Roku explores taking over HDMI feeds with ads
lowpass.cc
Roku is exploring ways to show consumers ads on its TVs even when they are not using its streaming platform: The company has been looking into injecting ads into the video feeds of third-party devices connected to its TVs, according to a recent patent filing.
This way, when an owner of a Roku TV takes a short break from playing a game on their Xbox, or streaming something on an Apple TV device connected to the TV set, Roku would use that break to show ads. Roku engineers have even explored ways to figure out what the consumer is doing with their TV-connected device in order to display relevant advertising.
Any company trying to use the HDMI-CEC protocol in such a subversive manner should lose their license to the HDMI standard IMO.
The HDMI forum is run by big companies so that is not happening, sorry
Death to HDMI. DisplayPort is the superior port.
I'm sure that a DisplayPort device in a chain can also inject video, but I have to admit that I would kind of like to not have two competing video standards, and my impression is that DisplayPort tends to lead HDMI technically, so...
DisplayPort: We have
HDMI: Oh yeah? Well, we have
Fuck HDMI.
Oh and HDMI prevents open source GPU drivers supporting HDMI 2.1 natively.
The bastards that control the hdmi standard: yeah!
Roku: 💰
Bastards: actually no
Collectivism: 💰💰 Fuck Roku.
It's not like they ever properly implemented it in the first place.
I’m mad that they did their broken implementation of sending control codes between devices that never works. I have to disable it on everything so that the correct input gets set.
And then they are killing the universal remote industry so there is nothing to replace it with.
You know HDMI is not some big secret they can use it without the license and ship from overseas like 90% of shit shipped from China.
For cheap gizmos I can see a chinese seller getting away with it (rebranding under another weird name like AWOYO or something, in a sea of identical devices under different brand names), but not a large business like Roku.
That only works if you're headquartered in China.
Not that the HDMI Fourm will stop them, anyway. More likely, the companies involved will want to license Roku's patent.
Imagine being the guy working on this and how much you hate yourself anytime somebody asks you what you are working on.
Even worse: Imagine being the guy working on this and being proud of yourself.
I think the former situation is worse for the person working on it.
Unfortunately, I bet these guys don't care. I used to work at a company you might have products from and I would constantly hear "Hey, we're a business" as an excuse to degrade the user experience. :(
I remember having an argument with my teacher in college about this. He asked us what we would do if we were asked to code something that could be used for things you personally don't agree with such as the government using tools to "help" but also remove peoples privacy. Or corporations being able to show you more ads. I told him i would refuse. And he said that it would be my job though and sometimes you have to do things you don't like. So i told him i would quit. And for some reason he could not really comprehend that and we got into an argument.
You were talking to a teacher who probably couldn't afford to pay rent if he ever quit his job.
To be fair, most people I know don’t have the financial flexibility to quit their job if they’re asked by their boss to do something objectionable
“Yeah, I know it’s shitty, but it pays the bills 🤷🏻♂️”
We had to listen this C-level guy give a speech how good the last couple of years have been. We've increased the price of services by 50% and the amount of useless upsell shit we push to people has gone up as well. While our wages are still the same and people are getting laid off constantly. But I need food and shit.
Some people also have no qualms in doing the dirty job. They get paid and they don't care.
I knew a guy who went to work for palantir. I asked "what if you end up working on like domestic spying or other sketchy stuff?'
He was like, shrug, iunno. Guy did not give a shit about anyone outside his immediate friend and family group.
The shittiest of enshitifications.
We need an anti-awards show for shit like this.
I like that. If there was a site that did like The Razzies for movies but for technology enshitification, I would definitely watch, and probably follow a blog if it was done well
Youre in luck!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXhmnQzZ7n8
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://www.piped.video/watch?v=NXhmnQzZ7n8
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
The plungies. Winners receive golden plungers
Plungers wrapped in cheap tinfoil, don’t want to give them anything they can melt down and sell
Roku has always been a shitty company that wants to monetize everything. People are finally waking up. How many of us have a Roku remote that advertises a useless or bankrupt streaming service?
I know I’m old, but I miss having numbers on my remote.
Now I have a “sling” and a “crackle” button. 🙁
Yeah, I do miss being able to quickly type a code to jump to a known broadcaster. Opening up a menu is slower than jumping direct to said thing.
The Roku buttons solves that a little bit, but there is only 4, you can’t change them, and they prioritize featuring whoever pays up.
"People are taking the piss out of you everyday. They butt into your life, take a cheap shot at you and then disappear. They leer at you from tall buildings and make you feel small. They make flippant comments from buses that imply you’re not sexy enough and that all the fun is happening somewhere else. They are on TV making your girlfriend feel inadequate. They have access to the most sophisticated technology the world has ever seen and they bully you with it. They are The Advertisers and they are laughing at you.
