Drivers Hate The Tech In Their Cars
It turns out that more technology in cars isn’t necessarily something customers want, and it’s not really improving their driving experience. We know my thoughts on the matter, but I’ll do my best to stay impartial on this latest survey from JD Power that shows most customers don’t appreciate technology in cars unless they can see a clear benefit to them.
JD Power’s 2024 U.S. Tech Experience Index Study evaluated over 81,000 drivers’ experience with “advanced vehicle technologies” in 2024 model year vehicles after 90 days of ownership, It turned out to be a pretty mixed bag when it came to what people liked using. There are a number of tech features that customers like using because they feels that it answers their needs, but at the same time there is a whole lot that don’t get used very often or are continually annoying, according to the survey.
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I'm ok with a decent amount of tech in a car. Like I'm fine being able to connect my phone to the car and have android auto take over the infotainment system.
But the HVAC stuff needs to be buttons I can access/control without looking or very minimal looking.
I don't want/need my car to have a SIM card, or connect to wifi, and report what I'm doing. If they want to do that, then they can give me the car for free and I'll drive it around letting them collect my driving habits.
Edit: Oh, and I'm sure as hell not paying some subscription fee on top of the price of the car.
Good news, lawmakers in the US finally started looking at this issue.
Bad news: probably will take years for change
There are numerous headlines like:
So good luck with that.
The company I work at is tangentially related to car company data collection. And this week, all employees received an email that we were legally required to save all records newer than 2005 related to a specific car company's onboard data collection service.
So it does seem like the investigation has already got a subpoena or smth.
General Motors
Is the car company involved, yes.
There's activity at the state level too in multiple states. I heard something about California, then not a lot. Bunch of articles about Texas.
Spoiler from the future: it's legal, and there's nothing you can do about it.
As of 2022, Toyota still put physical buttons on their HVAC system and audio system.
I know because, against my advice, my wife bought a Toyota Rav4 Hybrid in 2022. I can't tell her how to spend her money, but at least the car she got didn't have some of this other bullshit.
Hey, at least she picked one of the most reliable cars on the market.
It's a good car. I just wish she hadn't decided to buy one in 2022. It's bad enough to buy a new car now, it was worse then.
Out of curiosity, why didn't you want her to buy that specific vehicle?
I didn't think she should have bought any car. Her old car worked. It wasn't in the best shape in the world, but it was fine. And 2022 was a terrible year for buying a car.
Oh, the COVID-19 shortages? Yeah, that's a good point.
That's how you do it. Drove my 99 Crown Vic until the wheel literally fell off. Had it put back on and did another 80k on it. Traded it in at the dealer 4 years later, in working order, simply because it cost 80 dollars a week in gas, and that was back in 2018.
Yep. I had a 2002 Civic that I was planning to drive into the ground, but an idiot mechanic accidentally left the oil cap off when he was fixing it and it eventually destroyed the engine. The amazing thing is it took a very long time to destroy it. We successfully drove my car back from Baltimore to where we live in Indiana and several two hour plus round trips after that before it conked out on me coming home one day back in 2019. So I bought a used 2016 Prius and I plan to drive that into the ground. I just don't need a fancy new car. I'd like to get an EV only because I hate getting gas, especially in the winter, and if I never had to do it again, I'd be really happy. But I don't want one enough to get rid of the car I have now.
I drove the Vic with essentially a liter of burnt Hershey chocolate syrup for 3 hours on the highway, and then daily'd it for another 5 days.
Teens are rough on cars, but it survived.
I have a 2008 tundra a coworker just bought a new one so I asked for a ride. It was nice to see under the enormous center display, the HVAC controls!
I love my subaru outback. It's a great car. It does all the car things exceptionally well. It holds a lot of stuff. Snow, mud, fuck you it's all pavement to me baybeee.
I fucking hate my Outback's climate control, entertainment, map, and information screen. I understand newer models have improved slightly. It's still awful. The only good thing about that fucking screen is that I can turn everything on from my phone. Literally every other function is awful to try to access and use while you're driving.
Got a '24 outback late last year. For the most part I love it-it's comfortable, holds my giant dogs and it's way better to drive in bad weather than my previous car.
I'd read reports on subaru forums that infotainment was bad, so my expectations were low. But even basic stuff isn't functional. It has gotten less responsive over the months (reminder: we've had it just barely a year). The screen has several seconds of lag with every touch, and sometimes controls just don't work at all. I don't like that we have to use it for temperature control, and android auto integration is clunky (though that may not be Subaru's fault).
Add that to the horrifying data collection practices and it makes me question ever getting a Subaru again.
Is it possible to get some kind of firmware update that you may not have received?
kagis
This Reddit thread makes it sound like you need to manually do it or the dealer will do it as part of the regular maintenance. Not sure if this is specific to that model year.
https://old.reddit.com/r/Subaru_Outback/comments/18cjt00/software_update_december_2023/
And
The people there are also complaining about the touchscreen instead of physical controls.
Hey good catch! I'll try to ring my dealership to see if I can get that checked out during my next oil change visit.
Thanks
I just bought a forester a few months ago, and my 2 stipulations on the cars I was looking at were all-wheel drive because I live in snow country, and a car no newer than 2018 (IIRC) because that was the year car companies largely switched from manual controls to a 16-inch screen with everything, including climate control, accessed from an app.
When I was talking to the guy at the dealership I bought it from and mentioned how much I disliked the new screens, he outright said, "Yeah, a lot of people don't like them."
Similar complaint here. We were ready to replace our 2011 outback and decided it would make sense to get something at least a bit more modern. Loved our outback, and honestly would have bought another if it weren't for that damn screen.
After getting a gander at that thing, we seemingly confused (or probably just disappointed) our salesman by insisting we wanted the most simple, stripped-down style console they had to offer. Apparently we're not the most common customers, but i know I'm kinda weird so fair enough. After he went back inside to find out which models they had on the lot that might fit that description, the only one that had a "simple" console was the base model Forester. It was just not enough to transition over from our comfy 6-cyl beast that just had a 6-cd changer with a 1-inch-tall screen and an aux jack, but everything was operated by buttons. Even the rear view mirror had a clever backup camera integrated into it. Makes more sense that way, imo. It was everything we needed and only a smidge more.
I really wish we could have just bought a newer model of the exact same car feature-wise... That outback was a great car 🙂
2018 Impreza Base here. Manual ac controls (where, how fast, how hot), but the touchscreen infotainment is still AIDS. Several seconds from press to recognition. I need the screen to actually do stuff when I press it, not leave me guessing if I hit it right. If they can't put a faster cpu, they need to have programmers that can optimise these units so they run responsively. There's no excuse for that legendary input lag.
Good car though, other than that.
This reminds me of my 2016 Honda Civic. It had just the right amount of tech.
When carplay works, it's great. But mine constantly has issues connecting to phones. Both my wife's iPhone, and my Android. Both are flagships that are a couple years old, so still very current and sufficient specs.
Meanwhile, my old aftermarket Bluetooth radio connects every time with no issue.
I do like the convenience of GPS and audio on the car tablet when it works. But honestly, it's a distraction when it's being fussy.
Exactly my experience.
Phone dash mount all the way!
100% this. I shouldn't have to click through 2 menus on a touchscreen to change a basic environmental control. Give me a damn knob, so if I want to change something I can reach my hand over and turn 2 clicks without taking my eyes off the road.
I have a 2023 Mazda CX-5 and it has the perfect amount of tech for me. The headunit isn't touch screen, but you get used to the control knob after about a day and eventually it just feels second-nature. Also, all of the hvac controls are physical knobs and buttons, which is amazing.
I stopped using Android Auto on my infotainment system. I thought it was just me but when I'm using navigation (Google maps or wyze), the second I lose service for any reason, it completely exits out and cancels my navigation. I found that if I use it in my phone, it doesn't have that issue.
