousness, or purpose?
Did you click the link? 😰
Surely no one has said that.
Johnny Depp drunkenly implied it and nothing happened fwiw
Rich white guy doesn't get in trouble for something? What a crazy world.
Covfefe
Whether you're left, right, or center, focus on becoming ungovernable.
If you build up your local community and supporting institutions, and commit to ignoring unjust laws, you can greatly minimize the degree to which anything at the federal level impacts you.
This involves a lot of self sufficiency and privacy efforts that many are resistent to because of the loss of convenience, but it is well worth it.
I’ve been saving for a down payment for a house for two years. It would appear my money is not wanted in the USA. I also have dual EU citizenship. My plan is to improve my spoken German and take my family overseas.
As an atheist married to a Salvadoran woman with whom I have two hispanic children, I feel like after they run out of illegal immigrants we’ll not be far down the “committing suicide with two bullets to the back of the head” list. Or maybe we’ll just get sent to a camp that treats ADHD if you catch my drift.
I visited Germany in 2022 and was very impressed with the walkable/bikeable infrastructure and ICE trains even if they were late on occasion. The food wasn’t my favorite but the culture and people were kind and they still seem to value rule of law and societal decorum to a certain degree. The idea that making a nazi salute in public is jailable/fineable is really how it should be everywhere but “free speech” yadda yadda…
I have wanted to leave the US since 2003. Just didn’t have skills or money until now. I’m still going to struggle with a language barrier and finding a job with A2 level German. That’s my biggest issue right now I think.
My mom moved to the US not knowing English. How the turntables have turned.
As a German: You'll be welcomed and appreciated, just know that we too are fighting a political right shift and that the neonazi AfD might emerge as one of, if not the strongest party next election cycle. Especially if Trump wins this will float nationalist and fascists in Europe on the rising brown tide. It's extremely unlikely they'll end up in government though.
Generally immigrants from the US are quite happy over here and report high satisfaction with their move if they have a) children or b) health issues that cost an arm and a leg in the US and also bring a patience for German bureaucracy and good language skills.
Since you have German citizenship you are free to also consider the Netherlands (easier finding a job with only English, way higher cost of housing) or other EU countries, since you can settle in any one thanks to freedom of movement (Spain might be easier on your wife, since she'll speak the language).
So because I’m in a first past the post system over here, how does that work? You will still have other parties that can form a coalition against the right at that point? Assuming they don’t get 50+% of the vote, correct? The courts here are already fascist and preparing for the takeover due to Trump’s judge appointments during his term. Congress is deadlocked and useless as usual, and Biden is circling the drain figuratively and literally. There is no run off here. No coalitions to be had. Trump gets 47%, Biden 46%, and Kennedy 7%? Trump becomes president even though over half the country doesn’t want him. What’s worse is that he only needs percentages of the electoral college and not actual votes.
Germany, at least from my outsider perspective, seems to understand its history enough to be minimizing the right wing to its true proportions. But yeah, I’m well aware the developed world is going to shit. I’m not really sure what to do about it or where to go. The USA feels like ground zero for this shit due to Trump being in Russia’s pocket. That propaganda op worked better than anything they’ve ever done in the past. Even they probably can’t believe how successful they’ve been.
We looked at Spain, but ultimately the salaries are so low that we wouldn’t be able to afford to fly home to visit relatives and friends assuming we can still do that post Trump. I guess I’m not writing off the US entirely just yet but it’s not looking too great.
Thanks for your advice and well wishes. I hope to vote against AfD if/when I get there.
We have Senate and House of Representatives analogues, the AfD will be very influential in the Bundesrat (roughly equivalent to the Senate) because they will be the strongest party in some States but in the Bundestag (HoR), where representation is proportional it's extremely unlikely that they will be able to create a governing coalition, because if the CDU/CSU does that, they imho. will bleed voters all over and not win any election for decades.
But forcing the democratic parties to form an all-encompassing coalition will also be bad for all of them. Still better for the country, but really unstable and basically grind government operations to a minimum consensus for four years.
Our courts are... well okay-ish. They might have some hard conservatives (and will get worse with the AfD able to put judges forward), but generally the courts are seen as stable, fair and guardians of the democratic process. But the democratic process might just not be as crucial as democracy itself, when it's tools are used to get rid of democracy.
All in all, even with Russia puppeteering the AfD, I have way more confidence in the gernan, than in the american public, mostly because the "culture war" hasn't yet overcome the political need for cooperation in our proportional representative system.