You, however, are forbidden to touch them. Trademarks, intellectual property rights and copyright law mean advertisers can say what they like wherever they like with total impunity.
Fuck that. Any advert in a public space that gives you no choice whether you see it or not is yours. It’s yours to take, re-arrange and re-use. You can do whatever you like with it. Asking for permission is like asking to keep a rock someone just threw at your head.
You owe the companies nothing. Less than nothing, you especially don’t owe them any courtesy. They owe you. They have re-arranged the world to put themselves in front of you. They never asked for your permission, don’t even start asking for theirs."
– Banksy
Is there an anti-ad community on Lemmy? Or another non-Lemmy place to work through blocking/avoiding this bullshit? I'm so fed up with the advertisement industry. I don't want ads on my devices. I don't want ads in my operating systems. I don't want ads in my content. I don't want ads in the sky. I don't want ads in the ocean. I don't want to be forced to see or hear ads while putting gas in my car.
I really can't emphasize how much I am willing to go through to rid my life completely of advertisements.
If the gas pumps have those unlabeled buttons around a screen, try pressing all of em. The pumps around here (nebraska) will mute the audio when you press one of the buttons, it just isn’t labeled. I’ve taken to writing “mute” on the magic-button with a sharpie whenever I pump my gas.
Wait, the thing about ads while fueling your car is real?
WTF?!
Yep. Just shell stations around here (so far at least)
They’re super loud and in my experience usually political, think local office smear ads and oil lobbyist propaganda.
Well yeah how else are they supposed to make money? /s
Yeah no it’s real and it’s bullshit. They also have ad signage, but that’s been around my whole life, it just keeps getting worse constantly. I remember boycotting the first company to have gas ads, now I don’t have a no ad choice
Years ago I was talking to some engineers at one of the main gas pump manufacturers. They were venting about their company’s partnership with Verifone. While they used to handle credit card reading themselves in the magnetic stripe days, the switch to chip credit cards and readers in the U.S. meant they were going to partner with an established card reader company and Verifone (at least at the time) was the largest and most established in the new chip technology. Verifone was dominating the partnership and making life difficult for the gas pump company, insisting on all sorts of changes to the devices that weren’t necessary for the gas pump but were going to let them do things like run ads at the gas pump. If the pump manufacturer didn’t go along with it, Verifone seemed to have a very credible threat that they were just going to leave and go to the other main gas pump manufacturer. The gas pump companies needed the card reader a lot more than the other way around.
So, these ads have been a long time coming, but it wasn’t the pump manufacturer that had the idea or wanted to do it.
One of my local gas stations had that to where it was so loud you can hear them in the car. A few weeks after they installed them, someone came by with a hand drill and drilled out all of the speakers. Not sure what happened to that hero but we need more people like them.
While I never condone audio speaker violence, I do want to cheer/salute the activism of the person who did the work.
I've tried pressing every button at every pump I've used in my area and this trick doesn't work. I want to epoxy the speakers and screen and glitter-bomb the entire thing.
I won't. But I want to.
Sometimes it’s multiple presses. Around here for example I find that at my local Shell station it’s the second button down on the right side, two or three times.
At the 76 here its also the second down from the right but only needs a single press.
If there's an exposed speaker hole, a long enough push pin or coat hangar wire can probably ruin the cone and coil.
Definitely had to resist the urge myself a few times to jam my keys into the speaker when the mute button method didn’t work.
Right side, second button down?
I don't know if they're on the fediverse yet but Adbusters has been doing great work in this space for a long time.
Dammmn that takes me back! I had a subscription to their magazine in high school in the early 2000s. HOLY CRAP they're still selling the Corporate America flag too! Seeing all those tech company logos on the modern version makes me feel so old though... Shit.
It’s not specifically anti-ad, but the lemmy privacy community regularly discusses ad-blocking as it very much overlaps with privacy.
Look into adgaurd or set up pihole software for dns and have a network device dedicated to blocking ads
Roku uses hardcoded Google DNS, so you’ll need to make some additional changes on your router to direct their 8.8.x.x addresses to your DNS service. Instructions at the below site are for Unlocator, but I think should work with any custom DNS.
https://support.unlocator.com/article/131-how-to-bypass-forced-dns-on-roku
I already have Pi-hole with a bunch of additional lists to be blocked. I also cancelled all streaming services that service ads, and I use Adblock. I still see ads occasionally. What do you suggest for dedicated ad-blocking hardware?
Also, I don't know what to do about the environmental ads.
Make sure you’ve got rules set in your router to redirect Roku’s hardcoded DNS to your custom DNS service.
Some ads can’t be eliminated - for example, if a service delivers ads through the same content servers that the show/movie is coming from.
But would you like them on a train? Would you like them on a plane?