2020 Subaru Forester, but friends with other cars (VW, Honda) mentioned the same issue. Not sure if this has been fixes in recent Android Auto updates or in newer cars, but I'm not going to chance it anymore.
I've only experienced real issues when out of network coverage for a long time.
I make sure I download the areas I'll visit especially if the network coverage is spotty.
My Ford sync 3 amd my old Tundra with a Kenwood AA radio bot work fine out of service as long as I have the maps downloaded
Peak technology enjoyment in a car includes
There's some other minor tech that's fairly nice that I haven't seen in cheaper cars. Lights under the door to light up the ground on dark nights for when you're getting out. Just solid utilitarian tech right there.
My single piece of favorite car tech is the cruise control that follows the cars ahead of you and brakes when necessary. I barely use my feet for driving anymore.
Ah yea adaptive cruise control with lane assist is my jam.
I am entirely the opposite. I think cruise just makes driving less engaging and more boring.
Ideally I want everything to be manual, I even control every individual wiper swipe a lot of times if I am just driving along on a highway. Less boring, more engaging. Means I am more attentative on the road.
I do however understand I am a minority.
Fine for short trips, less fun on hours+ long drives. It's nice having options!
I don't know what is considered a long trip for you but to me it's 6 hours plus, which I deal with no problems. I just think it makes driving more boring when there's less stuff to be in control of.
I live far away from my family and my wifes family so we drive a lot of 6-12 hour drives and I always drive the full stint. Doesn't bother me but I am not everyone.
I've been driving spoiled with Lane Keep Assist. I'd like to continue to keep that as a thing in all cars.
Also, I used a Ford Escape as a rental this weekend, and holy shit I hate having to wait for the startup animation to complete so I can finally mess with the A/C and have it going on full blast after sitting in the hot sun all day. My Santa Cruz has actual buttons for all the climate control stuff and I had no idea I'd miss it so much until now.
Also, adaptive cruise control
I'm fine with adaptive cruise, however, I would also like to be able to turn it off quickly and easily if the situation calls for it.
Tapping the brakes has immediately turned off cruise control in every vehicle I've ever driven.
I was referring specifically to the adaptive part, and going back to dumb cruise. I wasn't clear, my apologies.
Can you explain a scenario where that would be necessary? Given that adaptive cruise slows you down below your target speed to follow traffic all I can see that doing is either nothing on an open road, or accelerating you into the vehicle in front of you.
I use it all the time on the highway.
That doesn't explain anything. I'll be more clear.
Can you explain why it would be necessary to suddenly need to turn off adaptive cruise and switch to fixed speed cruise?
Sure. When I set the cruise, it is because I would like to go a certain speed. I'll pass if I need to. Setting the cruise to 70 and then realizing you're traveling 65 behind someone on the highway is annoying. Furthermore, it reduces fuel economy gaining back the speed that got scrubbed off. Additionally, I prefer to be a consistent driver. Varying speeds while the cruise is set seems counterintuitive at times when the traffic is light.
Surely you notice that you're coming up on someone and can switch to the left lane before you're close enough that the adaptive cruise starts slowing you down though? It kind of sounds like you just don't want adaptive cruise at all, since you want to turn it off any time it "adapts".
You made it! That's the point. They are 2 different tools for 2 different situations. One sets a constant speed. The other follows the flow of traffic. Glad I could clear that up for you. I'll continue to use both.
Isn’t it just a press of a button to turn it off?
I replied to another comment on this as well. I wasn't very clear with what I meant, my apologies. I was referring to turning the adaptive part off, and going back to just regular old cruise control.
Lane keep assist is annoying AF when you live in a place where you're required by law to cross the double yellow when going around bicycles. You get in a steering wheel fight with the car until you find the menu to temporarily disable it. After next stop-start cycle mid-errand, it's on again by default thanks to US law.
I mean just using your turn signal turns it off in most cars...
Maybe do that?
lane keeping and radar cruise control are pretty great driving aids, I gotta admit.
I'd rather just have a standard size bank up front, like, 3DIN, and choose my own "car computer". Have security locking support, guarantee certain power supply, impact, and temperature conditions. And then open up the "car console" market.
And let me be able to upgrade it five or ten years down the road.
If they want to provide a standard first-party center panel offering, fine. But computers and phones have a shorter life than do cars, and I don't want to be locked into ancient or badly-chosen controls and computers. This "car is a big cell phone" thing is just godawful from a consumer standpoint.
That would be amazing. I miss the days of swapping my head for one I want. Blaupunkt MiniDisc here we go!
After having used both Android Auto and Apple Car Play.
I really prefer having a good phone mount, that puts my phone in a glance-able place near the wheel.
That, and quality Bluetooth Audio.
Nobody is mentioning heads-up displays? That's peak tech. The info is right there without having to move your eyes off the road.
because barely anyone even knows about HUDs, since there are barely any vehicles in the "won't cost you both kidneys" price segment with HUDs in them...
...but yes, they really should be in every car. it's just a no-brainer for safety, for the exact reason you said: simply having your speed right in your field of view alone is worth it!
I feel like a HUD is only in expensive cars because it's a very useful feature people actually want.
How about the unnecessary tech that just shouldn't be allowed.
At least in the US I feel like technology has leapfrogged regulation.
I think a touchscreen is fine as long as real buttons exist for things a driver might want to manipulate while driving. My Outlander has a fairly large touchscreen that offers media and navigation control, but everything else (climate, drive modes, cruise control/drive assists, windows, locks, etc) is real buttons and dials, and there are also an extra set of basic media controls on physical buttons as well (volume, next/prev track, tuning).
I'm quite happy with that. And the passenger still gets all the touchscreen bells and whistles if they want to explore the map or set up playlists or whatever.
Electronic doors can just fuck right off.. Just another thing to break.. I'd even go so far to say motorized windows these are great until the motor dies and you can't shut the window.
I've seen waaay more manual handles break than electric windows...but that might be somewhat biased by the sheer age of most of the cars with manual windows...still, rarely ever even heard of an electric one breaking...is that common where you live?
I hate electronic e-brakes. How am I supposed to impress women with handbrake turns without a hand brake?
I just use it for parking. And I like having a physical parking brake. I don't trust the function of it when it's just a button.
i absolutely love it when it's paired with manual transmission and an auto-break function:
when you stop, for example at a red light, and press the break while standing still for a bit, it goes into auto-break mode.
when you then release the clutch while in gear (neutral gets ignored), it automatically releases the hand break, so you can perform a hand break assisted start from standstill without having to touch the actual hand break!
this is excellent when you've stopped at an incline, and generally really useful!
but i get the skepticism...i was extremely skeptical at first too, but you get used to it quickly and then it feels weird when it's missing or turned off in another car... there's just no reason not to use this feature it's simply great!
My car has that and a manual handbrake and, yes, it is quite nice.
Based on this MKBHD/Auto Zone video the way to get real buttons and sensible features is to buy a minivan.
Can't say that I would buy a minivan, because I hate them.
But my car (Hyundai Azera) has all physical AC buttons and it's great. But it shows the temp on the touchscreen which is unfortunately kinda fundamental to this car from what I've found.
One of the reasons I mentioned android auto, I just have a AAwireless adapter right now, had a Motorola M1 which died. But that is basically all I need other than a charger which I have a 100w type c for that.
Sorry kinda rambled for a bit
I'd say that that kind of imposes a size restriction, but honestly, the crossovers that everyone seems to buy are about the same size as those these days anyway.
My current ride is peak technology imho:
Comfortable seats
A suspension that is comfortable over bumps, but not floaty or bouncy and slightly firm under compression.
You'd like the 2020+ Q50 then
We need some serious federal regulation against bullshit in vehicles.