The afd is curently the 2nd strongest in the polls but the strongest ist also the very right leaning cdu/csu, together they have the potential of 50% for the next election and there are forces in the cdu/csu that are not strictly opposed to that idea (like the current head of the party: Merz). Some other parts are but the cdu/csu is also very keen on not looking like they have internal struggles, so it's anyone bet if they will actually keep the tadition of being the self proclaimed right most acceptible party and therefore only forming coalition with parties left of them (or arguably on the same level in the case of fdp), or if they give into their own extremist wing.
i hope that afd and cdu/csu just don't get 50% so they have to do cdu/csu + spd + greens or cdu/csu + spd + fdp (sadly the only realistic option atm)
Buy a gun or two. Nothing in this country has more rights than a gun.
My kids both have autism and higher needs. I also have this population of clients. I can’t just uproot, honestly. Sit back and have a drink. Continue to teach the kids skills for stay-at-home careers and maintain a low profile.
Do you really think anyone competent will work for Trump? The first time around he tried to deport dreamers, didn't end the program the right way, and they didn't get deported for his entire term. He would sometimes forget to sign bills he had photo ops with. He lead a group of rioters to the capital, told them where the electoral votes were, and they ended up taking selfies and Nancy Pelosi's podium. And these were his intelligent supporters.
Trump is just a (stupid) face for the masses this time. The conservatists come prepared for some real uprooting.
Yeah and Hitler injected human shit into himself, so what? Where does this sense of confidence come from? He said he'd kill people and now he's legally allowed to do it.
Last Week Tonight said that Trump did not expect to win at all the first time and therefore entered his term very unprepared. This time it is completely different. He had four years to assemble a ruthless, strong, and clever team, which is now ready with a well-developed plan.
Yes. While Trump doesn’t have the full backing and confidence of the real three branches of government (Oil, Finance, and Military Industrial Complex) he has the backing of the religious fanatic institution like The Federalist Society.
They pay good money to figure out how to gamify voting and power, and have been moving the pieces in the shadows for a while. People have been calling them out for decades with their shit judge appointments, but only now that it’s reached a critical mass do people seem to care.
Now that most of the forest is burned, it’s a bit too late, but we can still put out the fire from conservative evil (all conservatives are evil, so if you are reading this know you go against your own Bible and will spend eternity in hell, bitch) and try to recover.
Yes. There's a lot of people itching to use this opportunity to seize power and implement their extreme right wing views via the government. Project 2025 is just there on the web to read, and they have people ready to go.
I'd like to try to assuage your fears regarding a protest meeting missiles or drone strikes. Yes, the President can order drone strikes with impunity. It's been that way since the first use of drones, early as the Obama era (maybe earlier, but I was a bit young then).
However, this does not apply to US soil. One of the benefits of state sovereignty is that federal armed forces can't operate on US soil. National guard gets involved, at the governor's request, but they don't have missiles or drones. Police are barbaric, but they also don't have missiles or drones.
So I don't think we'd see much of an escalation in terms of weapons of violence with regards to protests when compared to 2020.
If he declares it an official act, then it’s not illegal. Drone strikes are pretty official.
SCOTUS fucked up super-sized
SCOTUS (or at least 6 of 'em) knew exactly what they were doing and did it anyway. On purpose.
6 of ‘em are super-sized fuckups. Po-TAY-to / Po-TAH-to.
He can order it all he wants, but that doesn't mean any branch of the military has to actually carry out an obviously illegal order. All it means is that he theoretically "can't" get prosecuted for trying.
One of the biggest factors is that the courts can't get testimony from members of the executive branch of government, meaning if he does something insanely evil, as long as only his admin that knows anything about it, he can't be effectively prosecuted. It's pretty fucking terrible.
The people carrying out those acts are also not legally immune like the president is.
True, but he can pardon them easily.
If they refuse, they can be replaced with yes-men who will.
He can only pardon for federal crimes "atm" so if he drone strikes on state land the state can prosecute.
Also true. But, like, what are the states going to do about a mad king who's federally untouchable?
I'm trying hard to not be an alarmist (mostly for my own mental health), but it's not just that the floodgates are open; the dam has burst and we're all downstream.
Watch as the Supreme Court use the supremacy clause to counter act this. If they've already reached this far, I don't think that's a lot further to reach
They may or may not be pardoned. Trump has a well established history of stiffing employees, screwing over allies, and throwing anyone under the bus whenever he thinks it will suit him.