Ugh. Both of these exist already:
https://www.adquick.com/media/transit/train
https://simpleflying.com/inflight-advertising/
Sigh. They also have them in the rain:
https://www.streetadvertisingservices.com/discipline/rain-advertising
Jesus christ no. They're bombarding adds on sidewalks AND putting some extra PFAS shit in the environment? Is this even legal?
I do not like green eggs and spam.
👏🎉
I can't understand why anyone's money entitles them to put their mental parasites into my attention space. They aren't paying me, and I wouldn't take their money no matter how much they were offering. For fuck's sake, I don't even want to experience the offer of money for ad attention.
Rate those places online to warn others. fucking hailCorporate nonsense
Man... My personal list of banned companies not to buy from is getting scary long.
At this point just start using a white list.
I have a whitelist, not a blacklist.
Wow somehow their idea is even worse than I imagined, glad I don't own a Roku now.
Yeah way to fuck 80% of the purpose of pausing. This is basically malware.
Do not look away from screen while ad is playing, or playback will be paused for 5 minutes for first offense.
Yeah, I thought it was no different than what already happens on my fire cube. The screensaver with ads mixed in.
This is a much bigger invasion of privacy
How the fuck can an economy that's almost nothing but advertisements sustain itself for any period of time? It feels like forcing more and more ads is the only thing anybody does for money anymore.
Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
It’s got electrolytes!
Big economy, long time to fall. See example: rome or whatever.
They're not even going to profit so much off the ads as they will having a new way to distribute them. Even then its, "line go up this quarter", not "what if sales go down due to this?". They'll license it out to every offer company who needs it for line go up.
Wait until someone invents a bot/AI script that watches ads for you. Then the whole "ads everywhere" will either implode or it'll trigger a war between AI ad makers and AI ad watchers
Either way, it'll be entertaining.
I don't think AI does what you think it does
Interested in a 4 hour Adam Curtis documentary?
Don't buy Roku TVs. Got it.
Used to recommend Roku to others. I will never buy anything from them or recommend them to anyone again.
Someday maybe boards will figure out that "business" people have no idea what they are doing.
Boards only understand "line go up" or "line go down." If something turns off a few weirdos like us but it lets them sell access to millions of eyeballs they'll do it.
They'd step over their own dying mother to make a buck.
I mean, if she's already dying, what's the issue here? I'm losing money if I have to stop and call 911, when she has a perfectly good phone to do it herself.
History is littered with companies that decided they should "milk" their customers instead of providing new and innovative products. They usually don't last all that long, but you're right that the current board members might not gaf about any kind of longer term existence.
That may have been true in the past, but we're in a corporate fuedal system now, with a bunch of little fiefdoms we can't escape ruled by people who wish they had the rizz of Henry VIII or Louis XVI
I’ve always found their monetization strategy icky. Their remotes, with streaming service ads on them, always made me feel gross. Especially since those services change every couple years, and you get stuck with remotes plugging stupid services like Blockbuster and Redbox.
They know what they're doing! Maximizing share price for the next quarter while they jump ship... It's legitimately disgusting.
To be fair, this is just a patent, not Roku saying they will do this. But if they do, then absolutely.
I don't want my money used for shit like this so Roku and I are done regardless.of if they exercise this patent or not.
Late Stage Capitalism: Using a microscopic laser, we are able to burn our advertiser logos directly into our customer's retinas, so they will see them even as they sleep.
Shareholders: 👏 👏 👏
If Roku actually does this I would definitely never use them again. Completely asinine behavior. Especially because most people aren't even using stand alone boxes with their smart TVs.
I would get rid of my old Roku that I'm sure is too old for this tech and urge everyone I know to never buy anything Roku, and if they did, I would lambast them every opportunity I could.
I will never buy a Roku device because of that forced arbitration stunt. We can add the fact that they are even considering this to the list of reasons.
Yeah, Roku must be on its last legs with the crap they're pulling. All of this says to me: don't buy Roku.
To be fair, a lot of companies are doing the forced arbitration nonsense. I just bailed on Vultr (VPS host) for doing the TOS update nonsense (undismissable pop-up, must accept to access account), and I've been looking for an alternative and every one I've checked has that forced arbitration nonsense in their TOS. Some let you opt out, but you need to send a letter or email to do so.
So instead of dealing with that, I'm actively looking for ways to avoid using any type of service with forced arbitration. I'm upgrading my NAS to support hosting my things, I'm trying to find VPNs that offer a fixed public address so I can expose services behind my NAT, etc. It's incredibly frustrating because it's literally everywhere now...
Imagine a world where talented engineers would put their minds to work for solving big problems instead of ... I'm not sure wtf this is.
Increasing profit margins....which is the thing our society puts above all else.
Is it really "society" doing this? Or just the deliciously looking, juicy, meaty, 1%?