Every function that is normal to use while in motion needs a physical button.
Absolutely no fucking spyware reporting back to the manufacturer.
give me buttons and dials, not touch screens and ai. I want to drive, not check social media. I'll be keeping my 2009 until the engine locks up.
It’s not perfect, but the new (2019+) mazda system is very nice. It’s all controlled by buttons and dials, zero requirement to ever touch a screen. It all feels quite thoughtfully done, especially when you compare it to fords or teslas with a big dumb laggy iPad stuck to the dash.
Yep. I'm hoping my current car holds out until this 'smartphone on wheels" trend reverses.
*Apple CarPlay and Android Auto not supported.
Honestly that's all I want out of the center screen.
I like my 2018 Outbacks layout. Physical controls for AC, knob for volume, and a reasonable touch screen. The gauge cluster has a small screen in the center that shows me some basic info I'd like to see like tire pressure, MPG, etc.
I’m in this scenario, too.
When I needed a new car in 2019 I somehow found a six speed manual Crosstrek that has all physical buttons for climate and radio/volume that also has a backup cam and a touchscreen for CarPlay/Android Auto.
It’s perfect.
I'm pretty happy with where my car is at. It's got this cool thing where you plug a cord in, and the sound comes through the speakers. Then it displays right on my phones screen, which I put under the speedometer so I can glance at it without turning my head
It's like magic, my car does the car stuff and my phone does the phone stuff, and if I wanted a closer relationship between the two I could buy a cheap off the shelf component that plugs into the standardized ports (no disassembly required). No updates, my car can't snitch on me and the only subscription is satellite radio
Honestly I can't think of anything I'm missing out on. I don't have a backup camera or blindspots warnings, but I've never used them or needed them. Smarter cruise control sounds worthwhile, but until I can safely take my eyes off the road I'm more worried about it making me complacent.
As far as entertainment, or even navigation? I've never heard someone say "man, my phone experience is terrible, I wish it was more like my car"
At this point, I'm more inclined to convert my car to electric than to buy a more modern one
All I need is Bluetooth in the audio system and a place to hang my phone. Beyond that, things that don't make my car move or my body comfortable can go to hell.
That's the biggest (and dumbest) reason I'm looking forward to my next car. So I can play music seamlessly through Bluetooth.
I have a 2016 with Bluetooth but it literally will only let me use it for calls/texts.
Edit: Thanks for the suggestions, but I do have a Bluetooth receiver. It's just cheap and a pain. I have to power it on separately, occasionally re-pair my phone, and the chords get worn out and need replaced every so often.
Does your car have an AUX port by chance? Mine was the same with the Bluetooth limited to calls, but with a $20 adapter on Amazon I converted my unused AUX port to Bluetooth audio. Aside from that ONE thing I love my car and am thrilled to have this solved, especially so cheaply.
See if your car is on the website niftycity you might be able to get a piggyback adapter from them to run Android Auto & Apple Carplay through your OEM setup.
They no doubt sell rebranded versions of the same stuff you can find on AliExpress but they do the hard parts of working out all the bits to make it all nicely integrated with the OEM setup rather than having to research which obscure cables you need to buy.
Meanwhile I am in my 91 with a single DIN cheap aftermarket stereo enjoying Bluetooth
I don’t hate tech in my car.
I hate unnecessary, poorly designed tech in my car.
Current tech design unnecessarily complicates and obscures what should be simple and easily accessible functions. That’s more than just irritating, it’s dangerous.
BRING BACK THE FUCKING BUTTONS HOLY SHIT
Yeah, let me keep my eyes on the road. I'm not a huge fan of mini coops, but the dash setup of the ones I've driven are my favorite. They've got unique toggles and knobs, made it easy for me to memorize functions without having to give it any thought
No one hates the tech in their cars, ABS is universally loved. What people hate is tech working not in tandem but against them
I'd argue that touchscreens in cars is pretty dumb for the most part. Detents and buttons are incredibly effective physical feedback systems that are being thrown away for them, sadly.
I still can't believe they're legal. Interacting with your phone while driving is against the law but for some reason when it's a part of your dashboard it's a-ok?
Honestly, I always thought that "hands-free" phone use isn't really all that safe either - for some drivers, their brain being distracted by the call is what makes driving while "on the phone" dangerous. Heck, even having to pee really bad is worse than being tipsy.
It's not about ABS, its about BS like an everything touchscreen, tracking, bullshit subscriptions and the like
As a driver, all I really want is good music, good navigation, and easy access to all my controls.
I don't want to have to go into submenus to change my temp settings, or open the trunk.
IMO, a vehicle should be a fairly simple tool to operate. All of the nuances with driving should be how you use those controls to get to where you're going. Even with the (frankly, impressive) self driving tech we currently have, I still don't think it's ready to replace a driver at the wheel; bluntly, that's the only tech I really want in a car.
Automatic options for fairly standard functions, such as turning on your headlights at night, shutting off the highbeams when there's oncoming vehicles, and even automatic windshield wipers, can make things easier. Which I appreciate. I can override all of these systems, which is good. The advent of climate controls rather than "how hot" and "how cold" you want your blower to be and at what speed, is also nice. Even driving assist, like automatic lane keeping and adaptive cruise control is a nice-to-have. But these are all augmentations of systems and they're pretty transparent to the driver. If you don't want to use them, you can easily ignore or override the systems and do it yourself.
What I don't appreciate is all the infotainment garbage. I can literally play games on the touch screen of my partners 2019 accord. I tried it out and bluntly, it's not comfortable, it only works when the car isn't moving, and I'm not going to sit in my car to play games. That's dumb. I kind of get it for EVs for when they're charging, but honestly, I can have a better experience on my phone/tablet.
I don't need weather, I don't need a touch screen, and I don't need whatever garbage GPS system you were paid to sell with the car.
Give me Android auto/some carplay, with maybe FM as a backup in case of emergency, and I'm good. My phone already has data, my car doesn't need LTE. Give me buttons to press for all climate and driving functions and I'm a happy person.
I don't want to navigate some menu to try to turn on my defogger. Fuck off.
Driving tech should be transparent to anyone who doesn't give a shit, and just wants to drive down the road.
Actually that's one arena of technology that should have taken a different course. Auto manufacturers should have an upgradable modem module that you can swap out with the latest "G" (as the modules are already self-contained) and the car should have antennae that cover as wide swath of the RF spectrum as possible. Cars are Faraday Cages. Cellular reception on a tiny little rectangle phone in your center console won't ever be as good as a dedicated modem and antenna. Also, the car's dedicated modem can transmit at higher power levels (up to 3 watts, vs a couple hundred milliwatts) so you'll get cellular reception in places your phone will just say no service. It also moves the higher-powered RF outside the car with the Faraday Cage shielding the human, for those that are concerned about such things. (Also, also, phones have to limit their total RF output to the sum of the current transmission rate of the radios, so when you're doing Bluetooth + cellular, the cellular modem won't be allowed to transmit at its maximum power level, further reducing range.)
Bonus points, there has literally been a Bluetooth SIM profile in existence for decades, although very few car modem have ever been designed to support it. This means, if this was implemented as standard, when the phone pairs with the car, the car inherits the cellular account of the phone while the car is turned on. So you're not paying for two cell bills, you get better reception, same phone number, better data speeds, better voice calling, etc. The phone also has supremely better battery life because it doesn't have to be constantly screaming at cell towers.
Of course, automakers and cell carriers would never implement these things that already exist because they'd eat into their precious profit margins.
Personally, I don't want my car to have any connectivity options because car makers have already proven they are just going to abuse it to sell your data.
At most, they're very bad Faraday cages.
The vast majority of LTE bands are below 2600mhz, around 10 cm wavelength, which usually doesn't have any issue penetrating glass, and suffers very little degradation from the metal in the body of the car.