His history of stiffing / screwing over / bus throwing aside, I don't for one moment think he won't pardon someone who has been loyal to him. Not as long as it doesn't cost him any money or cause his ratings to drop.
Nope. But they can be pardoned for those acts by the prez
This is not the protection that you think it is.
One of the elements of the Trump victory plan is for them to replace pivotal positions in civil and military services with sycophantic yes-men who are GREAT at not questioning orders - or, are of the same psychopathic stripe as they are, and are actually enthusiastic about executing such orders for one reason or another.
Not to mention: go into any US military mess hall, anywhere. What’s on the TV? (Here’s a hint: it’s not MSNBC, CBS, or CNN).
Someone will be willing to do so. He can just fill everything with yay sayers.
A huge portion of the military supports him.
And a huge proportion doesn’t.
Dont underestimate how many people join the military at 18 for financial/career reasons and often end up living overseas and meeting people from different backgrounds. It’s not as conservative as people might imagine.
Ahh of course, america has never once committed a war crime
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_war_crimes
Project 2025 has you covered. Law abiding service members will be replaced. snap. Easy peasy.
Soldiers swear an oath to the Constitution to not commit illegal orders, regardless of who orders them.
The issue is that the president cant issue illegal orders anymore. Since hes the commander in chief of the military, his orders are an "official act," i.e constitutional.
The supreme court has said that the president can order military executions of anyone at all and the military can no longer legally refuse. The above is constitutional, because the people who decide what is constitutional said it is.
SCOTUS still decides what is or isn't an official act, not that it's reassuring.
SCOTUS can decline any case silently, with no justification. They can decide to not decide, ceding all power to the new American king if they like.
The military now have to murder americans if the the president says so, because he said so. That core check on tyranny, the military's ability to refuse an unlawful order, was wiped away by this supreme court.
If they declined to hear it, the decision would be in the hands of whatever court the appeal came from.
Haven't been following the news, have we? What you said was mostly true a week ago. Now, NO ONE has legal protection under U.S. law against crime committed by an American president.
From the Project 2025 wiki page:
Why is this fucker still alive?
Clearly "the system" isn't capable of handling the threat of right-wing extremism and something needs to be done, but anybody murking Trump would probably make things worse, not better. He'd become a conservative martyr, and they could point to his death and say "see, we told you they're violent" and use it to deepen hatred and oppression. This is what happened after the failed assassination attempt on Robert Fico
It does not matter what anyone does. Everyone needs to understand that. They will always find something to point to and rally against. But I meant why is he still alive when his health is terrible, he's past average life expectancy, he doesn't exercise, and he obviously spends all of his mental and emotional energy on petty vengeance and anger. I'm honestly amazed that he hasn't suffered multiple heart attacks.
Ah right I get you, a "how is he still kicking" instead of "why hasn't someone fed him to a wood chipper"
I suppose "how" would have been a better word choice.
The fuck they don't.
After my active duty service I was in the NG for a while until I figured out it was a fuckin joke, but my NG unit was a Bradley unit which means 30mm cannon and TOW missiles. And that was almost 30 years ago.
The Air NG also flies just about every fighter out there and they sure as hell have missile racks on them.
The hope is that the Americans behind those war machines will be hesitant to fire on their countrymen but Kent State puts a shadow over that hope.
I have, because of my father, dual citizenship with the UK and now that Labour has gotten in, I feel like that's a legitimate way out, so I am expediting getting a UK passport.
Due to a technicality of the sort that their bureaucracy will hate, I also have the possibility of German citizenship. I'd much rather have the ability to live and work in the EU, so I'll probably start working on that when I get to the UK.
My daughter is queer, I'm Jewish and (although this may not sound like a problem to some of you, I suggest researching it) my wife is a librarian, so I want an exit plan.
You escape BEFORE the regime change. You do not wait to escape.
It was evident that this was the path the US chose in 2008 election vitriol and then 2012 with the tea party. Then in 2016 Trump, it was as blatant as can be. You've had 8 years to plan and leave. You now have 6 months.
Make sure you have a passport. You should have been trying to obtain secondary citizenship. Even with all the money and education, you are only allowed to stay in a foreign country on a residency visa. Americans call theirs a green card for example. It is tied to your passport. When your passport expires, OR IS CANCELLED, then all the visas tied to it are also affected. In some places you can stay as you transfer your visa to your new passport. Some places you cannot, you must exit and re-enter. If your passport is invalid, you can only exit back to the USA if you are only American. The cancelled part is the scary part because the USA already does this. If you don't pay your taxes, or child support or if you have a warrant or even probable cause against you the US will cancel your passport. It's the easiest way to force Americans back home for prosecution.