The 1% - but unfortunately this includes our leaders and lawmakers; so that puts power in the hands of those who value money above all else. And that power is used to extract more money and power from everyone else. Advertising always reinforces their message of course.
It seems like so long that Roku was not a horrible company. Simple little box for a good price with a small static ad on the home screen to make money.
Seems like a lifetime ago.
I mean, there was always this bullshit.
And those have taken over all the damn tv remotes. I designed and 3D printed a replacement faceplate for my Samsung tv's remote that hides them, out of retaliation (they were in a spot where I accidentally hit the netflix button when trying to pause what I was watching, which was annoying af).
How and why is there a Blockbuster button lol
Because blockbuster paid for it.
it's on the chromecast remote as well now. Is there an open source chromecast alternative?
https://github.com/vincelwt/RaspberryCast
My parent’s 10 year old Sharp TV has a Netflix button on the remote. That’s how long this has been going on.
Guess I'll never buy a Roku TV then: Get all the way fucked!
Is this why they made people waive their right to sue them?
Yeah... Fuck Roku.
No, no. The waiver was because they lost millions of people personal data to hackers and scammers. Entirely different fuckup.
"Wow, this Roku TV is so cheap!"
Your selling your privacy and basically leasing the disposable tv.
This makes me make goddamm sure 1 don't buy a smart tv. Two definitely a Roku one.
Good luck finding an affordable "dumb" TV. They're just computer monitors and they cost a hell of a lot more at TV size than most people are able to spend. The smart TVs are so cheap because they are subsidized by the shit vendors paying the manufacturer to load their malware in front of your eyes.
Then I will not buy one I will spend whatever it is to continue using a dumb tv.
Roku is a pioneer in most of this crap but don't be fooled to think that only cheap stuff is gonna have these and that somehow you are safe if you spend a lot on your TV. as it turns out high end and average TV producers would also like to squeeze the tiniest profit margins out of their consumers and if they could get away with it they would do the same.
in fact nowadays most TVs regardless of price are actually collecting and selling your data and in the best case it's an opt out option in the worst possible place in the menu.
I wish a pox on these capitalist pigs.
Every day I get a step closer to dropping all this trash, going back to piracy.
Just do it.
Slowly but surely, we dropped Amazon, Netflix, and a few other services so far. My goal once I have free time is to setup a plex server so my parents can partake aswell.
Probably the only thing that won't get cancelled is YouTube as it provides to many benfits even as the cost goes up when split across 3 households
I would recommend Jellyfin instead of Plex, it does basically the same thing but it’s open source and way less bloated
I'm surprised that of all the services you would pay for YouTube, as I've never considered it. What advantages does a paid subscription have over uBlock/Sponsorblock?
yarr harr fiddle dee dee, do what you want 'cause a pirate is free!
Sorry, I love that song. What are we talking about?
This sounds like it could display ads over your pirated content.
Only if you're the kind of absolute dolt to let your television connect to the internet
I am not looking forward to the point where more hardware manufacturers start taking the route that automobile manufacturers are currently taking and start building cell radios into the thing.
I can't wait for the new brand of unboxing videos which entail opening up the device and removing the modem.
the source matters....If you were to be a bad person and wait for the blu ray rips it wouldn't have any ads in it.
Not that I would ever pirate anything...that would be immoral to steal from a giant corporation who's executives each made millions of dollars while my previous comment has been posted
The TV itself is overlaying ads onto content supplied via HDMI. This includes BluRay players and Nvidia Shields.
I don't think there was anything mentioning content detection of BluRays to stop playing the ads
This is gross. I cut my cable because of ads. Have about 3 types of adblockers on my computer to stop them. This hyper marketing is why so many have turned away from traditional entertainment to begin with.
I am more than the ability to spend money and it’s goddamn time everyone say this and boycott companies that do shady garbage like this
I have ubo, what are your other kinds of ad blocking? I always want to block as many ads as possible
I suspect they might be talking about a DNS based ad blocking solution. Like Pi-Hole or AdGaurd DNS.
They work by blocking DNS requests made by ads so the content can never be accessed. They're theoretically more powerful than browser extensions as they have the opportunity to block ads anywhere.
While we have one (Pi-hole) I can’t use it right now because some of my roommate’s work software won’t run with it and we haven’t had time to troubleshoot. So I have a bunch of extensions in my browser on my pc
You could configure the DNS only on devices that don't have issues with it rather than the network as a whole?
That, and you can also decide what (if anything) gets blocked on a per MAC/IP/FQDN basis, so you can explicitly allow ads for specific devices.
A TV is a device that shows you what you want. This is no TV.
that's a monitor.
Just because they patented it doesn't mean it will happen. Sony patented this evil idea.