Aluminum materials, which are not uncommon for body panels, and other automotive components due to its light weight and relatively low cost, is non-ferrous and won't impact signal strength any more than glass will....
The Iron/steel in the vehicle, usually in the frame/engine, are the primary issues with regards to signal blocking. That's what microwaves make their Faraday cage from for good reason.
Many wireless providers also have sub 1ghz channels which are harder to block, they're generally slower for bandwidth, but that's another matter entirely.
Most of the dashboard is made of plastics and other non-ferrous materials, but it's littered with devices, supports, and wires that can impact signal integrity. These are usually fairly sparce and don't generate a lot of interference. Since the dashboard is directly adjacent to the windshield and driver/passenger windows, signal is more or less unimpeded in the desirable directions (horizontal, mainly). Unless you're putting your phone on the floor of your vehicle, you're generally okay for signal, as it passes through the majority of the dashboard, around components in the dashboard, and through the glass relatively unimpeded.
The exception to this is that some manufacturers seem to think it's a good idea to put materials in their safety glass that impede RF. God knows why. It might be a biproduct of a coating that is there for a different reason, but it's not great. That's when you need a fairly simple LTE repeater.
Which brings me to my point. You can forego the complex and unsupported LTE SIM over Bluetooth stuff by simply putting a relatively low power LTE repeater from a good signal location, such as the roof of the vehicle, to a bad signal location, such as the middle of the cabin it can literally be built into the overhead cabin light. Resolving the issues you've stated, without providing any data access to the vehicle itself. Such an add-on would be a small increase in cost, as such units can retail anywhere from a few hundred to thousands of dollars, but as that cost would replace the built in modem most people never wanted to begin with, the addition may actually make the whole car cheaper... With little more than Apple carplay/Android auto, to replace all the functionality they'll lose by removing the cars data connection.
It's a very silly and pointless argument overall, because vehicle manufacturers will not be removing the LTE modems from their vehicles, since that allows them to remotely gather your data, which they can sell. That increases profits and that's what they care about. So they're never going to listen to us regardless... As long as someone is buying their wiretap vehicles and basically handing them free money in the form of your personal data, they're going to keep doing it.
Car companies don't care, they think the tech gives them an excuse to charge more even though a lot of the tech is actually cheaper (a single touch screen instead of all kinds of knobs and buttons) plus it's a way for them to collect more of your data to sell. Before buying my next vehicle, I want to make sure I can easily disable its internet functionality through hardware so that it doesn't phone home.
They can charge SUBSCRIPTIONS this way too
Data privacy is a concern of mine.
Car makers see technology as a data mining opportunity to force us to use their shitty infotainment systems to track our every move and interest, and then milk us with subscriptions.
I don't like tech in cars either.. I like EVs bit the thought of dealing with that center screen for everything is just lame. Another thing that sucks are the fobs.. Who asked for those? If I want to go swimming I now have to take apart a little plastic thing and stick it in my car
I really don't like those either. I guess it's okay to give people the option, I know that it's handy to unlock the car from a distance if you're loading kids or pets in the car. But give me a simple key/transponder if I just want to have a key on a keychain.
Also, I keep seeing more reports about those wireless unlock and remote start fobs being relatively easy to spoof, and the whole system seems comically insecure and fragile.
I can’t believe how much more money such a faulty feature costs too.
Most cars won't lock with the key fob inside them, and no one in the driver seat. So you might be leaving your car unlocked. That being said, the fobs are gasketed and water resistant, they should be able to handle a swim, no problem, but if you're concerned, a ziploc baggie should do the trick.
I'd say the benefit of the fob outweighs the "cost". Take it from someone who has had access to all 3 generations of entry tech (key, fob, keyless) at the same time, you'll really miss it when you don't have it.
It's not about the drivers, it's about cheaper costs and normalizing subscription services for your vehicle.
It's a nice, standardised way with which to lock you out of features and force you to engage with their out-of-vehicle services.
I drive an EV for work, any my biggest gripe is the touchscreen. What is wrong with buttons. Why must everything be hidden behind a menu I have to navigate on a touchscreen. It feels less safe, frankly. In my own car I have muscle memory for each button and can do things like skip songs or adjust the AC without looking away from the road... But in the EV I can't.
Why? Because it's a looot cheaper to produce.
Mhmm. Fewer moving pieces, fewer under warranty repairs. Also simplifies production, just need to screw in a screen.
And you only need to produce one screen and just re-skin the UI for your other product lines
And charge people for over the air software unlocking of features that are already part of the car but they "didn't pay for" when they bought it.
I wish they'd do exactly what they're doing now, but add a series of generic physical buttons along the bottom that can be remapped as quick buttons that either the OEM or end user can map to specific features.
E.g. A/C controls, skipping songs, opening apps or whatever.
My car does it pretty well. It's got a touch screen, but it also has a knob and two buttons that I can use instead of the touch screen.
Also there's no need to design a new user experience for each model of car - things like designing buttons and a button layout that fits in with the overall interior design of the car. Just use a touchscreen and reskin the same UI.
What does being an EV have to do with anything? ICE cars are exactly the same.
I totally agree with you though. Tech and UI in modern cars is pretty awful.
I would say eve typically do have more controls on touchscreens vs buttons. Now this issue is mainly observed in Teslas more than any other car, but Teslas are the most popular ev so ya it's definitely more of a problem on evs.
Summary: Computerized touch screens and 'smart' features with poorly thought-out UI and UX are a solution in search of a problem.
Start with what directly benefits the user and driving experience.
Go from there.
I know it's not what you meant, but it's what I immediately thought of.
Why can't some manufacturers just have a phone cradle instead with the backup camera on a screen in the rear view mirror? I hate waiting for my car to boot up just to put on some music.
While it would be nice to have a screen for music and nav, I absolutely hate any car where you NEED to use the screen to do things. It feels like distracted driving is designed into cars these days…
This is why I chose a Mazda. Buttons for everything. I didn't even realize I had a touchscreen until cleaning the interior one day with the radio going.
My Ford clearly has a touchscreen, and it’s nice, but I’ve also got buttons for everything I need while driving. That’s the way it should be.
subway surfers at a traffic jam
I wish my stereo system in my RX 450h were easily swappable. i haven't had a swappable stereo in a car since my 2005 suzuki wagon
I have one in my 2017 Mitsubishi mirage! Its a manual too! I love it, looks like its from the 90s.
I'd genuinely buy one of those, but they're just too expensive still. I'll just buy a car from the 90s for a fraction of the price.
I want fucking buttons!
Physical buttons are simply better.
I wonder if engineers protested getting rid of the buttons. Who's responsible for that terrible design trend?
I like the tech in my car, it has knobs and buttons. But then again it is from '91.
I drove a 2020 pickup while taking turns on a family trip. I jumped on the chance to get a 87 Chevy C10. Nothing I want, that I can't get with a cellphone mount. The 2020 truck feels like I'm driving a lifeguard's chair around.
Yeah huge trucks can just fuck off
I was helping my mom shop for a new car, and we discovered she needed the requirement of "physical AC controls".
Everything is all on the touch screen.
Visited my parents while they were in Florida recently. Drove their rental car to the store, it was a newer model with "Lane Assist Technology." It was terrible. Tried to swerve around a pothole, and the steering wheel vibrated and steered me back into it. Same thing happened as I angled the car to enter a roundabout, the damn thing just steered against me! It felt like at any time the car might just "decide" to swerve me into oncoming traffic! I'll never buy a car with that trash masquerading as tech. Absolute garbage feature.
I got a loaner last time I had my car worked on at the dealership and had the same experience. Also the option to turn it off was buried in the touch screen menu and didn't stay turned off next time you drove. When I brought it back the dude was like "So, thinking about trading up?" Fuck no, I hate this thing. I'm keeping my old Civic until the wheels fall off.