Your #1 goal should be starting to obtain citizenship elsewhere. If you have grandparents from Europe, see if you can get it. You have relatives in Canada, mayve you can get it. If you can't, then start looking to buy citizenship or residency with a path to citizenship. This is 6 figures and can be instant like Vanuatu or take years like most of Europe. But again, better to start now.
As the Chinese routinely say, the best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago. The second best time, is now.
The US is vast and it's unlikely to devolve into anarchy. It may get very violent and bloody or it may become more like a governmental issue where you just get locked up if you're bad. In that case storing some of your stuff in a storage area isn't too risky. If it goes into anarchy, then it'll be lost. Otherwise just keep paying and avoid.
I believe we're looking right at 1930's Germany. The parallels are uncanny. Those who survived, left. Those that waited until they were being rounded up to leave, mostly did not make it. And they lost everything they had and their families ever had.
I completed my move out 4 years ago now. I can now eat popcorn and watch the US implode from the other side of the world. I will lose some money, some possessions, and unimportant things. But my keepsakes and most of my assets are now free of the US.
Most Americans are too poor to leave. Those who have the money aren't likely to care enough.
Get a shitton of drives for media that would likely get banned under Trump (porn, etc.).
Also Hungarian here, the republicans are betting on the likes of you leaving in case of a Trump victory. That's how Fidesz is staying in power.
Brace for an absolute clusterfuck that will undoubtedly be even worse than last time and be ready for anything to the best of my ability. I'm a straight white guy so I guess I likely wouldn't be targeted directly but I have friends and colleagues who would be a great risk.
If America is lost, I don't know that anywhere would really be safe from the fallout, so go vote this November because if you don't, it might be the last time America gets to vote.
have your passport and any other docs in order now, if you're making all these contingencies.
make more objective and less speculative assessments.
find ways to enjoy yourself family and friends now. And build relationships and support systems with people you know and people in your community. Lines of communication and a habit of community work will help alleviate your doomy outlook for now, and help you build a network when it's time to respond to a bad situation, if one arises.
Stay constructive. Everyone has a plan til they get punched in the mouth, so if you aren't trained in combat or conflict theory, you should just keep assessing your current situation, and if you want to get out, if you truly believe Montreal is a more comfortable place for you, then go ahead now, why wait, it sounds very nice. Though I would appreciate it if you're here to vote to help our chances of correcting the illegitimate court system.
Anyway always ask yourself, "what is the best possible thing I can do right now?".
You should be scared but try not to feel hopeless that won't help anyone. I'm honestly shocked at how little people have been freaking out. Especially the news media, I don't see how a free press survives a second Trump administration. That's what really concerns me the seeming apathy.
I'm hoping that come November the election will go well, and we won't have to worry about it as much. (As well as possible given the choices)
My family and I are going to be overseas when the transition happens and if we might not return depending on what happens. We're going to be visiting family in a country where my spouse qualifies for citizenship ship so I feek like that's in our favor.
If shit goes south and it was just me, I would probably stay but I've got kids to worry about and I won't feel bad for a second about keeping them safe.
We have decades of examples of people standing up for what is right or true.
Journalists get shit on because "fake news" or "they are just writing clickbait" and people actively shit on their livelihood. Activists get the shit beat out of them, are maimed for life, and often go to prison. And people post pictures on facebook where they have a background in solidarity before they take a new duck-face picture and overwrite it.
The purpose of journalists are to seek and speak truth on behalf of The People. When The People have made it clear they don't give a shit and can't be bothered to even read the article someone had to go into hiding for?
So why stand up and make yourself a target?
What did I just read
I can't comprehend why there aren't people marching in the streets demanding a constitutional amendment to limit the executive branch and restore checks and balances. The recent Supreme Court decision granting absolute presidential immunity is a direct threat to our democracy. We all need to be more proactive. Government moves so slow if not pushed.
I'm Canadian. I plan to steal a dump truck, drive it to the middle of the bridge to the US that's 15 km from my house, turn it sideways, and disable it. Then, when they remove it I'll do it again.
a dump truck would indeed be more effective than doing this with a trump duck
Don't forget to load it with something heavy first.
Let's just say I bought a large cargo trailer, that admittedly serves multiple purposes, but one of those is for emergency scenarios.