We are not far from “please drink verification can”
error! user is attempting to steal lemmy premium™
If Sony patented this idea, does it mean nobody else can use it until it expires? Good guy Sony always looking out for us
I kind of feel like starting a non profit that solely creates patents for evil ideas with no intention of ever licensing them
Patent trollery, but white hat? I can get behind that
I think you can still pay to license patented technology for commercial use if the patent holder is willing. Just because they haven't used it yet doesn't mean they won't though!
If McDonald's needs a surefire way to make me not go to a McDonald's ever again, that's perfect.
MCDONALD'S!
Never connect your smart TV to the internet. Just don't do it. Get a third party device or ideally use an old PC with an appropriate HTPC Linux distro or something.
Wait, why? Is the TV spying on me any more than my phone, every app I use, my desktop OS, every website I visit, all of my smart home devices, my car, my bank, traffic cameras, and my bottom left molar?
Can't I just slap a PiHole on my home network and pretend I've done something about it?
TVs have a history of listening and collecting a lot more data than a smart device.
With a TV device like an android or Linux box, you can prevent that as well as ad-injection because you can install whatever you want on the device and it's not as locked down as a TV. You can even disable or physically remove recording devices if you'd like, and many smart boxes do not even come with them.
Also, a pihole does not guarantee you filtered out everything or prevented the TV from interfering with your experience.
A TV can also change its policy on the fly and suddenly start injecting ads. Many TVs do this to add additional income after your purchase.
If tv is talking home using ip directly, DNS blocking will not work. You have to ether disconnect tv from your network or give the tv a static ip and block all traffic to and from WAN (internet) from that device Update tv manually using USB stick.
Get a signage TV instead of a smart TV. Then you also don't have to deal with the slow ass UI.
This is how you get people to start rooting their TVs
I'd love that becoming a thing. TV OSs are always so shitty, I bet dedicated open source work would do wonders
so glad i never bought into roku
and i never fucking will
good riddance.
Great, so Smart TVs won't even function as basic displays anymore.
I swear I'm like going backwards with tech, I found an old ipod to use at the gym, I'm pirating shows, and I don't bother with blu tooth keyboards and mice for work.
Tech didn't get better or hassle free. Getting a haircut needs an "app" ffs.
What's wrong with the wireless keyboards and mice?
I can't explain it, a high tech wireless mouse glitches out on me in a year, and keyboard had phantom typos, I was just done with all of it I'm on a wired mouse and keyboard for 3 years and no problems
I also don't use wireless mouse or keyboard. For me, it's mostly about having confidence that it will work - and that if it doesn't work then there are fewer points of failure to think about.
For example, if my keyboard isn't responding... that could be because the computer has frozen and become unresponsive, or the keyboard is broken. That's about it. But with a wireless keyboard I have to consider that the keyboard itself might be working but the wifi is not. Perhaps the keyboard's radios are damaged or turned off; perhaps the battery is flat; perhaps the computer's radios are turned off, or the drivers have failed; or perhaps some device is interfering with the signal. ... I find that these thoughts just fill my head with crap that I don't want to think about or worry about. In particular, I'm sick of dealing with batteries. The cable doesn't bother me, so that's a better solution.
I remember one time I was using a wireless device, and it seemed to work fine except when I was sitting at a particular desk. I spent ages trying to work out what was going on before finally working out that my computer monitor was blocking the signal. Adjusting the position of the monitor, or the device, or the thing it was talking to fixed the problem. Changing the wavelength also fixed the problem. ... Wired just doesn't have any of those variables.
I'm done with Roku. I have one in every room, but they all need to go.
Oh please don't misunderstand my post. I'm in total agreement that this bullshit can't go unchallenged and that posting about it is necessary and good. It's just that, like public comment town halls, all the complaining in the world does not affect change.
Instead, I meant to imply that more needs to be done and in a way that people who have already paid can use to fight against them.
Like encouraging all Roku TV owners (and eventually all Smart TV owners) to contact their local, state and federal representatives to demand they enact consumer protection laws against post purchase forced software changes to functionality of the product (aside from security patches) or forced acceptance of 'terms of service' that essentially take away your right to your preferred method of recourse.
I mean, the idea that we buy something for the features and capabilities it gives us just to have it changed at the whim of a corporate moneymaking scheme is insane. Even moreso when policy changes mean you accept something you don't want to or lose what you paid for (i.e. Roku's forced arbitration acceptance that would otherwise brick the TV).
It's fine to vent frustrations but in the long run, jailbreaking and looking to buy something different doesn't resolve the root problem. Greed overcoming consumer protection in the name of shareholder interest (most of which are corporate C level douches).