I have to back into a parking spot in a shitty, shared driveway. If I don't throw my (automatic transmission) car into neutral and coast into place, my car will decide I'm too close to the curb and just slam the fuck out of the brakes while still several feet away from where I intend to be. It sounds awful and it scared the absolute shit out of me several times before I internalized the workaround.
Good thing I'm not a fan of the backup camera in general, or this problem would be even more irritating, since the camera turns off when I go from reverse to neutral.
My parents' cars (which I drive often) both have backup cameras but my own car doesn't. I often find myself backing up in my own car while staring down at my screen-less dashboard instead of looking behind me or in the rearview mirror.
Should have a setting to disable that.
Sounds like you used it on poorly marked surface roads.
Most lane systems do pretty well on well marked highways. Very useful for doing long drives.
It was actually a well marked/maintained road, the pothole I refer to was more like a sewer manhole with a deep depression. Didn't drive it on the highway, but my mother did, and said she was equally alarmed by how often the steering would "right itself" when she was trying to merge or change lanes.
First thing I turned off in my new car when I got it. I hate the feeling that the car is no longer responding to my inputs.
The only features I really want is ABS, Bluetooth and a physical interface. Everything else I would rather not pay for.
I live in Sweden so it's not like I need AC, I don't use cruise etc. and most other modern features mainly serve to annoy me.
Wireless CarPlay.
I guess it depends on how far North you live. I'm a Swede too, and cars in summer with no A/C would be unbearable.
Malmö :)
ABS has been an EU legal requirement for at least ten years. It's not generally marketed as a feature unless it's part of a safety-stability system e.g. ESP and collision mitigation.
If these control systems are implemented skillfully you won't know they are present on the vehicle. People think they understand how a car works right up to the point they have to make one and then go back to talking about bicycles.
I mention it mostly because my car doesn't have it.
If the DEFOG was 2 touchscreen menus deep how would you feel?
ITT: lemmy designing a car, like Homer Simpson.
Meh. Big screens don't make cars better. It's still a car, and basic functionality is more important than a big screen that lags or hides functions.
And a separate dome for the kids!
There's this thing called a smartphone. You might have heard of it.
2014 impreza. No screen at all. I bought a phone mount that shows waze and charges my phone.
I have cruise control and heated seats. And I can operate both with gloves on!
Don’t need a backup cam because my windows and mirrors are good.
I will drive this car until it dies, and then I’ll replace the head gaskets and drive it until it dies again. And then I will replace the cvt and drive it until it dies a third time.
Unfortunately there’s nothing you can do about the NY road salt. The frame will be left, flake by flake, in the gutters of 490. It’s the only thing that can take this car from me, and it is its inevitable fate.
That right there is one of the biggest reasons I hate this trend towards touch-screen interfaces in cars.
You know your maintenance schedule well!
Power windows, Bluetooth audio systems, seat warmers.
These are all really positive tech advancements in my lifetime.
Touch screen interfaces, power door handles (without a manual override), firmware disables features or limitations that are determined by the DLC you purchase from your dealership...
These are fucking bullshit and almost no one I know likes them.
It is insane how anti-consumer cars have gotten.
I'm fairly certain that's illegal. In the US at least.
There have been stories that sound like it's a thing. But those have always been people not knowing where the mechanical release is located.
Points at Tesla
They appear not to be even though it's extremely irrational. I might clarify that I think a single mechanism should be the door release and Teslas specifically bury their manual overrides within the body of the door itself in an area that most users are unaware of.
The rear ones are, the front aren't.
Not that this excuses the rear ones, but the front ones are so natural and obvious that if you don't tell someone new to Tesla that it's the manual, they'll use it.
I have no idea why they didn't just do the rear ones like the front.
Yup.
I refuse to buy any vehicle made after 2015, and even that's quite a bit newer than I'd like.
I wouldn't mind having tech in my car, but I have a zero-tolerance policy for proprietary spyware-infested shit. Therefore, I can't buy any vehicle made after 2015.
I'd like to have a double-DIN car computer with a Raspberry Pi, RTL-SDR (for the radio) and OBD2 connection, but haven't gotten around to making one yet.
I have a 2016, and its perfect in tech. A small non-touch screen to display basic media information and backup cam, and a small screen in the cluster to display car information. Now if only the Bluetooth module wouldnt freeze up every 3 months forcing a hard power reboot...
That's because they're putting dumb shit in. We have the technology for example to -
Have high beams shine around other cars. (Regulators actually fucked this up)
Put all the speed and other needed information on the windshield.
Put a thermal image on the windshield so you can see the road as if it were daylight.
Use "fly by wire" controls instead of the same control scheme as a Model T.
And quite a bit more. But no instead we have the world's worst mix of UI/UX and software in an attempt to save money and sell data.
Fly by wire would be a terrible design for a car, I've seen people driving on space saver tires or with taped up windows for months. If people already just ignore warning lights until something physically stops them from driving then at least having a physical steering column means there's still control after the power steering fails so that they don't go straight on into oncoming traffic.
On your other point about still using the same control systems as a model T, modern cars don't. Hydraulic steering came around in the 50s and almost all modern cars have electric power steering, the model T had completely unassisted rack and pinion steering. I can't find any definite answer on what the last car without any hydraulic steering was but I'd definitely like to find out if anyone knows.
You got me curious and found this article from 2019, it looks like the Alfa Romeo 4C didn't have power steering. It was discontinued in 2020.
https://driving.ca/features/feature-story/these-six-cars-were-the-last-without-these-now-essential-modern-features#:~:text=A%20car%20without%20power%20steering%20is%20a,their%20steering%20inputs%20perfectly%20into%20vehicle%20movement
Yeah FBW is cool for like big super complex systems that are maintained and inspected rigorously.
Not small sporadically maintained, almost never inspected vehicles with two pedals and a two dimensional control wheel.
I've driven a car that used a projected HUD like that before and hated every second. It is horribly distracting and unnecessary. The traditional dash is just better and has remained unchanged for so long for good reasons.
Okay. And I've driven stuff with projected HUD and loved not having to look away from the road. The best part about tech like that is you can turn it off. It takes literal pennies to implement.
... while pedestrians and cyclists get blinded.
I bought a $10 Bluetooth adapter that plugs into the cigarette lighter hole and then an aux cord in our 2010 vehicle. It works significantly more reliably than our other, 2020 vehicle with built-in Bluetooth, touchscreen and all the bells-and-whistles. Seriously, I turn my 2010 car on, "successful connection" every time within seconds. The 2020, I inevitably get failed connections. I don't think my phone has connected to it first try, once. And then sometimes it fails to connect either the audio or the phone calls. Or, I get it connected and my wife gets to the car with her phone and suddenly my Bluetooth connection is gone and we're listening to her phone. It's just infuriating.
I've got a 2012 Mazda 3. The radio was dumb, so I replaced the radio with a Pioneer one that supports Android Auto. Works perfectly.
I had the same setup going on for a few years myself. The dongle recently bit the dust and I've been too lazy to replace it but my car's bt connection is nowhere near as reliable as that $17 dinky device from amazon. Like 50% of the time my car will throw an error claiming my phone isn't capable of Bluetooth audio while playing a song from it
(but really really I just want a headphone jack on my phone again)
A million times yes. I LOATHE having to update my earbuds' firmware when I'm at the gym and I just want to start exercising already.
What adapter is that? I can only find the stupid fm adaptors
This one: https://www.coupang.com/vp/products/2287174737?itemId=3931382414&vendorItemId=71915861738&q=brisa+bluetooth&itemsCount=49&searchId=591d787f3d8642978b2e7eeab0727fb7&rank=3&isAddedCart=
I have a cigarette lighter-USB adapter already plugged in.