If things get really bad, my wife and I have careers that makes going to Canada or Germany or Norway somewhat viable.
I'm not having my family go down with the ship. Let them sink. I have far more responsibility to my kids than to my country. Like the brain-drain on Nazi Germany or Russia as of late, I'll have no problem going and enriching another nation with more sane people. (with recognition there is some degree of crazy everywhere).
What's so sad is that the ignorance that is perpetuating this modern absurdity and making someone like Trump viable in the first place is so deep that even if things come crashing down, they'll be too stupid to point the finger at the actual problem.
I'm applying ASAP to renaturalize in Europe. My ancestors survived by leaving shit hole countries when it was obvious they were going to start wars and become fascists, I'll follow suit. Fuck this place. Wish I started the process sooner.
I did not need to change my plans when he was president a first time, why would I this time?
He was no less a fascist in 2016, but there were enough checks on his power that he mostly managed to simply be incompetent and chaotic. He bungled Covid response and gave free handouts to billionaires, sold who knows how many state secrets to foreign entities, but there are a lot of positions in government held by actually qualified and competent people who waylaid his whims. Conservatives have been carefully putting the pieces into place to prevent this from happening again, for instance reclassifying higher ranking government employees so that the president would be able to fire/dismiss them without cause. If the leader of the FBI attempts to investigate him again, they could just hire a new one who won't. The supreme court being full of right wing extremists is another purposeful and deliberate step to undermine the checks and balances system. Conservatives want kings, and they weren't prepared the last time Trump was in power. They will be able to do much more damage this time.
There were no real checks. He had way too many Republicans in Congress for there to be. Most of what protects America is gentleman's agreements that we all assume a normal president wouldn't defy.
That is literally what happened last time. The house (where Republicans are a majority) wouldn't pass a bill that makes firing the FBI director illegal so there's no real difference.
There isn't exactly a single candidate in the past ten years I would've called competent. In 2016, every last person running was out of touch, the only thing that enormously benefitted were the memes. Which is why I often mention my biggest qualm with Democrats, that in 2016 they wanted votes so badly they shunned third party voting as "throwing away your vote". Uhm, no, throwing away your vote is what we're doing right now. If the system wasn't simply a monarchy with two choices and if people voted honestly, this is a situation we wouldn't even be thinking about. I feel sorry for nobody.
Not everybody who works for the government is elected. The vast majority of people who work for the government are hired like at any other job, and many of them work their ways up the pay levels with competency and years of experience just like the private sector. Only a very limited number of employees are supposed to cycle in and out with a White House administration, and those are the people the president is supposed to have the ability to get rid of at will. Tens of thousands of government employees keep working regardless of who is in charge and answer to their supervisors, and so can offer some resistance to illegal, immoral or downright stupid decisions from the "top". For instance, if the General Natural Resources Manager of the EPA says "no, there shouldn't be fracking operations here, it's too close to habitation" etc, they can push back enough to possibly cancel that initiative. Unless, of course, you make it so the executive branch can point to any government employee and say "you're fired" for arbitrary reasons and replace them with a sycophantic toady who always says yes to daddy oil.
Hmm I wonder if we know anyone who likes saying "you're fired"...?
He didn't know what he was doing for much of his first term. For his second, he'll have an instruction booklet that he just needs to follow and take credit for. Project 2025 and the recent SCOTUS immunity ruling are just 2 signs that show that a 2nd term will be so much worse.
Haven't been paying attention, have you. The coup, the threats, dictator day 1, political hit lists...yeah sounds fine and normal.
I'll keep on keeping on.
I'm lucky enough to have some security, so my plan is lay low and where I can play safehouse for the folks that need it, I'm not a fighter, but I have what I need and a little more, and I can use that to help whoever needs it.
I've got ideas for what the post crisis should look like, so probably try to find ways to network with the folks who are likely to be making that transition once this inevitably burns itself out.
Meantime, vote. Vote like your life depends on it because the odds are that you know someone who's life does.
Time is our shield, and even if it's only another four years, it's four more years the windbag has to survive into his 80s to take another crack at it, by which time the crop of Dem governors are going to be making enough noise to be suitable replacements for Biden, and if he drops dead in that time, it is very likely the movement will be demoralized the same way JFK and RFK dying took the wind out of the Democrat's sails.
The Redcaps are a cult, when the prophet of a cult dies without an already established right hand who can take over and reconsolidate the movement, the whole thing collapses under its own weight and the shock and grief of its members.