Sorry if I wasn't clear with my opinion but my posts usually are already too long before they even start. lol
https://www.congress.gov/members/find-your-member
Roku, somehow becoming shittier than Twitter
Roku still gives me a lot more valuable content
Enshitification gold rush continues. It's like now there is a word for it, all these companies are exploring how they can do it.
For consumers, "enshitification" is a reminder of how things get worse. For companies, apparently it's a delightfully new lower bar to aspire to. This is some Darkest Timeline kinda BS
Guess we need to be careful what we give a name!
Let's start a patent troll company that exclusively deals in dark pattern bullshit. Then sue every company that implements any of our terrible patents for as much money as possible. Use the proceeds to
bribelobby congress to pass stronger consumer protection laws.I wish I could find a TV for sale that isn't a Smart TV. It's not necessary and you get issues like this down the road. I'm sure it isn't too long until the other TV manufactures do the same thing.
Commercial displays are dumb TVs.
My Sony is smart but doesn't care that it doesn't have Internet connection and hasn't tried any funny business with open networks.
You know what people tend to forget?
Shareholders = Consumers of the product too
Marketing departments that come up with these assinine ideas are staffed with consumers of the product too.
As long as enough people are making bank from this stupidity, it will not stop.
The only right answer is not to give them your money. Hard to do that when they all do it and after purchase protests are kind of pointless since they already got paid. So, how to actually impact their bottom line? That's the only language they listen to.
How's that strategy working out for you? For us?
Unfortunately "don't give them money" doesn't work. Bc commerce is global due to internet. There will always be uninformed buyers in every product space. And always buyers who don't care.
My solution, posts like this. We should be informing others of these practices and discussing ways to bypass, repair, or disable blocks and unintended behavior on the products and services we purchase.
I don't get it.... Wouldn't it be easier for Roku to just declare bankruptcy and saves themselves the trouble?
From the article:
I was joking that such a move would put them so hard on the shit list that people wouldn't touch their products ever again
Yeah, I got that. What I wanted to express is that likely the opposite would happen. People just want cheap shit and don’t care about enshittification.
Hmmm not so sure I agree with that ... We take enshitification mostly when there is just no other option
For example, stewing services started great and now are poop, but what's the alternative? Back to cable? Never ... I for one, took to the high seas but none of my friends have the time or knowhow (or honestly just the will) to follow
I've never given money to roku, and now I'll never will
I've given them money and now I want it back.
Luckily I'm not involved in this smart-TV saga in any way, as I haven't been watching TV since my childhood (there were no smart-TVs back then, but TV shows in my country were shit).
Now my biggest fear is, if enough people realize that smart-TVs are shit, then desktop monitors will start to become "smart" too. My life will be doomed if that happens.
Looks like I'm about to go buy another used computer to setup my streaming services using Kody.
Didn't know I'd have to drink a verification can just to turn on the TV
All I heard is keep my current TV I'm using as a monitor alive for as long as possible.
I'm considering a projector with a mini pc as my living room TV. I only ever do movie nights and the occasional big show that pops up for me. Everything else is my pc or audio stuff on my phone anyways.
If they can do that, then nobody can say anything about devices doing the reverse.
Taking over Roku through hdmi ? that's bold
Hardware that is supported by ads or requires a subscription should be free, or better yet, not exist at all. Fuck paying $800+ for a TV that leeches forced ad revenue on top of the sale.
And fuck the TV manufacturers for enabling this behavior. Bring back non-smart TVs. I’ll never use Roku or Google built-in streaming, so they shouldn’t be on my TV at all.
you have to boycott all of the HDMI consortum and the streaming services who demand HDMI for full features. The idea of widevine levels on android are put to prevent "stream piracy" and why all the streaming services push you to use their apps.
basically all TV manufacturers are part of the HDMI consortum, or adhere to it.
But what if I want to have ads playing while I'm playing XBox? Can the Roku analyze the image, identify 3d surfaces in the game I'm playing, and plaster ads on them so that they look integrated with the game?
Once more games are pixel streamed, that's probably possible
Exactly what people want: more ads.
Corporations to their shareholders be like "addads"
Cool so what are some good Roku alternatives?
A simple PC, you can also use it to browse, download stuff, Steam stream etc. The possibilities are endless
Any used office pc from Craiglist for <$200, wiped and reinstalled with linux.... self contained mini PC NUC boxes are also a very good bang-for-buck these days
I’ve always loved my Apple TVs.
I blocked my TV from using WiFi, but there have been times I have need to unblock it (like using AirPlay or Google Cast), so it gets updates occasionally. I'm open to throwing my TV straight to the dump and buying another TV to avoid this at all costs.
Is nVidia Shield an alternative?
That's what I've been using for years now. It's great.
Personally looking at dumb panels and building OSMC machines to run them.
Over my dead body
Roku is pretty great for what it is, but the day I see such an ad is the day it hits the bin. That would finally bother me into driving the TV with an actual PC.