I love the adaptive cruise control of my ID3. It will not only keep the distance to other vehicles but speed up and slow down automatically based on speed limits and road features like roundabouts or turns not only by what it can see but also knows based on data from HERE.
It’s not always correct unfortunately and not usable in urban areas (should not even be allowed there in my opinion) but on highways it’s great.
But I hate the touch buttons in this car.
I think following speed limits automatically is a now mandatory feature imposed by the European Union.
Yes that rule came a year after my car was released but it does not require cars to automatically adjust the speed, it must only warn the driver.
I recently drove a Jeep Avenger (2023) and it had ACC and speed limit sign detection but it did not adjust the speed based on that.
Car tech peaked in 2018. Everything since then has been a down grade in my opinion
I agree, I bought my car in 2018 and its got a small screen and carplay / android auto. No OTA updated, no capacitive buttons, i don’t have to dig through touchscreen menus to change settings. I want to go electric soon, but everything i have driven is obnoxious with what you have to deal with in the cabin.
Very similar for me. I wish I had carplay, but otherwise my car does everything I want it to do without any fuss. I don't need a wrap around screen on the dashboard because I'm looking at the road.
My 2017 Toyota is loaded with touchscreen crap so I guess YMMV
It will get worse.
I love my car for the fact it doesn’t do anything crazy. Buttons and switches for everything, bluetooth for music, and a minimalist infotainment system that may as well only be there for the phone pairing process.
I might be in the minority, but I hate Apple CarPlay/Android Auto. I don’t want anything fancy, just music. I don’t want all the bells and whistles of my phone, just music.
Ditto. I feel like I'm the only one who still listens to the radio in my car. The only thing I want my car to have that it doesn't is cruise control. Otherwise, she's perfect.
Some is great and much appreciated. For instance I love the things that takes the camera feeds and creates a simulated top down view. But some things are just useless and needless.
what is the purpose of that view, though? why does driving need a bird's eye?
Not for regular driving, it's great for tight parking and backing.
It kicks on when you're parking, so you can see your car in a top-down view with all the lines and obstacles. When I drive our other car that doesn't have it, it's the thing I miss the most.
I really wish that wasn't under patent :(
Every car should have that if they got the cameras, but it's lame you gotta pay someone else if you want to stitch the photos together
All I want is tactile controls. I wanna feel when I hit the aircon control and know it's distinct from the volume control. And I wanna feel each increment of all knobs. That way, I do it by feel instead of having to look at the control panel.
Yeah tactile buttons and if you are like the mini and go beyond... Dip switches are the way
Spyware needs to go, asking with selling of driver's data.
A/C
ABS
radio
dashcam
Kill for aux support
Nah, android auto or apple car play please.
Why not both?
I still wonder why new cars aren't equipped with a dashcam by default. It's probably because of privacy reasons, but still... The world would be a better place if every car was equipped with a dash cam.
I dig the idea too but at the same time there are privacy concerns, more than half the population wouldn't know how to use 'em and I'm sure large groups of people would be pissed they're even there. And how long would it take to have regulations where they're wifi enabled and cops can subpoena dashcam info.
On the opposite side I genuinely believe you should get a break on your car insurance if you have a functioning dashcam.
Here in Denmark (maybe all EU, not sure) a dashcam has to be turned on manually. If it were to turn on automatically with the car, it'd be illegal. I'm guessing laws across the world could be stopping such a rollout.
All I want is a regular car with an electric engine. Why is that so hard?
Closest I've seen to that is BMW's offerings. It just felt like a BMW inside, which still means a crazy amount of tech of course, but it was very similar to BMW gasoline cars.
It's literally the reason we went with Polestar 2. It has a big screen, but all buttons on the steeringwheel are actual buttons. Same with audio controls, seat memory and mirror adjustments. And door handles! Screw pop-out handles in a country with proper winters! I've seen people piss on their Model 3 to get into it after freezing rain.
Only the AC is done on the screen, which is fine as it's "set and forget" for the most part.
It was the only EV at the time that still felt like a car.
This article strokes my confirmation bias!
I love my 2010 Toyota with 140k miles, and I hope it runs forever. I could afford a new car if I wanted one, but all of the options have been getting worse for years! It’s just a car, but it’s a car from the perfect era of technology to be stuck with forever, and it drives beautifully.
I wish it got better gas mileage by 2024’s standards, for both financial and environmental impacts, but I believe it’s net better on both fronts for me to keep driving it than to replace it early. Fortunately it doesn’t snow where I live, so road salt won’t inevitably rust out the undercarriage.
There’s an aux in for the factory stereo, and I have a $25 BLE audio adapter with a ground loop isolator so there’s no alternator whine despite it being powered by the car. It’s not the most quiet for speakerphone calls, but it’s perfectly functional, and I’ve easily replaced it multiple times. It’s so much better than having a bad native Bluetooth audio system from that era.
I have a really solid dashboard mount for my magnetic phone mount, comprised of pieces from three different companies for maximal awesomeness. Then there’s my USB C PD supply that meets the charging standards of the present day relatively inexpensively and upgradably to any brand, powered by the “cigarette lighter” power socket. The existence of this simple medium wattage automotive DC power port is the greatest legacy left to us by the tobacco smokers of yesteryear. Is it gone yet in the latest cars?
A really slick trick I learned somewhere (maybe on reddit during the good years) is to use tiny zip ties on a cable that must run across your dashboard, such as the one to my mag charger. Put them at very strategic locations on the cable and facing the right way, and snip off the zip tie ends while still leaving a tail maybe about 1/4”, then jam that tail in between two pieces of dashboard trim. Do that repeatedly and the cable will go neatly and orderly around all your buttons and knobs without ever getting in the way.
An aftermarket dashcam is one thing that felt very worthwhile but was actually a decent amount of work to install, since I pulled a bunch of trim and ran wires through the headliner for that clean look with a rear facing camera mounted on the outside of the back. But I think those aren’t quite yet standard other than in Teslas.
2010 was the pinnacle of car technology, change my mind!
I have a Toyota from around then, and yeah it's the best. The great thing about that era is the milage is decent, and also I think it's when abs and traction control became standard on all cars. So I have a manual transmission and aux cord, but it's not ancient, it's still very safe and efficient
All 4runners still reigning supreme with chonky ass thicc boi buttons and dials. Give me Android auto capabilities on a small screen, backup camera, and rear parking sensors. That's it.
My wife drives a 2023 loaded Kia Sportage. The thing is basically a smartphone on wheels. Giant dash screen with all the car controls buried in it, touch screen climate controls that double as touch screen audio/volume controls. If I want to change the AC temp I have to take my eyes off the road for a few seconds. Also a subscription service if you want to use any of the actual useful functions like remote start, remote climate control, remote door lock/unlock, sentry mode, etc. I hate where cars are at today.
I have a Kia Niro and have a similarish gripe about the switching ac/media controls, but the media controls are also on the wheel so it's not that bad if you leave it on the temp control mode mostly.
And only automakers are surprised by this. This last time I bought a car, i avoided all the new ones and just got a reliable one from 2013. Fuuuuck all the tattletale noises, fuck all the touch screen interface bullshit, and fuck their ridiculous asking prices.
I had a 2015 Maxima and I used to get mail from the dealership asking if I wanted to take the car into the shop to get an $150 map update. Fuck off with that bullshit.
OMG and the maps are ducking horrible in that vehicle.. When is have to drive one I'd just use the phone.
My car saved my ass from a road raging drunk, but android auto cannot skip songs from the steering wheel, quite a duality.
Android auto is great, but it's also a horrible cluster fuck because it's up to the automakers to integrate it into their system. Sort of just like Android phones from Samsung and other third-party companies.