They aren't gonna wake up to how wrong they've been, but they are gonna spiral hard and be unable to keep up the energy.
Continue not living in the US. I got out in 2015. It does mean, however, that unless one of my parents is in serious trouble, I'm not setting foot in that country for the duration.
For a long time now my plan has been to buy land way out in the boonies where no one can find me and set up a bunch of solar energy panels to power basic electronics and satellite internet while I grow potatoes and raise chickens.
Beans and apples too
Better buy it now, in any case.
Planning on leaving the country if I can. Preferably somewhere overseas.
We're preparing to leave the US.
To where? How?
We already did, to New Zealand. Education visa to get a PhD my partner had been eager to get, followed by work visa and/or resident visa. Few more years and then permanent resident then citizenship.
We'd been saving up/planning for a decade because we wanted to leave anyway, the environment that gave us Trump only encouraged us to leave. Years later and I'm still 100% convinced we made the right choice for us.
I suggest finding a culture that fits yours, making a very detailed budget, exploring all the options for visas and plan for future visa extensions/applications, and making some sacrifices to get where you want to be.
Lots of EU countries have generous options if you have lineage, I'd start with that as getting into one of them gets you into all of them eventually.
That's exactly the challenge. Without some sort of visa in hand we really don't have any options so we're still early in the planning. I've looked at New Zealand and Canada though.
To be honest, I don't think Trump has the attention span to do any more than hold a bunch of gloating rallies. Ironically his own immunity may end up working against his desire for revenge, as some justice department lawyers will push back until Trump gets distracted by a squirrel or a coloring book or something.
That being said, I kinda dream of moving to Canada. Fun fact: the median Canadian wealth per capita is higher than in the US, meaning it may have a better claim to "land of opportunity" if we're talking about ordinary people instead of the richest few. Plus the people really do seem to be nicer. The mosquitoes though...Canadian mosquitoes are no joke.
It's not trump, it's the federalist society.
All signs point to a anti-woke culture warrior crypro bro as our next Prime Minister, it's a pretty much given at this point, I really regret to share that...
It's not all about Trump or Biden personally though. It's the people they appoint and install to run the government and who they have as advisors. Trump has shown he selects the absolute worst people, who tend to be a combination of malicious, criminal and incompetent. Biden, on the other hand, built a competent administration who is actually interested in competently running the executive branch for the positive benefit of Americans.
Keep saving until I can get a used car, so I can stop renting to drive Uber. After that, rapidly save up a buffer using the eliminated rental cost, and then get my second career started. Sales, I’m thinking. Lots of outside sales requires having one’s own car.
Molotov cocktails 🍸
Nothing really. By then everyone in my household will hold dual-citizenship and be able to leave when they decide the situation has gotten unacceptable.
I won privilege bingo so me personally am in no danger, at least for the foreseeable future. Work in the infrastructure sector and plan to go down with the ship. You guys have fun with your civil war and genocides, I will keep the garbage and sewage at bay. At least until the secret police get to me and put a bullet in my brain.
Nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure
Hide my recent diagnosis of hypertension and return to the Motherland. I'd stay for the Civil War 2, but, honestly?
Fuck this place. Most of these fuckers don't even deserve Biden, much less a good candidate, lmao.
rampage
Just wait for them to come get me, I suppose
Start looking for jobs in Canada.
My partner and I missed our chance to leave in 2015. This time I'm buying a MIG welder and torch cutter.
No idea. Don't think I have the physical means to leave the country. I have in demand skills but I am so Far in debt I can't make financial arrangements and am considered a liability to due debts owed to foreign entities. I'm probably going to go back in the closet taking the hide option by retreating into a cist white het male shell and attempt to reclaim that privilege that may hopefully stop me from getting executed or put in a camp.
Join a John Brown Rifle Club.
Lets be honest, the "fight" part people are too comfortable and aren't going to do anything. I'd love it if it were so, but I"m not a leader.
So my realistic plan is buy in bulk, start a garden, try to convince friends and neighbors to do the same to be able to help each other out when the worst of it comes. Which frankly is the exact same plan if Biden wins, but with a lot more fear behind it.
I might be old but I seem to recall the French taught the proper way to protest this kind of stuff, rather than the soft protests we saw in 2020, let alone 2016.
As for me, fortunately I live in tbe Best Hemisphere so I plan to offer whatever housing space I have available so my friends from the US can flee over and nap the Trump Kingdom over.
Nothing like 2016.