As a former Roku fan, forced arbitration or a brick was the breaking point. Roku can fuck off.
Forced arbitration is a cancer and should be illegal, but at least it’s useful and technically my 5 yo agreed to it, so how is this legal again?
I hate this timeline
Roku, I already had you blocked at Pihole, but now I’m just straight up turning off your network access.
That's a fantastic way to guarantee my TV will not be connected to the internet
Get a CEC TV and a separate streaming box that supports that. Get a Shield and install an ad free launcher, or pick up an AppleTV.
Playing Xbox or PS5: "Game on with power thirst"
Watching Xxx content: ((Jergens ad))
Watching a movie: "Don't forget the popcorn"
No. Fuck no. All of my fuck no's that have ever fucked no
cant wait for ads in our dreams to happen like in futurama
Well, that would be a way to guarantee I buy a new TV...
Is there some open-source replacement for Roku? All I really use it for is a portal to my streaming services that’s easy to navigate with a remote. I’ve noticed my Roku become increasingly more overrun with ads ever since I started using it 4-5 years ago to my dismay, and it’s obviously not stopping any time soon. I’m vaguely aware of Plex but I have no clue where to start with setting it up or if it would even meet my needs
These days a lot of utilities have 3 components - hardware, software and backend hosting e.g. Ring door bell - you need all three to be able to DIY it. So DIY options are so complex that only highly motivated technical folks can do it. There need to be open source glue (OSG?) to make it simple, only then we can hope to reduce enshittification.
Not open source, but I use the Google TV chromecast in "apps only" mode.
Its very minimal but you still get a single picture of whatever show is being promoted that week. No other intrusive adds have been added {yet}.
Raspberry Pi and Kodi?
Am I the only one who gets the feeling that this is kinda dystopic? Like come on, this just gets crazy. It amazes me that some people think this is an ethically acceptable way to earn money.
What makes you think they have ethics to believe in? About 1 in 100 people is a functional sociopath on some level; they can't all be lawyers, politicians, executives, sales people, and criminals. There's gotta be a few engineers in there somewhere.
Mutually assured destruction if they were able to do this, because every other company that has a device that interfaces with HDMI would immediately implement their own ad-hijacking system that would fight for the same screen space during those "breaks".
Not to mention that if Roku saw some unknown time to monetize the screen, surely the host device they're trying to draw over would've done it by now.
Maybe they could plaster ads over their screensaver to ruin their own experience before trying to do it to someone else.
They're already doing what you mentioned in your last post. The screen saver scrolls and has a cityscape with billboards. Those billboards have ads on them.
Wow! Not since Xitter have we seen a brand so aggressively shoot itself in the crotch!
Amazing, Roku. That’s . . . something.
That is definitely way too invasive. Plugging something on to a Roku TV shouldn't enable them to show you ads through that other device.
I was actually thinking about getting a Roku once too. Really dodged a bullet.
The article says Roku is attempting to detect breaks, which are the only places Roku will try to show you an ad. So you open your inventory in the pause screen to fight a boss and an ad pops out.
It slowly dawned on video game developers that a lengthy loading screen was actually just a wasted opportunity for a digital billboard.
I wonder if they’re prepared for Microsoft’s lawyers to come knocking when they find out their screen space is being highjacked by another company for profit…
I'm so glad I made the switch to projectors. They have yet to be riddled with this horse shit. My current projector does 1080p, 60fps, makes an 85" screen in my room, can be used just fine during the day, works great with my Deck, and with the Kodak branded screen cost me less than 600 bucks.
Currently running a garbage knockoff projector that I got for $99 and I'm still glad I'm not using a smart TV. It has all the features I need and none of the stuff I don't. I'd be interested to see what $600 got you. Would you have a model name/ number or even a link? I like mine, but it runs loud.
I would but unfortunately I'm too spoiled by 4K 120Hz in HDR on an OLED. No other display technology comes even close to looking as good as an OLED does. Not to mention PC gaming at 4K120. Makes the PS5 look like a PS4.
If this happens I will find the person responsible and punch their dad in the cock
Unless that person happens to be with their dad, that would then require finding their dad. That's a whole extra person to find. It might be easier to skip straight to finding their dad.
The real treasure is the cocks we punch along the way.
Lmao, Roku can go suck on a lemon... Never buying any of their shit ever again.
I doubt that Roku is the only one exploring this option though. Heck Samsung displays ads everywhere in their UI, including the individual, source selection items.
Our TV can fortunately bypass all the "smart" shit, and run like dumb monitor, maybe because it's an older TV? We use it with an external computer with Linux mediacenter, where we have full control and no adds.
Would it even be possible to run a new "smart" TV as a dumb monitor?
We are very happy with our TV, because we can run it as a plain monitor no problem, but it could break.