The automakers usually fuck it up. It works fairly great on my 2015 Mazda 3 except for if I plug my phone in while the car is in reverse or some other odd times, the head unit just gets stuck on a black screen until I restart the car. Also, the touch screen doesn't work for Android auto which is a bummer.
One word: Stelantis.
Wut
Mine can do this, but it's a 2012 Mazda 3 with a custom radio (Pioneer AVH-2330NEX that I installed myself in 2018) and an adapter to make the steering wheel controls work.
Uconnect on stelantis vehicles is the worst software suite I've ever had the pleasure of connecting my phone to
Well that's ok, it was never for them.
/s
A backup camera and an Android Auto/Apple CarPlay head unit radio that sounds decent. That's all I want in a car for "tech" that isn't a safety feature. Everything else can go.
Yeah, when I drive other people's newer cars, the only thing I miss going back to my early 2000s model is the backup camera.
I've got a magnetic clip for my phone on the dash, and a 3rd party Bluetooth > FM converter and it makes for a perfect gps and audio solution.
Physical buttons please and thank you
I just found out that the Tesla 2024 Model 3 has a gear selector that's incorporated into the touchscreen.. I saw it (someone I know bought one) and I cannot understand.
I drove it, it's as bad as it sounds. They got rid of the stalks on the sides of the steering column too, the turn signals are buttons on the front of the steering wheel, which is even worse imo.
"You know what would be fun, fucking with 20 years of muscle memory tied to my ability to drive safely" -no one
-
no oneElonI heard you can buy aftermarket stalks now
"Oh... well we actually didn't FUCKING ASK YOU!"
-Automakers
i really need a car without this all shit. I just want to drive from point A to B. I don't need any navi, big LCD screen, AC, parking automatic, speed control and all the electronic shit that I have now in my car.
Honestly, I think our regulations have gone a little too far. Requiring backup cameras and automatic braking systems sounds like a good idea, but now we can't have a bare bones car.
Prices are up because there are so much additional shit they need to include. Personally, for a lot of my driving, all I want is a geo metro or similar shit box.
I mean, if I buy a two-seater convertible (if I can even find a new one) why does it need a backup camera? There isn't even a back window!
Stuff like Bluetooth, backup cams, and a screen to put your navigation directions on are handy. But I don't think my car needs a whole OS.
I'm planning on having a "headless head unit" built for my next car so I can basically live off AUX port wired to speakers throughout the car, I hate wireless that much.
I totally get it. I wish some of it was modular. My screen is too big 90% of the time. I love it for a clear view of the backup camera. It's nice for a clear view of the map if I'm out of town. Much better than trying to fumble with that on as phone like I did before.
But I don't have to do that often. It's not really in the way or anything but sometimes I just don't wanna see pixels. I can adjust it, but it's too much of a pain to mess with.
I don't have a car but if I rent one the only "advanced" feature I want is: Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC)
The good kinda that can come to a complete stop and start moving again without input too, not the kind that doesn't work under 25mph.
well obviously My aunt has a modern car that reads the signs for you. Where I live there is a highway in the middle and normal road on the outer side. That piece of crap slows down to 70 km/h from 130 when it sees the sign that belongs to the other road…
However, not all tech is terrible. For example, parking cameras, gps, cruise control are useful
Edit: I think the current toyota land cruiser 70 series sold in australia is at the sweet spor of technology
I daily a 1996 Jeep Cherokee. Manual transmission, manual windows, manual door locks. The basic radio was broken before I got it. It does have computer engine control with OBD2, but even that is simple in comparison.
When something breaks or maintenance is needed, it's a straightforward fix with typical tools. I've come to appreciate the simplicity.
I like having Siri in my car when she works. Like when my phone properly wirelessly connects. But when it doesn’t, I hate it, and would be better without it.
Also why the hell can’t CarPlay use the radio, when the car has a radio. Why can’t those two things talk to each other. Fucking dumb.
I drive an Audi Q7 and every time I turn my headlights on, I get warnings about how my "Side Marker Lights" are malfunctioning.
First, no, they're working fine.
Second, this seems to be super common on the Q7.
Third, the only "fix" is a $4,000 headlight assembly replacement.
Or, you know, connect an ODB-II device and disable the side marker lights.
What bothers me the most (aside from getting rid of all knobs and physical buttons...) is that I bought a car the better part of a decade ago with Android Auto. And it is awesome. It is everything I want in a car "entertainment" system and it makes it trivial to navigate and listen to music.
So... of course car companies are going out of their way to block that and apple auto. Because they want subscription fees.
I just got a new car. I get a text message. I click play on the main menu. It tells me I need a subscription to listen to text messages. I open up android auto, click play. It plays. WEIRD.
Ok the article mentioned ai climate control. Bitch that's not ai we have that in cars for decades
It turns out MOST products and services are built with shit we don't want but not a single damn corporation listens.
That's ummmmmm capitalism?
I think I got my car at the right time... it has Android Auto and a few automated features that I really appreciate, like auto headlights, pushbutton start, and adaptive cruise control. I can control some functions via an app on my phone, like remote unlock and remote start, which has come in very handy on several occasions. But it still has physical controls for all the commonly used and critical functions. It doesn't have a huge glass panel taking up most of the dashboard.
The one and only feature that really truly annoys me sometimes is the reverse automatic braking. It uses sensors on the back of the car, and if I have my hitch-mount bike rack in place it freaks out. I can disable it, but only until the next time I start the car, and every time I have to hold down a software button on the touch screen for 3 seconds. While I'm trying to back up. There should really be a physical toggle button for that.
My parents just got a new car with one of those tablets built into the console. They were showing it off to me and turned it on, only for the radio to be blaring and my dad had to go through like 5 menus to get to stop it from playing.
The only tech I want:
AC
Heated seats
Bluetooth/am/fm/aux sound system with good high and low ranges, but honestly as long as I have a diagram of what wires go where I can install my own like I did on my last two.
A backup camera for those times when I need to line up my trailer hitch but don't have a partner to guide me.
Beyond that?
Meh.
Honestly I never understood why people care much about the quality of their car audio system. If you're driving then you aren't paying much attention to the music anyways
Well, when you drive almost 100 miles to get to work, it's nice to have an hour and a half of good quality music instead of silence or low-fidelity tinny shit.
Also the passengers in my vehicle appreciate music since they don't have to focus on anything else.
Plus, you know... All the times I've been in my car without driving somewhere...
I actually like big screens on infotainment systems, especially the ones that integrate into the dash and not the ones where it looks like they just stuck a tablet on top of the dash. I have a Subaru and it has a nice vertical 11in screen. I also like the design of the new Hyundai and Kia screens that run across the dash.
Having said that, those screens should strictly be for that purpose, infotainment. Anything that controls essential functions should still be physical buttons, levers, and dials.
I was excited when Volvo announced they were going to release an affordable subcompact SUV EV, then saw they put almost everything on the infotainment screen in the middle of the dash, even the speedometer!
So what did they put there instead of the spedometer?
kagis
I guess this is the EX30. It looks like it doesn't have a driver's side display. Weird.
considers
I guess it saves some money, but yeah, that doesn't seem like a reasonable tradeoff. There are displays that I want to have readily-accessible all the time.
And, I mean, what does an LCD screen cost? $100 or something? It can't save all that much.
Yeah if you're going to do that then blew about a goddamn HUD. I bought my car to drive, not watch a DAMN TV
It's a nightmare and it's probably going to get worse now that they are ditching Apple Carplay and Android Auto. https://www.motortrend.com/news/general-motors-removing-apple-carplay-android-auto-for-safety-tim-babbitt/
I was surprised that I pretty quickly started to like the UX simplicity of Tesla. I thought I would've hated it, but they did a really good job there.