Never connecting the TV to the internet and never updating the firmware usually works. If they are determined to show you ads, they may not let you use the TV without an internet connection though. I would suggest that you avoid buying a roku TV.
Okay but they can also mesh the TVs with your neighbour’s tv of the same brand so that if your neighbour’s TV has internet, your TV can leapfrog onto his tv to download the ads
Open the TV, find the antenna, desolder it and replace it with a 50 ohm resistor. Now the WiFI will no longer have enough range to connect to your neighbors.
Wow... Roku found a way to dig a deeper while and somehow make Samsung look good by comparison.
I just had a horrifying thought while wondering what these TV manufacturers will do with the TVs if you just never connect them to the Internet.
I know people are worried about them jumping on your neighbor's WiFi without prompting, or even hacking your own connection, etc but I think that seems unlikely because of how deeply illegal it is...but my horrifying thought was that they could just create a new, free mesh network that only serves up ads.
You'd need a fucking faraday cage wrapped around your TV in order to not see ads.
Now if you'll excuse me I'm gonna go throw up. 🤮
Look up Amazon Sidewalk. Your TV will soon get an internet connection whether you like it or not.
Thanks I hate it
I will buy any other brand or a try to find a dumb TV if they do this.
Last tv I bought was a few years ago. My god is a dumb tv rare these days. Especially one that supports modern HDMI and audio
With all these mini PCs now it's time to go to a giant computer monitor and an HTPC
The only reason I liked using their remote app was being able to do Bluetooth listening. Now the app no longer runs on my phone, and after reinstalling and rebooting I deleted that and am back to using the Chromecast. Time to cut the internet to the TV so I don't get an update with this ad feature
Ugh, well what are the best Roku alternatives?
To be honest, a mini pc/wireless kb and the internet.
Imagine scrolling through the pornhub video that you spent half an hour searching for and then Bam! "Clean those pesky cum filled tities with Downy! Now with strawberry flavor, Downy is the only official pornhub gangbang body odor control soap and lubricant. Get your official pornhub bottle filled at the Costco sample counter today!"
Those kinds of brands would never want to associate their ads with adult content. So instead what you'll get is ads from scammers or shady business, like "make $600 a day from home", or "horny MILF in your area", or "penile enlargement cream ".
patents don't mean shit tho, companies usually just patent whatever they want without any plans of implementation
Sounds like a good way to get open source tvs
I'm so crotchety if your site so much as makes me click an extra X for an ad, promo, or even a coupon I'm fucking out homie.
First, fuck Roku. This is exactly why my roku tv is not connected to the internet and never will be. My kodi box handles my entertainment needs.
Bro Wtf If this happens I'm litterly buying a new tv
Roku, the company that’s literally puts streaming service ads on your remotes.
all the more reason to not connect your smart TV to the internet and let it update.
Not only can they hold your TV hostage until you agree to their terms, but now they want to hijack your signal and inject their own ads to monetize all the content thats not theirs.
At this point who would ever trust Roku products.
what an excellent extra reason to not use hdmi
Bring back S-video!
Does nobody in this thread know about HDCP? This wouldn't fly at all.
They'd be doing this change on their TVs, in principle this would be no different from displaying the settings menu that comes up when you press the * button, no tampering of the HDMI signal required. HDMI inputs are their own "channels" in the UI so it's pretty trivial to put ads on the screen periodically when one such channel is open.
HDCP signal is decoded by the TV before being displayed on the screen. The TV has complete control over what is shown to you.
Don't get it wrong: HDCP was not made to protect user interests, but specifically for the publisher and display device OEMs who subscribe to it.
Can you elaborate? I thought hdcp was mostly about preventing piracy type of things, what does it do for this situation?
It (in theory) prevents signal tampering of any kind, which would include injecting advertisements into the stream.
If they decide to go through with this I will literally replace every Roku TV I own, fuck that shit!
You should probably plan on that anyway. I've already seen screenshots of ads popping up over DVDs, offering to sell you what you're already watching.
This isn't a threat from Roku. This is a promise to their real customers, the glorious advertisers.
Uhhhg
Someone tell me there's an OSS Roku like system out there >_>
I mean, there are open-source systems to provide TV-style functionality. I'm not really current, but it looks like Kodi is an option.
Yeah fuck that shit
My cousin wanted a Roku TV as a wedding gift. I said no. Got Sony instead. I like to think he's thankful for that with all the shit Roku has been doing
I was permitted to close my account....without any hassle. Sign into my.roku.com and delete account is as the bottom. Selecting "don't want to use this anymore" gives you a box with 255 charachter limit (because of course they don't want to hear a real reason) and then when you hit send you just get "Thank you, account closed, if you come back you will need a new account"
Surprisingly, suspiciously, painless.