So fucking true. After 5 years in a model 3, anything else is just too cluttered and full of junk.
I will say though I wish there was a console selection wheel that you can spin or push or click to supplement the touch screen. It's too ridiculous to have to try to touch while driving for both the danger aspect and also the aggravation of the bumpy road making it difficult.
The climate controls are great and the selector wheels in the steering wheel are a master work. It's too bad Elon is a piece of shit and the car itself is not exactly the pinnacle of quality construction.
I have a feeling almost everyone has set that Push wheel set to windshield wipers. Solved my biggest touch screen gripe. None of the rest while driving really bother me as it's very infrequent that I need to adjust anything else while driving.
Setting climate to auto and I can mostly forget about it.
I need music control and that's about it. I sometimes like to set "minimal lane changes", but that's mostly for long haul and I can do it before I leave. My wipers are by and large well behaved.
Ah, I barely ever touch the music once it's going other than skip song on the wheel, and I otherwise use voice.
My auto wipers are bonkers though and are almost unusable so it was a HUGE quality of life improvement.
I would pay an extra 3k for "lack of touchscreen"
Depends on the tech. Touch screens? Those can go fuck themselves. Adaptive cruise control? I love that shit. Any backlighting beyond what's necessary to see knobs and buttons in otherwise total darkness? Fuck you! Any backlighting that's any color other than red? EXTRA fuck you! Backup cam? Yeah those are good. Backup cam screen that becomes some obnoxiously bright LCD display for the radio? No, fuck that.
Random side thought: a strict Eco mode only-when-pushed button would be pretty amazing. Eco mode kinda already forces your to drive like a grandma, but at the cost of responsiveness. Responsiveness is important if something catches you off guard, so if I slam on the gas suddenly, I want my car to fucking book it, cuz that probably means I'm trying to dodge something. That said, more often than not, when I'm accelerating from a stop or getting up to speed on the freeway, there's not really any urgency... but I tend to accelerate faster than necessary (waste gas) because my monkey brain likes the zoom-zoom. I want like... idk, the equivalent of a push-to-talk button on the steering wheel for embracing my inner grandma. I push it when I'm actively assessing that there's no urgency; my speed of acceleration will make only seconds of difference in my overall trip; and no matter how hard I pump that gas peddle, the uses only the most optimal amount of gas to get me up to and maintain speed. Then I take an exit into some busy downtown bullshit where there's shit coming at me from every direction, and I need to be able to jolt to dodge the giant metal projectile piloted by the monkey brain a few car lengths away from mine.
Basically keep the "Oh shit!" actions free of as many inputs as possible; demand a bit more from the thinky chunk of meat in my head shell only when everything else is relatively chill.
I would be against that, sure a button somewhere in a screen to turn eco mode on or off but not an on the fly thing.
The lack of physical buttons in new cars should be considered alarming from a safety POV.
I got a new car recently. The best feature it has is the adaptive cruise control. You can set cruise control and if the car in front of you is going just a bit slower than the cruise control, you will not creep up on it.
Most of the other shit is useless. It has that magic rearview mirror that is really a camera, but I dont like using it because it is easier to focus on a real mirror than a display. it also has the cameras that read the road signs, but they often pick up the wrong info anyway, especially in a construction zone.
At least it has real buttons for the HVAC. I sat in three other cars, and two of them didn't have HVAC buttons. I got right out. Car makers like the screens because they think they can eliminate buttons, but buttons are more effective.
I appreciate some of the tech. GPS, connecting phones to the infotainment, backup cameras. You know, the things that actually improve the car. Heck I'll even take push to start. But for the love of God don't put essential controls and climate control on a touchscreen. If I get hit with a pile of slush from a driver on the other side of the road and need to engage my windshield wipers immediately, a touch screen is a recipe for disaster. Also, bring back the PRNDL stick. I don't care if it's an automatic I need to know what gear I'm in immediately without needing to look away from the truck in front of me that's backing up at a stop light because he thought he could make it.
2002 Toyota Echo 4dr w/air & heat, quarter million miles, no clock and I have no intentions of ever purchasing another car ever.
I feel the same with my '02 Subaru Outback and I'm still under 200k!
I used to have one of those and loved it but 3 head gasket replacements was too many and it was time to move on. Good luck with yours!
How many miles were you at? I've only had to replace them once. Had the car for about 6 years now and got it for a flat $5k in great condition. The thing still runs as great as the day I got it. Although I did upgrade it with a new stereo but I keep the stock speakers, which are actually amazing and on par with anything modern imo. Though the stereo install was messy and botched because the person had no idea what they were doing (me). I need to do some small little cosmetic fixes on it though, but it's mostly small wear and tear stuff from use over the years.
I had a model year 2002 as well, and it went through head gaskets pretty reliably every 30-35k miles. The failure mode wasn’t catastrophic damage every time, but it wasn’t pretty. I think exhaust gases would start getting into the coolant especially when the engine got hot, so I’d be maybe going uphill and notice the temperature spiking. Then I could pull off to the side of the freeway and wait for 30 minutes, start out again and drive home slowly.
Subaru admitted a gasket design fault for something like model years 1998 through 2000, but claimed for a while that everything was fine in 2001 and 2002, jerking me around and generally being awful.
It’s too bad. It was my second car and I was excited for the reputation of reliability and capability of Subaru, but it left such a sour taste in my mouth that I’ll never buy one again.
That is going to break at some point.
I mean, I get the sentiment, but that is just not going to be a realistic long-term solution for "people are not happy with changes in newer vehicles".
Yeah and the sun is going to burn out at some point, too.
I recently had to drive my parents' new Volva XC40 and that thing is one of the most overengineered vehicles I've ever ridden in.
The lane assist is kinda great while driving because if you drift a little it helps keep you in your lane. But I found myself literal fighting against the wheel whenever I was genuinely changing lanes, on a lane-ending merge, but more importantly trying to not get sideswiped when a semi drifts into my lane.
Instead of traditional shifter, or even shift buttons like my '14 MKZ, this thing has a 3-position shifter knob to go between R-N-D, a separate long-press button to simply put it into park (and by long press, I genuinely have to verify on the dash it's is park because I almost jump a parking block more than once since I didn't press long/hard enough) and a separate little knob in the center console whose sole purpose is to turn the car on and off.
The electric child-lock is a nice little button mixed in with the window controls on the driver door arm rest...which both myself and my parents have accidentally engaged on a number of occasions by resting our arms on the arm rest.
Aside from that, even in my car I outright HATE the auto environmental controls where you have to set an internal temperature and when the temp reaches that it changes the air to maintain. So if it's a blazing GA summer, and i set the thermo at 69 (nice) once the internal temp reaches 69 it starts blasting not-cold air.
While the lane assist and adaptive cruise control can help a little on those long trips, I genuinely dislike them because I believe it actively encourages the driver to not pay attention to driving.
Hmm. Do they have a thumb button or something you can hold down to quickly and easily override it?
It can be turned off, but it defaults back to ON. I don't know if the default can be changed though.
When i got my last one i specifically asked for, and got, no electric or electronic "conveniences". Even the doubledin stereo got removed and a singledin unit put in its place for fewer distractions or trackers. Oldschool rules.
I don't mind tech, i hate bad tech
First thing I do to my next car, circumsize all the antennas at the root.
I don't mind most of the tech on my truck but I did go in and disconnect the LTE antenna so it can't phone home any more
Yeah, it's why I'm considering Mazda for my next vehicle. Granted, my 2010 Civic needs to get closer to "death" (about 100K more miles or so).
Physical controls were a primary reason I went with a 2023 Mazda 3. I didn't want a touch screen as the primary input device. The rotary dials for menus and volume have been great. I find the screen is just in a better position too; it doesn't need to be within reach so it just blends into the dash better and is at an easier angle to see.